Celebrity dumps disabled man on island.

[Az's Cruising Nana]

Several statements in the article raised my cynical alarm:

 

“I asked them to sit down so we could talk at eye level but they wouldn’t and I had to look up at them,” Keskeny said.

 

"Keskeny’s only remedy is to have his lawyer, Bernstein, who is blind, travel to Miami and arbitrate with the cruise line. In addition, Bernstein is unable under the ticket contract to recover his cost and time of traveling and related case costs to represent Kreskeny in Miami.

 

“I was lucky that I got home safely to the arms of my wife, Nancy.”

 

Apart from others-should-be-eye-level when addressing Mr. Keskney and his past as an advocate for the disabled now hiring (pro bono) a blind lawyer it was the ending statement to the article (about the wife) when the cynical alarm rang loudest.

 

If Mr. Keskeny knew, prior to the booking, he'd need assistance while traveling... why not bring along the arms of said wife? And if Nancy were not available, since Mr. Kreskeny like all single passengers had to pay for double occupancy, why not invite a friend or relative along for an all expenses paid cruise?

 

Something, perhaps forethought or honesty, is missing in this story.

 

 

I agree with everything you have stated. However I do have a friend in a wheelchair who thanks us when we sit at eye level with her. It means she doesn't have to sit in an uncomfortable position looking up and having a conversation with us. It is also difficult for her to hear every piece of the conversation if we are standing above her. So I don't think that is an unreasonable request. Possibly one that might have been met had he explained why he wished to have a conversation at eye level.

 

Sue

[kkorman]

My favorite part was that he was trying to blame RCI for the fact that he had to go through Haiti to get home... the flight that he booked and paid for on his own.

 

I have issues with people who have a sense of self-entitlement. Last time I checked a butler was not responsible for helping someone go to the bathroom!

[detroitcruiser]

This guy sued Northwest airline a few years ago and had the same blind attorney. The case was dismissed.

 

Actually, I followed the case in the papers and the suit was not dismissed. Completely the opposite occurred. Northwest's motion to dismiss was denied by the court as they found that the airline's argument for non-compliance with the ADA was not legally tenable.

[detroitcruiser]

I am posting only to address the issue of whether this is a wheelchair accessible cabin. I don't know whether the man in the story sailed in a wheelchair accessible cabin, but if it was on the Century, then you cannot assume that because there was a lip/bump up, it was not an accessible cabin.

 

We have sailed in an accessible sky suite on the Century and there is a lip/bump up between the main part of the cabin. There is not a step like in the regular cabins, but between the bathroom and the main part of the cabin there is a ramp and a lip or bump up at the top where the door closes. We were able to get into the bathroom, but sometimes it was difficult, especially if you were at an angle at all. Coming out of the bathroom wasn't usually difficult.

 

We are Elite on Celebrity and I have to say that our experience on the Century was the worst Celebrity cruise we have ever had and we would never sail on the Century again. Although we were in a Sky Suite which has a balcony, there was no ramp from the Suite to the Balcony and since there was a step, it was impossible to go out on th e balcony when rolling in a wheelchair. We were on a five day cruise and I started with the cabin attendant and worked my way up through the butler, Housekeeper, Guest Relations Desk, and Asst. Guest Relations Mgr attempting to get a ramp. The Guest Relations Mgr refused to talk with me without an appointment and I was told that I could not have an appointment. This is when the Asst. Guest Relations Mgr talked to me, but still claimed she could not do anything.

 

Believe it or not, the excuse given was that a wheelchair ramp on the balcony was a fire hazard. Odd that it is not a fire hazard on any of the other five Celebrity ships we have been on. (we've been on more cruises, but on a total of five different ships) And given that this is a wheelchair accessible cabin, one would think that a ramp of the appropriate material would have already been in place. It wasn't until I attended a Navigation briefing and actually questioned this "safety" issue with the First Officer and Captain who were in attendance that on Day 4 we finally received a ramp.

 

There were not the only issues on the cruise. We could have been forgiving of the deficiencies on the ship, but the response or lack thereof to provide a remedy and the general uncaring attitude of the staff is why we would not cruise on the Century again and would never recommend this ship to anyone who is disabled.

 

All of this being said, I am in no way taking a position on the situation involving the man in this story. I only want to clarify the situation in regard to wheelchair accessible sky suites on the Century.

 

Oh, and in response to Zoncom, our experience is that HC cabins on Celebrity are opened to the general inventory sometime between final payment and thirty days to sailing and it is often very difficult to get those cabins if you wait until then. We have been unable to take advantage of several Tuesday specials and other promos because, although there were a lot of regular cabins left, the HC cabins are taken. So I think it is unusual when a HC cabin is left empty on sailing. Others on the disabled board will back this up as well. So those of us needing wheelchair accessible cabins usually have to book early.

