Frank Del Rio: " . . . the emphasis will continue to be push prices up . . .

[NLH Arizona]

Your VERY correct. A cruise is a VACATION when I LEAST want to be bothered with these things. That's why I take a cruise. No hotel charges, no rental car, no restaurants and tip calculators.

Nothing on a cruise bothers me. I pay for what I want and if I don't want something, I don't buy it. I like NCL the way it is. Have a good night!

[legion3]

Nothing on a cruise bothers me. I pay for what I want and if I don't want something, I don't buy it. I like NCL the way it is. Have a good night!

 

But NCL is not really this way at all and really isn't that good.

 

Phooey on NCL for making cruising complicated and annoying.

[ldlewis45]

Carnival is never a cruise line that I would cruise on.

 

No, I don't think any of the things are that expensive, but that doesn't change my opinion that I would like NCL to have base fare and if you want any extra's, like UBP, SDP, etc., you pay for it. I don't want to pay for things I don't use or don't want. If they want a promotional offer, then make a percentage off the fare. Fine to disagree.

 

Having taken multiple cruises on both NCL and Carnival, the two lines are much more similar than not. The only differences I noticed were that NCL's buffet was superior to Carnival's while Carnival's MDR was superior to NCL's, the new pizza on Carnival was better than NCL's, NCL had fewer announcements, and NCL's entertainment was generally better. Specialty restaurants on both lines are generally very good, with the exception of NCL's Shanghai (horrid place). Other than that, they're pretty much on the same level in terms of cruising. I didn't notice any more "nickel and diming" on one versus the other.

[sparks1093]

Carnival is never a cruise line that I would cruise on.

 

No, I don't think any of the things are that expensive, but that doesn't change my opinion that I would like NCL to have base fare and if you want any extra's, like UBP, SDP, etc., you pay for it. I don't want to pay for things I don't use or don't want. If they want a promotional offer, then make a percentage off the fare. Fine to disagree.

 

Unfortunately under NCL's current pricing model you are paying for things you don't use or don't want because you are subsidizing other passengers. The last time I did a mock booking, $3300 on the Escape to the Bahamas out of NYC, there were 4 promotions to choose from- UBP, excursion credit, 250 wifi minutes or SDP. Obviously the UBP, valued at around $750-ish for 2, is the best choice monetarily because it gives you the biggest bang for your $. The cost of the UBP and the profit NCL expects from it have been factored into the fare so it doesn't matter if you choose one of the lesser promotions, NCL is still getting its pound of flesh for the UBP. And they are getting it from every single passenger regardless of the promotion they choose.

 

Of all the things that Oceania does that I don't like this is the biggest thing Del Rio is bringing to NCL that I don't like- they add so much "free" stuff to the fare that you really have no choice, even if you don't use it you are still paying for it.

[legion3]

Having taken multiple cruises on both NCL and Carnival, the two lines are much more similar than not. The only differences I noticed were that NCL's buffet was superior to Carnival's while Carnival's MDR was superior to NCL's, the new pizza on Carnival was better than NCL's, NCL had fewer announcements, and NCL's entertainment was generally better. Specialty restaurants on both lines are generally very good, with the exception of NCL's Shanghai (horrid place). Other than that, they're pretty much on the same level in terms of cruising. I didn't notice any more "nickel and diming" on one versus the other.

 

More upscale restaurants gave more opportunity for nickle and diming on NCL. Especially a la carte if one is not careful.

 

But NCL is simply a slightly more expensive Carnival with some slight differences.

 

Or they were before they jacked up the prices on their cruises.

 

Phooey on NCL

[NLH Arizona]

Having taken multiple cruises on both NCL and Carnival, the two lines are much more similar than not. The only differences I noticed were that NCL's buffet was superior to Carnival's while Carnival's MDR was superior to NCL's, the new pizza on Carnival was better than NCL's, NCL had fewer announcements, and NCL's entertainment was generally better. Specialty restaurants on both lines are generally very good, with the exception of NCL's Shanghai (horrid place). Other than that, they're pretty much on the same level in terms of cruising. I didn't notice any more "nickel and diming" on one versus the other.

