how does carnival get away with.........

[wingman152000]

BTW how do you think they pay for all these new ships they keep on building?

[shipty2]

Here is a good book "Cruise Confidential: A Hit Below the Waterline" By Brian David Bruns

http://www.amazon.ca/Cruise-Confidential-Hit-Below-Waterline/dp/193236160X

 

 

I just read this book and highly recommend it.

[Drew B]

It just seems that everybody is just overly concerned about issues that matter so little and that they have no business even questioning. If someone wants to work that is their choice...the issue of fairness is moot. We need to get realistic nowadays...I say let them work if they want to to...who are we to judge fairness when it comes to what job a person takes. As long as it is legal, how someone supports their family doesn't need to "seem fair" to a total stranger.

 

:confused:

 

I will never understand how expressing concern or sympathy for people who are working their butts off constitutes being "overly concerned about issues that matter so little". And I don't recall the OP ever suggesting that workers shouldn't be ALLOWED to do this if it is their choice -- the question was about the legality of it.

 

I hope the responses on this thread have made the OP feel better about how the workers themselves feel about their situation. I think that if they seemed to feel exploited or unhappy, many of us wouldn't cruise because we wouldn't want to participate in that exploitation. Because they seem satisfied (and in fact happy) with their situation despite how unbearable it may seem to us, we are willing to contribute to their industry.

[crazy cajun]

This will be our first carnival cruise ,but we have taken one a year for 6 years on the old commadore lines out of new orleans.

Our first cruise we had a waiter that just made a great impression on us and we sought him out during his off times to talk to him . he was from jamaica and was very greatful to have his job.

He explained to us about his job and yes the hours were long but he also explained that he would make more for 1 contract than he could in jam. in 3-4 years. the next year we requested him as our waiter again. on our first

supper night he remembered us as well as our names. The second night when we got to the table he had left us a nice card ,thanking us for careing enough to ask to be seated w/ him.

the next cruise he was not there so i went to the pursers desk to ask of him. They told us that he had a family emergency and had to leave the ship during his contract . He was back on the ship but was no longer a waiter. If they leave or don't renew their contract and are rehired they have to start all over again as a bar back or bus boy and work their way back up.

He had worked his way up to bartender and when he finished the contract he was on at that time he would make waiter again.

I still keep in touch w/ donovan and he is on another line and he says that in 2-3 years they are looking to make him a maitre'd.

He is looking forward to that as he says the pay is not alot more than a waiters w/ tips ,but the hours are alot better.

Thanks Donovan, Bob

[wingman152000]

thanks for all the replys........and i also didn't realize that all employees don't all sleep on level 1. I just figured if you were employeed by carnival you all slept on the same level. I always thought about being a cruise director but decided to be a flight attendant instead.

 

good choice!

[Nunu]

Any sympathy for me? My days can run 12-14 hours.. I bust my rear..

no one is forcing me... or them.. I love my job.. I bet some of them do too!

 

Good, now make me a sandwich. :)

[WALLYCBIA]

My nephew works for the Army and has been in Iraq for 3 months. He works 7 days a week 12 hours a day. He has 3 months left and has been away when is daughter turned 3. He was sent over just as his dad had major back sugery and we almost lost him after the sugery. We all [even Americans] have to do what we have to do. Just think about the hours our service people work while they are over seas.

[vacruizer]

I agree with you 100% but too bad Carnival or any other cruise line can't just pay their employees more! Have you looked at the profit these cruise lines are making! It shouldn't have to come down to tips for them to make a half decent wage! CALL the cruise lines for what they are CHEAP!! in many ways! the bottom line is to make a BUCK and they could careless about their employees!

 

Umm, yes, the goal of a for-profit corporation is to turn as much profit as they can - just like any other business. So the bottom line IS to make a buck. Otherwise they'd be a charity. :rolleyes:

[wingman152000]

Umm, yes, the goal of a for-profit corporation is to turn as much profit as they can - just like any other business. So the bottom line IS to make a buck. Otherwise they'd be a charity. :rolleyes:

 

To make a buck yes, to make a fortune at the expense of their employees well?

[trock]

Good, now make me a sandwich. :)

 

 

Make your own damn sandwich..

 

Hey where yer been?:)

[vacruizer]

To make a buck yes, to make a fortune at the expense of their employees well?

 

You could say that about any business. I'm in an industry (banking) where I count myself lucky to even have a job right now. No raises this year, no bonuses, incentive programs are gone - and the CEO made millions last year. No point in being bitter or thinking they are making a fortune at my expense - I am there by choice and because I love what I do. Carnival's employees may very well not think it's at their expense - otherwise they wouldn't be there.

