AZAMARA'S BIG ANNOUNCEMENT: More Amenities added for Up-Market Travelers

[taxjam]

Thanks Bill

 

Thanks for listening Bill, we are really looking forward to Azamara, all this negativity/change and hype is stopping others from joining. Several cruise people I now have come across this thread, they have been outraged or amused on two counts. 1, the concern by several on here that those who like to have a drink that is not wine are riff raff who will just drink themselves off the ship at all times singing rugby songs, this is all they see about comments on Azamara when they search, which makes them feel inferior because they like the thought of all inc. 2. how uptight people have got about nothing when the big issue is the increase in price for everyone.

 

It seems strange that people are so concerned about the 50% shorex issue, yet in the same sentence say they like to sort this out themselves and admit, trips have been cancelled because not enough people wanted to go. So even when trips are 50% they are never full, ergo, not working!

 

Hud & Pug,

 

I agree that pricing increases without a meaningful upgrade in value is an overriding issue. I do, however, disagree with your comments as related to the 50% off Land Discoveries. Perhaps you read the critical emails superficially and missed a significant nuance. Azamara's withdrawal of the 50% off program for a majority of 2013 is a pocket book issue to the Azamara customers, like me and many of the posters, who booked their 2013 cruises relying on the representation that they could book 50% off excursions. We now find that their overall cruise cost will increased. Besides that, many feel strongly it is unethical to unilaterally remove a significantly advertised promotion after customers have relied on it.

 

I do find your claim regarding silent board readers curious since everyone I know that has actually cruised on Azamara expresses some or all of the criticisms found on this board.

[dfishner]

Hud & Pug,

 

I agree that pricing increases without a meaningful upgrade in value is an overriding issue. I do, however, disagree with your comments as related to the 50% off Land Discoveries. Perhaps you read the critical emails superficially and missed a significant nuance. Azamara's withdrawal of the 50% off program for a majority of 2013 is a pocket book issue to the Azamara customers, like me and many of the posters, who booked their 2013 cruises relying on the representation that they could book 50% off excursions. We now find that their overall cruise cost will increased. Besides that, many feel strongly it is unethical to unilaterally remove a significantly advertised promotion after customers have relied on it.

 

I do find your claim regarding silent board readers curious since everyone I know that has actually cruised on Azamara expresses some or all of the criticisms found on this board.

 

I would much prefer to purchase drinks then have it be added into the cruise price.. I also do not believe on an Azamara ship people will drink themselves into a drunken stupor, but that cost of including it has to go somewhere and that is in the price and I do not want to it to. I like it the way it currently is.

 

The 50% had it problems and it is a three fold issue

1) Azamara website made it very difficult to book because you never knew which was the 50% off one area would say one price while another said another and on the area you look to purchase the excrusions were at 100% until you clicked up final payment and sometimes that did not work.

 

2) The tours themselves were no better then you could get on a mass market line and even with the 50% off they were more expensive then what say Celebrity charges for the same type of shore ex

 

3) Most Azamara customers are well traveled and want to see something different then the same old same old so they book private tours

 

If Azamara is to be known as destination immersion cruise line then their tours need to be at that level and as of now they are not. I know they are working on it but it is still not there.

 

My expectations when I booked our cruise was that the 50% was going to be available throughout 2013 and was told that by Azamara to have it be pulled the way it was is not good business after you tell your customers that it will be available. I feel disappointed that it was and am awaiting to see what Azamara will do to amend this.

[Bill Leiber]

Hello Azamara Commenter's -

 

I understand your concern about the risk that some guests might over-consume their use of alcoholic beverages and thereby negatively impact the onboard ambiance that draws you back again and again. Also there is the risk that they might put themselves in danger.

 

I want to share with you information that I've received from our Vice President of Hotel Operations which I'm confident will illustrate how our onboard staff have been trained to control that risk:

 

§ Azamara Club Cruises is a firm believer in serving our guests responsibly and encouraging them to consume responsibly. The safety of our guests and crew is our top priority. Furthermore, our demographic is a more mature and our guests tend to be more responsible in their drinking behavior.

