Using Credit Cards Abroad-Warning about Chase

[vbmom87]

Get your facts straight. The name of the CEO of JPMorganChase is Jaime Dimon.

 

Geez!!!! Can't we be a friendly bunch on this forum? I think some people need to take a break from reading these forums if they get so bothered by repeat questions and typos. JMHO.

[VioletHorse]

Jacqueline,

 

In case you are not aware of this, Chase also charges a foreign transaction fee of 3% on purchases made in US$ processed outside the US. Bank of America does the same thing. Chase instituted the new fee in February.

 

If you make a purchase in the Caribbean, Canada, Mexico or anywhere else outside of the US, they will tack on a 3% fee even if the transaction is US$.

 

I have a website that I occasionally make purchases from that appears to be based in Washington state. The prices are all in US$ and their shipping address is Bellingham, WA. However, they process their credit card transactions in British Columbia, Canada. I got hit with the additional 3% fee from Chase shortly after they introduced the fee so I use my Capital One card now to make purchases from them.

 

Unfortunately with the internet, it's hard to always know where the transaction will be processed. I've seen an few posts from people who booked their airlines or hotels through one of the major travel websites then got hit with the "foreign transaction fee" from their credit card because the charge was processed outsite the US. The world had gotten smaller and I can't help but think that the credit card companies are taking advantage of it.

 

This also happened to me recently. I had purchased merchandise via an internet website and there was no indication that it was located in Canada. When I received my credit card statement there was a 3% foreign transaction fee :(. Lesson learned. I'll use my Cap One credit card in the future.

 

With respect to using my debit card, I pretty much gave up using that card for purchases over 5 years ago. One evening I received a telephone call from the the Fraud Detection Department of my bank. They saw some larger purchases being charged to my card in the Province of Quebec (the card BTW was in my possession and had never been lost or misplaced). Once they were able to verify my identity with a few questions, they immediately blocked that # from further use. They were able to figure this out only because I'd used that card a few hours earlier at at local retailer, and since I live hundreds of miles away from where those large charges were coming from, my account was automatically flagged for review. However, I had to sign an affdavit before any of the fraudulent charges were removed and a new card issued.

 

The bank told me that my # had probably been hacked months earlier when I used it at a warehouse club since there had been other occurrences like this and they had tracked it to bad processing security protocols with that particular retailer. Lesson learned. As a result, I only use the debit card to get an occasional amount of cash from the ATM at my bank for for things like tips and gifts.

[Jacqueline]

Thanks VB mom. I was really struck by the tone of some of the remarks. Its not like I wanted to bring my five kids on a cruise and let them run amuck while smoking in my balcony whilst preparing to wear jeans on formal night in the MDR :). And lets not even talk tipping. I think there was a post about that once.

 

 

I had no need to do the search as I already had the information but wanted to highlight it to other cruisers who might not think to search.

 

Many posters did pass along a helpful links and information. One noted;

 

"In 2006, Visa, MasterCard and Diners Club were slapped with a $336 million settlement for hiding foreign transaction fees. Customers who used those cards abroad between 1996 and 2006 were not notified they were being charged such fees, and a court declared the consumers were entitled to refunds.

 

After the settlement, some issuers chose to reveal the foreign transaction fees in their cards' terms and conditions. For others, they remain absent. Tracking them down often requires a call to customer service or the corporate office, and even then, you're not guaranteed an answer. "

 

Kyriecat has reinforced the lack of transparency by these companies in her remarks regarding the expanding use of fees.. My point was that with three contacts with Master Card (on the phone twice and internet website once), in only one of these contacts was the fee disclosed. The online form that asked for my dates and countries while away did not even have a sententence to the effect that usage in these places would carry a charge.. Same with the autmated call process.

When I called Capital One she told me right off no fees.

 

So putting up a post on CC seemed like an ok heads up to people. The companies were found guilty for a reason and still seem less than compliant in at least some cases, even while expanding their usage of fees.

[Nasmas]

I use my Chase Ink all the time. I've never had a processing fee. I'm not sure I understood. Are shipboard charges assessed the 3% fee? Its never happened before.