I'm happy with NCL and I don't notice a lot of "nickel and diming" on it either. Agree with the your opinion of Shanghai; had one dinner there an never went back.

[NLH Arizona]

Unfortunately under NCL's current pricing model you are paying for things you don't use or don't want because you are subsidizing other passengers. The last time I did a mock booking, $3300 on the Escape to the Bahamas out of NYC, there were 4 promotions to choose from- UBP, excursion credit, 250 wifi minutes or SDP. Obviously the UBP, valued at around $750-ish for 2, is the best choice monetarily because it gives you the biggest bang for your $. The cost of the UBP and the profit NCL expects from it have been factored into the fare so it doesn't matter if you choose one of the lesser promotions, NCL is still getting its pound of flesh for the UBP. And they are getting it from every single passenger regardless of the promotion they choose.

 

Of all the things that Oceania does that I don't like this is the biggest thing Del Rio is bringing to NCL that I don't like- they add so much "free" stuff to the fare that you really have no choice, even if you don't use it you are still paying for it.

Obviously, on cruise lines you are supplementing other passengers on some things you don't use by paying your cruise fare, just as I'm paying for any perks that I receive in my cruise fare. I just don't want to see the UBP, SDP, internet, etc. included in the fare, I want a choice to purchase or not. NCL's current business model fits perfectly into my mix of cruise lines and if I want an inclusive line, I'll cruise on Crystal, if I want a premium line, I'll cruise on Celebrity and if I want a mass market line, I'll cruise on NCL.

[sparks1093]

I just don't want to see the UBP, SDP, internet, etc. included in the fare,

 

That's my point, under NCL's pricing model those things are included in the fare and they are included whether you take any of their promotions or not (in other words your fare is not reduced if you decline to take a promotion).

[legion3]

I'm happy with NCL and I don't notice a lot of "nickel and diming" on it either. Agree with the your opinion of Shanghai; had one dinner there an never went back.

 

He said he didn't see any" more "nickle and diming than CCL not that he didn't notice "a lot"

 

This does not suggest how much he actually saw. Which suggests it could be more than you don't see. :)

[NLH Arizona]

He said he didn't see any" more "nickle and diming than CCL not that he didn't notice "a lot"

 

This does not suggest how much he actually saw. Which suggests it could be more than you don't see. :)

This was my opinion. Not everyone see things the way you do, as we all see things with differently.

[legion3]

That's my point, under NCL's pricing model those things are included in the fare and they are included whether you take any of their promotions or not (in other words your fare is not reduced if you decline to take a promotion).

 

They may not have been fully included when I booked but given the jacked up prices now, they certainly are.

 

Phooey on NCL

[flipper32]

I always find these threads amusing, I guess his job is suppose to be to cut his margins and give us all better bargains? How do you think they pay for upgrades on older ships and the build of an $800 million ship like Escape?

Obviously NCL and every other company will always test price increases and when consumer purchasing slows they know they need to lower the price.

[legion3]

This was my opinion. Not everyone see things the way you do, as we all see things with differently.

 

Whatever, most can see what you did.

[NLH Arizona]

Whatever, most can see what you did.

 

Not everyone see things the way you do, as we all see things with differently.

[legion3]

Not everyone see things the way you do, as we all see things with differently.

 

Yeah, you said that already.

[NLH Arizona]

Yeah, you said that already.

Thank you for your response to me. Not everyone sees things the way you do. We all have our own interpretations/opinions, based on our own value system, life experiences, financial position, expectations, etc.

[sparks1093]

Thank you for your response to me. Not everyone sees things the way you do. We all have our own interpretations/opinions, based on our own value system, life experiences, financial position, expectations, etc.