§ Azamara’s onboard staff is trained in the ServSafe program, a responsible alcohol serving training program that Royal Caribbean, our parent corporation, co-developed with the Educational Foundation of the National Restaurant Association. Our bartenders and waiters serve all alcoholic beverages one glass (or bottle/can for beer) at a time watch for over consumption, and when over consumption is suspected, bartenders and waiters are empowered take appropriate action and serve water or non-alcoholic drinks instead, or may deny service altogether.

§ Our ServSafe program has been lauded by Cheer's Magazine as the Best Alcohol Awareness Program multiple times, an award that recognizes the best programs among land- and sea-based hospitality organizations.

 

I'm hopeful that this information will add another dimension as you evaluate our decision to include spirits and international beers as a component of our product features.

 

Best regards,

 

Bill Leiber

__________________________

Chief Blogging Officer*

Azamara Club Cruises

(*CBO is an authorized and compensated representative of ACC)

[Joecors]

[quote=HudandPug;35639588]Thanks Bill

 

It seems strange that people are so concerned about the 50% shorex issue, yet in the same sentence say they like to sort this out themselves and admit, trips have been cancelled because not enough people wanted to go. So even when trips are 50% they are never full, ergo, not working!

 

On a lighter note, can I ask that you do a Monaco GP special AzAmazing event for 2013 ;)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Do not understand logic that increasing the price of day tours will solve the problem of: "even when trips are 50% they are never full"

[Joecors]

[quote=taxjam;35641395]Hud & Pug,

 

I agree that pricing increases without a meaningful upgrade in value is an overriding issue. I do, however, disagree with your comments as related to the 50% off Land Discoveries. Perhaps you read the critical emails superficially and missed a significant nuance. Azamara's withdrawal of the 50% off program for a majority of 2013 is a pocket book issue to the Azamara customers, like me and many of the posters, who booked their 2013 cruises relying on the representation that they could book 50% off excursions. We now find that their overall cruise cost will increased. Besides that, many feel strongly it is unethical to unilaterally remove a significantly advertised promotion after customers have relied on it.

 

I do find your claim regarding silent board readers curious since everyone I know that has actually cruised on Azamara expresses some or all of the criticisms found on this board.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Couldn't agree with you more

[OuiOnboard]

....I think Azamara needs to reach a little further and develop tours that passengers will want to take. If shorex sales were soft at 50% discount, I can't imagine that demand would spike once prices increase, unless and until the product changes.

 

Perhaps the AzAmazing Night Tour is meant to be their nod to unique tours. That's a step in the right direction but not sufficient for a destination-driven cruise line.

You have hit the nail on the head. Well said.

[HudandPug]

[quote=HudandPug;35639588]Thanks Bill

 

It seems strange that people are so concerned about the 50% shorex issue, yet in the same sentence say they like to sort this out themselves and admit, trips have been cancelled because not enough people wanted to go. So even when trips are 50% they are never full, ergo, not working!

 

On a lighter note, can I ask that you do a Monaco GP special AzAmazing event for 2013 ;)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Do not understand logic that increasing the price of day tours will solve the problem of: "even when trips are 50% they are never full"

 

The point I was trying to make was, encouraging people to take up the offers by a 50% reduction only works if people are not then upset by the tour being cancelled because not enough have booked it. Fully agree that if something is offered as part of a cruise benefit then it should be honoured.

There have also been comments on here that the tours are not up to scratch anyway and Bill, I think has said it will be looked at. I can't really talk because I have never done an official Azamara tour, or any excursion other than through a private group from here. I also accept, given some cruises I have already booked, that there is a place for ship organised tours to avoid being left behind or in areas that are a bit risky.

