Highest Prices We Have Seen

[3rdGenCunarder]

1 hour ago, terrydtx said:

Probably will not be any balcony cabins, all portholes.

 

And a boring dress code, everyone wearing the same outfit. 

[mcrcruiser]

2 hours ago, mcrcruiser said:

yup Carnival stock down again in early trading  April 4,2023 .shares now at $9.86  .Analysts are leery about CCL 

last looked CCL now  $ 9,69  .Certainly not a robust stock

[mcrcruiser]

2 hours ago, 3rdGenCunarder said:

 

 

Thank goodness I can afford something in the range between these two options. 

 

31 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

I was speaking industry not single line.  This is truly a case where a rising tide lifts all ships😊

How do the major cruise lines afford new ships with the huge debt they must service? Additionally, as the Federal Reserve raises interest rates to fight inflation that places another huge strain on the cruise lines  free cash flow .Not good news for the cruise lines  .Just the facts 

[Mary229]

15 minutes ago, mcrcruiser said:

 

How do the major cruise lines afford new ships with the huge debt they must service? Additionally, as the Federal Reserve raises interest rates to fight inflation that places another huge strain on the cruise lines  free cash flow .Not good news for the cruise lines  .Just the facts 

Their rates were locked in before this rate hike cycle.  Those ships were in stream prior to the pandemic.   
 

what will happen if there is a downturn is the smaller players will exit. Branson declared bankruptcy today.

 

however on the other side Emirates just announced a new cruise line.  If business was so bad I don’t think they would be entering 

Edited April 4, 2023 by Mary229

[Mary229]

@mcrcruiser I still ask, why didn’t you book your fully refundable $100 deposit when you were on the ship?  If memory serves me your last cruise was very recently 

[mcrcruiser]

8 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

Their rates were locked in before this rate hike cycle.  Those ships were in stream prior to the pandemic.   
 

what will happen if there is a downturn is the smaller players will exit. Branson declared bankruptcy today.

 

however on the other side Emirates just announced a new cruise line.  If business was so bad I don’t think they would be entering 

Emirates has money to burn & no doubt will cater to their  kind  with regards to  customs ,good ie . The Branson thing was space not the cruise line as I recall .Imo .the smaller independent like a Viking will weather the storm better than the major players . It doesn't take thousands to fill viking ocean ships & remember they are very strong in the river cruise business .Oceana also comes to mind

Edited April 4, 2023 by mcrcruiser

[mcrcruiser]

7 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

@mcrcruiser I still ask, why didn’t you book your fully refundable $100 deposit when you were on the ship?  If memory serves me your last cruise was very recently 

We did book it in December; but we canceled it  just recently .The booking was for 14 night Zaandam Mexico Eclipse .We just can't see $5600 for a outside cabin deck 3 .HAL is  refunding $200 deposit for 2 of us

[Mary229]

2 minutes ago, mcrcruiser said:

Oceana also comes to mind

Oceana is NCLH, how are they any better off than CCL?  No one knows what the books look like at Viking so no one can draw conclusions.  Branson poorly executed Virgin and he misread the cruise demographic, it was his latest large venture and I am certain it was a major impact.   Why would Emirates throw good money into a failing industry, that makes absolutely no sense?

[Mary229]

Just now, mcrcruiser said:

We did book it in December; but we canceled it  just recently .The booking was for 14 night Zaandam Mexico Eclipse .We just can't see $5600 for a outside cabin deck 3 .HAL is  refunding $200 deposit for 2 of us

FYI, You could have moved that deposit to this other sailing 

[terrydtx]

11 minutes ago, mcrcruiser said:

he Branson thing was space not the cruise line

That is correct, not the cruise line. 

Richard Branson’s Virgin Orbit files for Chapter 11 bankruptcy | PBS NewsHour

[terrydtx]

13 minutes ago, mcrcruiser said:

Emirates has money to burn & no doubt will cater to their  kind  with regards to  customs ,good ie . The Branson thing was space not the cruise line as I recall .Imo .the smaller independent like a Viking will weather the storm better than the major players . It doesn't take thousands to fill viking ocean ships & remember they are very strong in the river cruise business .Oceana also comes to mind

Viking has a very different financing model. Most of their booked cruises both river and Ocean, requires 12 month out final payment which finances their new ship building without adding to their debt. 