 

Nickel and diming consists of charging for something the other cruise lines don't charge for or charging more for the same thing that other cruise lines charge for. While I used to defend NCL against those that said they nickel and dime I no longer can, because they do. Has nothing to do with interpretation, value systems, life experience or anything else, it just is what it is.

[NLH Arizona]

Nickel and diming consists of charging for something the other cruise lines don't charge for or charging more for the same thing that other cruise lines charge for. While I used to defend NCL against those that said they nickel and dime I no longer can, because they do. Has nothing to do with interpretation, value systems, life experience or anything else, it just is what it is.

That is not how I see nickel and diming. I see it as a company that charges small amounts for minor services. For example, if NCL were to charge someone a small amount to use a chair in the MDR or to use a towel at the pool or to have a key card, etc. Like I said, we all see things differently based on our own criteria.

[sparks1093]

That is not how I see nickel and diming. I see it as a company that charges small amounts for minor services. For example, if NCL were to charge someone a small amount to use a chair in the MDR or to use a towel at the pool or to have a key card, etc. Like I said, we all see things differently based on our own criteria.

 

So no cruise line nickels and dimes, that's good to know:rolleyes:. As I said, it is what it is.

[NLH Arizona]

So no cruise line nickels and dimes, that's good to know:rolleyes:. As I said, it is what it is.

Never said that!:rolleyes: You feel that NCL nickels and dimes and that is your opinion and for you that is the correct answer. Edited November 13, 2015 by NLH Arizona

[sparks1093]

Never said that!:rolleyes: You feel that NCL nickels and dimes and that is your opinion and for you that is the correct answer.

 

So what other cruise line charges a fee to use a chair or a towel or to have a key card? None of them that I am aware of, so if that is your definition then none of them nickel and dime. They are all in business and their business is to seperate as many dollars as they can from the passengers both before and during the cruise. NCL just does it more. Heck, if I were an investor I would be glad that NCL nickels and dimes. As a passenger I need to be aware of it so that I can avoid it or minimize it. Nothing more, nothing less.

[hondorner]

...Of all the things that Oceania does that I don't like this is the biggest thing Del Rio is bringing to NCL that I don't like- they add so much "free" stuff to the fare that you really have no choice, even if you don't use it you are still paying for it.

Spoken like someone who has precisely no knowledge of what Oceania is really like. The "free" stuff on Oceania includes all non-alcoholic drinks including bottled water -- I don't know anyone who doesn't use it. Also, specialty restaurants are included in the fare -- again, everyone takes advantage of it. Air fare is also included in the price -- and it's a great deal -- but, if you can do better on your own, you can get an air credit. I can't think of anything else that's "free" on Oceania.

 

There is no free laundry on Oceania for normal cruises; I get free laundry on NCL due to my Platinum status; I don't use it, so I guess I'm paying for something that's "free". Likewise the "free" specialty dinners on NCL -- I'm not impressed by any of NCL's specialties, and don't use them, even if they're free. I guess I'm paying for something I don't use...

 

Regent Seven Seas, of course, is different -- all alcoholic beverages are included, even premium brands. If you don't drink, you won't use it. Also, most excursions are "free"; if you'd rather take private excursions, you'll be paying for something ypou don't need.

 

Finally, as long as I'm responding to you, I'd like to comment on your notion that FDR is trying to create "Oceania Lite" as a stepping stone to Oceania. First of all, the target demographic for Oceania is ages 50 to 70. There are no children's facilities and no children's programs. If he's expecting NCL passengers to move up, he's probably going to wait a while for most. Oceania is not boring for the typical guests; not many of us are into water slides or rock climbing or zip lines or surfing aboard a ship, and have little desire for bumper cars...

 

Besides, Oceania has always been there for older, well-traveled, discerning NCL cruisers. In fact, some Regent cruisers have moved up from NCL. They have been there before the merger and will still be there after the merger, for those who are looking for something less rambunctious.