[wingman152000]

You could say that about any business. I'm in an industry (banking) where I count myself lucky to even have a job right now. No raises this year, no bonuses, incentive programs are gone - and the CEO made millions last year. No point in being bitter or thinking they are making a fortune at my expense - I am there by choice and because I love what I do. Carnival's employees may very well not think it's at their expense - otherwise they wouldn't be there.

 

Maybe that why we are in the shape in are in today.

[Kurbanfan]

To make a buck yes, to make a fortune at the expense of their employees well?

 

At what expense:confused:

[vacruizer]

Maybe that why we are in the shape in are in today.

 

 

Ah, but it's easy for everyone to bash the big, bad corporations. Banks in particular these days. And sure, they screwed up plenty. But everyone sees simply the profit or the ceo bonuses and doesn't realize that the livliehood of tens of thousands of "little people" depends on that bank. And as part of my job I provide a valuable service to the people of my community. So that big bank not only helps the community by providing a service, but it also helps by keeping a roof over my head.

 

Same goes for Carnival. They wouldn't be able to stay in business if they staffed by U.S. wage standards. But if they went out of business there would be many, many employees far worse off than they are now.

 

We met a great bartender on the Liberty last year - he had been with Carnival something like 21 years and absolutely loved what he did. He did miss his family a lot, but also chose that life because he was happy and helping his family. Most cruise employees I've met are thrilled to be there - they are working to feed their families, maybe get a better education eventually, maybe be able to start a business one day back home, or buy a house - same as the rest of us are. And very few of them feel like Carnival is making money at their expense - it's when Carnival stops making money they have to worry as unemployment is around the corner.

[mzche1999]

THANKS FIGS!!!!!

 

Yeah I was just curious about how they got around the labor laws....but again thanks for all the responses!

 

You have to know that many, many places here in the US find a way to get around said labor laws EVERYDAY! While vacationing in Hawaii, our waitress at dinner at 11:00 PM was also working at a donut shop at 6:00 AM the next morning. The cost of living is high there and I hear that many people have more than one job.

 

While in college I worked 2 summers at a huge amusement park here in Ohio. They hire thousands of people every summer...most are college kids. When we were hired, we were told that while you did not get OT, you did get a summer bonus at the conclusion of your contract. Very few people made it to the end of their contract and thus forfeited their bonus.

 

The conditions were just short of barbaric. I lived in an apartment with 15 other girls...5 bedrooms, 2 baths and one ROTARY phone (This was in the late 1990's). The work was brutal! I sold juice out of a cart in the hot sun. What was I thinking?? People quit daily. That first summer, I lasted 15 days. I exercised my right to choose and I chose to quit. I did return two summer later. Why? I got a job as a supervisor. Sweet apartment and more money. I had one of the best summers of my life. I finished my contract and received a bonus big enough to purchase my wedding dress.

 

This whole issue does boil down to choice. We sometimes believe that people don't have one, but they do. If anything, the harder jobs I have had made me realize that I never want to be in a position to have to settle for a job. They made me more determined to finish college and have a career that I love.

 

Hugs,

Chelle

[Nunu]

Make your own damn sandwich..

 

Hey where yer been?:)

 

Thank god for early release.

[vacruizer]

You have to know that many, many places here in the US find a way to get around said labor laws EVERYDAY! While vacationing in Hawaii, our waitress at dinner at 11:00 PM was also working at a donut shop at 6:00 AM the next morning. The cost of living is high there and I hear that many people have more than one job.

 

While in college I worked 2 summers at a huge amusement park here in Ohio. They hire thousands of people every summer...most are college kids. When we were hired, we were told that while you did not get OT, you did get a summer bonus at the conclusion of your contract. Very few people made it to the end of their contract and thus forfeited their bonus.

 

The conditions were just short of barbaric. I lived in an apartment with 15 other girls...5 bedrooms, 2 baths and one ROTARY phone (This was in the late 1990's). The work was brutal! I sold juice out of a cart in the hot sun. What was I thinking?? People quit daily. That first summer, I lasted 15 days. I exercised my right to choose and I chose to quit. I did return two summer later. Why? I got a job as a supervisor. Sweet apartment and more money. I had one of the best summers of my life. I finished my contract and received a bonus big enough to purchase my wedding dress.

 

This whole issue does boil down to choice. We sometimes believe that people don't have one, but they do. If anything, the harder jobs I have had made me realize that I never want to be in a position to have to settle for a job. They made me more determined to finish college and have a career that I love.