[serendipity1499]

The Schwab account is being dis=associated from Charles Schwab as of the end of this month. Current cardholders have received a communication that as of 01 October, the card will remain valid and no changes will be made in terms (2% cash back on all purchases plus no foreign exchange fee including the 1% visa fee) at this time. The last 3 words are the key. The card will become a credit card issued by a credit card processor known as FIA...I believe I read somewhere that FIA is associated with Bank of America....the speculation is the cards did not bring enough new accounts to Schwab...many people just opened Schwab accounts for the card.

 

All over the place, credit card companies are withdrawing rewards or making them harder to get. How long will FIA keep the perks of this card. My ballpark guess is that as of January, this will be history (just a guess mind you).[/quote]

 

You may be surprised about your perks though....My now Chase Card was originally a Shell credit card & we were getting 3% back for gas purchases.. Then many years ago Chase bought out the Shell card & I figured there goes the 3%...But I was wrong, we still get 3% back for gas & 1% back on other purchases..I use that card for most everything purchased in the U.S. Only thing I was annoyed about was our Shell card had our pictures on it & all the merchants loved it....Chase discontinued that practice..l

 

Last spring I was told by a Schwab representative that they no longer issue credit cards for any account. They do still honor cards already issued.

The Schwab Bank ATM card, however, does avoid ATM cash withdrawal fees from all banks. But there may be other fees from foreign banks charged to any cash withdrawal. The user is supposed to be notified of these fees before the final withdrawal step.

 

Bob :cool:

 

Thanks Bob for clarifying the Schwab credit card..Knew I saw something about it before..

 

Jacqueline,

 

In case you are not aware of this, Chase also charges a foreign transaction fee of 3% on purchases made in US$ processed outside the US. Bank of America does the same thing. Chase instituted the new fee in February.

 

If you make a purchase in the Caribbean, Canada, Mexico or anywhere else outside of the US, they will tack on a 3% fee even if the transaction is US$.

 

I have a website that I occasionally make purchases from that appears to be based in Washington state. The prices are all in US$ and their shipping address is Bellingham, WA. However, they process their credit card transactions in British Columbia, Canada. I got hit with the additional 3% fee from Chase shortly after they introduced the fee so I use my Capital One card now to make purchases from them.

 

Unfortunately with the internet, it's hard to always know where the transaction will be processed. I've seen an few posts from people who booked their airlines or hotels through one of the major travel websites then got hit with the "foreign transaction fee" from their credit card because the charge was processed outsite the US. The world had gotten smaller and I can't help but think that the credit card companies are taking advantage of it.

 

Jacqueline knows about the 3% charge.That's what she was complaining about in her Original post..There are hundreds of different types of Chase Cards & all Chase cards have different agreements..You can see the many chase cards on this URL..

 

https://www.chase.com/online/card_fe...ment_chase.htm

 

 

My Chase Freedom card has had the 3% foreign transaction fee for many years..I first noticed it in 2006 when I purchased pearls in Venezuella..As a matter of fact, we were put into a class action suit against Chase several years ago, because way before that Chase failed to make it clear in their printed agreements..They have since changed their printed agreements & the fees are quite clear now..

 

Thanks for the info about some WEB sites processing the cards in a foreign country..Will be vigilant when purchasing things through the Internet..

 

cheers.....:)Betty

[peaches from georgia]

Wachovia switched processing to FIA quite awhile back. No problems. No perks, but we never had any with Wachovia so I don't know if you will lose yours or not.

[NancyIL]

I use my ATM card to get local currency, and a Chase Visa (which was recently replaced with a Citibank Visa for the airline miles) when traveling. I am well aware of the 3% foreign currency transaction fee on most credit cards, but I am not interested in getting a Capital One card just for international travel. No matter how you pay for things in a foreign country, there will be a fee involved. Capital One's conversion rates may be higher than other banks' to make up for the 3% they're not getting in transaction fees.

[hrhdhd]

Only thing I was annoyed about was our Shell card had our pictures on it & all the merchants loved it....Chase discontinued that practice..

