Explore4 and price drops

[Spendogirl]

I was told the E4 was a "free" ammenity.. if that's the case, why didn't Hal give me the standard price reduction before final payment???? Why was I told "you have to chose".. sounds like double talk to me... "it's free", but it really isn't.. sounds more like a scam then, doesn't it.

 

When you can answer that without your obvious sarcasm, and have it actually make sense, I may actually take your response to my post with a grain of salt.

 

Otherwise, you have your opinion and I have mine...

 

You can conjure up any justification on Hal's part all you want, I won't agree, I won't see your point and I don't agree with what they did.. enuf said:rolleyes:

[Globaliser]

I was told the E4 was a "free" ammenity.. if that's the case, why didn't Hal give me the standard price reduction before final payment?

That sounds like exactly what HAL did.

 

You had your original fare of (say) $2,000 per person. That fare included a no extra cost benefit.

 

Or you could get re-fared in the standard way to the new fare of (say) $1,700 per person. That fare does not include that no extra cost benefit.

 

Your choice whether or not to re-fare to the new fare.

 

What you were demanding was to be re-fared to the new fare but re-writing the conditions of that new fare so as to get the conditions of the old fare. Or, in other words, trying to have your cake and eat it too.

[cruz chic]

The explore 4 is not free. Hal would like you to believe that. That is their way to try to get people to commit early to a cruise because their prices don't do that. I think their thought is that people would like to keep the explore 4 more than getting the price reduction. Unless you really like your drinks I can't see people preferring it.

[DaveOKC]

The Explore4 is the biggest scam going.. I am beyond frustrated how this whole pricing scheme works out.

 

We booked the Eurodam February 1, 2015, 14n cruise with the Explore 4 and Pinnical Dinner. For the 14 nights it works out to an ammenity of $730 pp, for a total of $1460.

 

When the cruise fare went down $300 pp after the Explore 4 ended, and final payment wasn't due yet, I called my TA for the price reduction.

 

The only way for us to receive the fare reduction, was to give up Explore 4, which would have been fine if I had received the difference of $860 in obc. As lets face it, why should Hal be able to keep the difference of $430 pp in ammenities for a $300 reduction, when I was given a $730 perk for booking.

 

Anyway, I was told tough sh**, by Hal, either keep the Explore 4 at original booking price or lose it and pay $300 less.

 

Either way I see it, I was offered $1460 in ammenities to book the cruise and was expected to give it all up for a total $600 reduction.

 

Hal said they "understand" why I was frustrated, however chose to lose us as cruisers over $860. And the possible $125,000 we plan to spend on cruising in the next 25 years at an average of $5000 per year.

 

We never asked for the reduction and also keep the Explore 4, we asked for the fare reduction and the difference of the perk in OBC or any other way to make up the difference for what was originally given to us to book the cruise in the first place.

 

So anyone who got to enjoy both the reduction, and keep the Explore 4, good for you, but to those of us who had to wrongfully choose either one or the other when the values are like night and day, it sucks to be us!

 

Unfortunately we have a $705 credit sitting with HAL that has to be used up, so I'll wait for rock bottom prices, sleep in steerage, but at least they won't get to steal that from me too.

 

I don't post this to offend, but it's just my personal opinion that it is completely wrong of them to not honour the full value of an ammenity they entice you with to book the cruise in the first place.. just saying...:cool:

 

At the end of the day, we cancelled the cruise.. I felt scammed and cheated, and what's the point of being pi**'ed off even before you get on the cruise. :mad:

 

I really do not understand why you are so upset, and feel cheated. You liked the Explore4 package deal, so you booked. You must have been happy with that offer and price or you would not have booked.

 

Now, HAL takes away the Explore4 package offer and lowers the price of the cruise a bit (as most of us expected they would do). You can keep your original deal (with Explore4) or take the new one - your choice. HAL has no obligation to you to give you anything more, as prices and offers change all the time.

 

I think what you are doing is confusing the OBC credits that some people have been given when prices go DOWN on their cruise (from what they are booked at). In your case, the price went UP, so the deal you had was better than what is available now. No harm, no foul IMO. Just keep your old deal and you are better off than those folks booking today.

 

Another way to look at it: HAL's total package price included the "extras" (such as drinks, OBC, free meals) for a sale. Its a total package. After the sale is over, prices normally go back up to regular price (just like your supermarket does). You took advantage of the sale and now that it is over, you cannot expect them to now give you even more.

 

In my case, I traded off a package "worth" about $1100-1200 (maximum) for a $1000 price reduction. Due to my situation, the cash price reduction was a better deal for me. For others it may not have been. Either way, it was my choice to make.

 

By the way, the "value" of the package is likely less than you quote (and HAL counts of this) since most people will not use all 15 drinks (per cabin) every day of the cruise (and all drinks will not be $6.95 either).

