hftmrock

for anyone thinking more testing means more cases.. here is NY stats to prove that wrong. A picture is worth a thousand words. Done right... more tests means LESS positive cases

1 hour ago, Goodtime Cruizin said:

 

I have to disagree. Having more cases isn't necessarily to mean 'hot spot', but rather more testing. And then we have situations that the test numbers are inaccurate & flawed. And while we're hearing of more tests being positive, we are seeing far fewer deaths. So if it has to be called a 'hot spot' , I'll take more positive tests w/ less deaths all day long.  

if testing was the cause , then the amount of people go up but the percentages stay the same.

Florida for example had 4% rate for a while before opening up and when they did more testing I think they are at or close to 20%.. thats not due to testing. thats a higher infection rate. science proves that out easily

and deaths lag behind so lets just wait.. first there is a spike in cases, then a few weeks later is a spike in hospitalizations then a few weeks later a spike in ICU and finally a few weeks later, a spike in deaths...

we will see if deaths are lower very very shortly. everything else is following the scientific pattern

On 5/13/2020 at 5:11 PM, hftmrock said:

and because people are opening too soon according to the CDC, we will probably have a setback so strap in... its going to be a bumpy ride

wow... almost 2 months ago... its like science or something...

7 minutes ago, Charles4515 said:

 

I tend to disagree with the doom scenario. It is the number of deaths that matter not the number of positive cases. Also the surge in positive cases is in states that had low numbers before. In states that had high numbers the rate is falling. In other words what is happening in Texas and Florida may have been inevitable. Texas and Florida should have stayed locked down longer as they only delayed going thru what happened in other regions. However the numbers likely will drop in the states now having a surge as they have in other states.


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I totally disagree. There was a plan in NY and they stuck to the Government and CDC guidelines. Texas and Florida did not so this spike was preventable.

On 6/21/2020 at 9:15 AM, 4774Papa said:

I think that there is too much COIVD 19 hysteria.

 

Florida is doing fine.  Testing has pushed up the cases, but fatalities are way down.  Understand that more of the new cases don't require hospitalization and are among under 50 persons.  I live in South Georgia and we have no problem with hospitalizations.   Only a very small percentage of new cases require hospitalization.  I think people are ready to get out and do things once more and with the fatality rate being a fraction of one percent, unless you have underlying conditions.  People are willing to take the risk.

 

https://experience.arcgis.com/experience/96dd742462124fa0b38ddedb9b25e429

 

We love cruising, but will wait until next year.   Cruising still involves the travel risk that ports will close to your ship.  Also, we have done one Caribbean cruise and the Caribbean doesn't appeal to us.  

 

 

Hospitalizations always lag a few weeks behind the positive cases, deaths follow a few weeks after...

Hospitalizations are on the rise in Florida as expected

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/coronavirus/os-ne-corovnavirus-record-numbers-hospitalizations-20200626-p5335ddw45f7xdlxiaezqzgjha-story.html

and to get back to cruising...as long as the positive cases are high, there will NEVER be cruising. forget deaths, forget hospitalizations... if the amount of positive cases do not reduce tremendously, there will not be cruising the in the US

So for the purposes of cruising... Positive cases matter

37 minutes ago, Newleno said:

per capita the usa does not have the most death, what an odd thing to say, facts matter my friend

I never say most death. dont put words in my mouth please. I was referring to positive cases and while some people believe positive cases are nothing, I dont believe this is true.

what an odd thing to do to put words in people mouths that they never said.. you are right... facts do matter my friend and the fact is, I never said deaths

This is as clear a picture showing testing is NOT the cause of the recent spike in Florida

http://ww11.doh.state.fl.us/comm/_partners/action/report_archive/state/state_reports_latest.pdf

Florida Department of Health website

https://floridahealthcovid19.gov/#latest-stats

Last 2 weeks of testing (besides yesterday there is NO clear increase in testing in the last 2 weeks)

More proof? Here is the breakdown between the number of cases and the positive results. If the theory of testing causes more positive results, the chart should show about the same percentage of infected but that would amount to more cases since there is more testing.. This does NOT show this

Here is what I see

06/11 - 06/17

234,683 tests

21,186 positive tests

9% positive rate

06/18 - 06/24

244,976 tests

32,345 positive tests

13% positive rate.

