The Prepaid Gratuities Removed List

[aggieastrosfan]

can take pictures of it. This tour is only offered to Platinum guests, maybe it shouldn't be offered to anyone if they are taking pictures of confidential information.

 

How confidential is an email tacked onto a cork board in plain view? :rolleyes:

[dan40]

Agree with parts of your opine, but service was better before pre tips and more personal. But last night dining room was empty, so pre tip was Carnival's answer.

 

Service was better before auto-tips. But the auto-tips are not a factor in that. The vast expansion in both the size and the number of ships has hurt service. Not all that long ago there were a couple dozen 17,000, to 30,000 tons ships worldwide. Today there are well over 100 ships above 70,000 tones. The need for servers has taken a quantum leap. The dining room staff on some mega-ships probably exceeds the entire staff of some LINES in the old days. If we still had the 50% no tip, empty dining rooms with today's need for personnel. Service would be beyond miserable.

 

Was service better when there were only 4 to 500 passengers aboard? Well,... Yeah! How could it NOT be!

[luv2cruise777l]

How confidential is an email tacked onto a cork board in plain view? :rolleyes:

 

This list should only be viewed by Carnival Staff not people taking a tour.

Very tacky to have this list in plain sight.

 

In my letter to Carnival I will let them know that this list shouldn't be where it was so people can take pictures of it.

[dan40]

This list should only be viewed by Carnival Staff not people taking a tour.

Very tacky to have this list in plain sight.

 

In my letter to Carnival I will let them know that this list shouldn't be where it was so people can take pictures of it.

 

 

But aggieastrosfan and Wennfred are both honor graduates of the Jethro Bodine double naught School of Spyin'

[jeschwartz82]

i personally like to tip people very well for very good service, good for good service, and not as much or not at all for very poor service. i dont like the idea of being forced to pay if i have received poor service.

 

i understand that their pay is entirely based on tips, but, dont you think that knowing you have at least X amount guaranteed take some of the drive out?

[lollylew]

After reading the book "Below the Waterline", I personally WILL NEVER remove the prepaid tips. It is amazing how much Carnival employees subsidize their income with those tips! Lucky us that we have the $$ to do this :p

[tbrown]

I personally think the only reason anyone would be upset about a picture of this list being taken is because they may be on it at one time or another. Otherwise why give a crap? They were allowed to take the tour they found something that answered many questions brought up on these boards now the question is answered an people are upset over that. Is there anything to make people happy? The OP was nice enough to not include names so I see no problem. :eek::rolleyes:

[picklebongo]

I too will be writing a letter to Carnival and complaining that this list was left in a place that was visible to other cruisers during a tour. In my opinion it should not even be available to staff until AFTER a cruise is over. It is rather unsettling the number of people who advise to watch ones toothbrush and food in the event it is fiddled with because of tips that were taken off. I expect professionalish from the people who are handling my food and if they DO tamper with my food, that is a criminal offense and should be punished as such.

 

Given that almost 100% of you say you leave EXTRA above the suggested gratuity, I can't see where they are losing any money. Quite frankly if you guys are leaving anywehre near what you claim, they are making a really good living, though I think many exaggerate for whatever reason. I never leave extra because they do exactly what I expect them to, deliver great service, which is what I'm paying for.

[pnjkeith]

 

You have advised the staff but this still does not prevent them from being cslled on the carpet for your actions.

 

 

There is a poster here that always aeks for the source of that info! I too am curious why you think that?

[Tucker in Texas]

I don't understand why the room stewards would even get a list showing who pre-paid gratuities or not. Is there a reason behind this? They *should* clean the room regardless. We have always prepaid just because it's fair to everyone all around, and then we tip extra in cash at the end. Less hassle for me.

 

It was my understanding that this was a "subtle" way of letting the crew members know that since the tips were removed, they were expected to turn in cash tips that were given to them by those people. I'm sure the lines have data of the percentage of those removing the tips that are stiffing the crew but if a crew member regularly comes up with a very low amount of cash tips in comparison to what they expect to be given, he would be given a "talking to" about "skimming."

 

Tucker in Texas

[pnjkeith]

 

You have advised the staff but this still does not prevent them from being cslled on the carpet for your actions.