 

Thank you for coming forward. I think it is terrible to automatically assume that people have the worst intentions. I am a very loyal celebrity cruiser but I am also a person with a disability (legally blind) and I can understand both sides. I also understand that just because someone has a good experience, it does not mean that another person having a bad experience is implausible.

[80sramfan]

Although I didn't read the ship mentioned by name in the article this apparently was on the Celebrity CENTURY.

 

 

It's obvious this guy had no business cruising by himself. It is not Celebrities job to pick people up into their chair and pick them up off the toilet etc.......

[detroitcruiser]

It's obvious this guy had no business cruising by himself. It is not Celebrities job to pick people up into their chair and pick them up off the toilet etc.......

 

I did not read anything about helping him off the toilet. If the bathroom was not truly HC accessible, e.g. had a lip on the floor as another poster claimed, he was misled into thinking he could manage on his own. You do not know what the cruise line disclosed.....don't jump to conclusion.

[Solstice23]

We were just on Eclipse and there were 4 guide assisting dogs and and saw the staff go out of the way for the guests and the dogs! Even taking the dogs personal pictures on embarkation day and formal nights!

 

Our friends and some officers played fetch with a ball on the lawn club Kate one night when MAGIC the poodle was on off ours!

 

I am sure there is more to the story

[gentlemancruiser]

I think everyone in this story is at fault.

 

RCL/Celebrity should have facilities that meet ADA requirements if they sail from a US port. If there is a non-ADA problem entering the bathroom, then RCL/Celebrity better figure out how to fix it to be compliant. This may be a basis for legal action, irrespective of Celebrity's contract, but I'm not a lawyer.

 

RCL/Celebrity on-board management apparently showed little "compassion" and understanding...but I am left wondering just how confrontational the passenger was vs asking nicely for help.

 

There is no reason given why they put the passenger off the ship...so can't comment on that issue.

 

The passenger should not expect a butler or staff member of the ship to provide routine assistance....if one needs that type of care, they should take a companion with them. There is a shady line between helping someone who stumbles once...and helping a passenger each time they want to go to the bathroom or if they fall off the toilet seat. Butler's are not for personal/touch the body type of assistance...that's really pushing.

 

Sorry but there is NO FAULT with the cruise line, only the passengers is at fault. Butlers are NOT personal support workers and they are NOT trained to transfer people. Asking an untrained cabin attendance or butler to transfer a disabled person is taking a huge change for both the disabled person and the cabin attendant. This passenger clearly assumed things. Ask anyone in the health care industry about their training. The cruise line was not going to accept any liability for injuring a disabled passengers. This guy's got a axe to grind and I found the article to be totally one sided and lacked some basic facts.

 

As far as blaming the cruise line for the stop over in Haiti, YOU'VE GOT TO BE KIDDING ME! It was the disabled man choice of airline that he flew home.

[donaldsc]

Sounds to me like he is a professional disabled activist who travels and does things just to find non-compliant situations. IMHO, he got what he deserved on the cruise. I am surprised that he did not expect people to lift him in and out of tenders.

 

DON

[gentlemancruiser]

The Century wasn't doing 10 day itineraries.

 

It was a nude cruise.

http://cruiseforums.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?p=25669623

[detroitcruiser]

Sounds to me like he is a professional disabled activist who travels and does things just to find non-compliant situations. IMHO, he got what he deserved on the cruise. I am surprised that he did not expect people to lift him in and out of tenders.

 

DON

 

Your comment is as offensive as it is ignorant. I only hope that if you become disabled in your lifetime (most people do at some point) that people show you more respect than you have shown them.

[gentlemancruiser]

The cruiser and his lawyer already know they do not have a case otherwise they would persue it and not even discuss it at all publicly, if it's a good case they can find a representive in Miami if need be. I would bet alot of money that there is video showing the cruiser being abusive or overly demanding in a very obvious manner (or some other action that I can't even dream up) otherwise the cruise line would never have disembarced him. The cruise line will have their bases covered in this case. They are being the squeaky wheel to see if something can be recovered. JMHO.

 

One reason for disembarking this guest from the ship might have been the safety issues with of having a solo traveller who's disabled. Many years ago I wanted to bring my disabled uncle on cruise. The biggest problem I faced was, in the event of an emergency I had to take FULL responsibility for ensuring he could get into a life boat.

[80sramfan]

I did not read anything about helping him off the toilet. If the bathroom was not truly HC accessible, e.g. had a lip on the floor as another poster claimed, he was misled into thinking he could manage on his own. You do not know what the cruise line disclosed.....don't jump to conclusion.

 

Sorry after he fell off the toilet. REgardless it's not any employees job on the ship to do such things. End of story.

