Breaking News P&O is safe!

[Stitchman]

Thank you I love cake I shall totally enjoy Ventura.

 

But This is one of the most important things ever and I think every OV'er will agree with me.

The conexxions bar staged some of the funniest alternative commedians I have seen .... most off of the UK circuit. Alot of good money was spent on quality entertainment and that should carry on on all P&O ships.

 

Every ship should have a Conexxions !!!!

 

Stitch xx

 

ps I love cake ..... please make it sooner rather than later x

[daiB]

Stitchman

 

OOOHHH you are so right.

 

Never mind P&O there are many other cruise lines which are excellent and give wonderful holidays. And I am very sure that we would enjoy them all if we tried them.

 

I always say that the best P&O ship us the one you are on and that must be the same for all other ships. The best cruise ship is the one you are on at that time. What is the point of going with Princess and saying well this is not P&O or RCI and saying this is not Cunard.

 

You are on holiday do your research and enjoy your ship.

 

 

Ilovecake

 

I can see exactly why you and others are not happy. You have been given a product which you like and then you have it snatched away. I suspect I would be just as unhappy.

 

One point to remember is that, it is my understanding that a large % of OV cruisers were in fact P&O cruisers first and possibly they have evidence that these people return to P&O.

 

 

 

:):)Happy Cruising:):)

 

 

 

:cool:

 

 

Dai

[Johnthed0g]

Must say that the entertainment on OV was really good, always something going on, I know it was our first cruise & one tends to remember that one fondly, but we really haven't found one to compare, we just prefer waiter service mainly & of course the flying thing. My personal view is that OV'ers are indignant at losing their favourite ship & this reflects in the dress code thing, you can dress casually & dine in the self serve any time, nobody will say anything especially on Oceana & Ventura

[KenAndJulie]

This just epitomises the P&O we're better than you brigade.

No it doesn't, it puts forward a valid line of argument that highlights why many at P&O do not want to see the standards on their preferred cruise line being dropped to OV standards. For example, if it was the P&O brand that was disappearing and P&O passengers were insistent that OV should change to being formal cruising, I am sure the OVers would also have something to say.

Why do you think that the food, entertainment and service is much higher on P&O than on OV? When were you last on Ocean Village?

I have experienced both, and enjoyed both but when it comes to quality of entertainment, quality of food and standards of service P&O wins by a long-long margin.

And incidentally Ocean Village has scored the highest satisfaction ratings in the UK Carnival fleet this summer which hardly seems to reflect it to be a dumbed down operation. What utter nonsense, all 3 mechanisms were of the highest order on OV and this is from us who have stayed at 4 and 5 star properties throughout the world.

As many surveys show, it is easier to please those with low expectations than it is to please those with high expectations. OV is a good product but sits at the lower end of the market ... if I go on OV I could well mark it highly (based on the promised offering), but if I got the same offering on P&O I would mark it low (because I expect and receive much better).

 

Putting on a dinner jacket and bow tie in the evening does not make you or the cruise have more style.

That depends on your point of view ... some people understand 'style' and others don't. It is about delivering a product as promised (in the brochure), that includes formal nights. To obtain the ambience of formality that requires a high participation factor ... everybody should know what sort of product they have purchased (assuming they have had the intelligence to read the brochure before they hand over their money). The onus is on the cruise line to provide the holiday they advertise and for P&O (and others) that means ensuring the ambience of formality is present on those nights deemed to be formal.

 

I could ask why P&O are getting less fussy about formal wear in some restaurants on some ships - I have a funny suspicion it is because they and Carnival both know that they are about to lose a significant number of cruisers with the demise of OV and all to keep the Australian market happy because apparently they have a booming cruise market whereas in the UK it is shrinking. It will be shrinking further now...

Now you are just making things up.

 

The UK market is doing very well and growing (as is the market for our Antipodean friends). It can support many different brands and offerings. I think it is a shame that OV is being canned but somebody who understands the market much better than you or I, and has access to genuine facts and figures (not the 'opinion' and 'delusional facts' made up by some of the authors on this site) has looked at the market and made a decision (rightly or wrongly).

[geecee1]

No it doesn't, it puts forward a valid line of argument that highlights why many at P&O do not want to see the standards on their preferred cruise line being dropped to OV standards. For example, if it was the P&O brand that was disappearing and P&O passengers were insistent that OV should change to being formal cruising, I am sure the OVers would also have something to say.