 

 

There is a poster here that always asks for the source of that info! I too am curious why you think that?

[maxamuus]

There is a poster here that always asks for the source of that info! I too am curious why you think that?

 

stuttering? 9 mins apart so not a duplicate post...

[pnjkeith]

Service was better before auto-tips. But the auto-tips are not a factor in that. The vast expansion in both the size and the number of ships has hurt service. Not all that long ago there were a couple dozen 17,000, to 30,000 tons ships worldwide. Today there are well over 100 ships above 70,000 tones. The need for servers has taken a quantum leap. The dining room staff on some mega-ships probably exceeds the entire staff of some LINES in the old days. If we still had the 50% no tip, empty dining rooms with today's need for personnel. Service would be beyond miserable.

 

Was service better when there were only 4 to 500 passengers aboard? Well,... Yeah! How could it NOT be!

 

 

Good points! Ship size has hurt service, so has pre tips. Why do the extra work, when most are going to leave auto on, regardless of service. At least the majority on this board say they do!

[pnjkeith]

stuttering? 9 mins apart so not a duplicate post...

 

No got distracted by big boobs on TV. Forgot what i was doing, so sorry maxamuus! LMAO:D

[nolaAlive]

For people who depend on tips for a living, its nice to know how much to expect for budget purposes. It isn't like they receive tips after each customer they service, as a server in a real restaurant might.

 

I overtip, but think the level of service you receive is more related to your attitude. I think happy people get better service than chronic complainers.

 

Should Carnival move the letter to a different location or should they stop offering the tour because someone took, and published, a picture of something they perhaps should not have? Platinum benefits, including the tour, are a privilege, and one that could easily be revoked.

[picklebongo]

For people who depend on tips for a living, its nice to know how much to expect for budget purposes. It isn't like they receive tips after each customer they service, as a server in a real restaurant might.

 

I overtip, but think the level of service you receive is more related to your attitude. I think happy people get better service than chronic complainers.

 

Should Carnival move the letter to a different location or should they stop offering the tour because someone took, and published, a picture of something they perhaps should not have? Platinum benefits, including the tour, are a privilege, and one that could easily be revoked.

 

People at cc selectively decide what rules to follow and protocols, because as many of you like to say, "it's your vacation." Now if it was anybody else other than the OP, I would hazard to say many would be up in arms that this was not a cool thing to do, post this letter here. I have the greatest respect for the OP, but I do think he used poor judgment to post that letter here.

 

If Carnival did not want people to remove tips, they would not have this as an option, it would be automatic. If you believe everybody deserves their tip regardless, then leave it on your S&S and if you don't, make the adjustments you feel are warranted. The notion that these hardworking, wonderful people from third world countries will spit in our food, soil our toothbrushes if we don't tip at the appropriate levels or remove our tips, does not speak highly of them as professionals. I think the more people learn that this list exist and that crew members know who is tipping and who isn't, more people will be offended and perhaps Carnival will take some action, or at least make certain it goes underground, moreso.

[The C-Macs]

I'm one of those people who always pays at least the conventionally expected tip. And since working with a former waiter who used to regal me with some great stories, I often tip more. I kinda like the antiquated notion of a tip as an expression of appreciation for an underpaid person who has gone above and beyond in personal service. But I think the whole contemporary ritual of "tipping" sucks and is unamerican.

 

First, tips are so often pooled these days. The rationale is that there are others besides the table waiter (for example) who have contributed to the experience: back waiters, busboys, dishwashers, etc. But the pooling is taken to the extent that the poor servers get as much as the above-and-beyond people; there is less incentive for everyone to perform well when they know their performance will have less of an impact on their reward, or that other people's performance will have more of an impact than their own. There is also less incentive for people to tip, knowing that the person they wish to reward is required to throw his tips into a kitty to be shared by the rest.

 

Second, rather than a voluntary reward for superb service, the actual tipping system these days leads in many cases not only to poor service but actual criminal actions! What I mean is that some servers, if they find out they are being "stiffed," will ignore customers, spit in their food, make sport with their toothbrushes, or worse.