 

IMO, HAL did nothing wrong in their offer to you.

[Spendogirl]

trying to have your cake and eat it too

 

And the way I see it, I was given a $1460 cake, if you reduce the cake by $600, sounds to me like somebody ate half my cake, and it wasn't me.. :p

 

Again, keep trying to justify it, yeah HAL, good for them, blah blah blah..

 

I am not new to cruising or to HAL, I am not an idiot, I rather enjoyed HAL, however, doesn't make your opinion right, nor will you convince what they are doing is right.

 

My OPINION, be it from the "Pram" or the "Cake", what "I" felt they did, is wrong, will always be wrong and I will never see it from your point of view, ever!!!!:rolleyes:

 

And at the end of the day, it's up to me where I spend my cruising dollars, and it wont' be on HAL, simple as that.

 

They chose to disregard us as any value to them, and I in turn get the last word, don't I!

 

If someone want's to give up perks for price reductions not nearly worth the value of the perk, that's their choice.. but don't dance around the bush when it comes to advertising. Don't tell me something is free, when it's not. :eek:

[cruz chic]

Princess does the same thing. Offer you things for free that aren't I guess they think we are all dumb and don't know we talk about it here;).

[CantanaLobo]

My take - HAL is selling two products. One is a cruise + Explore4 for $3,149 PP. The other product is just a cruise for $2,999. I get to pick one of those two products.

 

I might wish they had a third product consisting of cruise + Explore4 for $2,999, but they're not selling that. I'm not going to cancel a cruise because they don't.

[Spendogirl]

Princess does the same thing. Offer you things for free that aren't I guess they think we are all dumb and don't know we talk about it here

 

I agree completely! :D

[Globaliser]

You can conjure up any justification on Hal's part all you want, I won't agree, I won't see your point and I don't agree with what they did.

I am not new to cruising or to HAL, I am not an idiot, I rather enjoyed HAL, however, doesn't make your opinion right, nor will you convince what they are doing is right.

 

My OPINION, be it from the "Pram" or the "Cake", what "I" felt they did, is wrong, will always be wrong and I will never see it from your point of view, ever!

 

...

 

If someone want's to give up perks for price reductions not nearly worth the value of the perk, that's their choice.. but don't dance around the bush when it comes to advertising. Don't tell me something is free, when it's not.

Well, they do say that there are none so deaf as will not hear.

 

Many of us on this thread think that the Explore4 package may only be worth $20 a day or so, and therefore we'd never buy it for $50 a day because it isn't worth that much to us.

 

Even if it was "free", it only came with your original fare and doesn't come with the new fare if you re-fare. What's so hard to understand about that? It's like agreeing to buy a phone with a camera, and then being offered a cheaper phone with no camera. You can't demand to have the cheaper phone and also have the camera that came with the original phone.

[Spendogirl]

It's a mute point anyway.. It cost me nothing to cancel, and if I re-book today I would NOW be getting the value of the loss of the Exlore4. At today's price point..it's a fair value.. last week, not so much..

 

Original booking $2209 CAD with Explore4

 

Nov 1st, $1910 IF I give up Explore4 (at this point is where I took issue with the whole situation) If it had dropped to anywhere near $1500 - $1600, I would not have taken exception as it would have dropped with a reasonable price to the value of the Explore4.

 

Nov 3rd or 4th another price drop to $1806 CAD

 

Nov 7th or 8th another price drop to $1632 CAD

 

Today, $1632 CAD plus $100 obc offered from HAL

 

So, if I book today, I would be getting the same value as the original booking with the Explore4... and that is ALL I was asking for..

 

I wasn't looking to have my cake and eat it too. I was expecting a fair value reasonable to what I was offered at the higher booking price. And 10 days after Explore4 ended and several price drops later, in my opinion are both equal.

 

On November 1st, in my "opinion" the price drop was not justifiable to losing the Explore4.

 

However, ALONG with the issue I felt was not fair or reasonable on HAL's part, it was the way I was treated, by HAL's customer department, that I cancelled the cruise.

 

I was on a 3 way call with my travel agent, and the HAL Customer Service rep was rude, dismissive, and used a tone neither appropriate or acceptable to me or my TA. She talked over us, wouldn't even remotely listen to what was being said. She wouldn't explain any reasoning with their pricing strategies, and basically said "if you don't like it, oh well, cancel".. My TA was speechless and as shocked as I that we were treated like that.

 

So in the end, I did exactly what she said I could do.. cancel..so I did..

 

Should I let one rude person, or one pricing scheme determine whether I cruise HAL, probably not, but at this point, I am, and have made the decision to not cruise with them, when so easily dismissed by them..

 

So like I said, I have a credit to use, I'll buy a cruise at rock bottom price, and bid HAL farewell..

