Be careful which UK TA you choose

[NorbertsNiece]

So how are you Linda?

keeping well I trust?

 

We are on Adventure again in October

7 nighter + 4 nighter

Tenerife/Lanzarote/La Palma/Grand Canaria/Malaga/Lisbon/Gibralter

 

Sounds wonderful. I'm ok ta. Got made redundant earlier this year but am doing bits and pieces to pay for my Cruise addiction. Say hi to the Mrs :)

[hula-hoops]

Having worked in the travel industry for over 12 years (both as a travel agent and in my current role with a niche tour operator), I felt I must say a few words in the defence of the high street travel agent.

 

The high street chains pay very low wages and invest very little in their staff. The training is abysmal if it is existent at all. As a result, the only people who can and will work for such low wages tend to be young people with few financial commitments such as mortgages, families, etc. They earn between and £10k and £12k a year and are put under immense pressure to hit very high targets with little training and support. Another reason why the staff tend to be very young - people don't last long in such environments! Staff turnover within the travel industry is notoriously high.

 

They are expected to handle all manner of queries that are brought through the door by customers. It could be a flight to Sydney one minute, a Caribbean cruise the next, followed by an all-inclusive family holiday in the Med and then a romantic trip to Paris for a wedding anniversary. Each tour operator has a different booking system for the agents to use. Hundreds of tour operators are constantly bombarding them with offers and promotions to get them to book with them and it is impossible to know everything about every cruise line, hotel, airline, tour operator, safari organiser, hotel chain, etc or to keep abreast with all the current promotions. It's also impossible for them to know every country in the world inside out, particularly as they are usually so young.

 

That's not to say people's complaints here are not valid. They certainly are. But due to the ever competitive market and the pressure from the consumer to offer discounts, cuts have to be made and unfortunately these are usually made in effectively training staff and developing them. And the things being complained about here are the result.

 

Cruise-only agents at least have the advantage that they only need to focus on one sector of the industry. You might pay more to go to a small independent or a specialist cruise company but at least you know where the extra money is going.

[Greghouseo]

Having worked in the travel industry for over 12 years (both as a travel agent and in my current role with a niche tour operator), I felt I must say a few words in the defence of the high street travel agent.

 

The high street chains pay very low wages and invest very little in their staff. The training is abysmal if it is existent at all. As a result, the only people who can and will work for such low wages tend to be young people with few financial commitments such as mortgages, families, etc. They earn between and £10k and £12k a year and are put under immense pressure to hit very high targets with little training and support. Another reason why the staff tend to be very young - people don't last long in such environments! Staff turnover within the travel industry is notoriously high.

 

They are expected to handle all manner of queries that are brought through the door by customers. It could be a flight to Sydney one minute, a Caribbean cruise the next, followed by an all-inclusive family holiday in the Med and then a romantic trip to Paris for a wedding anniversary. Each tour operator has a different booking system for the agents to use. Hundreds of tour operators are constantly bombarding them with offers and promotions to get them to book with them and it is impossible to know everything about every cruise line, hotel, airline, tour operator, safari organiser, hotel chain, etc or to keep abreast with all the current promotions. It's also impossible for them to know every country in the world inside out, particularly as they are usually so young.

 

That's not to say people's complaints here are not valid. They certainly are. But due to the ever competitive market and the pressure from the consumer to offer discounts, cuts have to be made and unfortunately these are usually made in effectively training staff and developing them. And the things being complained about here are the result.

 

Cruise-only agents at least have the advantage that they only need to focus on one sector of the industry. You might pay more to go to a small independent or a specialist cruise company but at least you know where the extra money is going.

 

No need to defend them

We all know that slave labour exists, merely questioning the mentality of people who actually go to a High Street agent........and then gets ticked off when things go wrong

[rogueangel]

I use in independent cruise specialist TA and they dont charge me a credit card surcharge for payments. I have had issues with them not always responding to me quickly or following up on stuff but I've done enough research to make sure I can find what I need and they've come up with the best prices I've found either online or by phoning around so in the end that is what was most important to me so I've stuck with them.

