Planning to purchase Oneworld RTW ticket at end of May, which Citi AAdvantage card?

[happy cruzer]

Hello,

 

Thanks to all the excellent info on the USA to Singapore thread (special shoutout to Gardyloo) we are looking at booking a Oneworld RTW ticket (business class).  Lots of information out there.

 

So our interest started because we were planning a trip to Madrid in the fall and an cruise March 2025 that starts in Singapore and ends in Hong Kong.  Our home airport is DFW.  Played with the Oneworld tool to see what the options are.  Of course our plans are getting more ambitious :).  It looks feasible to start in Oslo for the Europe part of the trip, then do a US part in the middle, then the Asian part and finally end in Oslo.  I am sure to need to do much more detailed planning in the next two month.

 

But what seems to be important now (so we have the card to use to purchase the flights) is to apply for a credit card that gets miles (AA seems to be the most usful).  So looking at the AA site, they are currently offering Citi AAdvantage Platinum Select World Elite and Citi AAdvantage Executive World Elite.  Anyone care to share an opinion on which credit card to pick?  We are leaning toward the Executive because of the Admiral's Club access, credit for Global Entry, and the extra mile awards.  But if purchasing the business class RTW get lounge access,  then it really comes down to value of the miles.

 

We have not booked with miles very often so have a hard time determining the value.  Advice?

 

Sorry, if this question is vague, getting started on the learning curve.

[Gardyloo]

With a business class RTW ticket you will get lounge access for all flights EXCEPT AA flights within North America.  So I suppose it would depend on your detailed itinerary; if you plan to bounce around North America on AA during that portion of the trip, then the card that includes an Admiral's Club membership might be the best option. 

 

If your internal flights in North America connect to an overseas flight, e.g. DFW-LAX-HKG, then you'd get access to the lounges at both DFW and LAX.  If it's DFW-SEA with no onward overseas destination, then no access.  Hope that's clear.  

[FlyerTalker]

The biggest question in my mind, and I hope yours, is:  what is my expected and my desired outcome for the points to be earned?

 

Points earning comes in two varieties.  Those that are earning into a specific airline program and those that are transferable to a variety of programs.  Programs that earn AAdvantage miles are in the first category, while "bank programs" such as Amex Membership Rewards, Chase Ultimate Rewards, Citi Thank You, and Capital One Rewards allow you to move your points (in one direction) to a variety of programs.

 

Airline programs have the advantage of having any spend on their cards count further towards elite status with that carrier.  How much that may mean to you varies from person to person, and also depends on the status level you eventually attain.  Airline programs generally let you use the points for travel on that airline, along with alliance and other partners.  But you can't use them for non-partners, and redemptions must be made through the original program, not through the partners.

 

Bank programs have the advantage of flexibility.  Your points are not locked into a particular carrier/alliance, but can be used to either offset travel costs directly (by using points to credit against travel charges), or to transfer to various carriers to then use within that program.  A guide to those types of transfers is here:  https://thriftytraveler.com/guides/points/credit-card-transfer-partners/

 

Note that this is the info as of December - always check as partner arrangements change (such as Bilt dropping transfers to AA, which is happening soon).

 

IMO, using bank points for offset is getting poor to so-so value for the points, as you can get more leverage with transfers.

 

But - this all depends on YOUR ultimate desires for the use of the points.  I prefer having the stash of points that can be used in many ways -- others want just one airline's miles.  Sometimes you find a good deal using an obscure program -- you won't have "native" miles there, but can transfer in from elsewhere.  Note that once you transfer out of a bank program, you can't later send the points back.  It's a one-direction transfer.

 

If you do decide to go the bank-card route, look at both the partners and the earning rates.  Best earn for flying is with Amex, where their platinum card earns 5x on airline purchases and the gold card earns at 4x.  OTOH, those cards have some hefty annual fees, so you need to ask if they are worth it overall.

 

To summarize -- determine what your goals are for the points you earn.  Will they be enough for using on award tickets, or is it better to use them in smaller numbers to offset charges?  Where should I park my points.

 

And a final piece of advice -- don't willingly earn SkyPesos at DL unless you are desperate to earn increasingly worthless status, and increasingly worthless points, on that carrier.