If it was just testing, the percentages would be the same. the positive rate has gone up 5%. Also, there is a huge jump yesterday that gave 06/18 - 06/24 more tests. if they did the same amount as the other days, the amount of tests would be LOWER for the last 7 days.

they are not increasing testing... and testing is NOT the reason for more positive cases. this is 100% proof by the Florida Department of Health

12 minutes ago, PTC DAWG said:

https://dph.georgia.gov/covid-19-daily-status-report

 

Click on the tab for Deaths, right below the map of the GA Counties.  

 

More info from GA, where I live, ...our Gov was chastised for early opening too..deaths plummeting here also, cases are up, as testing is.

georgia is doing better than Florida but since this is a cruise site, I will say that if we ALL dont get the numbers down.... no one is cruising and Florida would be a hub for cruising so if the deaths dont go down and positive cases keep skyrocketing... no one is going to cruise. NY has number that have gone down significantly but I dont bring up NY because we need to have a collectivism attitude to get this under control enough to start to cruise

3 minutes ago, PTC DAWG said:

Positive tests are up in Fl. Deaths continue to fall...

 

https://experience.arcgis.com/experience/96dd742462124fa0b38ddedb9b25e429

 

Same thing happening in GA..National News wants no part of falling deaths..it simply doesn’t fit the narrative..

apparently there is a difference in RESIDENT deaths which is your chart and ACTUAL deaths of anyone in Florida which is this chart. It shows that deaths are NOT way down in Florida

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/usa/florida/

the totals are the same on BOTH of the charts (ArcGIS and Worldometer) BUT your chart only counts for 'Resident' deaths.

Florida still has an issue which DOES fit the narrative

1 hour ago, GlamorousGirl said:

Governors didn’t cause this. The Chinese government lying about it and letting planes leave China but not fly within China when the outbreak started are to blame. We would have been sailing months ago if it weren’t for that. Governors can’t stay locked down forever; the economy is vital too. There are people out of work for months who can’t pay their rent or utilities or buy food. That can’t be ignored.

have you seen other countries curve. Seems some had the SAME Chinese government issues yet they have totally managed to avoid what the US is currently going through

1 hour ago, 4774Papa said:

I think that there is too much COIVD 19 hysteria.

 

Florida is doing fine.  Testing has pushed up the cases, but fatalities are way down.  Understand that more of the new cases don't require hospitalization and are among under 50 persons.  I live in South Georgia and we have no problem with hospitalizations.   Only a very small percentage of new cases require hospitalization.  I think people are ready to get out and do things once more and with the fatality rate being a fraction of one percent, unless you have underlying conditions.  People are willing to take the risk.

 

https://experience.arcgis.com/experience/96dd742462124fa0b38ddedb9b25e429

 

We love cruising, but will wait until next year.   Cruising still involves the travel risk that ports will close to your ship.  Also, we have done one Caribbean cruise and the Caribbean doesn't appeal to us.  

 

 

Fatalities are NOT way down... they are closer to flat than way down. Look at the charts.

How do you look at this chart and say deaths are way down??????

Hospitalizations are trending UP

2 hours ago, OceanCruise said:

From CDC:

"A positive test result shows you may have antibodies from an infection with the virus that causes COVID-19, or possibly from infection with a related virus from the same family of viruses (called coronavirus), such as one that causes the common cold." 

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/testing/serology-overview.html

 

Perhaps this is why numbers appear to be increasing as states like Florida upped their antibody tests starting in May.

 

Ive said it time and time again... the testing in Florida has basically been flat (it rose VERY slightly for the past month) and the positive cases has broken florida records for the past week. The number show its NOT testing

Just now, Newleno said:

that is why i said equivalent to,  If you really dont think that term you used is a horrible thing to say to some one then, well, 

Bless your heart (according to you not me)

thanks!

Just now, Newleno said:

you do know that your statement is equivalent to a racial slur, it serves no purpose on these boards and it is an affront to free speech and civilized discourse.

I will have to research that. I wanted to end the conversation by acknowledging the differences we have in this topic and probably wont see eye to eye but respect the right to say what you want. I guess I can say hello and someone will say its a racial slur too.