 

In a similar vein, NCL is there for Oceania and Regent guests -- as long as they only sail when school is in session, take longer cruises, and cruise out of the country when possible. At those times, NCL is very much like Oceania.

[sparks1093]

Spoken like someone who has precisely no knowledge of what Oceania is really like. The "free" stuff on Oceania includes all non-alcoholic drinks including bottled water -- I don't know anyone who doesn't use it. Also, specialty restaurants are included in the fare -- again, everyone takes advantage of it. Air fare is also included in the price -- and it's a great deal -- but, if you can do better on your own, you can get an air credit. I can't think of anything else that's "free" on Oceania.

 

I don't need to know what Oceania is like, their marketing on their website says it all. Start with the 50% off for booking a cruise, sure that's realistic when you set the normal price so high. And I always use "free" in quotation marks because nothing is "free", as whatever you are getting for "free" is being included in your fare. If all of that works for you that is great but it's too much like Barnum and Bailey for my tastes.

There is no free laundry on Oceania for normal cruises; I get free laundry on NCL due to my Platinum status; I don't use it, so I guess I'm paying for something that's "free". Likewise the "free" specialty dinners on NCL -- I'm not impressed by any of NCL's specialties, and don't use them, even if they're free. I guess I'm paying for something I don't use...

 

The free laundry is yours because you earned it as a perk, use it or not as you wish. If you don't take one of the promotions then yes, you are paying for something and not using it.

Regent Seven Seas, of course, is different -- all alcoholic beverages are included, even premium brands. If you don't drink, you won't use it. Also, most excursions are "free"; if you'd rather take private excursions, you'll be paying for something ypou don't need.

Again, all factored into the fare, not free by any stretch.

 

Finally, as long as I'm responding to you, I'd like to comment on your notion that FDR is trying to create "Oceania Lite" as a stepping stone to Oceania. First of all, the target demographic for Oceania is ages 50 to 70. There are no children's facilities and no children's programs. If he's expecting NCL passengers to move up, he's probably going to wait a while for most. Oceania is not boring for the typical guests; not many of us are into water slides or rock climbing or zip lines or surfing aboard a ship, and have little desire for bumper cars...

 

It's not my notion, this is what industry analysts and people more expert than I have discerned from interviews with Del Rio. From what I've seen they are spot on in their analysis.

Besides, Oceania has always been there for older, well-traveled, discerning NCL cruisers. In fact, some Regent cruisers have moved up from NCL. They have been there before the merger and will still be there after the merger, for those who are looking for something less rambunctious.

 

In a similar vein, NCL is there for Oceania and Regent guests -- as long as they only sail when school is in session, take longer cruises, and cruise out of the country when possible. At those times, NCL is very much like Oceania.

 

I've added my comments above.

[NLH Arizona]

So what other cruise line charges a fee to use a chair or a towel or to have a key card? None of them that I am aware of, so if that is your definition then none of them nickel and dime. They are all in business and their business is to seperate as many dollars as they can from the passengers both before and during the cruise. NCL just does it more. Heck, if I were an investor I would be glad that NCL nickels and dimes. As a passenger I need to be aware of it so that I can avoid it or minimize it. Nothing more, nothing less.

I gave you examples of some of the things that I would consider as nickel and diming, never said anyone was doing these thing. To me the definition of nickel and diming is: charging small amounts for many minor services. Your definition might be different. I also don't think anyone can be nickeled and dimed unless they allow it, because one is in full control of their money and no one is forcing them to purchase anything. If we think differently, that is okay, because what a boring world it would be if we all saw everything in the same light. Edited November 13, 2015 by NLH Arizona

[abe3]

Nickel and diming consists of charging for something the other cruise lines don't charge for or charging more for the same thing that other cruise lines charge for. While I used to defend NCL against those that said they nickel and dime I no longer can, because they do. Has nothing to do with interpretation, value systems, life experience or anything else, it just is what it is.

 

 

So if I go to a mom and pop store and buy the same item for more than I would get at target or Walmart is that nickel and diming?