 

Third, the tipping system has transferred the obligation of compensating employees fairly from the employer to the customer. Checkers at the grocery store, school teachers, the sandwich-maker at Subway, and the clerk at Blockbuster all get paid a set amount from their employers rather than relying on me for tips. There's no reason waiters, housekeeping staff, or bartenders couldn't do the same. If the rationale for this double-standard is to motivate better service, see above. If the rationale is "tradition," see below.

 

Fourth, the tipping system makes people feel bad. Service providers feel bad when they don't get good tips, or when they don't get as much in tips as others. Customers feel bad when they don't know what they "should" tip--will their 15% be appreciated, or will it be resented because everyone's giving 18% these days? Will their waiter learn not to wait 30 minutes before taking an order, or will he simply spit in the food next time? Customers also feel bad when they don't have the proper cash denominations but want to tip. If a $1 or $2 tip is appropriate, but all I have is a $20, what do I do?

 

What about employers that take responsibility for their service professionals by charging a gratuity or service charge up-front, or adding a set amount to the final bill, or the like? Either this is mandatory, in which case why not avoid confusion by simply raising prices in the first place, or it is optional, in which case they aren't really taking responsibility--in essence they're covering their behinds with their employees, while adding pressure to their customers to tip (quite apart from any customer desires to reward good service). Either policy changes tipping from an act of gratitude for service well-done to an alternate method of compensation (a more complicated and murky one) for doing one's job.

 

In many countries, of course, tipping is not customary. Waiters, attendants, and the like still exist, but they are paid by their employers, who also supervise them to elicit the expected level of service.

 

Writing all this kinda makes me appreciate those who don't expect a tip--airline attendants, banquet hall servers, and that kind gentleman who offers to help with the bags out of old-fashioned manners. For the time being, however, don't expect me to be on the vanguard of social change; I'll try to stay current as to what expectations are, and meet or exceed them. After all, I might return to that restaurant again, and I like to leave my toothbrush on the counter.

[Toni12345]

The people cooking your food, know you've removed everyones tips. That could be bad :eek:

 

I know everyone has their fabulous excuses for taking them off and they all swear they pay them in the end but I'm betting most are just cheap and stiff them.quote]

 

 

Sorry, but I take offense to this.... I am one that removes the auto tips based on my personal opinion of what a gratuity is. Rest assured that In the end, everyone I tip get what they deserve based on their overall performance (and in most cases this is ABOVE the norm). And yes, I have tipped down when necessary and not afraid to admit to that, but I have never "stiffed" a staff member on any of the 50 + cruises I have sailed on.

 

So I have my flame retardent suit on for those who wish to attack me on this !

 

I totally agree.. I hate it when tips are added not only to cruises but at restaraunts too.. I believe in leaving a tip when I FEEL the service was great. Thats what tipping is about, I am surprised CCL doesn't just charge alittle more and state tips included in price...

[luv2cruise777l]

I personally think the only reason anyone would be upset about a picture of this list being taken is because they may be on it at one time or another. Otherwise why give a crap? They were allowed to take the tour they found something that answered many questions brought up on these boards now the question is answered an people are upset over that. Is there anything to make people happy? The OP was nice enough to not include names so I see no problem. :eek::rolleyes:

 

I already admitted to being on the list and I did tip my wait staff for the days we sailed. What I am mad about is, this information shouldn't be posted where a passenger can take a picture of it and post it on Cruise Critic!:mad:

[Diving Rabbit]

To be honest, I may be in a bit of a cheapskate frame of mind at the end of a cruise, especially if I have spent a ton of money during the cruise. Pictures, drink cards, excursions, shopping, etc. etc. I need the gratuity to be added on so that the people taking care of me get theirs. We always tip extra to our cabin steward and the maitre de and the, of course, our wait staff at dinner.

[skylock]

Seems to me that this might explain why some people have EXCELLENT service and some have ROTTEN service that sail on the very same cruise. I know if i was your waiter and knew you removed your tips i would certainly spend my time taking care of my paying guests.

 

I always leave the tips on and look at it like part of the fare. If they deserve more i will and did tip more.

 

Where did this misconception on what tipping is get started.

 

Those people have a job. That job is to take care of the passengers. I really imagine they are expected to do the best job they are capable of just like I am at my job.

 

In my job, I am paid a certain wage. I agreed to that.

 

In their job, they are paid a certain wage plus room and board, They agreed to that.

