Saga Rose Greenland Voyager August 2007

[franu]

I arrived home this morning from the bay area of California. I am certain that my brain is still flying over Denver. If I sound incoherent please excuse me this once. I have been doing the Grandma thing for three weeks.

After reading the 59 pages of this thread, I have come to respect each and every one of you. You are all so knowledgeable and eager to share it with a complete stranger.

I understand that by asking what your favourite port is I am asking an open question. That is exactly what I want and wasn't asking for a decision to be made for me. So many people have given me lots of "food for thought". Previously I have looked at the itineraries of the various small sized ships and when I made my decision I spend an enormous amount of time researching the area. I try not to go on the ship's tours except when I have concerns about my safety.

I am interested in architecture, art, history, understanding cultures. I enjoy people watching and interacting with the locals to better understand them. People fascinate me.

Ruby, thank you for the wake-up call. I really seem rigid even to myself.
I promise that I will be more flexible.
I promise that I will be more flexible.
I promise that I will be more flexible...........

Doug,
Thanks for the recommendation. I will follow it up as soon as I unpack.

Thanks everyone
Fran

[PRINSENDAM]

[quote name='franu']

I am interested in architecture, art, history, understanding cultures. I enjoy people watching and interacting with the locals to better understand them. People fascinate me.


Doug,
Thanks for the recommendation. I will follow it up as soon as I unpack.

Thanks everyone
Fran[/quote]


Fran, Doug, Conte Di Savoia... & the rest of the gang here.......

HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!

This thread has been a bit sleep for a while so I have not been checking in, but it now seems that everyone is awake!

Doug is quite right about PRINSENDAM. Wonderful ship. I have made several cruises in her and she is a favourite. That said, even as a die- hard Holland America passenger, SAGA ROSE and SAGA RUBY are better. The ships are more traditional and that is a big plus. Saga's style of doing things is top notch also... without going overboard.

I have only visited SPIRIT OF ADVENTURE but I felt some good vibes. I'm hoping to sail in her this coming August.

Tomorrow is the big day of the year for Saga. The ROSE and RUBY will be departing from Southampton at the start of their grand voyages for 2008. In forty-six days the ROSE will be here in Sydney and it is my turn to board. I understand that there will be between 350 and 400 passengers on board. She ship isn't crowded when she is full but with 400 she is like a private yacht!

Again, Happy New Year to everyone!

Stephen

[Alan2504]

It seems the Saga Rose is popular with those starting a new life down under!

here's a link to a rather touching story:

[url]http://shiphappenzz.wordpress.com/2008/01/03/never-too-old-to-cruise-and-start-a-new-life/[/url]

Hope all goes well for both of them!

[Saga Ruby]

[FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2]Alan 2504 - Welcome to our thread! What a lovely, touching story. I was fascinated with the wife who, at the age of 87, is looking forward to working a quarter-acre garden. And a man in triple digits of age who looks forward to a new life in New Zealand - one can only admire these people. It is a joy to hear stories in which a couple has found wedded bliss. Life is what you make it.[/SIZE][/FONT]

[SIZE=2][FONT=Verdana]About Spirit of Adventure - I have heard good things about this ship if one is willing to give up that 10th of a level of luxury. I was impressed when told that a group of 90 people recently came off an SoA cruise to Antartica and 83 of them immediately booked another cruise. [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=2][FONT=Verdana]Fran, I also am a devoted people watcher. To me, sitting at an outside table in the Piazza San Marco, watching the parade of nations pass by as I pay $10 for a bottle of water, is about as good as it gets. I may be a creature of habit at home but when I travel, all bets are off. In days gone by, I was nervous on my first day alone in, say, Paris, hoping I would find the railway, the cab, a café, or be able to wend my way back to a new hotel. Now I embrace whatever experience is going to happen. If I get on a westbound Tube train instead of eastbound, I ride to the end of the line to see what there is to see and to people watch. [/FONT][/SIZE][SIZE=2][FONT=Verdana]You and I have similar thoughts for a vacation destination - I avoid ship’s shorex. When I am overseas, I cash in the hours of research done at home and then embrace the best possible "day in . . . ." [/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=2][FONT=Verdana]According to Prinsendam, [I]Saga Rose[/I] and [I]Saga Ruby[/I] are now off to see the world. Bon voyage, bon chance to those marvelous Saga Sisters.[/FONT][/SIZE]

[SIZE=2][FONT=Verdana]Ruby[/FONT][/SIZE]

[Druke I]

You tube has an interesting video of a small ferry boat in heavy seas, the Cook Strait between North and South Islands, New Zealand.

It is listed under "ferry depart".

