Lessons Learned from our Recent 20-day Noordam Med Cruise

[Terpnut]

We recently got home from 25 days in the Mediterranean, including 20 days onboard the HAL Noordam. While I'll spare everyone a long review, I thought I'd post some of my "Lessons Learned" and other surprises:

 

1. Don’t overplan with too much walking for seniors and kids. Use more taxis, or car and bus tours to get around.

2. Make sure to carry lots of snacks for mid-morning and mid-afternoon blood sugar boosts.

3. Sharing tours and transfers with others makes a lot of practical and financial sense.

4. As long as you are not a timid or conservative driver, renting a car makes a lot of sense in many ports. The rental process is very quick and easy. Renting a car is much more convenient, gives you a lot of flexibility to go where and when you please, and is more cost effective than hiring a private driver or taxi.

5. Despite HAL’s reputation for skewing older demographically, the guests on our sailing were the youngest we’ve ever sailed with. The Mediterranean itinerary is definitely more demanding physically and perhaps this skewed the guest list to younger and more physically fit guests.

6. HAL’s approach to turnaround days on B2Bs was a very pleasant surprise: no annoying morning announcements; special lunch, spa and tour options; and no muster drill.

7. Loved HAL’s silent disembarkation process (as compared to our RCI and Carnival experiences). Very effective, quiet and orderly.

8. Relatively few places accepted (or wanted to accept) credit cards. While perhaps half of restaurants took plastic, virtually none of the museum, church or site admissions accepted them. This resulted in me withdrawing and using much more cash than originally planned.

9. Even when a restaurant accepted credit cards, nearly every one of them wanted tips in cash only.

10. The port shuttles that charge a fee are almost always a rip-off.

[larie]

Thanks, great advice.

[Cruisin_Cheesehead]

Thank you for the tips...we will be sailing at the end of August on the NCL Jade. Our plan is to rent a car in Livorno and drive to Pisa and Cinque Terre. Did you have experience renting a car in this port? If so- could you elaborate on that experience at all? Thanks,

[Fblack]

It seems that most European ports are a long way from the city center. Years ago cruise ships provided free shuttles for their passengers. In some cities, merchants or chambers of commerce provided low priced or free shuttles to get passengers to shops to spend money.

 

But now, shuttles can be quite expensive. I suspect that cash strapped cruise lines are making a profit on the shuttles now.

[cruisemom42]

We recently got home from 25 days in the Mediterranean, including 20 days onboard the HAL Noordam. While I'll spare everyone a long review, I thought I'd post some of my "Lessons Learned" and other surprises:

 

1. Don’t overplan with too much walking for seniors and kids. Use more taxis, or car and bus tours to get around.

2. Make sure to carry lots of snacks for mid-morning and mid-afternoon blood sugar boosts.

3. Sharing tours and transfers with others makes a lot of practical and financial sense.

4. As long as you are not a timid or conservative driver, renting a car makes a lot of sense in many ports. The rental process is very quick and easy. Renting a car is much more convenient, gives you a lot of flexibility to go where and when you please, and is more cost effective than hiring a private driver or taxi.

5. Despite HAL’s reputation for skewing older demographically, the guests on our sailing were the youngest we’ve ever sailed with. The Mediterranean itinerary is definitely more demanding physically and perhaps this skewed the guest list to younger and more physically fit guests.

6. HAL’s approach to turnaround days on B2Bs was a very pleasant surprise: no annoying morning announcements; special lunch, spa and tour options; and no muster drill.

7. Loved HAL’s silent disembarkation process (as compared to our RCI and Carnival experiences). Very effective, quiet and orderly.

8. Relatively few places accepted (or wanted to accept) credit cards. While perhaps half of restaurants took plastic, virtually none of the museum, church or site admissions accepted them. This resulted in me withdrawing and using much more cash than originally planned.

9. Even when a restaurant accepted credit cards, nearly every one of them wanted tips in cash only.

10. The port shuttles that charge a fee are almost always a rip-off.

 

 

I'm thinking of doing a 20-day BTB itinerary on HAL next Fall. Maybe the same itinerary?

 

If you do end up posting a review (on the HAL board or in the review section) please post a link here also, as I'm interested in your more detailed experiences.