 

What I can say is I have looked at the Monaco GP offering from Azamara and sitting on a hill for 8 hours in the hope of catching a glimpse of a car passing underneath, is not my idea of exclusive ;) We shall be booking a venue which is not cheap, but delivers what we hope will be a great memory and its a shame that Azamara can't do something classy, but reasonably priced in Monaco. If sitting on a hill is an example of what counts as a 5/6 star immersive experience, well the rest of the tours can't be up to much.

[insidecabin]

Has any profiling of the pax that do their own tours been done?

 

Anyone been asked what they organized for themselves, why they did this rather than take the ACC offerings and how much it cost to DIY.

 

Across all cruise lines there seems to be a massive mismatch between costs and pricing to the point where people just won't accept the profiteering.

 

I would expect that ACC could then build similar tours using buying power to cover some of the shorex staff costs but offer the cruise line insurance that the ship waits if things go wrong.

 

I suspect that many of the shorex are just plucked from the RCCL basket of tours at the ports that RCL and celebrity use and for others they farm out to local tour opperators and just mark up.

 

Does ACC have a team researching the ports and putting together tours.

 

I am sure there are plenty of pax that would love to help with this for ports on the program.

 

Would be a great way to engage pax and get them buying into the destination immersion ahead of the cruise.

 

OK some ports you pretty much have to use the local offerings as they are closed shop like the taxi tours in Gib. but others there must be some great opportunity for something special.

 

I wonder if there is mileage in cruise lines offering a share a private tour service to match up the pax with others that are organizing tours that people want to do.

 

currently sharing it is done on the likes of CC roll calls but this limits the exposure and has had issues with fake passengers organizing tours on a paid basis.

[HudandPug]

Has any profiling of the pax that do their own tours been done?

 

Anyone been asked what they organized for themselves, why they did this rather than take the ACC offerings and how much it cost to DIY.

 

Across all cruise lines there seems to be a massive mismatch between costs and pricing to the point where people just won't accept the profiteering.

 

I would expect that ACC could then build similar tours using buying power to cover some of the shorex staff costs but offer the cruise line insurance that the ship waits if things go wrong.

 

I suspect that many of the shorex are just plucked from the RCCL basket of tours at the ports that RCL and celebrity use and for others they farm out to local tour opperators and just mark up.

 

Does ACC have a team researching the ports and putting together tours.

 

I am sure there are plenty of pax that would love to help with this for ports on the program.

 

Would be a great way to engage pax and get them buying into the destination immersion ahead of the cruise.

 

OK some ports you pretty much have to use the local offerings as they are closed shop like the taxi tours in Gib. but others there must be some great opportunity for something special.

 

I wonder if there is mileage in cruise lines offering a share a private tour service to match up the pax with others that are organizing tours that people want to do.

 

currently sharing it is done on the likes of CC roll calls but this limits the exposure and has had issues with fake passengers organizing tours on a paid basis.

 

Good idea!

[crzrr]

In regards to the 50% shore excursion situation, here is my take. People have made the comment that they booked their cruise counting on the 50% offer. Really?!! I find that hard to believe. And before anyone gets all bent out of shape, here's why:

 

Most of the time (and it appears that AZ is changing this) when you book, assuming that you aren't booking last minute, you can't even see the shore excursions that will be offered for your cruise. So the 50% off price is a moot point. At any time, the "full price" could be adjusted so that the discounted price reflects the old full price. They don't have to announce that they're doing this. Every time we look at a shore excursion we determine if it is a good value for what is being offered. Sometimes it is and sometimes (even at 1/2 price) it is not.

 

Also, you can prebook an excursion at the discounted price and get onboard and find out the excursion has been cancelled. Then, should you decide to book a different excursion, you have to pay the full price since you are booking it onboard.

 

Removing the pricing difference first of all would appear to help those passengers who are not computer savvy to get the same deal as others. Also, it evens out the pricing so that if you are forced to change excursions, there isn't an unplanned charge.