 

I used to have a CitiBank card with my picture and signature on the front. NOT ONCE did anyone look at the front of the card; the store employees (back when they actually used to swipe the card for you [don't get me started on making the customer do all the work!]) automatically flipped the card over to see the signature on the back. It was little to no extra security.

 

Now, of course, at many stores, the employees don't even handle the card to see if it's even been signed, never mind to compare signatures. (Not that you can compare a fuzzy signature on an electronic pad to one in ink on a card.)

[kyriecat]

Jacqueline knows about the 3% charge.That's what she was complaining about in her Original post..There are hundreds of different types of Chase Cards & all Chase cards have different agreements..You can see the many chase cards on this URL..

 

https://www.chase.com/online/card_fe...ment_chase.htm

 

 

My Chase Freedom card has had the 3% foreign transaction fee for many years..I first noticed it in 2006 when I purchased pearls in Venezuella..As a matter of fact, we were put into a class action suit against Chase several years ago, because way before that Chase failed to make it clear in their printed agreements..They have since changed their printed agreements & the fees are quite clear now..

 

Thanks for the info about some WEB sites processing the cards in a foreign country..Will be vigilant when purchasing things through the Internet..

 

cheers.....:)Betty

I apologize to both you and Jacqueline for butting in. From her original post, I thought she was upset about the 3% foreign currency fee that Chase adds to purchases made using a currency other than US$. I didn't realize she was actually upset about the 3% foreign transaction fee that they add to purchases made using US$ but processed outside the US. Those are two different fees. I guess I didn't read close enough to see that she already knew about the foreign transaction fee. I know that I wasn't aware Chase had added it prior to being hit with it. I knew about the 3% foreign currency fee since my card has had that in place for years.

 

I have a Chase Continental OnePass Mastercard. Chase started charging the foreign transaction fee on my card in February so it was new to me. I didn't know that Chase was charging a foreign transaction fee on some of their other cards for years. I have used my Chase card prior to February to make purchases using US$ outside the US (Canada, Mexico, and various Caribbean islands) and wasn't charged a foreign transaction fee. When I questioned the charge in March, Chase emailed me a copy of the new T&C's that were included in my February statement but I hadn't read.

 

I was just trying to help educate people (like me) who don't read every piece of paper included in their credit card statements. I read them now. ;)

[kyriecat]

I use my ATM card to get local currency, and a Chase Visa (which was recently replaced with a Citibank Visa for the airline miles) when traveling. I am well aware of the 3% foreign currency transaction fee on most credit cards, but I am not interested in getting a Capital One card just for international travel. No matter how you pay for things in a foreign country, there will be a fee involved. Capital One's conversion rates may be higher than other banks' to make up for the 3% they're not getting in transaction fees.

I got a Capital One "No Hassle Rewards" Visa card in March because I was upset with Chase about their foreign transaction fee. I had heard that Capital One uses a higher conversion rate. However, when I used the card in St. Lucia in April (EC$ for transactions), the conversion rate Capital One used was the same as xe dot com for the transaction dates. There were no additional fees that I could find. They might use higher conversion rates for other currencies. I'm not planning on another trip abroad until April so I'll have to compare conversion rates again then to see.

[whogo]

No matter how you pay for things in a foreign country, there will be a fee involved. Capital One's conversion rates may be higher than other banks' to make up for the 3% they're not getting in transaction fees.

This is not correct. You can charge foreign purchases with a Capital One Visa charge card without paying any more than the interbank rate with no markup. It is also possible to withdraw foreign currency from ATM's with the proper debit card and pay no markup. There is not always a fee involved. Any number of savvy consumers can make their foreign transactions without paying any fees or markups.

 

The link I posted earlier lists 15 ATM cards that charge 0% markup on foreign withdrawals and 5 credit cards that charge 0% markup on foreign purchases.

[NancyIL]

This is not correct. You can charge foreign purchases with a Capital One Visa charge card without paying any more than the interbank rate with no markup. It is also possible to withdraw foreign currency from ATM's with the proper debit card and pay no markup. There is not always a fee involved. Any number of savvy consumers can make their foreign transactions without paying any fees or markups.