[Terpnut]

Thank you for the tips...we will be sailing at the end of August on the NCL Jade. Our plan is to rent a car in Livorno and drive to Pisa and Cinque Terre. Did you have experience renting a car in this port? If so- could you elaborate on that experience at all? Thanks,

Sorry, but all my car rentals were in the Greek ports. We wanted to see Lucca, Pisa and Firenze (and I didn't want to drive and park in Firenze!) so we went with romeinlimo for a tour out of Livorno.

[Terpnut]

I'm thinking of doing a 20-day BTB itinerary on HAL next Fall. Maybe the same itinerary?

 

If you do end up posting a review (on the HAL board or in the review section) please post a link here also, as I'm interested in your more detailed experiences.

As you can probably tell, we're loyal RCI cruisers and it took something for me to try HAL, but Noordam, its crew, the passenger mix and this particular 20-day B2B itinerary made for our best cruise vacation ever! And with the very port-intensive itinerary, my kids were too tired to miss the rock climbing wall, ice rink, wave pools, etc. etc. :D

 

As for my detailed experiences, I will be updating my blog with some of my thoughts and ideas, so I will update you with a link when I'm done if you are still interested. Thanks! :)

[chloes nana]

As you can probably tell, we're loyal RCI cruisers and it took something for me to try HAL, but Noordam, its crew, the passenger mix and this particular 20-day B2B itinerary made for our best cruise vacation ever! And with the very port-intensive itinerary, my kids were too tired to miss the rock climbing wall, ice rink, wave pools, etc. etc. :D

 

As for my detailed experiences, I will be updating my blog with some of my thoughts and ideas, so I will update you with a link when I'm done if you are still interested. Thanks! :)

I am doing this cruise the end of the month, :D couple of questions, what was the average age of the passengers? you say they were younger but what exactly is younger. this is our very first cruise ever and are in our 60's, we know there will be lots of walking. And really? no one accepted credit cards? also how was the weather while you were there, what was the average tempuratures? thanks for the help, I am very excited and ready to go just have a few questions.:)

[daisydriver]

Terpnut and other posters -- Thanks for these tips. I am sailing on Noordam October 6 (western med) with my mom (85) and mom-in-law (80) -- booked a deluxe verandah suite so we could have room to move around... I have booked private tours (in Livorno,Monaco and Naples) where it looked like the HAL offerings would be too ambitious for them re walking. Doing HAL tours in Barcelona and Palermo. But I have not chosen an excursion for Tunis yet and was wondering which site(s) if any we should try to see there. I am concerned about their stamina and safety issues as well. Any advice from anyone with similar experiences would be most appreciated. We are relatively new to cruising: we did Alaska together on Zaandam in June 2007 (also in a deluxe verandah suite) and loved it. HAL staff was kind and considerate. The "moms" are great ladies and we all get along beautifully -- I am blessed. I want this trip to be a wonderful memory and stress-free experience for them (and for me!) -- Thank you, all!

[Terpnut]

I am doing this cruise the end of the month, :D couple of questions, what was the average age of the passengers? you say they were younger but what exactly is younger. this is our very first cruise ever and are in our 60's, we know there will be lots of walking. And really? no one accepted credit cards? also how was the weather while you were there, what was the average tempuratures? thanks for the help, I am very excited and ready to go just have a few questions.:)

I can only compare demographics to my other 6 cruises so if this is your first it is difficult for me to convey the passenger mix. When I say younger, I don't mean a ship of rowdy 20-somethings--just that the average age onboard was not 60's. We found a broad mix of couples, families and seniors. And unlike the stereotypes of HAL, we saw few wheelchairs, oxygen tanks or people needing assistance in the Lido. As I pointed out already, this was probably because this is a VERY physically demanding itinerary. If you can't walk at least a little over rough and uneven surfaces AND climb/walk steep hills and stairs, then you probably won't really get to see much on such an itinerary.

 

As for credit cards, the majority of higher-end restaurants accept them, but many smaller places either don't accept them or discourage you from doing so. And most museums and churches do not accept them. Some stores did not take credit cards either. Overall, I was expecting more places to take credit cards.