 

Another "plus" is the ability to use your onboard credits for shore excursions. There have been discussions on these boards about people wanting to be able to use the credits for their shore excursions but also wanting to get the 1/2 price deal.

 

As Bill mentioned, pricing is being worked on. We don't know that the new pricing will be back up in the range of the old 100% cost or closer to the old 50% cost. At the old 100% cost, AZ will be hard pressed to get any takers. Much above the old 50% cost and they will also have difficulties filling the excursions unless they significantly improve many of the offerings.

 

Personally, I would rather wait until onboard to book any excursions for areas that I haven't booked private excursions to. But, I don't want to pay more for that option.

[marinaro44]

It's utter nonsense to claim that the 50% discount is a moot point. Perhaps it is for you, but clearly it is important to many here who have expressed themselves quite strongly. How presumptuous to attempt to question the motivation of others.

[taxjam]

In regards to the 50% shore excursion situation, here is my take. People have made the comment that they booked their cruise counting on the 50% offer. Really?!! I find that hard to believe

 

Do you misunderstand the point or did you intentionally misstate it?

 

The point is not whether customers calculated the exact cost of the excursions into their decision to book with Azamara. I certainly didn't, but I did rely on Azamara's advertised 50% off shore excursion promotion in deciding on booking the Azamara cruise. I knew the $ cost of the cruise per night plus I had an assurance that I could book tours privately or if for some reason I wanted ship's excursions they would be reasonably priced. In other words, all my costs would be either know or expected to be reasonable. The real point here is that a reputable business should not employ "bait and switch" sales techniques. Azamara extensively promoted 50% off shore excursions for 2013 and it has an ethical, and possibly a legal, obligation to offer them to customers who booked. The posters on this subject want what Azamara promised not something different.

[pacheco18]

Has any profiling of the pax that do their own tours been done?

 

Anyone been asked what they organized for themselves, why they did this rather than take the ACC offerings and how much it cost to DIY.

 

Across all cruise lines there seems to be a massive mismatch between costs and pricing to the point where people just won't accept the profiteering.

 

I would expect that ACC could then build similar tours using buying power to cover some of the shorex staff costs but offer the cruise line insurance that the ship waits if things go wrong.

 

I suspect that many of the shorex are just plucked from the RCCL basket of tours at the ports that RCL and celebrity use and for others they farm out to local tour opperators and just mark up.

 

Does ACC have a team researching the ports and putting together tours.

 

I am sure there are plenty of pax that would love to help with this for ports on the program.

 

Would be a great way to engage pax and get them buying into the destination immersion ahead of the cruise.

 

OK some ports you pretty much have to use the local offerings as they are closed shop like the taxi tours in Gib. but others there must be some great opportunity for something special.

 

I wonder if there is mileage in cruise lines offering a share a private tour service to match up the pax with others that are organizing tours that people want to do.

 

currently sharing it is done on the likes of CC roll calls but this limits the exposure and has had issues with fake passengers organizing tours on a paid basis.

 

 

Oceania has done this and for the most part their new program of small group tours does not attract those of us who only book private tours. Here is why:

 

THEY control who is the tour guide

THEY control the persons you tour with

THEY control the itinerary

They make a profit.

 

Those of us who book private tours do so because WE control all of the above. No cruiseline can offer that.

[frequent traveler]

We are new to Azamara and will be taking our first voyage immediately after the "new program" kicks in. We booked before the big announcement.

 

While the opportunity for 50% off tours was nice, since we couldn't see the tours, we didn't count on using them -- so unlike others this change doesn't affect us. It was a great price for a great itinerary (like other lines, it has risen in price since we booked, seems proportionate to what other lines are changing for the same ports).

 

I am a former SeaDream addict, loving the small ship and the "all-inclusive" - never having to sign for anything but my spa bill. However, I don't count AZAMARA's new beverage program as "all inclusive". Sorry, but my pre dinner martini is not made with those vodkas. We're assuming the beverage card option will still be available for brand liquors and if we like AZAMARA will consider in our pricing decision for future voyages.