We'll be down in those waters, on Oceania's Nautica, cruise of 1-22-09, New Zealand and Australia.

[Saga Ruby]

I have admired Conte's collection of maritime memorabilia and artwork. I am now able to announce proudly that I accidentally stumbled upon the Passenger List from our Empress of Britain crossing from Montreal to Liverpool in 1957. It has a glossy brochure cover with pages of listings of first class and tourist passengers along with "while ashore" information and how to use the cable office.

In the same place, I found the original sticker that should have been pasted on one of my Canadian Pacific bags. My father was firm about no one having more than two pieces of luggage - since I didn't need the third sticker I kept it then stored it away.

I also found a postcard from our cruise in 1959 featuring that awful Yarmouth Castle - the terrible story of her demise and the disgrace of the Greek bridge staff's abandonment of their passengers lives on long after her sinking. The Greeks were the first ones in the lifeboats and first at the rescue ship where the ship's captain directed the Yarmouth's captain to return and fulfill his duties to his passengers.

Now I can at least hold my head up as some of you bring forth the most marvelous souvenirs of classic liners - artwork and souvenirs of crossings gone by.

I know, I know, I should be posting the luggage tag and the passenger list on this thread but - oh dear, I feel a case of the vapors coming on.

Ruby

[PRINSENDAM]

[quote name='Druke I']You tube has an interesting video of a small ferry boat in heavy seas, the Cook Strait between North and South Islands, New Zealand.

It is listed under "ferry depart".

We'll be down in those waters, on Oceania's Nautica, cruise of 1-22-09, New Zealand and Australia.[/quote]


Check out Y TUBE

SAGA ROSE BIG WAVE ;)


Stephen

[Conte Di Savoia]

[quote name='Saga Ruby']I have admired Conte's collection of maritime memorabilia and artwork. I am now able to announce proudly that I accidentally stumbled upon the Passenger List from our Empress of Britain crossing from Montreal to Liverpool in 1957.
Ruby[/QUOTE]

I also collected newspaper articles about ships. Years ago, when ocean liners were more well known among the general public, these stories would appear with some regularity. The New York Times and Herald Tribune even had marine editors. One of my favorite articles was [url=http://select.nytimes.com/mem/archive/pdf?res=F5081EFD3A5B1A7B93CAA8178DD85F438685F9]this one[/url] from the June 18, 1967 NYT which discussed, of all topics, funnel design. It has now appeared in the NYT on-line archive and in light of our recent speculation about whether the new Saga ship will have a central funnel, I thought it would be fun to post here. Notice that it refers to the QE2 by its code name, Q4. (Q3 was never built, but that is another and very interesting story.)

[Saga Ruby]

[quote name='Conte Di Savoia']The New York Times and Herald Tribune even had marine editors. One of my favorite articles was [URL="http://select.nytimes.com/mem/archive/pdf?res=F5081EFD3A5B1A7B93CAA8178DD85F438685F9"]this one[/URL] from the June 18, 1967 NYT which discussed, of all topics, funnel design. It has now appeared in the NYT on-line archive and in light of our recent speculation about whether the new Saga ship will have a central funnel, I thought it would be fun to post here. Notice that it refers to the QE2 by its code name, Q4. (Q3 was never built, but that is another and very interesting story.)[/quote]

Conte - I have a user name and password for the NYT but can't "reach" this article. The Times wants me to re-enter all my personal info and I ain't gonna do it. Can you cut and paste or use another link? I suspect that the rest of us won't be able to access the online archives without major effort and I would enjoy reading this article.

Ruby

[Conte Di Savoia]

Sorry about that Ruby, but apparently I have access to this article because we get home delivery. I think copying it would be against copyright and therefore cannot do that.

[Kapricorn]

Ruby, the mention of finding your Empress of Britain passenger list made me look up the booklets which I still possess from my first four sailings. I love the cover of American Export Lines' Atlantic from 1963. The Empress of Canada's 1964 booklet would be similar to yours. The 1972 Incres Line's Victoria booklet is classic in its simple yet elegant design. The 1982 Song of Norway booklet strove to be modern, with the names of RCI ships in a wavy line at the bottom. I consider the discontinuance of passenger lists to be a major loss.

Donald d'Maniac.

[Saga Ruby]

[quote name='Conte Di Savoia']Sorry about that Ruby, but apparently I have access to this article because we get home delivery. I think copying it would be against copyright and therefore cannot do that.[/quote]

I signed up for home delivery of the Sunday NYT in last spring. In three weeks, I got one copy one time. So I canceled. If the Times can't get their paper delivered to a customer, so be it. Harumph.