 

 

[Gardyloo]

In my mind it comes down to the same suggestion I made in bringing up the RTW idea in the Singapore thread.  Make a plan, maybe call it a "master plan," although I don't much like that term, covering your travel aspirations for a couple of years, maybe three.  (Longer than that is fine but the chances of it going off the rails are correspondingly higher.)

 

Not only would the plan include where you'd like to go and when, but also how you'd get there and how you would pay for it.  Frequent flyer miles and points, whether gained through actual flying or through purchases with credit cards, etc., are simply a form of currency like dollars or Euros.  Use miles to pay for travel, maybe in conjunction with cash, or maybe not.

 

With almost all the airline frequent flyer (FF) programs, miles or points earned through flying also can contribute to "elite" status within that airline's FF program.  With this status can come various perks - bigger baggage allowances, lounge access, fast track connections - and also bonus miles that can be redeemed on flights.  

 

A business class RTW can provide a rich harvest of points toward these things - free flights and status - so thinking about the miles or points and the "currency" they represent could and should go into your "master plan" thinking.

 

When my late wife and I were doing a lot of travel utilizing RTW tickets, we set up a cycle where we'd use an RTW business class ticket in year one, then use the accumulated miles in year two, then a new RTW in year 3.  Of course it wasn't always that clean; sometimes in year 2 we'd have to spend cash for some unplanned travel, but nevertheless the system worked pretty well.  Our investment in the RTW not only gave us the flights included in the ticket, it also leveraged a number of "award" flights with the miles earned in the RTW.  Over the course of two years it reduced the per-flight cost (in business or first class) to very low levels, when you averaged the cost out.  $200 per flight seemed okay value for a one-way business class flight from Seattle to LA; it was downright golden for one way from London to Cape Town or New York to Hong Kong.  

 

Now this all requires some work on your part.  Even though you may buy the RTW ticket through American Airlines doesn't mean you need to sign up for AA's AAdvantage mileage program.  You can earn miles and possibly status with any Oneworld airline's program with the RTW.  For example, if you sign up for British Airways' FF program, the BA Executive Club, you can typically easily achieve "Silver" status with one RTW ticket.  With that status, you'll have access to business class lounges across the Oneworld system, even Admiral's Club lounges in the US that you wouldn't be able to access as an AAdvantage member.  

 

Or if you signed up for Alaska Airlines' Visa card, you'd get a big signup bonus but also receive an annual "companion certificate" which allows one person to fly on any Alaska Airlines itinerary for $99 if the other pays the going price.  That can make for big savings, well in excess of the annual fee charged by Visa. 

 

But it all requires you to have a plan and do your homework.  Might as well start now.

[happy cruzer]

Just WOW!  Thank you for the responses.  I've read them many times and each time see a new item of interest.

 

In the past we have always done a credit card for the cash back feature.  And been an AAdvantage member (but no status at this time) because of business funded travel out of DFW.  So at this time we are most comfortable with AA but starting to explore the options using their partners.

 

The two Citi cards that I mentioned in the original post are offering 70000 mile bonus at this time as well as extra miles for AA purchases.  That is why they moved to the top of my list.  And I believe that as long as you have the card the miles do not expire and if the card is cancelled the miles do not expire for two years.  The drawback for cards that get miles for us has always been the getting to the award levels, limits on award ticket availability, and mile expiration dates.

 

 Did the Barclay's AA card for one year to get the AA miles then cancelled it one year ago.  Looking at the terms for the Citi cards that does not seem to be a problem. 

 

Just trying to make a good plan and avoiding a big mistake.  Again thanks for all the very useful advice. 

Edited March 15 by happy cruzer

[SelectSys]

On 3/15/2024 at 8:57 AM, Gardyloo said:

But it all requires you to have a plan and do your homework.

Thanks again for all your good information on this subject.  Like @happy cruzer, your information has triggered me to start planning the planning process for a OW RTW ticket. 

 

One struggle that I am having is how to plan for flights beyond what is visible in reservation system's schedule?  I have been researching a ticket initiating in Tokyo in the fall and the tail end of the trip falls off what is currently visible schedule in 2025.

 

[Gardyloo]

8 minutes ago, SelectSys said:

Thanks again for all your good information on this subject.  Like @happy cruzer, your information has triggered me to start planning the planning process for a OW RTW ticket. 