 

We are definitely NOT in the upper 1% and I will continue working until I drop to be able to afford to travel. For us, the changes didn't impact our decision.For the percentage that use the pre book feature, this is clearly an unwanted price increase. But what we don't see is how many complaints are received from passengers getting on board after using less than good travel agents and finding out that they are paying more than others. I can't imagine the amount of good will discounts/OBC given as result of those complaints. IMHO, two tier pricing at a 50% differential is not a sustainable business practice.

 

I agree with those who take the position that AZAMARA should honor the 50% discount for all 2013 voyages booked before the big announcement. Its the honorable and ethical thing to do. Forget the contract out.

 

my 2 cents.

 

FT

[pacheco18]

Oceania has done this and for the most part their new program of small group tours does not attract those of us who only book private tours. Here is why:

 

THEY control who is the tour guide

THEY control the persons you tour with

THEY control the itinerary

They make a profit.

 

Those of us who book private tours do so because WE control all of the above. No cruiseline can offer that.

 

Just want to add one more thing

 

Many of the private tour guides we hire are NOT connected with big companies. Some are even individuals with stellar reputations. I book these individuals more than a year in advance! These smaller companies and individuals are not likely to partner with a cruise line. They are booked solid early and have no interest in having the cruise line take a cut.

 

So that is another reason why cruise lines cannot replicate the private tour experience. They would not have access to the same guides that we hire on our own.

[GailnBrad]

Wow...I am very sad. We just returned from our second Azamara cruise which we loved. I just knew as soon as we found the perfect cruiseline...it would go and get screwed up. We begged you not to change things. You had just the right size ship, right type of cruise, just enough included soda and wine, etc. I did not sense people wanted more included alcohol, as well as the other changed you have mentioned. I am quite sure we have sadly taken our last Azamara cruise...I'm sure the prices will sky rocket and be out of our range. We dont drink alcohol at all...didnt even have any of thr included wine the last two weeks on our cruise...I will certainly not pay the prices your cruises will be now...only to subsidize other drinkers. WHY...did you have to go and cahnge such a good thing??? :(

[cpgrneyes]

I understand the frustration with those who booked for 2013 and now cannot take advantage of the 50% reduction in shorex.

 

As far as the exhorbitant price increases, nobody yet knows what they will be. If you see a cruise you want in 2013 or 2014, you know what the prices are, and have a few weeks to book before the price increase. If we don't find value in those prices, we are all free to look and book elsewhere.

 

There is a 2014 Quest sailing that I'm very interested in, but will not be booking until I can see what other lines will be offering. I will be very surprised if Oceania is less expensive OR if their itinerary is as good as Azamara's for us. I, for one, like the later departures and overnights, as I can see a port in the evening and get a feeling for what it is like to live there. Leaving at 6 pm or even 8 pm doesn't afford that opportunity. Plus, there is the wonderful crew and more inclusions than Oceania.

 

My mind is open, however, and if there is a substantial savings or even a comparable itinerary, I may be nudged to move. That said, Azamara offers ME a value because I feel it IS unique in the industry.

[greeneg]

Impressive. Bill started this thread on October First, it now has just under 500 posts and just under 24,000 views which isn't bad for nine days. You certainly cannot say that there is no interest in the subject matter and that many people do not have strong opinions.

 

I think that it's too bad, that I see a lot of similarities between this particular controversy and the previous one in the Spring of 2010; Azamara has made very striking changes both times and the customer base by and large has reacted negatively to the changes. A percentage of the base has felt it necessary to look for their vacations elsewhere. So far, I think that Azamara has been successful in replacing those customers who have voted with their feet, the real question will be whether or not Azamara will be able to continue to replace them at this level, or in fact, be forced to resort to strong discounting in order to fill the ships. I think that Azamara can only go through this process so many times, what that number will turn out to be no one knows at this point.