 

The link I posted earlier lists 15 ATM cards that charge 0% markup on foreign withdrawals and 5 credit cards that charge 0% markup on foreign purchases.

 

I use my bank's ATM card (not a debit card) and am perfectly willing to pay $1 per ATM transaction when out of my local area. Some ATM machines charge you a minimal fee, no matter what kind of card you use.

[MATHA531]

I apologize to both you and Jacqueline for butting in. From her original post, I thought she was upset about the 3% foreign currency fee that Chase adds to purchases made using a currency other than US$. I didn't realize she was actually upset about the 3% foreign transaction fee that they add to purchases made using US$ but processed outside the US. Those are two different fees. I guess I didn't read close enough to see that she already knew about the foreign transaction fee. I know that I wasn't aware Chase had added it prior to being hit with it. I knew about the 3% foreign currency fee since my card has had that in place for years.

 

I have a Chase Continental OnePass Mastercard. Chase started charging the foreign transaction fee on my card in February so it was new to me. I didn't know that Chase was charging a foreign transaction fee on some of their other cards for years. I have used my Chase card prior to February to make purchases using US$ outside the US (Canada, Mexico, and various Caribbean islands) and wasn't charged a foreign transaction fee. When I questioned the charge in March, Chase emailed me a copy of the new T&C's that were included in my February statement but I hadn't read.

 

I was just trying to help educate people (like me) who don't read every piece of paper included in their credit card statements. I read them now. ;)

 

A lot of people don't understand this fee and almost all the near criminal banks that add 2% to the amost justified 1% visa/mc fee for converting foreign currencies as they do the conversion and take whatever risks of currency fluctuations there are while the banks receive the charge already converted and have no foreign currency fluctuations to justify their 2% fee. None whatsoever. It is a rip off fee.

 

However, as noted here it has gotten worse. Most of these banks now charge the 3% fee on any "foreign" transaction but you would be shocked what is considered a foreign transaction even if done completely within your home country (we'll just assume it's the USA). The message boards are full of complaints, for example, of people who buys say an Aer Lingus ticket from New York to Dublin on orbitz for whatever (it is charged and stated only in UD)...however the foreign transaction fee of 3% applie with these near criminal banks because all airline charges made to Aer Lingus clear through their mc/visa account in an Irish bank!

 

Try to get a justifrication from the banks for this fee. And contrary to what some people have said here, Capital One's big selling piont (and I am sure their bean counter studies have shown that this is the major selling point of their cards) is they do not add 2% to foreign transactions and actually eat the 1% visa/mc fee and so when you use a Capital One card for any foreign transaction in a foreign currency, the amount is converted at the interbank rate with nothing added on.

[Jacqueline]

kyrie - you made good points and I appreciate them. Reading what people have written it is clear that it is unclear.

I am really interested i seeing if the exchange rates that Capital One uses are the same as the other cards. I am supposing that they must state somewhere the rates that they use. Perhaps this information is already posted on the boards? Worth knowing for sure.

 

The information posted by Matha was stunning to me.

"Most of these banks now charge the 3% fee on any "foreign" transaction but you would be shocked what is considered a foreign transaction even if done completely within your home country (we'll just assume it's the USA). The message boards are full of complaints, for example, of people who buys say an Aer Lingus ticket from New York to Dublin on orbitz for whatever (it is charged and stated only in UD)...however the foreign transaction fee of 3% applie with these near criminal banks because all airline charges made to Aer Lingus clear through their mc/visa account in an Irish bank!"

[serendipity1499]

A lot of people don't understand this fee and almost all the near criminal banks that add 2% to the amost justified 1% visa/mc fee for converting foreign currencies as they do the conversion and take whatever risks of currency fluctuations there are while the banks receive the charge already converted and have no foreign currency fluctuations to justify their 2% fee. None whatsoever. It is a rip off fee.

 

However, as noted here it has gotten worse. Most of these banks now charge the 3% fee on any "foreign" transaction but you would be shocked what is considered a foreign transaction even if done completely within your home country (we'll just assume it's the USA). The message boards are full of complaints, for example, of people who buys say an Aer Lingus ticket from New York to Dublin on orbitz for whatever (it is charged and stated only in UD)...however the foreign transaction fee of 3% applie with these near criminal banks because all airline charges made to Aer Lingus clear through their mc/visa account in an Irish bank!