I have experienced both, and enjoyed both but when it comes to quality of entertainment, quality of food and standards of service P&O wins by a long-long margin.

As many surveys show, it is easier to please those with low expectations than it is to please those with high expectations. OV is a good product but sits at the lower end of the market ... if I go on OV I could well mark it highly (based on the promised offering), but if I got the same offering on P&O I would mark it low (because I expect and receive much better).

 

That depends on your point of view ... some people understand 'style' and others don't. It is about delivering a product as promised (in the brochure), that includes formal nights. To obtain the ambience of formality that requires a high participation factor ... everybody should know what sort of product they have purchased (assuming they have had the intelligence to read the brochure before they hand over their money). The onus is on the cruise line to provide the holiday they advertise and for P&O (and others) that means ensuring the ambience of formality is present on those nights deemed to be formal.

 

Now you are just making things up.

 

The UK market is doing very well and growing (as is the market for our Antipodean friends). It can support many different brands and offerings. I think it is a shame that OV is being canned but somebody who understands the market much better than you or I, and has access to genuine facts and figures (not the 'opinion' and 'delusional facts' made up by some of the authors on this site) has looked at the market and made a decision (rightly or wrongly).

 

Why do people such as you have to revert to insulting the intelligence of other posters by using phrases such as "delusional facts" and inferring that people like me do not have "style". There is absolutely NOTHING stylish about a dinner suit!

Encouraged by positive comments from many posters on this forum, we were considering P&O next winter, but it is the pomposity and arrogance of the of some the contributors to this forum is making us reconsider!

[Norfolk Brit]

Why do people such as you have to revert to insulting the intelligence of other posters by using phrases such as "delusional facts" and inferring that people like me do not have "style". There is absolutely NOTHING stylish about a dinner suit!

Encouraged by positive comments from many posters on this forum, we were considering P&O next winter, but it is the pomposity and arrogance of the of some the contributors to this forum is making us reconsider!

 

IMHO, 'style' does not come into the equation: a better word would be 'appropriate', in that one dresses according to the stated dress code. Formal for men on P&O equals business suit or dinner jacket.

 

For the record, I don't particularly like dressing up...

 

Mary

[MattyBarlow]

but it is the pomposity and arrogance of the of some the contributors to this forum is making us reconsider!

 

 

Yes but i have yet to meet any of these people on board. I have to say that some of the comments from the guys on the OV board do not help with the whole us and them situation. I think we need to end these discussions as they just go round in circles and wind everyone up. Accept what has happened, do what we need to do and see what the all seeing Carnival bods come up with in 2011.

 

 

Also KenandJulie, reference your comments about food being better on P&O. Having been on OV and P&O last year i would have to say they (where comparable) are on a par with each other. Same menus, same ingredients, same suppliers, same chefs etc etc.

[KenAndJulie]

Why do people such as you have to revert to insulting the intelligence of other posters by using phrases such as "delusional facts" and inferring that people like me do not have "style". There is absolutely NOTHING stylish about a dinner suit!

As I said some people understand 'style' and some don't.

 

Encouraged by positive comments from many posters on this forum, we were considering P&O next winter, but it is the pomposity and arrogance of the of some the contributors to this forum is making us reconsider!

I think you need to go back and try to understand what I have written before you make such irrelevant and inaccurate comments.

[KenAndJulie]

Yes but i have yet to meet any of these people on board. I have to say that some of the comments from the guys on the OV board do not help with the whole us and them situation. I think we need to end these discussions as they just go round in circles and wind everyone up. Accept what has happened, do what we need to do and see what the all seeing Carnival bods come up with in 2011.

I agree .. I like to wind up those that obviously only come across here for mischief.

 

I believe that Ventura is being positioned at the bottom end of the market to attract the OV passengers looking a home ... I hope, for the sake of those passengers and the brand, that while dress code standards may slip that other standards, expected from P&O, will not. I would like to think (and may be delusional in this thought) that many will want to experience (even once) a cruise with a few formal evenings and consider upgrading to such a ship/line. While I am not a fan of formal evenings I would mourn their loss because they do bring a certain ambience, class and style to an evening.