 

As for weather, we really lucked out. It never rained on us and the temperatures never exceeded the normals. And most days, the temps were usually below average. In fact, on one of our final days in Roma, the high was 78 deg F! You however will need to plan on upper 80's and 90's in most places. Unless there is a miracle, you need to plan on it being either hot or VERY hot. :p

 

I will also add that, because you are going July/August, that many shops and restaurants will be closed. When we left Roma July 21st (post-cruise), we found many good restaurants were already closed for their summer holidays--they were open three weeks earlier pre-cruise in June. This is a problem with travelling in Europe around this time. Not trying to disappoint you but just wanted you to be aware of this in case you didn't already know.

 

Terpnut and other posters -- Thanks for these tips. I am sailing on Noordam October 6 (western med) with my mom (85) and mom-in-law (80) -- booked a deluxe verandah suite so we could have room to move around... I have booked private tours (in Livorno,Monaco and Naples) where it looked like the HAL offerings would be too ambitious for them re walking. Doing HAL tours in Barcelona and Palermo. But I have not chosen an excursion for Tunis yet and was wondering which site(s) if any we should try to see there. I am concerned about their stamina and safety issues as well. Any advice from anyone with similar experiences would be most appreciated. We are relatively new to cruising: we did Alaska together on Zaandam in June 2007 (also in a deluxe verandah suite) and loved it. HAL staff was kind and considerate. The "moms" are great ladies and we all get along beautifully -- I am blessed. I want this trip to be a wonderful memory and stress-free experience for them (and for me!) -- Thank you, all!

For Tunis, I didn't find many options but selected tourinmed.com. They did a very good job with our group of 16 so I would recommend them. Tell Chris that I referred you!

 

Tunis was SUPER hot--it was over 110 deg F when we were there and that was a good day. The guide said we were lucky because the last two days were really hot!? By October however, the heat shouldn't be a factor but I'm not sure. We did an ambitious itinerary that included Ancient Carthage, Sidi Bou Said, Bardo Museum and the Medina Souks. If you don't have alot of stamina, I definitely recommend the Bardo Museum. Carthage is worth a look but if you can't stand the heat, you will cook out there because there's no shade. Sidi Bou Said is pretty with great views but it's hilly (think Santorini of Africa). The Medina Souks are good if you must do some shopping but don't waste your time going on Sundays because most shops are closed. Good luck!

[daisydriver]

Terpnut -- Great insights, much appreciated. I just looked up weather in Tunis -- today it's 99...! they say the average temp in October is 77... let's hope so! But if it's crazy-hot on our port day there, maybe I will tell the moms to stay on board and enjoy the spa and I will make a quick photography pilgrimage to Carthage for my trip album... Anyone else with HAL western med experience with seniors? Any and all advice most welcome!

[chloes nana]

I can only compare demographics to my other 6 cruises so if this is your first it is difficult for me to convey the passenger mix. When I say younger, I don't mean a ship of rowdy 20-somethings--just that the average age onboard was not 60's. We found a broad mix of couples, families and seniors. And unlike the stereotypes of HAL, we saw few wheelchairs, oxygen tanks or people needing assistance in the Lido. As I pointed out already, this was probably because this is a VERY physically demanding itinerary. If you can't walk at least a little over rough and uneven surfaces AND climb/walk steep hills and stairs, then you probably won't really get to see much on such an itinerary.

 

well now I am concrened, I booked this cruise with the hopes the demographics would be skewed to a middle to older crowd. I don't have a problem walking 2 miles, as long as it is a leasurely pace and not sprinting speed with 20 and 30 year olds.:o:( Maybe I will post this question on the HAL boards and see what others think in regards to the demographics. Maybe yours was younger as it is summer vacation, mine is very late August and mostly September, all the kids should be back in school and the Europeans are almost done with their vacations??

[Terpnut]

well now I am concrened, I booked this cruise with the hopes the demographics would be skewed to a middle to older crowd. I don't have a problem walking 2 miles, as long as it is a leasurely pace and not sprinting speed with 20 and 30 year olds.:o:( Maybe I will post this question on the HAL boards and see what others think in regards to the demographics. Maybe yours was younger as it is summer vacation, mine is very late August and mostly September, all the kids should be back in school and the Europeans are almost done with their vacations??

