Wow. Pride of Hawaii Taken Out of Hawaii Service - to be moved to Europe!

[Leafpeeper]

I think the lack of gambling on a ship is definetely a huge financial loss. When we sailed on RCCL, we could gamble at night sailing between ports. I don't understand the restriction on NCL.

 

I would like to see a mixed crew of Americans and other nationalities. A cruiseship is a great place for culinary students to get their hours in for their degrees. I know my son was paid minimum wage during his internship at a Florida Keys Resort. He landed a job at Four Seasons after graduation so the training paid off.

 

We are looking for a European cruise similar to the one RCCL is running this year from England to Ireland, Scotland, France, Holland, and Norway. Unfortunately, this itinerary is being change to Russian and Scandinavia for 2008, which is when I want to go. Maybe Pride of Hawaii will offer me the British Isles and Norway in 2008. Can't wait to see.

[mbisson]

I think the lack of gambling on a ship is definetely a huge financial loss. When we sailed on RCCL, we could gamble at night sailing between ports. I don't understand the restriction on NCL.

.

 

Don't know where your RCCL cruise(s) have been but the restriction to NCLA is due to Hawaii Law. I don't know how long it's existed (the law that is, not the state ;) )

[ohioNCLcruiser]

I don't think anyone will be "fired." don't they work on contract? I'm sure NCLA will make sure all the contracts will end on 02/2008.

 

more of a term agreement. No contract like the international ships. Its not really in ink you can give 2 weeks notice whenever you want.

[electricron]

Don't know where your RCCL cruise(s) have been but the restriction to NCLA is due to Hawaii Law. I don't know how long it's existed (the law that is, not the state ;) )

There's no gambling in Hawaii, per State law. Cruise ships sailing round trip cruises from Honolulu can't have gambing throughout that cruise. I'm not sure if that limitation is a State or City law. Cruise ships not making round trip cruises can have gambing once they depart Hawaiian seas.

 

Unforunately, all exclusive Hawaiian cruises usually don't leave Hawaiian seas. Also, as with the Wind, round trip cruises from Honolulu, even those going to Fanning Island, can't have gambing either.

 

It's against State law to posses gambling equipment. If NCL didn't remove the equipment, Hawaii would. That's why NCL removes gambling equipment from the ships sailing round trip cruises.

 

I believe Hawaii alllows cruise ships not making round trip cruises from Honolulu to keep gambling equipment aboard as a thanks for coming their way occassionally. Never-the-less, they expect the casinos aboard these ships to be locked up tighter than a drum while in Hawaiian seas.

[exnav29]

It looks like NCL has finally realized that the NCLA concept is not working. Thankfully they are taking steps to alleviate this disaster.

 

I do not see NCL bringing the Pride Hawaii back to Hawaii. After next year's season in Europe they will see the amount of revenue they are making with the ships new casino (alone) along with much reduced crew salaries, Hawaii will be nothing more than an awful distant memory.

 

Hats off to NCL for having tried this "experiment" with NCLA. But now it is time to get back to the business of making money.

[mbisson]

It looks like NCL has finally realized that the NCLA concept is not working. Thankfully they are taking steps to alleviate this disaster.

 

I do not see NCL bringing the Pride Hawaii back to Hawaii. After next year's season in Europe they will see the amount of revenue they are making with the ships new casino (alone) along with much reduced crew salaries, Hawaii will be nothing more than an awful distant memory.

 

Hats off to NCL for having tried this "experiment" with NCLA. But now it is time to get back to the business of making money.

 

I wouldn't say that leaving 2 ships in Hawaii is really leaving it as an "awful distant memory". And I'm sure from their other ships that they're familiar with how much money they can expect from the casino and the amount that crew salaries will be reduced.

 

I don't think the experiment is over or yet a failure.

 

-Monte

[honestguy]

I wouldn't say that leaving 2 ships in Hawaii is really leaving it as an "awful distant memory". And I'm sure from their other ships that they're familiar with how much money they can expect from the casino and the amount that crew salaries will be reduced.

 

I don't think the experiment is over or yet a failure.

 

-Monte

 

 

Oh I think its a big signal. I think its quite possible there will no longer be an NCLA. They just can't keep bleeding money like this. At the same time there is no way that could just pull all three ships at the same time. its something that has to be done slowly. we didnt get 3 ships in hawaii overnite.

[smeyer418]

I belive that NCL and NCL A have a committment to Hawaii but if there crowds aren't there to support these ships they will leave. Cutting the number in half should increase the price of the cruises. But time will tell...

[ce2000]

I don't think that NCLA should throw in the towel. I believe that it is now possible for NCLA to turn a profit in 2008, due to the fact that the fares should increase and the shortage of help should decrease. I believe that there is a niche market for NCLA, that could be profitable, just like Disney serves a niche market, but is very profitable with no casino.

[ohioNCLcruiser]

if ncla starts filling up their two ships but still loses a little money..would that be better then shutting down and giving the business to other companies?