[vswan]

The title of this thread is "Highest prices we have seen." Of course they are. Most things do not go down in price, but up. After not having any business during covid, the increased cost of fuel, food and labor, and having to honor money paid prior for those who "let HAL hang on to their money," I wouldn't expect prices to be down.

 

It's up to each of us to determine if we can afford (or are willing to afford) the new prices.

[AFNavigator]

19 hours ago, mcrcruiser said:

That is why we did not jump at the booking .Best to book close in to a cruise date  if you are already on a HAL ship for the extra OBC  & the use of buying 2 FCCs while there at the  new cruise booking desk 

 

19 hours ago, mcrcruiser said:

That is why we did not jump at the booking .Best to book close in to a cruise date  if you are already on a HAL ship for the extra OBC  & the use of buying 2 FCCs while there at the  new cruise booking desk 

You can always book at the current asking price then periodically check for promotions as you get closer to final payment date.  If the price drops (which it very likely will as noted in an earlier post), then ask for a fare adjustment.  This can be particularly attractive to do when HAL runs a low-deposit promotion.  I seem to recall them running a $25 deposit promotion last Black Friday.

[AFNavigator]

1 hour ago, Mary229 said:

however on the other side Emirates just announced a new cruise line.

You do realize Emirates announcement about starting a cruise line was an April Fools Day joke right?

 

First voyage will depart Dubai harbor in Apr 2024

   - No ship builds underway--pretty tough to design, build, outfit, do sea trials and have ready for passenger service just a year from now

 

Captain Jack Shallow will be their Chief Maritime Officer

    - Hmmm, sounds a bit too similar to "Captain Jack Sparrow" from Disney's Pirates of the Caribbean

 

Will "sail at more than 50 knots per hour, nearly double the speed of today's fastest ships". 

     - Doing so would require a massive increase in engine power, with resultant high fuel consumption

 

"Itineraries and bookings will be open from 31 June."

    - Last I checked, June only has 30 days

[Mary229]

1 minute ago, AFNavigator said:

You do realize Emirates announcement about starting a cruise line was an April Fools Day joke right?

 

First voyage will depart Dubai harbor in Apr 2024

   - No ship builds underway--pretty tough to design, build, outfit, do sea trials and have ready for passenger service just a year from now

 

Captain Jack Shallow will be their Chief Maritime Officer

    - Hmmm, sounds a bit too similar to "Captain Jack Sparrow" from Disney's Pirates of the Caribbean

 

Will "sail at more than 50 knots per hour, nearly double the speed of today's fastest ships". 

     - Doing so would require a massive increase in engine power, with resultant high fuel consumption

 

"Itineraries and bookings will be open from 31 June."

    - Last I checked, June only has 30 days

Did not know that.  I just saw a headline 

[Mary229]

1 hour ago, terrydtx said:

Viking has a very different financing model. Most of their booked cruises both river and Ocean, requires 12 month out final payment which finances their new ship building without adding to their debt. 

Viking’s books are not open for inspection 

[BermudaBound2014]

2 hours ago, mcrcruiser said:

 .Oceana also comes to mind

 

As Mary stated, Oceana is NCLH and IMO they are actually more precarious than CCL because they are so small comparatively. 

 

Who knows what Viking books are, but everything I've read suggests that longer, more exotic, upscale cruising is where the money is landing.

[Guest ldtr]

18 hours ago, mcrcruiser said:

and people lie as well . Do you really believe every thing you hear on TV? Hotel rates have increased but 64%  .Even i'if " that were true ,how long would that last .Can employers give gigantic raises to compensate ? LOL  .

 The only possibility will be for a very short term. Corporate hotel rates & even there the corporate world must save cash, especially now

Many corporations are laying off thousands of employees& the US is headed into a deep recession  or worse  . 

Too funny.  On the business channel from analysts whose job is to track the hotel companies and the corresponding booking volumes and hotels prices.

 

So far it has stuck around quite a bit.  People are still traveling and filling those hotel rooms, especially the luxury brands where increases are even higher.  Reality is that the people traveling are mostly not those feeling the impact from higher prices.

 

On the other hand you seem to want to complain about cruise line prices and do not appear to want to believe that there are reasons why.

Edited April 4, 2023 by ldtr

[Guest ldtr]

7 hours ago, SargassoPirate said:

One more thought, I had a World Cruise booked prior to the pandemic, as well as a South America cruise, and a cruise to Norway.  Covid took care of those.