[c-legs]

The Century wasn't doing 10 day itineraries.

THAT particular sailing was a 10 day charter nude cruise.

[c-legs]

There is indeed more to this story.

 

I wonder how the other passengers were aware of his plight of falling off the toliet???

 

Sue

 

An '' activist '' ,by nature, will always make sure he/she is HEARD.....

[c-legs]

There is nothing in the story that shows he did not get a HC room.

 

Nor is there a lot that shows he did......

Matter of fact, he does mention a problem with the lip obstacles into the bathroom. HC staterooms do NOT have such obstacles

Best to allow all facts from all sources rise to the surface here....As it stands, this whole picture is quite nebulous...

IMO

[cynbar]

It's also possible that this passenger made an erroneus but well-intentioned assumption that the butler would do more than he is supposed to do. There was a thread on another line, I think NCL, where a woman had booked a suite for her father just to receive personal assistance. She was shocked when told by others on the message board that this was not true. Actually, the thread was not a question about that, her false assumptions came up by accident. Because she found out in advance, she was able to make other arrangements and I assume the cruise went well for her Dad. So, maybe we could give the disabled cruiser some benefit of the doubt. Of course, it would still be his fault for not making certain that the butler would provide care -- but infortunately not everyone researches their trips in advance as much we we do on cruise critic!

[c-legs]

This guy sued Northwest airline a few years ago and had the same blind attorney. The case was dismissed.

 

HA !!!!!

 

Surprised ??

 

Nope....

[terrierjohn]

In the UK brochure under booking condition 5.2 it states that handicapped passengers need to be self sufficient or to travel with someone who will provide all necessary assistance.

I assume US booking conditions have a similar clause.

[Bridge Maven]

Since Celebrity's cruise contract specifies that "handicapped passengers need to be self sufficient or travel with someone who will provide all necessary assistance", I don't feel Celebrity should be held responsible in any way. It appears that this passenger either signed the contract without reading it or felt that he should be an exception to the rules that apply to other disabled passengers.

[Taxguy77]

That is quite an accusation. There is nothing in the story that shows he did not get a HC room.

 

He did not ASK for one, why do yu think he was assigned one?

[SusieV]

I am ashamed of Celebrity for this behavior. How they can allow their crew to be treated this way is astonishing. This is so uncivilized and I don't know who these people are that want to prance around in the nude. Its gross.

 

Wow. I'm not a nudist but this is really offensive and judgmental. If you go almost anywhere else in the world, nudity isn't a big deal and people aren't nearly as uptight about it as they are in the US. It's just a body, people. We all have them. Who cares?

[pacheco18]

Since when is a butler the equivalent of a home health aide or practical nurse?

 

The story is makes me angry and this "activist" makes responsible people with disabilities -- people who understand their needs and take appropriate steps to make sure they are met -- look bad. He's looking for some deep pockets for a lawsuit. Put me on the jury! He won't get a dime.

[c-legs]

Actually, I followed the case in the papers and the suit was not dismissed. .

Huh ?????

You posted a short time earlier ( post #17 ) that you were NOT the person referred to in the article, but you had '' noticed the story in the local paper ( theOakland Press ) and thought it would be of interest to the board ''....quite a good intent....

Your present comment on a case which occured years ago involving the same people now tells me your whole interest in this runs just a weebit deeper, closer...., ''different" than originally portrayed....

 

What exactly is your point in starting this thread in the first place ?

 

When stirring a good stew, it helps if we know ALL the ingredients in it...and it's surprising how succesfully tasty it ends up being...once the receipe and all the goodies are known.

Cheers

[rebeccalouiseagain]

Wow. I'm not a nudist but this is really offensive and judgmental. If you go almost anywhere else in the world, nudity isn't a big deal and people aren't nearly as uptight about it as they are in the US. It's just a body, people. We all have them. Who cares?

 

There is a difference between going to a nude beach or sunbathing in the nude. I am sure after the initial shock the crew just gets used to it. I am just thinking about the various cultures onboard and wondering how they feel about this because not all nationalities are as accepting. I shouldn't have made these statements because I wasn't looking for a debate on nudity. I guess I am taken aback by it but that's just me. I really hope that they are using towels before sitting on the upholstered furniture. That's what I picture- lots of bare asses on the chairs that I am going to be sitting on. I'm not sailing Century but I would be put off by this on my upcoming Summit cruise. The only place they are required to wear clothes is in the formal dining room per their nude cruise literature. Don't you think that perhaps the butler felt uncomfortable dealing with a naked man in a wheelchair and you know that was the case or he wouldn't have chosen this type of cruise. And yes, in America we don't generally prance around naked in front of each other. I don't think our customs are inferior to others. I am honestly shocked that there are enough nudists that want to take cruises. You learn something new everyday.