Sorry, I certainly didn't intend to alarm you! And when you said your cruise was "at the end of this month", I assumed you were sailing this week or next (it's still July). If you don't sail until August, then most of the families might be gone, but honestly there weren't alot of kids anyhow on Noordam so I don't think the demographics will be that different.

 

Our family consisted of my parents (early 70's), us (DW and I are in our late 40's) and our two kids (10 and 8). What I was surprised to find was that there were many 30, 40 and 50-somethings on our ship. And we even hung out with a few newlyweds in their 20's. All I was trying to convey was that I was expecting a ship of all 60's, 70's and 80's seniors, but in fact there was a broad spectrum of relatively mobile people of all ages.

 

I'm not saying there were few seniors--there were many and still the majority. I was just surprised by the number of active middle-aged people (like my wife and I) onboard. I'd say it was similar to a typical Royal Caribbean ship demographic in the Caribbean but with notably fewer teenagers and children. That's what I meant by "youngest we've ever sailed with". Hope that helps.

[hylasgirl]

It seems that most European ports are a long way from the city center. Years ago cruise ships provided free shuttles for their passengers. In some cities, merchants or chambers of commerce provided low priced or free shuttles to get passengers to shops to spend money.

 

But now, shuttles can be quite expensive. I suspect that cash strapped cruise lines are making a profit on the shuttles now.

 

 

I have cruises the Mediterranean several times and the only shuttles that I had to take were of a reasonable cost. I have NEVER had one that would shuttle you into the city center in a port like Livorno.

[hylasgirl]

We recently got home from 25 days in the Mediterranean, including 20 days onboard the HAL Noordam. While I'll spare everyone a long review, I thought I'd post some of my "Lessons Learned" and other surprises:

 

1. Don’t overplan with too much walking for seniors and kids. Use more taxis, or car and bus tours to get around.

2. Make sure to carry lots of snacks for mid-morning and mid-afternoon blood sugar boosts.

3. Sharing tours and transfers with others makes a lot of practical and financial sense.

4. As long as you are not a timid or conservative driver, renting a car makes a lot of sense in many ports. The rental process is very quick and easy. Renting a car is much more convenient, gives you a lot of flexibility to go where and when you please, and is more cost effective than hiring a private driver or taxi.

5. Despite HAL’s reputation for skewing older demographically, the guests on our sailing were the youngest we’ve ever sailed with. The Mediterranean itinerary is definitely more demanding physically and perhaps this skewed the guest list to younger and more physically fit guests.

6. HAL’s approach to turnaround days on B2Bs was a very pleasant surprise: no annoying morning announcements; special lunch, spa and tour options; and no muster drill.

7. Loved HAL’s silent disembarkation process (as compared to our RCI and Carnival experiences). Very effective, quiet and orderly.

8. Relatively few places accepted (or wanted to accept) credit cards. While perhaps half of restaurants took plastic, virtually none of the museum, church or site admissions accepted them. This resulted in me withdrawing and using much more cash than originally planned.

9. Even when a restaurant accepted credit cards, nearly every one of them wanted tips in cash only.

10. The port shuttles that charge a fee are almost always a rip-off.

 

 

Terpnut! Glad to see you are back!

 

I am so glad that you had a good time with Raffaelo with Rominlimo like I referred you to! Did you enjoy the hotel I recommended as well? We just loved it! Now I will be spoiled in Rome for the next time.

 

Yes, we ended up using a lot more cash than planned. AND, we didn't tip as much as we would have if it weren't for the credit card deal. This is something they should really change if they are expecting more tips above the service charge. There were many many times we just didn't have much to lay down for tips if we couldn't add it to the bill. Oh well...

 

I really enjoy a few things like that about HAL. I love the dignified way you can have breakfast in your cabin until it's time to go. And I adore the FULL promenade deck for walking. I think EVERY ship should have this. There is NO WAY to get in a good workout around sunbathers that have their chair on the track. (I purposely bump into these)

 

We didn't have any issues with shuttles... although we had private tours everywhere that was a "big" stop. They actually had FREE shuttles on the Solstice in Piraeus (Athens) that took you closer to where the metro was.

 

Did you get a guide in Pompeii? This was our 3rd visit and our first time for a guide. We had Lucia with Romeinlimo and I cannot believe what a difference a guide makes in that amazing place. It was so interesting to finally hear about things we had been looking at for years. Yes, some things you can figure out... but it's a HUGE place.