[DKMDE]

Guess we'll see if they change the name from PoH to the Norwegian Sapphire...

I like that name, however, I think that it could be named the Norwegian Song. Technically, it has a familliar name (RCCL's 1st ship Song of Norway). It's possible.

Of course, the ship will probably recieve a casino. All of NCL's ships have one (except for the Wind, which is on its final voyage anyway).

[honestguy]

I don't think that NCLA should throw in the towel. I believe that it is now possible for NCLA to turn a profit in 2008, due to the fact that the fares should increase and the shortage of help should decrease. I believe that there is a niche market for NCLA, that could be profitable, just like Disney serves a niche market, but is very profitable with no casino.

 

 

NCLA lost moey with one ship they lost money with 2 ships, and they lost money with 3 ships. until they figure out how to retain staff they will lose money. its ashame the amount of money they lose training new staff.

[Deck10 007]

Such alot of postings and it took me some time to read all.

My first reaction is don't just see the trees but also the forest. First the Wind now the POH and my thoughts are with NCLA itself. I have said before it cannot be done with an American crew and Mikekaye calls me the cheerleader for the demise of NCLA. Mike, maybe what I said before would eventually turn out to be true.

When Tan Sri Lim first look at the Hawaiian market things look more than right to him. Under the existing law he could use his large modern ship now called the NCL Spirit which can do 30 knots and reach a foreign port Fanning Island and homeport in Hawaii. But his world turned upside down when the local Sanator whose wife was on the board of the small local cruise company managed to change the Federal law to prevent him from doing exactly what he wanted to do.

That he decided to proceed regardless and NCLA was born is the fateful decision that he made. It just goes against all the stengh he possess with his Star Cruises compamy. His casino revenue is second to none, his Asian crew cost him a small fraction of the International crew he first employed.

I understand he is presently diong the same with NCl. This American crew is something else out of this world. His only strengh he could use is his Asian aquired killer app known as freestyke dining.

So this NCLA and not just the POH or other ships is at stake here.

[sunshine 229]

I just re-read some of the release from NCL(A?) and noticed this section:

 

We continue to have a vision of a strong domestic cruise industry in Hawai`i and firmly believe that the combination of steps we have now taken will result in a strong NCL America delivering the best cruise itinerary anywhere in the world with the very highest standard of service at sea," Veitch concluded

Combination of steps? Has NCL other changes planned or announced for these ships?

 

[mbisson]

It could be considered that not sending the Sun to Hawaii and having other ships do occasional cruises to Fanning would be a step (and of course taking the POH away is another step)

[sunshine 229]

I'm sorry I haven't been following this discussion for a while and I'm at a loss. Does NCL now have some west coast cruises that go out to Fanning Island without doing Hawaii?

[cruizinwithkids]

I'm sorry I haven't been following this discussion for a while and I'm at a loss. Does NCL now have some west coast cruises that go out to Fanning Island without doing Hawaii?

 

No

 

NCL had an international staffed ship that cruised from Honolulu on 10 and 11 day cruises that included Fanning Island. In December they announced that this ship was no longer going to follow that schedule. They now have an NCLA ship - the Pride of Aloha doing 10 and 11 day cruises from Honolulu - sometimes they include Fanning Island. More often they do not.

 

NCL has also redeployed the Pride of Hawaii. (obviously as you have looked at this thread) So the choices USED TO BE 10 and 11 day cruises with international crews and four days at sea including Fanning Island; AND 3 different 7 day cruises on American staffed ships. The choices now are simpler 7 day on the Pride of America OR 10 and 11 day on the Pride of Aloha.

 

Staffing the American ships seems to have been one of the bigger problems. Now they can redirect the crew from three ships to two. In addition I read that 15% of the crew can now be international. Hopefully this will allow NCLA to offer a better product and they will be able to increase the demand, by decreasing the supply. Hopefully this will reduce operating costs while increasing revenue.

 

I was booked on a 10 day Sun cruise. I am now on a 10 day Pride of Aloha cruise. I am personally very excited as I will now see more of Hawaii on what will hopefully be a fully or near fully staffed ship. It's all good for me.:)

[sunshine 229]

No

 

NCL had an international staffed ship that cruised from Honolulu on 10 and 11 day cruises that included Fanning Island. In December they announced that this ship was no longer going to follow that schedule. They now have an NCLA ship - the Pride of Aloha doing 10 and 11 day cruises from Honolulu - sometimes they include Fanning Island. More often they do not.

 

NCL has also redeployed the Pride of Hawaii. (obviously as you have looked at this thread) So the choices USED TO BE 10 and 11 day cruises with international crews and four days at sea including Fanning Island; AND 3 different 7 day cruises on American staffed ships. The choices now are simpler 7 day on the Pride of America OR 10 and 11 day on the Pride of Aloha.

 

Staffing the American ships seems to have been one of the bigger problems. Now they can redirect the crew from three ships to two. In addition I read that 15% of the crew can now be international. Hopefully this will allow NCLA to offer a better product and they will be able to increase the demand, by decreasing the supply. Hopefully this will reduce operating costs while increasing revenue.