 

Try to get a justifrication from the banks for this fee. And contrary to what some people have said here, Capital One's big selling piont (and I am sure their bean counter studies have shown that this is the major selling point of their cards) is they do not add 2% to foreign transactions and actually eat the 1% visa/mc fee and so when you use a Capital One card for any foreign transaction in a foreign currency, the amount is converted at the interbank rate with nothing added on.

 

I bold-ed your paragraph because I became aware of this when we booked an Oceania Cruise back in 2006 for travel in 2007...While perusing the Oceania Cruise Critic board I discovered that they also used an Irish Bank to process their bookings..And some posters were very upset on learning that they were charged an additional 3%..That would have been more than $180 alone on our booking in an outside cabin.. Can you imagine what those in suites paid..

When we were deciding on the booking the TA involved spoke to the Oceania REP who promised to refund any fees the Credit Card company charged us...We had to give the deposit on our Chase card...But immediately DH & I each applied for a Capitalone card with two different numbers & accounts..So, If my card is lost or stolen DH will still have his which we always keep in the Cabin's safe..Fortunately Oceania used a U.S. bank to process our deposit & we didn't have to go through the problem of getting a refund..

Also believe that Oceania no longer processes their accounts in Ireland, but we still will use our CapitalOne card if we book with them..

 

Cheers.....:)Betty

[serendipity1499]

This is not correct. You can charge foreign purchases with a Capital One Visa charge card without paying any more than the interbank rate with no markup. It is also possible to withdraw foreign currency from ATM's with the proper debit card and pay no markup. There is not always a fee involved. Any number of savvy consumers can make their foreign transactions without paying any fees or markups.

 

The link I posted earlier lists 15 ATM cards that charge 0% markup on foreign withdrawals and 5 credit cards that charge 0% markup on foreign purchases.

 

You are absolutely correct..We have never incurred a higher rate of exchange on our Capitalone card in the 4 years of using it..We check our credit card statements very carefully..

 

I use my bank's ATM card (not a debit card) and am perfectly willing to pay $1 per ATM transaction when out of my local area. Some ATM machines charge you a minimal fee, no matter what kind of card you use.

 

 

Agree some banks & ATM's will charge the extra fee but our credit union will refund those extra fees..If we want to use an ATM for local currency, which is very rare, we'll use our Credit Union Card rather than our Bank Card..We only carry our Wells Fargo/Wachovia Card & store it in the safe along with our Chase Card & one CapitalOne card..That card is there in case of an extreme emergency...

In addition, we always take travelers checks for any extra $$$ we may need, on our cruises..The Ship's Front Disk will cash them at no cost to us..

All our bases are covered..

Cheers......:)Betty

[kyriecat]

I am really interested i seeing if the exchange rates that Capital One uses are the same as the other cards. I am supposing that they must state somewhere the rates that they use. Perhaps this information is already posted on the boards? Worth knowing for sure.

The website FAQ doesn't specifically state what conversion rate they use for foreign currency:

Will Capital One® charge me a fee if I use my credit card overseas?

Capital One does not charge a fee for using your credit card for foreign currency transactions. Foreign purchases will be converted at the foreign exchange rate in effect at the time of posting the charge.

http://www.capitalone.com/creditcards/help/after-applying.php#7_pg_sl

 

I found their conversion rate to be the same as xe dot com for the limited experience that I have had with them. However, it could vary. I used to use my AMEX for foreign currency purchases because they only charged 1.5% (then) foreign currency fee rather than the 3% that the other cards charged. I noticed that AMEX conversion rates sometimes varied from what xe dot com showed for the same day. It was never a big difference.

[Boytjie]

Get your facts straight. The name of the CEO of JPMorganChase is Jaime Dimon.

 

Uhem, actually his name is Jamie Dimon. :D

[Jacqueline]

Betty,

That is such an interesting story about your Oceana booking ~ considering how careful we all are to get the most for our money, the $180 charge is very meaningful. And good point about the premium people may have inadvertantly paid for the suites.

