Art Auctions?

[Mjflowers]

If I where purchasing Dali work I also may have concerns. This is what the article is about, is it not? There are other artists through which PW also sells. Not all are fraudulent, or are they? I'm not an expert on art authentication, but I do have an appraiser that is. As the saying goes, "Buyer beware." Have your purchases checked out.

[Travelcat2]

If I where purchasing Dali work I also may have concerns. This is what the article is about, is it not? There are other artists through which PW also sells. Not all are fraudulent, or are they? I'm not an expert on art authentication, but I do have an appraiser that is. As the saying goes, "Buyer beware." Have your purchases checked out.

 

There are many more articles/lawsuits not related to Dali -- hopefully other posters will do research before buying anything from Park West. You are not bothered by Park West's presence on board Regent ships while others are. Regent management reads CruiseCritic and will hopefully not renew Park West's contract.

[2old4this]

A boycotting of Park West by passengers is probably the best way to rid the ships of this activity. Otherwise, use the auction as a rest stop or buyer beware! Jack Morris

[Mjflowers]

There are many more articles/lawsuits not related to Dali -- hopefully other posters will do research before buying anything from Park West. You are not bothered by Park West's presence on board Regent ships while others are. Regent management reads CruiseCritic and will hopefully not renew Park West's contract.

 

You're right, I'm not bothered by PW. You may go to the auctions or not, your choice. If you do not buy, you don't have anything to worry about. If you do, as you said, do the research. I did. I understand the lawsuits are of a civil nature, not criminal. I may be wrong, but I haven't yet see a DA bring charges. Anybody, not happy, can sue for any reason. Not all art will appreciate, though some will. Kinda like stocks. No guarantee, all speculative. If you can not handle the loss, don't invest.

[Mjflowers]

A boycotting of Park West by passengers is probably the best way to rid the ships of this activity. Otherwise, use the auction as a rest stop or buyer beware! Jack Morris

 

You're right Jack, as I said. Buyer beware. As long as its a plus sales item for any business, cruise line or not it will continue. I also use the auction as a rest stop per say. Sometimes though, there are some reasonable items worth the investment. Not for everyone, but sometimes worth the price of admission. Free, and also a little education included.

[wripro]

Just refraining from attending the auctions would be a fine solution if Regent kept that horrible art work contained to an enclosed room of the ship instead of exhibiting it in areas people need to traverse, cluttering the way. They are foisting these so called works of art on their passengers even if we choose not to attend the auctions themselves.

[Travelcat2]

Just refraining from attending the auctions would be a fine solution if Regent kept that horrible art work contained to an enclosed room of the ship instead of exhibiting it in areas people need to traverse, cluttering the way. They are foisting these so called works of art on their passengers even if we choose not to attend the auctions themselves.

 

Exactly! The picture posted on this thread shows how Park West turns Regent into a storage room for unwanted artwork.

[Travel2Learn]

IMHO The best thing PW provides on The Voyager is the use of a pen not far from the stand for the daily quiz. :-)

[cruiseej]

Just refraining from attending the auctions would be a fine solution if Regent kept that horrible art work contained to an enclosed room of the ship instead of exhibiting it in areas people need to traverse, cluttering the way. They are foisting these so called works of art on their passengers even if we choose not to attend the auctions themselves.

 

I understand the concern, but this description doesn't match my most recent experience on Mariner last month at all. Yes, there was some art on display one side of the wide hallway on Deck 6. It doesn't block the way, and it's easy enough to tune out if you're headed for Horizon lounge or Signatures restaurant (the only two destinations down this hallway). We generally didn't even glance at the art as we walked this hallway. A couple of times, we paused for a few seconds to look at a few things -- laughing at a few pieces (but I laugh at a lot of modern art!), admiring a couple from the few artists we actually recognized (such as Agam). There certainly is some legitimate art there. Whether they're good values or not, I have no idea, since I've never looked for or asked about a price -- as there is zero possibility of me purchasing a piece of art while on a cruise. We never gave thought to going to one of the auctions -- way too many other things to do (including reading a good book or napping by the pool!) for me. But I found the art displayed in this area of the ship unobtrusive, easy to ignore, and having absolutely no impact on our cruise experience whatsoever.

 

I'd be perfectly happy to see Regent discontinue the art auctions, as I think they're a little tacky for the luxury cruise experience. But if Regent makes money on the art auction program, as I'd assume they must, and it keeps the cost of my cruise down by even a few dollars, then it doesn't bother me if they continue it.

 

-- Eric

[wripro]

I don't understand why anyone equates Regent making money off the art auctions with the fares being lower. If I buy a bottle of $1000 wine and Regent makes $600 off it does tha mean fares will be lowered?