 

But I personally do think that it is a finite number and they're getting close.

[jdavidg]

Hello Azamara Commenter's -

 

I understand your concern about the risk that some guests might over-consume their use of alcoholic beverages and thereby negatively impact the onboard ambiance that draws you back again and again. Also there is the risk that they might put themselves in danger.

 

I want to share with you information that I've received from our Vice President of Hotel Operations which I'm confident will illustrate how our onboard staff have been trained to control that risk:

 

§ Azamara Club Cruises is a firm believer in serving our guests responsibly and encouraging them to consume responsibly. The safety of our guests and crew is our top priority. Furthermore, our demographic is a more mature and our guests tend to be more responsible in their drinking behavior.

§ Azamara’s onboard staff is trained in the ServSafe program, a responsible alcohol serving training program that Royal Caribbean, our parent corporation, co-developed with the Educational Foundation of the National Restaurant Association. Our bartenders and waiters serve all alcoholic beverages one glass (or bottle/can for beer) at a time watch for over consumption, and when over consumption is suspected, bartenders and waiters are empowered take appropriate action and serve water or non-alcoholic drinks instead, or may deny service altogether.

§ Our ServSafe program has been lauded by Cheer's Magazine as the Best Alcohol Awareness Program multiple times, an award that recognizes the best programs among land- and sea-based hospitality organizations.

 

I'm hopeful that this information will add another dimension as you evaluate our decision to include spirits and international beers as a component of our product features.

 

Best regards,

 

Bill Leiber

__________________________

Chief Blogging Officer*

Azamara Club Cruises

(*CBO is an authorized and compensated representative of ACC)

 

Well Bill,

Obviously this isn't working in the MDR. On our most receint Quest cruise we were unfortunatly seated at a table for 8 and next to me was seated a woman

(I won't call her a lady) who came in intoxicated.

The waiter proceeded to serve her wine for the next 3 hours during which it was obvious to everyone present she was drunk. :mad:

We couldn't wait to leave. Even though we asked the service to be speeded up it never happened and we were in port and wanted to go into town.

The service was so slow that we no longer would take a table after that for more than 2.

With a 2 top table service was excellent.

We are Discovery members so this is not our first dance, so Azamara get your stuff together and train and expect the MDR servers to be RCCL quality which iN MHO are the best on the 7 seas.

[Christine Frances]

I think we all have to remember that it is only a 5yr old cruise line which still is trying to fine tune it's identity and find it's own place in the market.

[greeneg]

I think we all have to remember that it is only a 5yr old cruise line which still is trying to fine tune it's identity and find it's own place in the market.

 

I think that this isa very valid point. I would hope however that the Line would learn from previous experiences and I do have to say that I do have some question about that: most Five Year Old Children know pretty much who they are and where they live.

[Jade13]

We are new to Azamara and will be taking our first voyage immediately after the "new program" kicks in. We booked before the big announcement.

 

While the opportunity for 50% off tours was nice, since we couldn't see the tours, we didn't count on using them -- so unlike others this change doesn't affect us. It was a great price for a great itinerary (like other lines, it has risen in price since we booked, seems proportionate to what other lines are changing for the same ports).

 

 

FT

 

 

Which date/itinerary?

[zqvol]

Which date/itinerary?

 

 

The May 25th - 9 Night Mykonos To The Black Sea Voyage

[3418ahl]

Funny thought just now...Azamara is starting to seem like "Luxury for the Lowly"...if you don't mind really small cabins and showers, low quality booze, and specialty restaurants you have to pay for, we're all inclusive. Not a good way to go in my book and not definitive of anything at all!

[Jade13]

The May 25th - 9 Night Mykonos To The Black Sea Voyage

 

I was just wondering what was considered "a great price" since Veranda's start at $4,300.00 per person for 9 nights.