New and lost! Planning 1st trip!

[pacmom]

Jazzbeau et al, Yes Tom Baker was one of my favorite time lords. The Tom Baker mentiones here writes for Conde Nast magazine. Have a hard time swallowing his breakdown of river cruise lines. His luxury lines as of 2014 are all inclusive. Also would switch Viking and Avalon. IMO none of these travel mgzine writers ever sail incognito, so the staff knows who and what they are. Yes, just a bit snarky but it is Mon. and still no weight bearing on this dratted foot. Pat

Edited August 19, 2013 by pacmom

[Ship's Wake]

Jazzbeau et al, Yes Tom Baker was one of my favorite time lords. The Tom Baker mentiones here writes for Conde Nast magazine. Have a hard time swallowing his breakdown of river cruise lines. His luxury lines as of 2014 are all inclusive. Also would switch Viking and Avalon. IMO none of these travel mgzine writers ever sail incognito, so the staff knows who and what they are. Yes, just a bit snarky but it is Mon. and still no weight bearing on this dratted foot. Pat

 

Just a wild guess here, but I bet this blogger hasn't taken near as many river cruisers than you have. :)

[tbaker5]

Hello All,

 

I am here to apologize for offending anyone here! I do not work for Conde Nast and am a travel agent who sells over a million dollars in river cruises myself a year to varying clients with varying needs. My observations about quality of each river cruise experience are based on hundreds of client comments & Reviews, personal experience, as well as the branding by the vendors themselves.

The Avalon product is a middle of the road product operated and owned by Globus Gateway (A known middle of the road tour operator). My client comments have been that Avalon did not compare to higher end experiences and they found the Avalon crowd not as well-traveled or sophisticated. This sounds snobbish and perhaps it is but that is the difference between luxury and non-luxury brands and travelers. I have been on one Avalon river cruise and it was not my cup of tea either. I will leave it at that and found, food, cleanliness, staff, and experience to be better elsewhere. I stand by Tauck as being the best. Those who get it-get it! this product sells out over a year in advance at a price point that caters to a true luxury traveler. I am sorry to have offended anyone and again, did not mean to offend anyone here. Sincere apologies!

[AttilaTheFun]

Hello All,

 

I am here to apologize for offending anyone here! I do not work for Conde Nast and am a travel agent who sells over a million dollars in river cruises myself a year to varying clients with varying needs. My observations about quality of each river cruise experience are based on hundreds of client comments & Reviews, personal experience, as well as the branding by the vendors themselves.

The Avalon product is a middle of the road product operated and owned by Globus Gateway (A known middle of the road tour operator). My client comments have been that Avalon did not compare to higher end experiences and they found the Avalon crowd not as well-traveled or sophisticated. This sounds snobbish and perhaps it is but that is the difference between luxury and non-luxury brands and travelers. I have been on one Avalon river cruise and it was not my cup of tea either. I will leave it at that and found, food, cleanliness, staff, and experience to be better elsewhere. I stand by Tauck as being the best. Those who get it-get it! this product sells out over a year in advance at a price point that caters to a true luxury traveler. I am sorry to have offended anyone and again, did not mean to offend anyone here. Sincere apologies!

 

Hi Tom,

 

Apologies to pull you into this foray, but I have found your blog entries to be informative and helpful and was trying to share with others. In addition, the times I have seen you mentioned/quoted in conjunction with Conde Nast Traveler, it always came across as candid and honest, which I appreciate. It's a shame that everyone has pounced on the one comment they find offensive while disregarding the rest of the helpful info in that post. Best wishes to you.

[franski]

It's a shame that everyone has pounced on the one comment they find offensive while disregarding the rest of the helpful info in that post. Best wishes to you.

 

Actually, I think it was a shame that the comment about Avalon was geared to making a value judgement about the clientele. If the general feeling is that the experience is lower end, then by all means say that. The observation could have been about the clientele being less well traveled, or happy with a mediocre to average experience.

 

I am impressed that Mr. Baker took the time to post here, and to explain the rationale behind his comments. If he had taken a few seconds to think about how this could (and would) be interpreted, perhaps the comment might have been wordsmithed a bit before it was published.

 

I guess I had better dust off my copy of Garth Brooks' song "Friends in Low Places" ... I have an Avalon cruise booked for next June.

 

Fran

[Got2Cruise]

Apology accepted but unnecessary. This is Cruise Critic one big dysfunctional family. But you can make it up to us by offering us huge cash incentives on our next cruise. Ha just kidding. Happy Cruising

[vivi9909]

We are sea cruisers and have not done yet river cruises but are considering a Rhine or Danube one in the next two years.

 

I am a little bit confused by Amadeus by Luftner and AmaWaterways: similar names and ship names starting by AMA or Amadeus. Are they somewhat related or completely different companies? Is one of the two companies keeping that confusion alive on purpose?

 

Our travel agent is proposing an organized group tour on Luftner but I never heard about that company before. I found some limited info on that forum but much less than companies such as Viking, Avalon, Uniworld and AmaWaterways. Tauck, very highly ranked on CC and other forums, was also a surprise for me.

 

I would like to know from people who cruised on Luftner and some of the other companies how it compares about cabins, food and onboard service. The fact that we travel on Celebrity is an indication of the kind of quality we are looking for: not the luxury class but the upper middle one. Will we be disappointed by Luftner?

 

Thank you.

[Host Jazzbeau]

There is some ancient history between the companies which explains the similar names, but for your purposes they are two completely different entities. Amadeus is an Austrian company. AMA is an American company.

 

Amadeus has very little presence on Cruise Critic. Check out the CC official review of the company:

http://www.cruisecritic.com/reviews/cruiseline.cfm?CruiseLineID=181

 

There are hardly any member reviews and little discussion on the forums.

 

What I noticed in the CC review is that they only offer wine with dinner (not lunch or champagne at breakfast), and they do not include shore excursions.

 

But your group tour may have its own perks, especially as regards tours. This would change the experience dramatically.

 

One final point, which I don't know how to interpret. When a large group is on a river cruise, passengers who aren't in the group often complain on CC that it had a negative impact on the ambience on the ship. What I don't know is what it feels like to be in that group.

[Sylve1]

Actually, I think it was a shame that the comment about Avalon was geared to making a value judgement about the clientele. If the general feeling is that the experience is lower end, then by all means say that. The observation could have been about the clientele being less well traveled, or happy with a mediocre to average experience.

 

I am impressed that Mr. Baker took the time to post here, and to explain the rationale behind his comments. If he had taken a few seconds to think about how this could (and would) be interpreted, perhaps the comment might have been wordsmithed a bit before it was published.

 

I guess I had better dust off my copy of Garth Brooks' song "Friends in Low Places" ... I have an Avalon cruise booked for next June.

 

I agree. What does 'lower end clientele' even mean? People with less money to spend? Your average working people? People with tattoos? People who don't wear ties or expensive jewellery ? We travelled on an excellent Avalon cruise and met with wonderful people with various travel experience from all walks of life. 'Lower end clientele ' certainly never occurred to us. Not every one is on the same wave length as you but all are interesting and fine people . It's an insulting, unnecessary and demeaning term.

[pully8]

.

Sylvie enjoy your cruise. we have had 6 wonderful river cruises and met people from all over the world from many different backgrounds.

 

high end, low end who cares as long as they are good company? on Avalon we have sat with people who are travel agents, retired, educators, doctors, judges and who own companies, etc. perhaps in oz we think differently about class and money?

 

of course it is also true that 1 can have 1 and not the other. the choice of a travel product does not always define the individual. fascinating that some would believe it does.

enjoy your cruise.