[quote name='Kapricorn']Ruby, the mention of finding your Empress of Britain passenger list made me look up the booklets which I still possess from my first four sailings. I love the cover of American Export Lines' Atlantic from 1963. The Empress of Canada's 1964 booklet would be similar to yours. The 1972 Incres Line's Victoria booklet is classic in its simple yet elegant design. The 1982 Song of Norway booklet strove to be modern, with the names of RCI ships in a wavy line at the bottom. I consider the discontinuance of passenger lists to be a major loss. Donald d'Maniac.[/quote]

Thanks for posting those covers. It is, indeed, intriguing to read and review the passenger lists and your Canadian Pacific cover is a near clone of mine. I agree with you - what a pity there no longer are passenger lists. I understand that they would be difficult for shorter cruises, but 25-35 days? Cannot we be accommodated for a cruise of that length? The answer, of course, is silence from the cruise lines. Oh woe, oh woe.

To Stephen - I have heard in the wind that you were a sea captain, perhaps merchant marine? I would enjoy hearing a personal experience with huge waves from your side of the bridge.

Ruby

[Kapricorn]

[quote name='Saga Ruby']
I agree with you - what a pity there no longer are passenger lists. I understand that they would be difficult for shorter cruises, but 25-35 days? Cannot we be accommodated for a cruise of that length? The answer, of course, is silence from the cruise lines. Oh woe, oh woe.
[/quote]

The SS [I]United States[/I] had passenger lists for its 4- or 5-day transatlantic crossings, and other ocean liners always had these. I don't see why passenger lists cannot be published nowadays for week-long round-trip cruises. There has to be a specific reason for their demise. The popular magazine, [I]Cruise Travel[/I], had an article about passenger lists early last year, but, unfortunately I missed that issue.

Speaking of magazines, the British [I]Cruise[/I] magazine seems to have been discontinued during mid-last year, and its website even closed. I always enjoyed reading their issues, especially their "Liners from the Past." That section in its last issue, Spring 2007, covered the [I]Caronia[/I].

Donald.

[Conte Di Savoia]

I also miss the wonderful menus with artful covers which made them great collectibles. While I still ask for a set of menus before disembarking any ship, they are far less interesting than they used to be.

The one I am posting here is not from a ship that any of us traveled upon. I think I mentioned earlier in the thread that I am the "caretaker" of a wonderful painting that Stephen did of the North German Lloyd liners [i]Bremen[/i] and [i]Europa[/i] from the 1920's. That has been motivation to collect a few items from these ships. [url=http://www.travelserver.net/travelpage/aspgallery/pictures/Ad_2779_7.jpg]This menu[/url] is from the [i]Bremen[/i] from August, 1939 just a few days before the outbreak of WWII and is one of the most interesting menus in my extensive collection. The picture is an example of propaganda of the time and portrays a laborer at the steel mill in Essen. The German caption should be translated as "The German Nation Works". It represents the antithesis of what we associate with the good times and conviviality of travel on board ships. I find it both horrofic and sobering.

[Kapricorn]

Conte, thanks for the illustration of the [I]Bremen[/I] menu cover! If I was on that particular crossing, that menu cover would have made me nervous and cause me to order another martini. I read somewhere that when war broke out, and the [I]Bremen [/I]sailed a southerly route to avoid British warships, American passengers nervously asked the Captain if they were indeed heading to America, and he teasingly replied that a cannibal chieftain had bribed him to bring them to his Caribbean island. What a great sense of humour!

Donald.

[Druke I]

Reference Passenger Lists - last one I received was either on the Golden Odyssey, 11-86, Hong Kong to Singapore, or perhaps on Crown Odyssey, 11-88, Mexican Riviera RT San Francisco. Either one, it is packed away someplace!

For you liner buffs (snobs?), [url]www.maritimematters.com[/url] has a couple of interesting photos of Queen Victoria and QEII, running together on an Atlantic crossing, in heavy seas. Victoria heavily down by the bow, and Elizabeth cresting a swell, with lots of Plimsol red at the bow showing.

[Saga Ruby]

[quote name='Conte Di Savoia']I find it both horrofic and sobering.[/quote]

[FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2]Statten Deutscher Arbeit - it makes my blood run cold as the word "arbeit" does every time I see it. Arbeit Macht Frei - murderous words reverberating throughout history. [/SIZE][/FONT][SIZE=2][FONT=Verdana]I didn’t realize that, by 1939, the fascist movement had already reached the shores of the Lloyd company, enough to have the party line on a menu cover for an ocean liner crossing. It is, indeed, sobering.[/FONT][/SIZE]

About menus onboard ships nowadays - on most of my cruises, my waiters present me with that cruise's menus but they are simply the paper inserts of each day's offerings. No covers. So I can remember the meals but no cruise-specific artwork. [heavy sigh] Do the luxury ships like [I]Seabourn [/I]hand out artwork menus or go the generic route?