 

Hugs,

Chelle

 

I also worked for an amusement park in my college days in the early 90s - sounds like I had a much better experience but you are right about the pay! Anyone here in the U.S. considered "seasonal" workers gets no overtime pay - no matter how many hours you work it's straight time. I used to work 12 and 15 hours days with an hour drive on each end and not a dime of OT. You had to work through Labor Day to get the year end bonus so none of the college kids could get it if they went back to school in August. I made my choices, had a blast for a few summers, and can still tell you more than you ever wanted to know about roller coaster operations. :p But I think I made about 3.40 an hours for sometimes 70-80 hours a week at that time.

 

Same goes for waitstaff here. 2.12 an hour - your income comes pretty much from tips alone. My checks for the 2.12 an hour were usually marked "void" because my taxes came out of that. You make your choices. I finally worked my way out of that business because I no longer wanted to deal with the tightwads and idiots my income was dependent on but that was my personal choice. I doesn't mean every restaurant is making a profit at the expense of the employees - it's just the way that business works. You'd pay 4 times what you do now to eat out if they had to pay waitstaff a living wage instead of tips.

[tedjazz]

Bait

 

Would you care to explain your accusation, I thought my comment was fair and impartial and completely true, but maybe you can explain why it's BAIT.

[tnt091605]

may i ask you a question i know your timer is a facebook timer ive tried to use this myself can i ask you how you did this? sorry im off typic but it is a cool timer

 

http://www.criticallayouts.com/content/blogcategory/350/444/

[tnt091605]

Why bother?

 

The hours they work, long or split shirts, they choose to accept. The salary the get, they choose to accept. The tips they get, they choose to accept.

Maybe they have many choices, maybe their choices are very limited. But they are their choices and are NONE of our business.

 

Dan

 

That was my point. They do not work like people on CC think they work. I bet I work more hours than they work in a week.

[Denton_Geek]

I agree with you 100% but too bad Carnival or any other cruise line can't just pay their employees more! Have you looked at the profit these cruise lines are making! It shouldn't have to come down to tips for them to make a half decent wage! CALL the cruise lines for what they are CHEAP!! in many ways! the bottom line is to make a BUCK and they could careless about their employees!

 

 

Wages are paid based on the rarity of the talent. Anybody can make a bed or carry a tray or serve a cocktail. It's why they make tips... they differentiate themselves by the service they provide to the paying customer. If you think the porter or the bartender or the waiter deserve more for the service they provide, then you are free to pay them more.

[MB1974]

The ship is not registered in the US and sails to foreign ports, so therefore it is not subject to the Jones Act. They can require whatever they want from their employees. That is why most of the crew is foreign. Most Americans will not work under some of those conditions.

 

 

I saw a show not too long ago on the travel channel. Seems they don't get paid very much either. They most often work 7 days a week too.

[Rcrand03]

This is always an interesting outrage. We lament the hours and pay that the cruise ship employees receive yet we only see half the problem. We only focus on those who work in the dining rooms and clean our staterooms. There are many people who work in other areas of the ship - cleaning, painting, maintenance, ships electrical, propulsion, PLUMBING, LAUNDRY, FOOD PREPARATION, etc. that never even get honorable mention yet these people work the same arduous hours and don't even have the chance to receive tips.

 

Here's yet another wake up call for some of you. Life at sea is hard work. It's not just restricted to the cruise line industry. What do you think our young sailors in the Navy go through. By the way, no tips there either. As a young sailor in 1973, my take home pay was $155.70 every 2 weeks. My gross pay was $377.70 per month at that time. In 2007 dollars, I was being paid the equivalent of $10.06 an hour or just slightly more than minimum wage. But this is based upon a 40 hour week. Take that same young sailor, put him on an aircraft carrier working in a squadron on jet aircraft and the situation becomes even better. Aviation sailors work a minimum 12 hour shift, every day, 7 days a week for 6-9 months at a time during a deployment. Take out maybe 3 weeks off time during port visits and that sailor will still work over 161 days (12 hr shifts minimum) on a 6 month deployment. Hourly pay during that time (84 work hours per week minimum, not 40)? $4.79 an hour in 2007 dollars. Of course, that young sailor does get full medical/dental benefits and well as quality berthing accommodations and truly gourmet dining options (and no tips).

 

So like I said, life at sea is hard work. Those who choose this difficult yet rewarding work environment deserve as much praise and financial support as we can give them.

When you figure our soldiers and sailors are also on call 24 hours a day, and really do not make that much money. If we took their pay, based on 24 hours, (I'm paid to be on call) they are making much less than minimum wage. God bless them!

[bigd from ct]

http://www.criticallayouts.com/content/blogcategory/350/444/

thank you as yo u can see ive got mine working now once again thank you

[crusinpsychRN]

Norma Rae!