Ive been on these boards for way too long to feel or see anything like that

just looked it up

"Bless your heart" is a phrase that is common in the Southern United States.^[1][2][3] The phrase has multiple meanings. It can be used as a sincere expression of sympathy or genuine concern. It can be used as a precursor to an insult to soften the blow. It is also sometimes used to mean "you are dumb or otherwise impaired, but you can't help it" by individuals who wish to "be sweet” and do not wish to "act ugly"

Dont see anything remotely racial... But I wish people would start believing people dont have such bad motives. I did mean it as sympathy and genuine concern since we will not see eye to eye on this important topic

But you can feel free to see it any way you want

8 minutes ago, Formula280SS said:

 

Sorry, but if the middle legend symbol if # daily total tests, and you see it as "flat," I can't help you.  Also, will note below, Florida C-19 testing is OPEN TO ALL and younger people are being tested; the # of positives have increased - - - yet they are asymptomatic, not hospitalized nor near death.

 

 

Same reply as above; again, focus on the average age decreasing and the % asymptomatic very high.

 

 

 

Regarding the deaths, it does appear to be going down.

 

 

The hospitals have been so financially crippled by the lock-down and essential medical protocols, massive staff layoffs and furloughs, and weren't remotely overwhelmed or challenged in Florida (nor NYC as experts and Governor predicted), that many admissions to the hospitals are increased to those with lesser symptoms previously used expecting the wave.

 

 

if you cant see that the comparison between testing and positive cases are so different, there isnt much I can do for you... tiny increases in testing did not cause the spike in new cases. You have hit an all time high ever day this week and look at the testing this week. not much different from the middle of May..

nothing I can do if you see these with rose colored glasses and see this as good...

Bless your heart

8 minutes ago, Formula280SS said:

 

No, it is not rocket science.  However,  I have learned years ago, that I can inform but cannot control ones' ability to comprehend.

 

If you could post the daily rates for the State of Florida for the # tested, # hospitalized and # dead it would be helpful (I believe).

 

Take care.

your wish is my command

Florida Testing has been basically flat for a month

Florida Cases

That should IMMEDIATELY prove that testing is NOT the reason for the spike

Deaths are Flat for 2 month.... when will it ever go down?

Florida Hospitalizations... flat..3 months.. will it ever go down??????

6 minutes ago, Formula280SS said:

 

 

It's called TESTING.  Quite simple, the more you test, the more cases.  It is not rocket science.

 

 

 

 

Testing... not Rocket science huh???

Well my scientist... Florida's testing for the past month has been TOTALLY FLAT. but the cases have skyrocketed...

Please take your time to explain

Also , NY has increased testing throughout... yet they have a flattened curve.... does rocket science not work there?

10 minutes ago, Newleno said:

Once again what is the current solution to the problem, I dont think there is an answer, if there was it would be implemented. 

The USA had a solution that the governement and the CDC agreed to. 14 days of declining numbers before opening... States that listened to the government got great results.. states that didnt (like Florida) didnt get such great results

the solution is only as good as the implementation

4 minutes ago, Newleno said:

  Once again what is the current solution to the problem, I dont think there is an answer, if there was it would be implemented. 

many countries seem to have found the basic solution on how to flatten the curve... I wonder if the US government has looked at other places that have been MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH better than the US

I found a good chart for Florida... ARE YOU KIDDING ME?

1 hour ago, boatseller said:

Except we've had excellent leadership from the Whitehouse*.  The US is very well positioned in healthcare capacity, testing and economic recovery.

 

Anyone who thinks we'd be magically virus free is living in a fantasy world.  I know, it's easier to just close your eyes and hope the situation will change, but adults deal with problems.  We're well on our way to putting this behind us getting back to cruising ASAP.

 

*I'd ask for an example of a lie, but don't want to embarrass you for not being able to find one. 🙂

Well on our way to putting this behind us? really? lets look at the statistics

Spain is putting it behind them

The UK is putting it behind them

Italy is putting it behind them

Now lets look at the good ol' USA

We havent even STARTED to get this under control. We need to get the curve LOWER not higher... Other countries have done some states in the US have done it. So why is the curve RISING in the US?

13 minutes ago, boatseller said:

  Despite cases going up, ER visits and hospitalizations are essentially flat and capacity is not under stress. 

only in America , we can have a pandemic and for 3 months the hospitalizations for a disease are flat and that is seen as a good thing. 

again... Hospitalizations in Florida

Hospitalizations in NY

4 minutes ago, boatseller said:

 Fatalities are declining. 

do you look at the facts? at BEST its flat and that is HORRIBLE for 3 MONTHS... it should be down!

Here is NYC. Can you spot the difference?

Just now, boatseller said:

.  People are going to get the virus, that cannot be stopped, ever. 

Funny... NY , NJ and many other COUNTRIES have gotten the curve to go down.... Florida and Texas has not figured that out yet