 

As you all have lead me to do more internet research, it is apparent that the banks, like the cruiselines, are being as creative as possible to get any additional revenue stream. As an ad for a clothing discounter in New York says,"an educated consumer is our best customer".

 

I meant the thread to be about helping one another to have that information for our international travels. Now I can see that the potential for fees actually is greater than I had thought, as Betty and others have explained.. According to some reading that I have done today a transaction that at any time in its travels touches a foreign bank is on some cards assigned a fee. Hmmmm... You don't think that anyone would do that intentionally, do you? Well, there seems to be litigation pending on these issues in some states.

 

I do understand that sometimes it is just convenient to pay a fee (like using a non-affiliated ATM that is nearby) but that is clearly stated, which to me is no problem and fair to the end user and the bank. It's a convenience for which there is a fee.

 

It seems that while Capital One is not the be all and end all, they have come up with a nice competitive advantage for those of us who prefer to avoid the 3%.

[serendipity1499]

Uhem, actually his name is Jamie Dimon. :D

LOL...

 

Jacqueline,

 

In case you are not aware of this, Chase also charges a foreign transaction fee of 3% on purchases made in US$ processed outside the US. Bank of America does the same thing. Chase instituted the new fee in February.

 

If you make a purchase in the Caribbean, Canada, Mexico or anywhere else outside of the US, they will tack on a 3% fee even if the transaction is US$.

 

I have a website that I occasionally make purchases from that appears to be based in Washington state. The prices are all in US$ and their shipping address is Bellingham, WA. However, they process their credit card transactions in British Columbia, Canada. I got hit with the additional 3% fee from Chase shortly after they introduced the fee so I use my Capital One card now to make purchases from them.

 

Unfortunately with the internet, it's hard to always know where the transaction will be processed. I've seen an few posts from people who booked their airlines or hotels through one of the major travel websites then got hit with the "foreign transaction fee" from their credit card because the charge was processed outsite the US. The world had gotten smaller and I can't help but think that the credit card companies are taking advantage of it.

 

I bold-ed this only because you have blown my mind with the story of your internet purchase..Wonder how one finds out before buying from a U.S. Company if they bank out of the U.S.... I was surprised about Oceania but never knew that U.S. companies did the same..

 

Betty,

That is such an interesting story about your Oceana booking ~ considering how careful we all are to get the most for our money, the $180 charge is very meaningful. And good point about the premium people may have inadvertantly paid for the suites.

 

As you all have lead me to do more internet research, it is apparent that the banks, like the cruiselines, are being as creative as possible to get any additional revenue stream. As an ad for a clothing discounter in New York says,"an educated consumer is our best customer".

 

I meant the thread to be about helping one another to have that information for our international travels. Now I can see that the potential for fees actually is greater than I had thought, as Betty and others have explained.. According to some reading that I have done today a transaction that at any time in its travels touches a foreign bank is on some cards assigned a fee. Hmmmm... You don't think that anyone would do that intentionally, do you? Well, there seems to be litigation pending on these issues in some states.

 

I do understand that sometimes it is just convenient to pay a fee (like using a non-affiliated ATM that is nearby) but that is clearly stated, which to me is no problem and fair to the end user and the bank. It's a convenience for which there is a fee.

 

It seems that while Capital One is not the be all and end all, they have come up with a nice competitive advantage for those of us who prefer to avoid the 3%.

 

We're very happy with our CapitalOne Cards, & hope they never change..But Kriecat's story really threw me for a loop...Wonder if the banks in Canada are giving the business from the U.S. who bank with them, incentives such as kickbacks when they charge the 3%...

Think about it..One could have a business lets say in Detroit & bank in Windsor...They could process their credit cards in Windsor & the back will be getting the 3% transaction fee...Then the back could share by giving the Business Owner part of that fee..Wonder if that is illegal?:eek:

 

Wish Brian would weigh in here, as he's a banker & knows the in's & out's of the banking industry & the credit cards..

 

Will be back later as have to make DH dinner...Think I'll give him a check & then set up a bank account in Canada...LOL..

Cheers.....:)Betty