 

As the market started to reopen and schedules were nnounced, I now have the World Cruise booked, the Norway cruise booked, and the South America cruise booked.  When I compared the current bookings with those that were cancelled, the prices are all in the same ballpark.  No major jumps in prices.  And, at prices I am willing to pay for the adventures.

 

Thank goodness, we still have a free market economy.

The revenue per passenger (used that to filter out the occupancy issues) per day on all CCL lines in total, during the most recent quarter was only 2-3% higher than the same quarter in 2019.  So anything booked last year or even during the first quarter was, in general at  prices comparable to 2019.  The focus has still been on filling ships with occupancy still slightly below 100% compared to the 105% in 2019.Even the recent increases for on board spend items on some lines occurred at the very end of the quarter and not reflected.  Will be interesting to see what happens to revenue as those increases and fare increases take hold in future quarters.  

 

On the other hand food cost per passenger per day has gone from $12 in 2019 to $15.4 in MRQ. An increase of 28%.  Fuel has gone from $17 to $26.5. Up 55%.

 

[Guest ldtr]

33 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

Viking’s books are not open for inspection 

While they are a private company the impact of their payment terms is pretty clear.  The public company get to run with 3-4 months of money received for cruises not yet taken giving them about 30-40% of their annual revenue in cash not reflected in their results.  That caused them a lot of problems at the start of the shutdown since that number at that time far exceeded their cash on hand.

 

With Viking they have 75%+ of their annual revenue in that cash amount.  They certainly funded their river boat construction  out of that cash cushion.  With their ocean going vessels that have a longer payoff period probably not all of the construction costs,  but certainly a pretty good percentage of it is funded by that cash.

[Domer81mpc]

22 minutes ago, ldtr said:

Too funny.  On the business channel from analysts whose job is to track the hotel companies and the corresponding booking volumes and hotels prices.

 

So far it has stuck around quite a bit.  People are still traveling and filling those hotel rooms, especially the luxury brands where increases are even higher.  Reality is that the people traveling are mostly not those feeling the impact from higher prices.

 

On the other hand you seem to want to complain about cruise line prices and do not appear to want to believe that there are reasons why.

Too funny and ironic too boot.

[ChinaShrek]

3 hours ago, mcrcruiser said:

 

How do the major cruise lines afford new ships with the huge debt they must service? Additionally, as the Federal Reserve raises interest rates to fight inflation that places another huge strain on the cruise lines  free cash flow .Not good news for the cruise lines  .Just the facts 

Carnival has said they aren't ordering any new ships until 2025 at the earliest and that's ordering not when they are delivered. I think we need to get used to sailing old ships at high prices for a long time.

[ChinaShrek]

1 hour ago, AFNavigator said:

 

You can always book at the current asking price then periodically check for promotions as you get closer to final payment date.  If the price drops (which it very likely will as noted in an earlier post), then ask for a fare adjustment.  This can be particularly attractive to do when HAL runs a low-deposit promotion.  I seem to recall them running a $25 deposit promotion last Black Friday.

I have a $25 deposit on a Panama Canal cruise over Christmas. If there is a huge price drop, can I just cancel (eat the $25) and rebook?

[Mary229]

16 minutes ago, ldtr said:

While they are a private company the impact of their payment terms is pretty clear.  The public company get to run with 3-4 months of money received for cruises not yet taken giving them about 30-40% of their annual revenue in cash not reflected in their results.  That caused them a lot of problems at the start of the shutdown since that number at that time far exceeded their cash on hand.

 

With Viking they have 75%+ of their annual revenue in that cash amount.  They certainly funded their river boat construction  out of that cash cushion.  With their ocean going vessels that have a longer payoff period probably not all of the construction costs,  but certainly a pretty good percentage of it is funded by that cash.

We just don’t know.  And that is their right as a privately held company but we can’t have a clue.  

[Mary229]

11 minutes ago, ChinaShrek said:

I have a $25 deposit on a Panama Canal cruise over Christmas. If there is a huge price drop, can I just cancel (eat the $25) and rebook?

As long as you are before final payment you can ask HAL to re-fare.  You may or may not lose any perks attached to your old fare, things like OBC, complimentary dining, etc….  You can keep your room and your reservation.  I have never been asked for additional deposit either