 

If they have provided very good service and you want to reward them with extra cash, that is good, but you are NOT paying them to do their job, and you are NOT obligated to give them a single dime.

 

This is why you tip AFTER good service has been provided if you so wish, not before you see if they provide you good service.

 

A tip should never be expected for them to do the job they were hired for, are paid for doing, and they agreed to do. A tip should be appreciated if one is given no matter what that amount may be.

 

What part of it is their job and you are not paying them to do their job but rewarding for a job well done, do you not understand?

 

So you are basically saying, you would not do the job your were hired for unless you knew they were going to reward you for doing your job before you even did it? I would fire you on the spot.

[travelntreats]

I was always of the belief that within the cruise package I paid for, many cruiseline operational expenses came out of that price INCLUDING LABOR COSTS paid to the staff.

 

But wait, fuel prices went up and who of course had to eat those costs while oil was so high ??? The passengers.

 

It now appears that the cruiselines want the passenger to subsidize their payroll to the staff via the gratuity.....Horse patootie !

 

Well I am sorry xyz cruiseline, that is not how it is supposed to work. And I will continue to pay my gratuities based on the level of service I am provided during my cruise just as I would at a restaurant, land resort, etc....

 

If the cruiselines would pay their staff a tad more based on the workloads these folks have to deal with.... they wouldn't need to worry about the passengers having to subsidize the additional income the crew is "EXPECTED TO RECEIVE" via the automatic gratuity concept.

 

Bottom line.... THE PASSENGER IS PAYING THE CRUISELINES "OPERATING EXPENSE" OVER AND ABOVE THEIR CRUISE PACKAGE TOTAL, JUST SO THE CRUISELINE CAN KEEP RATES DOWN AND FILL THEIR SHIPS !

[WendyinOC]

I think most people who take the tips off in the begining of the cruise never planned to pay. I am sure their our a few exception to the norm. I have relatives who do it. They don't go to the dinning room all week so they don't feel they need to pay etc.. Not a real good idea to have a list and when Carnival sees this they might change that.

[nolaAlive]

I was always of the belief that within the cruise package I paid for, many cruiseline operational expenses came out of that price INCLUDING LABOR COSTS paid to the staff.

 

But wait, fuel prices went up and who of course had to eat those costs while oil was so high ??? The passengers.

 

It now appears that the cruiselines want the passenger to subsidize their payroll to the staff via the gratuity.....Horse patootie !

 

Well I am sorry xyz cruiseline, that is not how it is supposed to work. And I will continue to pay my gratuities based on the level of service I am provided during my cruise just as I would at a restaurant, land resort, etc....

 

If the cruiselines would pay their staff a tad more based on the workloads these folks have to deal with.... they wouldn't need to worry about the passengers having to subsidize the additional income the crew is "EXPECTED TO RECEIVE" via the automatic gratuity concept.

 

Bottom line.... THE PASSENGER IS PAYING THE CRUISELINES "OPERATING EXPENSE" OVER AND ABOVE THEIR CRUISE PACKAGE TOTAL, JUST SO THE CRUISELINE CAN KEEP RATES DOWN AND FILL THEIR SHIPS !

 

This is nothing new, it has been like this for decades, so either you haven't cruised much, or on many cruise lines, or most likely, you are just plain cheap. Bottom line.

 

There are very few cruise lines where everything from liquor to tipping is included, but most people are too cheap to pay the going rate for true full service.

[crischickie]

I think most of the people who rationalize to themselves about not paying tips eat at the wind jammer or lido or whatever you call it and figure they don't get service from anyone. They don't realize that the waiters and asst waiters who serve them dinner in the dining room (or don't serve them dinner in the dining room) are providing breakfast and lunch service in the windjammer or lido. The tips are per day, not per meal!!

 

If you stop and think about the service you get for a 5* dinner and the recommended tip is less than $5 per day, you would be amazed. Imagine going into any restaurant in the US, eating the same type meal they serve on the ship and then paying 15% of the tab in tip. That would be way more. If you want to avoid the guidelines, there is no way other than saying you are are CHEAP!!!!!

I think this is why Holland America changed their "Tipping not required" policy. Too many old folks used that as an excuse not to tip.