[Elizanessie]

A friendly reminder. :)

 

The naming of Travel Agenst is against CC Guidelines.

 

Thank you.

[moniquet]

No need to defend them

We all know that slave labour exists, merely questioning the mentality of people who actually go to a High Street agent........and then gets ticked off when things go wrong

 

Yes I agree, most of the staff know nothing about the holidays they are selling. The so called cruise specialists aren't much better either. Someone we spoke to said the UK TA had messed up their arrangements, placing them in a hotel many miles away from the port, not linking flights so that luggage had to be collected between two flights. They had also sold (or should that be mis-sold!!) them inapproriate and expensive insurance. Nearly everyone is on the internet now, no need for TA's. All they do is hard sell the cruises they want to sell you and trim it up as advice.

[Greghouseo]

Yes I agree, most of the staff know nothing about the holidays they are selling. The so called cruise specialists aren't much better either. Someone we spoke to said the UK TA had messed up their arrangements, placing them in a hotel many miles away from the port, not linking flights so that luggage had to be collected between two flights. They had also sold (or should that be mis-sold!!) them inapproriate and expensive insurance. Nearly everyone is on the internet now, no need for TA's. All they do is hard sell the cruises they want to sell you and trim it up as advice.

 

Shame that the few give the many a bad name.

 

Booking a Hotel away from the port is not necessarily a major crime since there may be other considerations, however that would depend whether the booking was "transfer inclusive".

 

Not linking flights - absolutely inexcusable

 

Insurance - Well that is a subjective opinion, and possibly it only seemed expensive retrospectively when they did not need to claim. Surely in that context it's "Buyer Beware" inaasmuch as it behoves everyone to phone around to get the cheapest and best insurance they can. Don't forget that Holiday/cruise insurance is often dependent on Pre-existing medical conditions.

 

I think the advantage of a Cruise Specialist is his/her experience in having probably been on, or actually cruised several ships. For example I have been on every class of Royal Caribbean ship (the only class I have not cruised on is Radiance class), so a know many of the little nuances, the issues, the potential problems and the positive selling points, now I would see it as being rather unfair at least, and downright cheeky, if a member of the public used my expertise to discover what was best for them, and then book it on the internet, especially if there was no price differential.

[sidari]

We have used the same High street TA for most of our cruises, ok we book via a person who works for them but from home and have always got price drops where they became available ... maybe we just got lucky in finding someone who is very helpful!

 

For one of our Caribbean cruises we used a well known internet cruise specialist with direct prices to RCI and to whom we had to ring to Tell them to ask RCI about a price drop! ... the answer came back oh they don`t do that !!! What ? they got a flea in their ear before ringing and getting our price drop ... good when you have to tell them how to do their job!

[Greghouseo]

We have used the same High street TA for most of our cruises, ok we book via a person who works for them but from home and have always got price drops where they became available ... maybe we just got lucky in finding someone who is very helpful!

 

For one of our Caribbean cruises we used a well known internet cruise specialist with direct prices to RCI and to whom we had to ring to Tell them to ask RCI about a price drop! ... the answer came back oh they don`t do that !!! What ? they got a flea in their ear before ringing and getting our price drop ... good when you have to tell them how to do their job!

 

That assumes that it is the TAs job to tell you that there is a Price drop.

Not necessarily disagreeing with you, but perhaps you can tell me why, purely from a business perspective should a TA moniter for price drops, when the only effect of that price drop is to reduce the TAs profit

[moniquet]

Book direct on the internet and many offer a good discount. You can do all your research re. which cruise on this forum or google around. Same as insurance. Far better than listening to a 22 year olds sales patter who has probably only been to Benidrom or had 2 nights on QM2.:D

[Greghouseo]

Book direct on the internet and many offer a good discount. You can do all your research re. which cruise on this forum or google around. Same as insurance. Far better than listening to a 22 year olds sales patter who has probably only been to Benidrom or had 2 nights on QM2.:D

 

Agree with you re 22 year old Benidorm kid, but speaking for myself.