 

Over the short time I have been cruising I have seen various levels of standard slip so that a product can be priced at a certain level. This is what always surprised me about OV, it often cost more than significantly better brands? I wonder how much of this was down to not wanting to dress up versus ignorance of the price others were charging .. they obviously had a good marketing department.

 

Also KenandJulie, reference your comments about food being better on P&O. Having been on OV and P&O last year i would have to say they (where comparable) are on a par with each other. Same menus, same ingredients, same suppliers, same chefs etc etc.

Food is very subjective, and I can agree that they were similar/comparable .. but only as far as the buffet selection goes. La Luna wasn't bad nor was the James Martin restaurant (we enjoyed both) but I would say no better than the basic 'traditional dining' found on P&O, neither came close to the speciaility restaurants.

[History addict]

Kenandjulie - comments like positioning Ventura at the bottom end of the market to attract OV customers will offend others too, not just mischief makers. It's like lighting a touch-paper.

 

I agree with both points of view expressed here. I think P and O has a defined product and I see no reason why they should change it. Everyone on the P and O ships should adhere to the P and O dress code - no argument.

 

Personally I would always pay more for a good informal product than a formal option, having tried both styles of cruising. This will obviously surprise some and I can assure everyone that I watch prices of all cruise lines like a hawk. Informal cruising can be a preference. I attend lots of black tie dinners with work and dressing formally has no novelty factor to me. I would sooner maximise my time exploring ports than having to rush back and sit through a protracted dinner when all I want to do is put my feet up on the balcony!

 

OV has been my favourite line to date. This year is one of experiencing new lines looking for a new home. We have cruises booked with Celebrity (Eclipse) and RCI (Adventure) and will probably try a P and O short break later in the year. However P and O will need to introduce fly cruises to tempt me over.

 

I shall certainly be interested in what P and O has to offer in 2011. I suspect we may see a change in at least Venture and a different style of cruising on offer on this ship? I just wish they'd let us all know what they are planning....:)

[Johnthed0g]

K&J...how many times have I said about dressing up..."people either get it or they don't" if they do they understand, OK, but if they don't then there is NO POINT trying to explain, they don't want to do it & that's the end of it. I, like you, seem to be able to do both, shorts & tee shirt in the Maldives to black tie in Barbados on Old Years Night, don't see the problem, go with the flow. If P&O would make it clear that they allow casual dress in the buffet on formal nights it would solve the problem, other lines do this.

[davecttr]

K&J....... If P&O would make it clear that they allow casual dress in the buffet on formal nights it would solve the problem, other lines do this.

This could actually increase confusion because the P&O dress code is meant to apply to the WHOLE ship. This circle can't be squared without P&O having a ship or ships in which the dress code ONLY applies to the restaurant on formal nights. These ships would be better under a different brand and fly cruises should be available. Carnival still have an opportunity to put things right before TUI manage to sort out their Island Cruises problems. I like the look of the P&O ships but for now Thomsons get my money with their more flexible approach to formal dining. On my last cruise a passenger was boring EVERYONE by talking about his football team, even his family were glassy eyed. On formal night I took a walk on the promenade deck and there he was, looking just like James Bond in his Dinner Jacket and still banging on about his team. How you dress does not maketh the man!.

[Johnthed0g]

This could actually increase confusion because the P&O dress code is meant to apply to the WHOLE ship.

 

I realise this, but I have found that in practice people dress in "Smart Casual" on formal nights in the buffet.

Common misunderstanding too, that dress has any bearing on a persons manners, it's just a dress code so people join in with the theme. I don't assume anyone is better than anyone else by their dress but I do wonder why they go on a dressy cruise & don't bother, I maybe then wonder what sort of person they are.

[geecee1]

I realise this, but I have found that in practice people dress in "Smart Casual" on formal nights in the buffet.

Common misunderstanding too, that dress has any bearing on a persons manners, it's just a dress code so people join in with the theme. I don't assume anyone is better than anyone else by their dress but I do wonder why they go on a dressy cruise & don't bother, I maybe then wonder what sort of person they are.

 

More sense from you again, John. P&O are sat on their hands when a simple statement of intent would put an end to this discussion once and for all.

Despite what Dai says, as a former marketing man, and not one prone to "delusions", I am sure that their people have noticed that many OV passengers will pay a premium for a casual cruise( a brief look at the figures for this winter bears this out). A few MD'S I have worked for would want to know what efforts I was making to ensure that they stayed with us.