 

One struggle that I am having is how to plan for flights beyond what is visible in reservation system's schedule?  I have been researching a ticket initiating in Tokyo in the fall and the tail end of the trip falls off what is currently visible schedule in 2025.

 

Flight date changes after ticketing are free, so what you do is book the unlisted flights with "dummy" dates that fall within the booking window, then change them to the actual dates when those become available.

[SelectSys]

7 minutes ago, Gardyloo said:

Flight date changes after ticketing are free, so what you do is book the unlisted flights with "dummy" dates that fall within the booking window, then change them to the actual dates when those become available.

Okay - I guess you just need to bet that a ticket will be available around the time you need it. My hope is to have as many real dates and flights locked in as I have seen using the online planning tool that not all flights have RTW space available.

 

Thanks again for all your good information.

Edited March 16 by SelectSys

[Gardyloo]

13 minutes ago, SelectSys said:

Okay - I guess you just need to bet that a ticket will be available around the time you need it. My hope is to have as many real dates and flights locked in as I have seen using the online planning tool that not all flights have RTW space available.

 

Thanks again for all your good information.

The Oneworld online tool is and always has been, a piece of you-know-what.  I'd strongly recommend a subscription to Expert Flyer which will let you see seat availability by booking class (L for economy, D for business) for the chosen flights.

 

https://www.expertflyer.com/

[SelectSys]

6 minutes ago, Gardyloo said:

The Oneworld online tool is and always has been, a piece of you-know-what

Yes, I know your feelings about the tool.  It is definitely not the best.  I have been able to get it to work, but it is hard to control as it continuously tries to replan thigs that are already set.

 

8 minutes ago, Gardyloo said:

I'd strongly recommend a subscription to Expert Flyer which will let you see seat availability by booking class (L for economy, D for business) for the chosen flights.

Thanks, I will take a look at this tool.  

[SelectSys]

@Gardyloo - using all of your suggestions I have developed an itinerary that works starting from Tokyo.  It dovetails with a transpacific cruise that heads back to the US at the end of the trip.  I can also slot in an extra South American trip by picking up a couple of domestic flights as a separate ticket.

 

I am now ready to book.  Will I have any issues getting the AA desk to price it using the Japanese price which is much cheaper than starting from the US?   Will they try to switch me to US pricing?  My other alternative, I guess, is to try and buy it via the OW website.

 

Thanks in advance for any additional help and insight you can provide.

 

BTW - I was able to price the flights by entering them into your favorite tool on the OW website.  I also have several tickets on AA operated flights both domestically and those to the South America.  I could also switch to AA to fly LAX to Tokyo at the end, but I would rather fly on JAL.

[Gardyloo]

If you can get to the pricing screens using the Oneworld tool, go for it there first.

 

If that doesn't work, then by all means phone the AA RTW desk.  You shouldn't have any difficulty getting the ex-Japan price; if you get some rep that wants to charge the US price, say thank you, hang up and call again (HUCA is standard practice in such cases.)  

 

If you're using AA metal on the South America segments, that ought to be adequate incentive for AA to issue the ticket; you might also look for AA codeshares on other airlines' flights.  AA codeshares on most/all JAL flights between the US mainland and Japan, including LAX-NRT/HND.  

 

If you want to post your route I can see if there are any hints or suggestions possible.  Good luck!

[SelectSys]

3 hours ago, Gardyloo said:

you might also look for AA codeshares on other airlines' flights.  AA codeshares on most/all JAL flights between the US mainland and Japan, including LAX-NRT/HND.  

 

If you want to post your route I can see if there are any hints or suggestions possible.  Good luck!

I just got off the phone with the AA RTW desk.  The agent was really quite knowledgeable and helpful as you suggested previously.    The availability of one segment (DXB to CMN via DOH) changed by the time I called in so the agent made a bit of last minute adjustment to the ticket.  The connection was a bit worse, but still acceptable.  I guess we will run around in Doha for the day (if it's not too hot) or just hang out in the airport...

 

The agent said I would receive the price back tomorrow from the ticketing desk via email.  She said I should get the Japanese pricing.  I will see what happens.  If the pricing holds up, the ticket should be $6100 including taxes for a 31,451 mile journey (~$.19/mile) in business class.   I priced a somewhat similar journey starting from LAX and its price came in at just under $12k which is almost twice as much as starting in Japan!  Wow, what a great "hack" to start outside the US!  It's basically like either my wife or I are travelling "free."  Your second suggestion, or "hack," to add in supplemental trips was great too!  With this is mind, I was able to get a flight to and from South America for very little marginal cost.  