Been on 30+ ships, just shy of Diamond on RCCL, cruised Med, Fjords, Caribbean, Baltics, Mexico from a number of ports in a variety of different cabins. 56 years old with a mature and reasonable perspective on cruising.

 

Clearly, you have no faith in yourself to separate the wheat from the chaff

Clearly you are unable to resist being suckered in

Clearly you can't determine that the person you are talking to actually does know what he is talking about.

 

That is as much your issue, as it is mine as the "cruise specialist".

[Elizanessie]

Clearly, you have no faith in yourself to separate the wheat from the chaff

Clearly you are unable to resist being suckered in

Clearly you can't determine that the person you are talking to actually does know what he is talking about.

 

That is as much your issue, as it is mine as the "cruise specialist".

 

If a TA or cruise specialist responded to me in this way it would be ..bye bye to them.

[Greghouseo]

If a TA or cruise specialist responded to me in this way it would be ..bye bye to them.

 

 

Fair comment Elizanessie HOWEVER I would never respond to anyone like that, however, the fact that self-publicizing is forbidden, I am, I presume at liberty to post my private thoughts in a discussion.

 

There are many ways of diplomatically saying what I have posted previously, but since this is about a general discussion I didn't feel I needed to.

Now please dont think I am advertising, but you were critical of my phraseology so I feel entitled to respond

 

For example the phraseology I would use when talking to someone who knew nothing and needed assistance and advice on their cruise is something like..............

"What you need to do Sir/Madam. is rather than listening to a lot of friends/relatives etc who have their own particular agenda, you need to talk to a couple of cruise specialists and put your faith in your judgement of human nature. Ask yourself. Is this a kid? has he/she cruised before? Does he sound credible? Does he sound knowledgable? Then what you do is make your decision based on who you think has shown more comprehension of your needs and who actually appears to understand more about cruising"

 

Do you get my point, Elizanessie? Huge difference between me expressing an opinion on CC, and the way I conduct myself when talking to potential clients, especially the Cruise Virgins and Novices?

[Elizanessie]

Fair comment Elizanessie HOWEVER I would never respond to anyone like that, however, the fact that self-publicizing is forbidden, I am, I presume at liberty to post my private thoughts in a discussion.

 

There are many ways of diplomatically saying what I have posted previously, but since this is about a general discussion I didn't feel I needed to.

Now please dont think I am advertising, but you were critical of my phraseology so I feel entitled to respond

 

For example the phraseology I would use when talking to someone who knew nothing and needed assistance and advice on their cruise is something like..............

"What you need to do Sir/Madam. is rather than listening to a lot of friends/relatives etc who have their own particular agenda, you need to talk to a couple of cruise specialists and put your faith in your judgement of human nature. Ask yourself. Is this a kid? has he/she cruised before? Does he sound credible? Does he sound knowledgable? Then what you do is make your decision based on who you think has shown more comprehension of your needs and who actually appears to understand more about cruising"

 

Do you get my point, Elizanessie? Huge difference between me expressing an opinion on CC, and the way I conduct myself when talking to potential clients, especially the Cruise Virgins and Novices?

 

 

What we need to remember is not that may in the UK know about sites like CC and so when they go into a TA's they believe the TA knows best...hey just as when we go to the Doctors..we think they know best...many times that isn't the case but hey thats life I guess.

 

Not all cruise specialists know their stuff. I had an cruise agent who was a supervisor...didnt know what Aft or Hump was...didnt know how to spell..wouldnt admit when they made a mistake..they passed the buck..so I passed them by.

 

Personally, I respond as me, no matter that I am a Host, or lead a group of CC members or whatever...me....what you see is what you get :D

[sidari]

Greg ... regardless of how many cruise you have been on you still missed the point i was making!!

 

we had to ring to Tell them to ask RCI about a price drop! ... the answer came back oh they don`t do that !!!

 

For a So Called "cruise specialist" who claimed they have a special pricing relationship Direct with RCI to come out with the above goes to prove that they are Not Specialists! and it was not just from one person either, it also goes to show a lack of knowledge in their field!ie cruising.