 

HAL isn't doing this same cruise next year... unfortunately. Now I am trying hard to decide between a TA on HAL or Celebrity???

 

I am glad your back safely. I hope the jet lag and time adjustment goes well for you. It took us a good week to get back to normal.

[cruisemom42]

Terpnut, would you mind posting your itinerary? I was thinking the 20-day BTB cruise on Noordam next fall would be the same or very similar to what you did, but then saw Hylasgirl commenting that your itinerary isn't offered next year..... So now I'm wondering what ports you visited?

[Terpnut]

Terpnut! Glad to see you are back!

 

I am so glad that you had a good time with Raffaelo with Rominlimo like I referred you to! Did you enjoy the hotel I recommended as well? We just loved it! Now I will be spoiled in Rome for the next time.

 

Yes, we ended up using a lot more cash than planned. AND, we didn't tip as much as we would have if it weren't for the credit card deal. This is something they should really change if they are expecting more tips above the service charge. There were many many times we just didn't have much to lay down for tips if we couldn't add it to the bill. Oh well...

 

I really enjoy a few things like that about HAL. I love the dignified way you can have breakfast in your cabin until it's time to go. And I adore the FULL promenade deck for walking. I think EVERY ship should have this. There is NO WAY to get in a good workout around sunbathers that have their chair on the track. (I purposely bump into these)

 

We didn't have any issues with shuttles... although we had private tours everywhere that was a "big" stop. They actually had FREE shuttles on the Solstice in Piraeus (Athens) that took you closer to where the metro was.

 

Did you get a guide in Pompeii? This was our 3rd visit and our first time for a guide. We had Lucia with Romeinlimo and I cannot believe what a difference a guide makes in that amazing place. It was so interesting to finally hear about things we had been looking at for years. Yes, some things you can figure out... but it's a HUGE place.

 

HAL isn't doing this same cruise next year... unfortunately. Now I am trying hard to decide between a TA on HAL or Celebrity???

 

I am glad your back safely. I hope the jet lag and time adjustment goes well for you. It took us a good week to get back to normal.

Thanks S! We greatly enjoyed both using Romeinlimo and the Albergo del Senato! We also had Rafaele and Lucia (for Pompeii)--they were the best. And yes, I'm still trying to get back to my routine after a week! :)

 

Terpnut, would you mind posting your itinerary? I was thinking the 20-day BTB cruise on Noordam next fall would be the same or very similar to what you did, but then saw Hylasgirl commenting that your itinerary isn't offered next year..... So now I'm wondering what ports you visited?

Looking at next year's itineraries (although they might still be subject to change), Noordam is indeed doing something completely different. Looks like HAL Nieuw Amsterdam is sailing a similar and longer 24-day East/West Med B2B out of Venice next summer. Just off the top of my head, for your reference, our itinerary was: Civitavecchia/Roma, Livorno/Firenze, Monaco, Barcelona, Palma Mallorca, La Goulette/Tunis, Palermo, Naples, Civitavecchia (turnaround day), Dubrovnik, Corfu, Katakolo/Olympia, Thira Santorini, Kusadasi/Ephesus, Piraeus/Athens, Messina, Civitavecchia.

[cruisemom42]

 

Looking at next year's itineraries (although they might still be subject to change), Noordam is indeed doing something completely different. Looks like HAL Nieuw Amsterdam is sailing a similar and longer 24-day East/West Med B2B out of Venice next summer. Just off the top of my head, for your reference, our itinerary was: Civitavecchia/Roma, Livorno/Firenze, Monaco, Barcelona, Palma Mallorca, La Goulette/Tunis, Palermo, Naples, Civitavecchia (turnaround day), Dubrovnik, Corfu, Katakolo/Olympia, Thira Santorini, Kusadasi/Ephesus, Piraeus/Athens, Messina, Civitavecchia.

 

That sounds pretty close to the Sept 2010 itinerary I'm considering on Noordam: :confused:

 

Civitavecchia

Dubrovnik

Corfu

Katakolon

Santorini

Kusadasi (Ephesus)

Piraeus (Athens)

Messina

Civitavecchia (turnaround day)

Livorno (Florence)

Monte Carlo

Barcelona (overnight)

Palma de Mallorca

Tunis

Trapani

Naples/Capri

Civitavecchia

[Terpnut]

That sounds pretty close to the Sept 2010 itinerary I'm considering on Noordam: :confused:

 

...