[KenAndJulie]

Kenandjulie - comments like positioning Ventura at the bottom end of the market to attract OV customers will offend others too, not just mischief makers. It's like lighting a touch-paper.

Hmm, I can see your point but I am not quite sure what other way to put it ... in any market there is a bottom and a top. OV is an entry level product and that is where they positioned themselves (similar to Island cruises) - but still definitely higher than the likes of Easy cruises.

 

Personally I would always pay more for a good informal product than a formal option, having tried both styles of cruising. This will obviously surprise some and I can assure everyone that I watch prices of all cruise lines like a hawk. Informal cruising can be a preference.

I agree that many probably pick OV through choice but also believe that some pick it through ignorance (in the belief that it is priced as an entry level product and they could not afford P&O, Pricess, Celebrity etc.).

 

OV has been my favourite line to date. This year is one of experiencing new lines looking for a new home. We have cruises booked with Celebrity (Eclipse) and RCI (Adventure) and will probably try a P and O short break later in the year. However P and O will need to introduce fly cruises to tempt me over.

I have continually said that we also thoroughly enjoyed OV and would gladly have gone back on either ship ... but we always got better value elsewhere (with 'beter value' being subjective to a persons requirements). P&O do fly-cruises (Caribbean) but not the Med ... yet (there was however a questionairre last year that talked about a possible very interesting 2-week fly cruise to the Med (one of my comments was 'let me know when you introduce it so that I can sign up).

 

I shall certainly be interested in what P and O has to offer in 2011. I suspect we may see a change in at least Venture and a different style of cruising on offer on this ship?

I think many people (P&Oers and OVers) are sort of expecting Ventura to become much more casual, with Azura then offering the 'premium' version of the product. It is interesting times ahead and, as I have said before, there is plenty of room in the market for both ... but as you and others have said, the companies need to be clear about what is on offer and then ensure peoples expectations are met.

[KenAndJulie]

If P&O would make it clear that they allow casual dress in the buffet on formal nights it would solve the problem, other lines do this.

I agree, but a suitable bar area also needs to be provided. The main show lounges and dining rooms should then strictly adhere to the dress code of the evening. Quite often the only issue is the tie, maybe loosening the dress code to the definition of smart-casual and semi-formal (e.g. jacket without tie).

 

Sadly these days anybody who tries to promote the maintenance and retention of a high level of standards is often referred to as pompous or snobby ... that is about as accurate as saying those on the other side of the argument are all chavs.

[Johnthed0g]

I hope Azura is as you say....

[Ilovecake]

Sadly these days anybody who tries to promote the maintenance and retention of a high level of standards is often referred to as pompous or snobby ... that is about as accurate as saying those on the other side of the argument are all chavs.

 

And on that I do agree with you. Ocean Village passengers are not all chavs, neither are all those who go on Ventura. Neither ship is "bottom end of the market".

It still seems to me that P&O/Carnival just can't make their minds up what to do with Ventura - turning it into an alternative Ocean Village is like admitting you were wrong to take the brand away in the first place and yet they seem to be adopting a we want it all ways form of dress code on board. If it's P&O keep it as all the other ships ie adherence to the dress code everywhere, if it's not then turn it into a casual ship. The hybrid they are coming up with is confusing everyone.

Anyway as I said in a previous post, after 2 enjoyable cruises this year, we're giving it a miss next year and have another major family holiday planned for 2011 so we won't be going then either. Hopefully by which time we will find something else we fancy.

By the way our socioeconomic profile must fit P&O because they've sent me a brochure - not asked for one, so no idea why and it's the first time they ever have done.

Go in peace!:)

[Presto2]

Just been perusing the dress codes on Celebrity, we thought it was a better experience all round last time, & as we have booked again I would refresh my memory, they certainly state if you don't want to dress up you can dine in the buffet..no problem, no confusing double standards...a statement... smart casual. Sail from Southampton.

 

Just found this -- hubby has gone Celebrity Mad having stumbled on one of their cruises. For once he is the one doing the researching ----- it is for his 50th (dont tell) ---- would you recommend. We have done OV2 but are more than happy to go with the flow re dress code and be more formal if need be.

 

:)

[Johnthed0g]

Just found this -- hubby has gone Celebrity Mad having stumbled on one of their cruises. For once he is the one doing the researching ----- it is for his 50th (dont tell) ---- would you recommend. We have done OV2 but are more than happy to go with the flow re dress code and be more formal if need be.