[cruz chic]

There was no reason for hal to talk to you that way. Some of their reps are in serious need of training. Does hal think they are the only game in town?

[Spendogirl]

I could care less about the Explore4, but if they are gonna price a cruise higher for a "free", yet "not free" perk, than give ME the choice on the price with or without it.

 

But don't tell me that the "free" Explore4 which clearly states in the contract I signed has a value of and I quote "$50 pp per day" and then tell me it has no value. Make up your mind, it has value, or it doesn't, and that IS MY POINT and only point:rolleyes:

 

And agree with me or not, it's the only way I'll ever see it!:cool:

 

Thank you CruizChick for having a voice of reason!:D

[cruz chic]

No problem.

[ithaca gal]

Well, they do say that there are none so deaf as will not hear.

 

Many of us on this thread think that the Explore4 package may only be worth $20 a day or so, and therefore we'd never buy it for $50 a day because it isn't worth that much to us.

 

Even if it was "free", it only came with your original fare and doesn't come with the new fare if you re-fare. What's so hard to understand about that? It's like agreeing to buy a phone with a camera, and then being offered a cheaper phone with no camera. You can't demand to have the cheaper phone and also have the camera that came with the original phone.

 

Globaliser -- I couldn't figure out how to explain it but you nailed it. When she decides to use up her credit, I hope I'm on land. Sorry, but I think I understand why the HAL employee MAY have gotten a little out of sorts. You can only explain something so many ways! And, of course, her TA agrees with her -- it's her TA!!! Not exactly impartial! ;)

[cruz chic]

Globaliser -- I couldn't figure out how to explain it but you nailed it. When she decides to use up her credit, I hope I'm on land. Sorry, but I think I understand why the HAL employee MAY have gotten a little out of sorts. You can only explain something so many ways! And, of course, her TA agrees with her -- it's her TA!!! Not exactly impartial! ;)

 

This post is out of line. So it's all her fault is it? I had two terrible PCC's before the one I have now. To say they were useless was giving them too much credit. I suppose it's my fault:rolleyes:. Hal is never wrong, that's for sure. A good customer service person would keep their cool even if they were frustrated.

[Spendogirl]

Sorry, but I think I understand why the HAL employee MAY have gotten a little out of sorts. You can only explain something so many ways! And, of course, her TA agrees with her -- it's her TA!!! Not exactly impartial!

 

Oh I'm sorry, I hadn't realized I was involved in a 4 way conference call and you knew exactly what was said, and how it was said!:rolleyes:

 

Bravo, excellent response, highly intelligent!:cool:

[CantanaLobo]

A good customer service person would keep their cool even if they were frustrated.

 

Gotta agree with this. A good CSR can say 'No' without annoying the customer.

 

When I called about the price drop, I got my two choices and made a decision. CSRs are at the bottom rung. I think the only way I *might* have gotten some other choice would be to escalate to a supervisor, but that is a low probability likelihood. Not worth my time - I place a value on Explore4 that's a lot less then HAL wishes someone would pay for it.

[Spendogirl]

Thank you for your resposne. We were on a 3 way call to a supervisor, who said "the pricing is fair for everbody, no matter what", and when she was asked to explain the logic in that statement is when things went south.

 

FWIW, my TA didn't agree with my opinion on the matter, but felt I at least had the right to contact HAL and have it explained to me why I signed a contract with a clearly stated value of the Explore4, yet the cruise, until today didn't drop in price of that value.

 

When you are repeatedly told "read your contract" in an ingnorant way, and you want something defined in that contract, shouldn't HAL be able to clearly explain themselves without being rude about it?

 

I wanted a simple explaination for wording and the misrepresentation of the word "free".

[ithaca gal]

I was told the E4 was a "free" ammenity.. if that's the case, why didn't Hal give me the standard price reduction before final payment???? Why was I told "you have to chose".. sounds like double talk to me... "it's free", but it really isn't.. sounds more like a scam then, doesn't it.

 

When you can answer that without your obvious sarcasm, and have it actually make sense, I may actually take your response to my post with a grain of salt.

 

Otherwise, you have your opinion and I have mine...

 

You can conjure up any justification on Hal's part all you want, I won't agree, I won't see your point and I don't agree with what they did.. enuf said:rolleyes:

 

I did not need to be in on your conversation with HAL -- I just had to read your post above to Globaliser to guess how it went. Her response made complete sense to anyone willing to have an open mind.

 

"I won't agree, I won't see your point ......." And MY post was criticized? Please!

[ithaca gal]

This post is out of line. So it's all her fault is it? I had two terrible PCC's before the one I have now. To say they were useless was giving them too much credit. I suppose it's my fault:rolleyes:. Hal is never wrong, that's for sure. A good customer service person would keep their cool even if they were frustrated.