 

Thanks again for all your help!  I don't think I would have attempted to get this ticket without your posts as the process seemed a bit intimidating at the outset if you have never done it before.

 

Here is my route map if you are curious:

 

BTW - I am still not certain how we will get to and from Japan.  I have a cheap points ticket reserved in an economy exit row as a place holder to get to Tokyo and maybe we will return back from Tokyo on a cruise.  Also, AA seems to be unbundling their one way fares between the west coast (at least LAX) and Tokyo while JAL is not.  I wonder if AA's move is a reaction to ZIPAIR as a new player in the market? 

[happy cruzer]

1 hour ago, SelectSys said:

I just got off the phone with the AA RTW desk.  The agent was really quite knowledgeable and helpful as you suggested previously.    The availability of one segment (DXB to CMN via DOH) changed by the time I called in so the agent made a bit of last minute adjustment to the ticket.  The connection was a bit worse, but still acceptable.  I guess we will run around in Doha for the day (if it's not too hot) or just hang out in the airport...

 

The agent said I would receive the price back tomorrow from the ticketing desk via email.  She said I should get the Japanese pricing.  I will see what happens.  If the pricing holds up, the ticket should be $6100 including taxes for a 31,451 mile journey (~$.19/mile) in business class.   I priced a somewhat similar journey starting from LAX and its price came in at just under $12k which is almost twice as much as starting in Japan!  Wow, what a great "hack" to start outside the US!  It's basically like either my wife or I are travelling "free."  Your second suggestion, or "hack," to add in supplemental trips was great too!  With this is mind, I was able to get a flight to and from South America for very little marginal cost.  

 

Thanks again for all your help!  I don't think I would have attempted to get this ticket without your posts as the process seemed a bit intimidating at the outset if you have never done it before.

 

Here is my route map if you are curious:

 

BTW - I am still not certain how we will get to and from Japan.  I have a cheap points ticket reserved in an economy exit row as a place holder to get to Tokyo and maybe we will return back from Tokyo on a cruise.  Also, AA seems to be unbundling their one way fares between the west coast (at least LAX) and Tokyo while JAL is not.  I wonder if AA's move is a reaction to ZIPAIR as a new player in the market? 

So glad to see your post!

 

We are getting ready to book a ticket as well. 

 

We have one segment showing in the ONEworld tool for 21 Feb 2025 DFW to TYO which we want a time later than 6pm departure but the tool only shows early in the day departures.  Otherwise we could purchase in the one world tool.

 

Any ideas on which is better?  Call AA's desk or book in oneworld tool?

 

Thanks.

 

 

 

 

 

[SelectSys]

5 minutes ago, happy cruzer said:

We have one segment showing in the ONEworld tool for 21 Feb 2025 DFW to TYO which we want a time later than 6pm departure but the tool only shows early in the day departures.  Otherwise we could purchase in the one world tool.

Is it really that big a deal in terms of departure time?  As I said above, I needed to change one of my flights to a time that was less than ideal.  To me it's all a tradeoff of many factors to get a ticket.  Of course you can always buy it now and try and change the flight later.  I need to do this for my last flight as my preferred date isn't even bookable yet.

 

6 minutes ago, happy cruzer said:

Any ideas on which is better?  Call AA's desk or book in oneworld tool?

The tool itself doesn't support bookings and forwards you to an airline for ticketing.  I would simply call AA's desk.  My agent was really good and if you need to make changes, you'll need to talk to the airline that created the ticket. 

 

BTW - The tool told me that my options were to call JAL or book online somehow via QANTAS.

 

[FlyerTalker]

I am going to assume that your DXB-DOH-CMN will be on Qatar.  If so, there is an interesting "hack" at work.  Business class flights within the Middle East on QR price out as "business", but get coded as "first".  So a business class ticket that includes DOH-DXB on QR will be a "first class" segment - and that gets you full access to the Al Safwa First Class Lounge, which is an awesome destination on its own.  It has full ala carte dining, a collection of art from the Doha Museum of Islamic Art, and many other delightful touches.  Plus a superb bar with very premium spirits and wines.  On our last visit, we passed on going out into Doha on a long connect and just enjoyed the lounge.