 

Ahhh, I hadn't looked at September--just June and July! Maybe HAL hasn't release their full schedule yet, because I still can't figure out what Noordam is sailing in May and June!?

 

Anyhow, for your September sailing, I see they are in fact doing pretty much the same 10-day East and West B2B itineraries except for two changes:

1. Trapani is substituted for nearby Palermo.

2. You lose the leisurely and scenic sea day along the Cotes d'Azur for an express run from Monte Carlo to Barcelona. However this does buy you a bonus half day with an overnight stay and a full day in Barcelona the next day.

 

Overall, I'd highly recommend this itinerary. And one more thing: Due to the cruise length and breadth of ports (the two B2B itineraries were clearly designed to compliment each other), the distances between ports are smaller than on other cruise itineraries. Thus you spend more time in most ports, and this will greatly increasing your touring flexibility and reduce your stress.

[CintiPam]

That sounds pretty close to the Sept 2010 itinerary I'm considering on Noordam: :confused:

 

Civitavecchia

Dubrovnik

Corfu

Katakolon

Santorini

Kusadasi (Ephesus)

Piraeus (Athens)

Messina

Civitavecchia (turnaround day)

Livorno (Florence)

Monte Carlo

Barcelona (overnight)

Palma de Mallorca

Tunis

Trapani

Naples/Capri

Civitavecchia

 

Cynthia, have you considered Oceania? Our first two cruises ever (last September and last month) were on Oceania, and covered many of these ports. We absolutely loved this cruiseline: no assigned dining times or seats, no formal nights, great food and service, interesting non-pretentious passengers, and with 684-passenger ships, we had one port day in Sorrento and one in Amalfi rather than Naples.

 

Many 2010 cruises on $2,000 discount through August 31.

 

Pam

[cruisemom42]

Cynthia, have you considered Oceania? Our first two cruises ever (last September and last month) were on Oceania, and covered many of these ports. We absolutely loved this cruiseline: no assigned dining times or seats, no formal nights, great food and service, interesting non-pretentious passengers, and with 684-passenger ships, we had one port day in Sorrento and one in Amalfi rather than Naples.

 

Many 2010 cruises on $2,000 discount through August 31.

 

Pam

 

 

I'll have a look at Oceania, but one strong reason I'm considering HAL is that I'll be cruising solo and they generally have the best rates (e.g., less than 200%) for solo cruisers.

[Terpnut]

I'm thinking of doing a 20-day BTB itinerary on HAL next Fall. Maybe the same itinerary?

 

If you do end up posting a review (on the HAL board or in the review section) please post a link here also, as I'm interested in your more detailed experiences.

The following isn't really a review of the cruise, and I'm not sure how relevant or interesting it will be for you, but here's a link to my blog with some of the things we did, issues, problems, highlights, surprises and other thoughts: http://terpnut.blogspot.com/. To see just the cruise or travel-specific posts, you can filter my posts by a specific keyword on the right hand side. Please note that I'm still posting some of my blog entries so not everything will be there for a couple days. :)

[Got2Cruise]

May I add one tip that I learned from our recent trip?

Always carry 50 cent Euro coins to pay for the bathroom, and NEVER pass up the opportunity to use the bathroom, because you don't know when the next one will come.:)

[CintiPam]

May I add one tip that I learned from our recent trip?

Always carry 50 cent Euro coins to pay for the bathroom, and NEVER pass up the opportunity to use the bathroom, because you don't know when the next one will come.:)

 

A resounding ditto!:)

 

I had no trouble with the sun or the heat at Pompeii, but no bathrooms anywhere except at the entrances of this massive site; yikes, I was ticked off!

[Terpnut]

A resounding ditto!:)

 

I had no trouble with the sun or the heat at Pompeii, but no bathrooms anywhere except at the entrances of this massive site; yikes, I was ticked off!

On the subject of restrooms, the nicest bathroom we found in 25 days in the Mediterranean was on the walls of Dubrovnik, facing the Adriatic! Never expected that! :)