[SIZE=2][FONT=Verdana]Ruby[/FONT][/SIZE]

[Conte Di Savoia]

[quote name='Saga Ruby']
Do the luxury ships like [I]Seabourn [/I]hand out artwork menus or go the generic route?
[SIZE=2][FONT=Verdana]Ruby[/FONT][/SIZE][/QUOTE]

Sadly, there is no more artwork on any line with which I have traveled. SilverSea, Regent and the grills on Cunard have all opted for the insert. We did, however, receive a passenger list on our last cruise on SilverSea three years ago.

[Kapricorn]

When I was on the [I]Westerdam[/I] to Alaska in 1999, we had the menus with the artwork covers. On the last evening, the waiters provided each diner with a collection of the menus for the past week. Had I known that these would be the last such ones, I would not have thrown them away.

Donald d'Maniac.

[CGTNORMANDIE]

[B]CLASSIC OCEAN LINER MENUS: [/B]My favorite topic!!!

HI CONTE, What a contrast your 1939 BREMEN/EUROPA menu is to my 1929 collection of BREMEN/EUROPA menus. Mine are wonderful, fanciful, colorful works of art. I have an extensive collection of BREMEN/EUROPA from the 20's and early 30's and they are classic art pieces...inside and out. Your 1939 menu is dark and colorless...a harbinger of things to come. When the war id break out on September 1st 1939...the BREMEN left New York a few nights afterwards and sailed a northerly route...ending up in Russia before returning to Germany. As the BREMEN left New York that September evening...all the ships complement turned out above deck and gave the **** salute as she sailed out of NY harbor...a harsh reminder of what was to come.

I love the classic liner menus...and there is nothing like them on today's ships. Printing a new menu each day on a fresh cover with wonderful art work was one of the great surprises that each passenger looked forward to. Nothing can come close to the epicurean banquets that were prepared on some of the classic liners. The QUEEN MARY had more than 9 courses offered each evening with a selection of roasted game dishes and a hot savory course on top of the usual feast. The first meal I ever had onboard a ship was in the First Class Dining Room of the "old" QUEEN ELIZABETH. You can imagine my surprise...as a 16 year old traveler. The breakfast menu had 3 types of bacon, 3 types of sausage and more dishes than I ever thought existed. I was stunned...and never forgot it...I can picture that room, the menu and the steward in my mind...clearly...today...even as I write this.

Ross

[franu]

In these days of computer generated art I really can't understand why we don't get beautiful and interesting menus. Creativity can still be utilized in a positive way. Perhaps even having pax create covers and entered into a contest.

I believe that the passenger lists are another thing all together. They have probably disappeared because of the litigious public. If someone is bothered by another pax or harmed in any way here comes the lawyer. Privacy is much more of an issue now than it was years ago. The cruise lines are leery about how pax will use this info.
Fran

[Kapricorn]

While passenger lists used to be a great way to keep track of all our cruises, I now keep my pass-keys to do so. I now have 27 pass-keys. I'm curious if anyone else here have kept theirs, or discarded them?

Donald.

[Conte Di Savoia]

Duplicate Post

[Conte Di Savoia]

I keep mine. The photos are particularly awful, so I don't show them to anyone.
This, of course, reminds me of another "in the old days story". One year I was vacationing on St. Maarten on a non-cruise vacation with my brother and sister-in-law. One morning I spied [i]Angelina Lauro[/i] at anchor in Philipsburg harbor. So off we went to the pier in town, boarded a tender and toured around the ship. No questions were asked, no ID asked for or checked.
Ah, the good old days!

[Kapricorn]

Ah, these good old days of boarding ships when they were open to anyone, passengers or visitors! I noticed that security had increased to an absurd degree in Los Angeles when I and the other passengers boarded the [I]Vision of the Seas[/I] a month ago. First, the guard at the entrance to the dock checked passports & tickets, then the guard at the X-ray machine checked the same passports & tickets, and [I]then[/I] the ship's guards checked the same passports and tickets. After the first two checkpoints, everybody had put away their passports and tickets in their purses or pockets, and then there we had to search and drag these out again for the ship's guards. This caused a bottleneck at the gangplank. That was security overkill, in my opinion. The odds of an unauthorized person making it past the first two checkpoints are remote.

Photos, Conte? None of my pass-keys has my photo on them. These are generic ones which everyone else on the ship has.

Donald.