 

 

[happy cruzer]

OK, I will call AA this coming week.  But before maybe I can have a bit more knowledge?

 

How do you get seat assignment in business class (how to easily check seat configuration)?

 

Here is the RTW Segments of note:

 

osl prg 27/aug/2024 BA763/BA860

BUD MAD 05/sept/2024 ID32914

MAD DFW 08/sept/2024 IB6149  (AA only shows econ)

three US trips

dfw tyo 22/feb/2025 JL 11

TYO SIN 26/feb/205 JL35

HKF OSL 16/Mar/2025 AY100/AY911

 

Any ideas of options?

 

Thanks.

 

 

[SelectSys]

1 hour ago, FlyerTalker said:

DXB-DOH-CMN will be on Qatar

You are correct.  Both our routing in and out of DXB will be on Qatar via DOH.

 

1 hour ago, FlyerTalker said:

So a business class ticket that includes DOH-DXB on QR will be a "first class" segment - and that gets you full access to the Al Safwa First Class Lounge, which is an awesome destination on its own

Interesting.  I had noted the first class coding, but I had not thought about Al Safwa lounge access as part of the ticketing.  It will be fun to compare the Al Safwa lounge to the Al Mourjan lounge. 

 

[FlyerTalker]

16 minutes ago, SelectSys said:

It will be fun to compare the Al Safwa lounge to the Al Mourjan lounge.

 

Both are excellent.  Al Safwa is much less populated, and at a higher level.  But both will be worth your time, if only for some comparison.

 

 

[SelectSys]

3 hours ago, happy cruzer said:

How do you get seat assignment in business class (how to easily check seat configuration)?

I just let the agent pick my seats for me.  I may go back and review them, but I am good for now.

 

If you want to check more closely, my suggestion would be to look up the flights on line which list the aircraft type

[Gardyloo]

15 hours ago, happy cruzer said:

OK, I will call AA this coming week.  But before maybe I can have a bit more knowledge?

 

How do you get seat assignment in business class (how to easily check seat configuration)?

 

Here is the RTW Segments of note:

 

osl prg 27/aug/2024 BA763/BA860

BUD MAD 05/sept/2024 ID32914

MAD DFW 08/sept/2024 IB6149  (AA only shows econ)

three US trips

dfw tyo 22/feb/2025 JL 11

TYO SIN 26/feb/205 JL35

HKF OSL 16/Mar/2025 AY100/AY911

 

Any ideas of options?

 

Thanks.

 

 

Once you're ticketed, you'll get a record locator/PNR that you can use with the individual airline's website to pick seats, the same way you'd select seats with any other type of ticket.  Note some carriers (BA, Iberia) will charge a fee for seat selection until 24h before the flight (yes, even in business class.)

 

Note that there are two systems that issue the PNR locators.  Some airlines (American, Alaska) use the Sabre system that will issue locators comprised of six letters, like ABCDEF, while others (BA et al) use the Amadeus system, which issues locators with mixed letters and numbers, like AB12CD.  It's useful to have both locators on hand; contact any airline and they can give you both, otherwise you might run into a situation where Airline A can't see Airline B's PNR for your trip.

 

Regarding the itinerary, a couple of notes.  First, by having BA for your first flight (OSL-LHR) the Oneworld tool will default to having BA issue the ticket.  That will expose you to very high BA fees and surcharges for the whole trip, which conceivably could add hundreds, maybe more than a thousand dollars to the final price.   

 

This is your trip, of course, but if it was me, I'd do the Prague/Budapest visits BEFORE starting the RTW in Norway.  Look at it this way - with a $5K+ price tag, each of the 16 allowed flights is worth around $312.  A one-way ticket (yes, in economy, but it's only an hour flight) between Prague or Budapest and Oslo costs $150 or less (even less than $100) so if you save those segments for higher-value flights later, you're money ahead.  It would also have the added benefit of avoiding BA and their fees.  Your first RTW segment would be on Iberia to Madrid; while Iberia and BA have the same ownership, Iberia's surcharges and fees tend to be a lot less than BA's, PLUS, if you chose the American Airlines flight from Madrid to DFW (which leaves a little earlier than the Iberia flight but which will be a much better experience - AA uses new Boeing 789s rather than Iberia's clapped out A330s) you'll be using AA planes for a transoceanic segment, thereby greasing the skids for AA to issue the ticket in the first place, a good thing. I hope that's not too confusing.  