 

I didn't say it was all her fault. But her post did smack of a little petulance, you must agree. And, yes, a good customer service person would keep their cool even if they were frustrated but we have no way of knowing who said what on that call.

 

Sometimes (and I have no way of knowing if this is the case here) a customer service person SEEMS to be rude when they won't say what you WANT them to say.

 

I do not feel my post was out of line -- sorry that you thought so.

[davedex]

We booked during an explore 4 promotion but coming from the uk could not get the drinks package and was only offered the " pay for an inside get an ocean view" offer. We would much rather have the drinks as we are happy with our inside cabin but they are being stubborn and saying that it is for American guests only! How unfair!

 

 

I love cruisin!

[MishelleMcc]

Our cruise price dropped SIGNIFICANTLY.....and we had to 'do battle' with HAL. Had the cruise itself not been so enjoyable, and the crew so amazing, we would never consider sailing with HAL again. It is not a gift, as you have pointed out. And the price game is frustrating.....

 

Totally agree! And no one should have to "Do Battle" with the cruise lines for fairness. Oops! you overpaid! Sorry!

 

Our Cruise fare has dropped $500 pp. $1000 total. The two "offers" I was given were:

 

1) an upsell which we chose not take because we simply can't afford it. (I now know that savvy cruisers book and plan to gamble on getting upsells but I did not know this before I booked so booked what we wanted - a balcony)

 

2) The second offer was a FCC but with a short window to purchase and we would lose the $50 pp on board credit we currently have. We probably won't be able to cruise again for at least 2 years so the "credit" would go to waste while we would give up our current $100 OBC.

 

So while I don't expect a dollar for dollar re-compensation, I feel that the offers both required more money from me. In reality, they are not offers. They are hustling tactics.

 

... I have had a sour feeling about this since yesterday morning after talking to my PCC (she had to work this weekend)

 

I was naive and if I am ever able to cruise again, I will never book early again. From reading these threads, this is not unique to HAL. All the cruise lines subscribe to these tactics.

[Gail & Marty sailing away]

I really can't picture ever drinking enough to make the Explore 4 worthwhile

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

We are in the same boat ..

[Globaliser]

It cost me nothing to cancel, and if I re-book today I would NOW be getting the value of the loss of the Exlore4. At today's price point it's a fair value. last week, not so much.

 

...

 

So, if I book today, I would be getting the same value as the original booking with the Explore4 ... and that is ALL I was asking for.

 

I wasn't looking to have my cake and eat it too. I was expecting a fair value reasonable to what I was offered at the higher booking price. And 10 days after Explore4 ended and several price drops later, in my opinion are both equal.

Why do you think HAL was ever obliged to make you a new offer with the same or lower value as your original booking?

 

Suppose the price had gone up and you could choose to rebook at the higher price? What would be wrong with HAL doing that? It would be entirely your choice whether or not to rebook at the higher price (and you probably would have chosen not to), just as when your price first dropped, it was entirely your choice whether to take the lower cash price or the more expensive package that may have been better value for you.

 

And with each successive price drop, it was open to you to reconsider the value of the new price and work out whether it would now be to your benefit to forego the Explore4 package and take the new price.

 

Instead, you thought that you were entitled to a better offer from HAL; and when you didn't get one, you then threw your toys out of the pram.

[Spendogirl]

I did not need to be in on your conversation with HAL -- I just had to read your post above to Globaliser to guess how it went. Her response made complete sense to anyone willing to have an open mind.

 

I did not once say her response did "not make sense".. I said, "I don't agree" with her point of view and never will.

 

When someone responds to a post with condescending remarks such as "sounds like you are throwing your toys from the pram", "having your cake and eating it too", I will take nothing they say at any value, and you remark, "I MAY know why HAL Customer Service Rep was rude"

 

The fact is, you were not in on the conversation, and you know nothing about her attitude, or mine, or the TA's.

 

You made ASSUMPTIONS, based on my sarcastic, and well warranted remarks to a poster that feels HAL can do no wrong, and just didn't see the way things I do, but couldn't say it in a nice way like other posters did.

 

Just because one doesn't agree, like other posters did, they could state how they felt without being condescending or rude, unlike yourself, I am sorry, but you were completely out of line with your comment, and it sounds like others agree.

 

If you have something informative or productive to say, I'll gladly listen and have a normal conversation, otherwise, my best advice, keep your snide comments aside.. as you can see, otherwise, you won't be taken seriously.

 

So I welcome you or Globaliser to actually be productive in the conversation.

 

Simply put so YOU understand...

 

I Don't agree with HOLLAND AMERICA on how the pricing works. I PERFECTLY UNDERSTAND how the pricing works. Big difference, read the post. I was simply putting it out there, my disagreement to the promotion, and my experience.