 

I was booked on a 10 day Sun cruise. I am now on a 10 day Pride of Aloha cruise. I am personally very excited as I will now see more of Hawaii on what will hopefully be a fully or near fully staffed ship. It's all good for me.:)

 

Thanks for attempting to answer my question, cruizinwithkids. I did know that they used to have internationally crewed ships that did a few days in Hawaii and then made a run to Fanning Island. I think the Star was doing that for a couple of seasons and maybe the Wind too? What is confusing me is this statement from the post above:

 

It could be considered that not sending the Sun to Hawaii and having other ships do occasional cruises to Fanning would be a step

 

I am wondering what 'other ships' NCL might be sending to Fanning island and why they would do that.

[PDAZ]

The Pride of Aloha will start hitting Fanning Island on some cruises in the fall.

[mbisson]

 

I am wondering what 'other ships' NCL might be sending to Fanning island and why they would do that.

 

Sorry Sunshine-I guess I wasn't clear. Never meant to suggest that any ship would visit Fanning from the West Coast. The Aloha was what I was referring to as making occasional visits to Fanning. I said "occasional" as not all of it's 10-11 day itineraries will go there. Looking at the itineraries some of those 10-11 day trips do not go to Fanning but instead stay in Hawaii.

 

-Monte

[honestguy]

No

 

 

Staffing the American ships seems to have been one of the bigger problems. Now they can redirect the crew from three ships to two. In addition I read that 15% of the crew can now be international. Hopefully this will allow NCLA to offer a better product and they will be able to increase the demand, by decreasing the supply. Hopefully this will reduce operating costs while increasing revenue.

 

I was booked on a 10 day Sun cruise. I am now on a 10 day Pride of Aloha cruise. I am personally very excited as I will now see more of Hawaii on what will hopefully be a fully or near fully staffed ship. It's all good for me.:)

 

 

NCL couldnt keep the aloha staffed when thats all they had. they couldnt keep the america or the aloha staffed before they had the hawaii. It will be no different now. They will continue to struggle with staffing until they change the way they do things

[ohioNCLcruiser]

NCL couldnt keep the aloha staffed when thats all they had. they couldnt keep the america or the aloha staffed before they had the hawaii. It will be no different now. They will continue to struggle with staffing until they change the way they do things

 

maybe now though they know how to bring in enought workers. They learned their lesson that they were getting too few people with those ships so maybe now they know? When I left piney point there were about 375 people and most were going to be there for a long time because the ships were full.

[Globaliser]

maybe now though they know how to bring in enought workers. They learned their lesson that they were getting too few people with those ships so maybe now they know?

NCLA could certainly recruit enough decent people now for two ships, if they try. But it will be costly to maintain a recruiting/training capacity that was designed to feed three ships when only two ships need to be crewed. The danger for NCLA is that the temptation will be to cut back too much on the recruitment/training side, and that NCLA will once again fall back into the pit of having insufficient good people.

 

In addition, it has probably now been demonstrated that NCLA will always have the problem that it is unlikely to be able to get the career crew that international fleets attract. There is likely always to be a more transient component to the crewing, a higher turnover rate, and therefore permanently higher recurring costs than originally budgeted.

[sunshine 229]

In addition, it has probably now been demonstrated that NCLA will always have the problem that it is unlikely to be able to get the career crew that international fleets attract. There is likely always to be a more transient component to the crewing, a higher turnover rate, and therefore permanently higher recurring costs than originally budgeted.

 

 

Very valid point. One problem is to get enough staff to keep the ships running well, the other problem is to do it at a cost that will keep the whole operation economically feasible.

 

These ships already have to pay higher wages and don't get gambling revenues. Having to spend more on training, as an ongoing expense, due to rapid turnover isn't going to help, especially since the past couple of years experience seems to indicate that they are having trouble filling these ships at the present relatively reasonable fares. The outlook for being able to increase revenue by increasing fares does not look good.

[sunshine 229]

The Pride of Aloha will start hitting Fanning Island on some cruises in the fall.

 

 

Thanks for clarifying.

 

Have they made any statements about why they are doing this?

 

I was under the impression that one of the reasons they were so eager to start running American flagged ships in Hawaii was that it would allow them to avoid the several day run to Fanning Island which many passengers saw as a waste of time in the middle of a Hawaii cruise.

 

I guess, if they only do it on an occasional basis it might attract the odd few customers who did enjoy that part of the earlier cruises and give them a destination that none of the other cruise lines have.

 

It will put pressure on them to do a better job of the on board experience though, won't it?

 

It is one thing to sell the cruise as a port intensive one focused on the beauty of Hawaii and to expect passengers to be satisfied to treat the ship mostly as tranportation between the islands and a floating Motel 6 at night, it's another to expect them to spend three or four days trapped in a Motel 6, as they make their way to and from Fanning Island.