[SelectSys]

15 minutes ago, Gardyloo said:

than Iberia's clapped out A330s

I flew on the IB A350 last summer and didn't think much of it either in relation to other carriers as the seats seemed really crammed together.

[SelectSys]

The AA RTW desk charged my credit card this afternoon.  The final price went up by about $300 to $6400 / ticket.  Regardless, I feel this is an incredible deal and will result in a great travel experience.

 

For grins, I asked the agent doing the ticketing why such discrepancies exist between ticket prices depending on where you start.  As you can imagine, I didn't really get a very understandable answer so I guess it's a simply a matter of market demand for these fares.  

Edited April 15 by SelectSys

[happy cruzer]

8 hours ago, Gardyloo said:

Once you're ticketed, you'll get a record locator/PNR that you can use with the individual airline's website to pick seats, the same way you'd select seats with any other type of ticket.  Note some carriers (BA, Iberia) will charge a fee for seat selection until 24h before the flight (yes, even in business class.)

 

Note that there are two systems that issue the PNR locators.  Some airlines (American, Alaska) use the Sabre system that will issue locators comprised of six letters, like ABCDEF, while others (BA et al) use the Amadeus system, which issues locators with mixed letters and numbers, like AB12CD.  It's useful to have both locators on hand; contact any airline and they can give you both, otherwise you might run into a situation where Airline A can't see Airline B's PNR for your trip.

 

Regarding the itinerary, a couple of notes.  First, by having BA for your first flight (OSL-LHR) the Oneworld tool will default to having BA issue the ticket.  That will expose you to very high BA fees and surcharges for the whole trip, which conceivably could add hundreds, maybe more than a thousand dollars to the final price.   

 

This is your trip, of course, but if it was me, I'd do the Prague/Budapest visits BEFORE starting the RTW in Norway.  Look at it this way - with a $5K+ price tag, each of the 16 allowed flights is worth around $312.  A one-way ticket (yes, in economy, but it's only an hour flight) between Prague or Budapest and Oslo costs $150 or less (even less than $100) so if you save those segments for higher-value flights later, you're money ahead.  It would also have the added benefit of avoiding BA and their fees.  Your first RTW segment would be on Iberia to Madrid; while Iberia and BA have the same ownership, Iberia's surcharges and fees tend to be a lot less than BA's, PLUS, if you chose the American Airlines flight from Madrid to DFW (which leaves a little earlier than the Iberia flight but which will be a much better experience - AA uses new Boeing 789s rather than Iberia's clapped out A330s) you'll be using AA planes for a transoceanic segment, thereby greasing the skids for AA to issue the ticket in the first place, a good thing. I hope that's not too confusing.  

Time, Finances, and Resources

 

Time - we have two weeks (one of us is still employed with limited vacation time) to spend on the Europe sections.  Either Aug 24 to Sep 8 or the start Aug 31.  Note the Aug 24 to Aug 27 part is on our nickel to get to Oslo.

 

Finances - still employed.  Fairly low priority to save bucks.  The great ideas of using cheaper econ flights will matter in 2 years. HA!

 

Resources - We are slowing down.  Like to spend 4 to 6 hours touring then a nice meal.  A few days can be longer.

 

So maybe we change the order of our itinarary?  Right now we plan to have two day in Oslo, two day in Prague, train to Vienna, 2 days in Vienna, train to Budapest, 2 days in Budapest, fly to Madrid, two days in Madrid.

 

Ideas to improve?

 

[RPen63]

12 hours ago, happy cruzer said:

 Right now we plan to have two day in Oslo, two day in Prague, train to Vienna, 2 days in Vienna, train to Budapest, 2 days in Budapest, fly to Madrid, two days in Madrid.

 

Ideas to improve?

 

If time was not an issue, I would suggest adding at least 1 more day to each city.  Aside from that, Bratislava is a beautiful little city and it is worth spending a day there as well.  It can be reached by fast ferry from Vienna along the Danube.