 

:)

 

Try the celebrity section of this site, so far they seem very nice, unlike a few on P&O. Celebrity are very good, to us just that bit better.

[Presto2]

Try the celebrity section of this site, so far they seem very nice, unlike a few on P&O. Celebrity are very good, to us just that bit better.

 

Cheers

 

:)

[KenAndJulie]

Just found this -- hubby has gone Celebrity Mad having stumbled on one of their cruises. For once he is the one doing the researching ----- it is for his 50th (dont tell) ---- would you recommend. We have done OV2 but are more than happy to go with the flow re dress code and be more formal if need be.

 

:)

presto, my in-laws love Celebrity (they are in the top loyalty tier now). They were very much RCI fans but felt that it was being repositioned too much in favour of families and many standards had slipped over the years so they moved to Celebrity.

 

They are currently on their first P&O cruise, so I will be interested to hear a comparison ... will post their thoughts when they get back. There is no doubt that Celebrity will be a significant step up from OV.

[geecee1]

I agree, but a suitable bar area also needs to be provided. The main show lounges and dining rooms should then strictly adhere to the dress code of the evening. Quite often the only issue is the tie, maybe loosening the dress code to the definition of smart-casual and semi-formal (e.g. jacket without tie).

 

Sadly these days anybody who tries to promote the maintenance and retention of a high level of standards is often referred to as pompous or snobby ... that is about as accurate as saying those on the other side of the argument are all chavs.

 

What you are describing is social apartheid.(Do not forget that those lesser human beings who chose not to dress formally have paid at least as much if not more for the privilege of sharing the same ship). I am all for maintaining standards in all walks of life,but insisting that fellow passengers who are not "correctly attired" should be confined to certain areas of the ship is beyond the pale on what is supposed to be a HOLIDAY!!!!!!

Would you also support the idea that on non formal nights, anyone dressed formally should be restricted to one bar, one restaurant and not allowed into the show bars, I think not.

[geecee1]

[/color]

 

Well that is the concern of Carnival and not P&O.

 

But those who cruise with P&O want the formality and just why should they change for the few who don't when they can fill their ships with those who do.

 

I repeat, if it worked then why are they ditching it. Also why did Island Cruises go belly up, with a similar product.

 

Thompsons who have taken an Island ship are not going all casual so why not have a go at them?

 

 

:):)Happy Cruising:):)

 

 

 

 

:cool:

 

 

Dai

P&O patently cannot fill their ships with those requiring "the full cruise experince", hence the aggressive pricing for Ventura during Nov09.

Are you also suggesting that people who dress casually are denied "the full cruise experience"?

I am an admirer of your previous profession, but having read your contributions on here, I find the tone more than condescending*, as if you are addressing children, not adults with a lifetime of experience in the competitive business world.

*Starting a response with "Errrm...." shows a total lack of repect to the previous poster, but perhaps that is acceptable in academia!

[daiB]

P&O patently cannot fill their ships with those requiring "the full cruise experince", hence the aggressive pricing for Ventura during Nov09.

Are you also suggesting that people who dress casually are denied "the full cruise experience"?

I am an admirer of your previous profession, but having read your contributions on here, I find the tone more than condescending*, as if you are addressing children, not adults with a lifetime of experience in the competitive business world.

*Starting a response with "Errrm...." shows a total lack of repect to the previous poster, but perhaps that is acceptable in academia!

 

Nice of you to get personal. You clearly have your humour chip removed. At the time I was saying that I had made theses comments months ago.

 

However, with reference to your post;_

 

I am all for maintaining standards in all walks of life,but insisting that fellow passengers who are not "correctly attired" should be confined to certain areas of the ship is beyond the pale on what is supposed to be a HOLIDAY!!!!!!

 

At last you have got it, we are talking about our HOLIDAY. We have made the decision to choose a cruise which has a formal element and one which the cruise line insists that everyone complies with. WE have picked that type of HOLIDAY as have the other P&O cruisers. So you are now telling us we are wrong, we cannot do that???????

 

You pick your HOLIDAY and we will pick ours. But please do not try to change ours just because it does not suit you.

 

 

:):)Happy Cruising:):)

 

 

 

 

:cool:

 

Dai