[Travelcat2]

Eric, the way paintings are displayed differ from ship to ship and possibly cruise to cruise. On one Mariner cruise the "artwork" was lined up next to the pathway leading to Prime 7 and Compass Rose. If you wanted to sit in the lounge at that time, it would be nearly impossible to get past the easels. On our last Mariner cruise, everything was set up in Stars lounge -- nice and out of the way. The Park West displays last month worked well as they were on a deck that we seldom visit

 

IMO, Regent would lose money if they no longer had art auctions, but this should not be an excuse to associate with a company with such a poor reputation. Not even RCCL will do business with them

[2old4this]

I don't understand why anyone equates Regent making money off the art auctions with the fares being lower. If I buy a bottle of $1000 wine and Regent makes $600 off it does tha mean fares will be lowered?

 

Will you be on the April 3 cruise up the south coast on Navigator wripro? I would enjoy dining at your table where your $1,000 wine is being sampled by you and your friends. As to art having any impact on passenger ticketing, I agree with you. No impact at all! Jack Morris

[hondorner]

... But if Regent makes money on the art auction program, as I'd assume they must, and it keeps the cost of my cruise down by even a few dollars, then it doesn't bother me if they continue it.

 

-- Eric

I once heard, from a very authoritative source, precisely why Oceania no longer has art auctions. The backgoround is that space must be fopund, not only for the art, but for the Park West sales people. Because they are on board as a third party entity, not as part of the crew, they must be assigned cabins in the general guest area, not in the crew's quarters (the same is true of others who serve under contracts, such as jewelry representatives).

 

The cruise line does receive a percentage of the proceeds from art auctions, and from those receipts must be subtracted the opprotunity cost of the staterooms that are lost from sales. As long as those receipts are greater than the costs, the art auctions will remain. On Oceania, the costs began to exceed the receipts, and Poof! -- the art auctions were history. I suppose it must have corresponded with the expiration of a contract, if that was necessary, but the simple reason they were gone is because they were were incurring more costs than covered by their revenue. They may not necessarily be there to contribute to the botttom line, but they are certainly not there to reduce the bottom line.

 

What does this imply about Regent? It occurs to me that enough Regent guests must be happy with making such purchases to keep the venture profitable for the cruise line. Based on the Oceania story, considering that the management in this regard is the same for both cruise lines, I can only assume that the profits are sufficient evidence for management to conclude that the art auctions are something a significant number of guests want to retain.

 

By the way, I believe it's the same reason that Oceania dumped photographers from the ship. I don't know if Regent ever had those obnoxious photographers or why they got rid of them if they ever existed.

[Travelcat2]

Hi Don. . . . does your "authoritative source" know why Regent uses a company that has been involved in selling fake art and fraud? It just feels icky (for lack of a better word) to see them on board a luxury cruise ship (or anywhere else for that matter). If the sale of art is so profitable, it would seem that they would contract with a legitimate company. Any thoughts:confused:

[Mjflowers]

Hi Don. . . . does your "authoritative source" know why Regent uses a company that has been involved in selling fake art and fraud? It just feels icky (for lack of a better word) to see them on board a luxury cruise ship (or anywhere else for that matter). If the sale of art is so profitable, it would seem that they would contract with a legitimate company. Any thoughts:confused:

 

I'm surprised that you haven't contacted Regent your self and ask them that very question. That would seem to be the most authoritative source possible.

[Travelcat2]

I'm surprised that you haven't contacted Regent your self and ask them that very question. That would seem to be the most authoritative source possible.

 

There is really no one to call about this. I asked Don because he has an inside contact that is the most reliable source around:)

[hondorner]

Hi Don. . . . does your "authoritative source" know why Regent uses a company that has been involved in selling fake art and fraud?

That never came up in discussion. I have personally never even considered attending the art auctions, even for a glass of cheap sparkling wine, so the subject is not high on my radar. The discussion I related earlier wass the result of a specific question about why Oceania stopped the auctions, and came from a travel writer at dinner. I was at the table, between the questioner and my source, so I obviously heard the answer.

 

With regards to my thoughts, however, it appears that (1) enough people want and expect the auctions to make them almost a necessary part of a cruise experience (of course, not everyone wants them; for example, I never take part in ping pong tournaments, either ;)); (2) therefore the ship is going to provide them as long as they don't lose money (not necessarily to make money, at least on the classier lines); and (3) there isn't much to choose from. The newest articles I could find in a quick search state (in 2008) that only two companies provide the service, Park West and Global Fine Art on Princess; a similar article in 2009 mentions a company called British American. I didn't pursue the research enough to know if either of the other companies are still in business.

 

Apparently Park West signed, in 1996 a contract with a Cruise Management company, which apparently also provides other services on board (many of the shops and other services are contracted out). I don't have enough information to make an educated guess, but speculation implies that many cruise lines sign with such a management company and are more or less obligated to take all of the services they offer.

 

I'm really commenting on a subject about which I know little besides the conversation I related earlier.