 

As for price drops what you are saying is that it is ok for a TA to be aware that a price has dropped but not to tell their customer just so they can keep some money !! a wide Berth would be given by me to such an operator had i found out they had done this.

[Greghouseo]

Greg ... regardless of how many cruise you have been on you still missed the point i was making!!

 

we had to ring to Tell them to ask RCI about a price drop! ... the answer came back oh they don`t do that !!!

 

For a So Called "cruise specialist" who claimed they have a special pricing relationship Direct with RCI to come out with the above goes to prove that they are Not Specialists! and it was not just from one person either, it also goes to show a lack of knowledge in their field!ie cruising.

 

As for price drops what you are saying is that it is ok for a TA to be aware that a price has dropped but not to tell their customer just so they can keep some money !! a wide Berth would be given by me to such an operator had i found out they had done this.

 

OK to address your points:-

I didn't miss your points at all.

1) Monitering a "price drop". Well, how do we do that? Reality is, it is not as simple as you would say. If I take lets say 100 RCI/Celeb bookings each month. If lets say a running 25% of them have already travelled then I have to moniter daily 75 idfferent cruises to see if the price has dropped....... and all for what? To reduce my margin on a booking......... so.....

2) If a client finds a price drop and phones me, then absolutely 100% it will be honoured, but equally the client MUST MUST MUST be aware, that it is possible that if they have negotiated a discount with me on the original booking, he/she may not receive the full price drop. I could give you examples whereby if the full price drop was invoked then I would be losing money on the booking (please ask me if you want me to and I will be happy to show you the mathematical workings of a booking)

3) You are totally wrong with regarding to "keeping some money" that is NOT the case. From my perspective either.......... There is a price drop I invoke it, inform the customer and pass some or all of the drop on to the customer or .......... there is a price drop and I did not know about it, in which case what was I supposed to do if I didn't know about it.

 

The price drop does NOT, repeat NOT, repeat NOT get automatically applied by Royal Caribbean. It is only applied by them if it is requested, and the deal codes are compatible with it.

 

You seem to be singularly misinformed regarding many of the workings of the cruise industry from the TA and pricing policy, including the margins that we take, and the potential implications of applying a price drop in its entirety, but that is not unusual, as most of the general public is.

 

Please feel free to come back to me, a healthy debate never did anyone any harm, but at least be armed with all the facts.

[sidari]

For your info YES We do know how price drops work!!! and we DO know that there are a myriad of figures that cruise lines and TA`s deal with regarding bookings and their codes and prices! and how much or how little is passed on to the customer!

 

Again it was WE who had to Tell the Well known ONLINE TA that RCI GIVE PRICE DROPS not the other way around!! despite the fact that more than 1 person claimed that it was not possible!! so YES we probably do know more than you are willing to accept what people know regarding cruises!!

[Greghouseo]

For your info YES We do know how price drops work!!! and we DO know that there are a myriad of figures that cruise lines and TA`s deal with regarding bookings and their codes and prices! and how much or how little is passed on to the customer!

 

Again it was WE who had to Tell the Well known ONLINE TA that RCI GIVE PRICE DROPS not the other way around!! despite the fact that more than 1 person claimed that it was not possible!! so YES we probably do know more than you are willing to accept what people know regarding cruises!!

 

I would agree that your average CC person knows more about cruises than your average High Street TA and some cruise specialists, but CC travellers represent maybe 5% of all cruise travellers, which means 95% are not as au fait with the way things work.

 

I never doubted your knowledge or expertise, just the gewneral cruising public.

[NorbertsNiece]

I see and hear on the news that the practice of charging extra for paying by credit cards is to be abolished in the UK. Yayyyyy!!!

[Ray66]

Not quite.

 

"Excessive" fees for using a debit or credit card to buy items such as travel or cinema tickets will be banned by the end of 2012, under government plans.

 

The move comes amid complaints that airlines, booking agencies and even councils were imposing excessive charges for using a card.

 

However, firms will be allowed to levy a "small charge" to cover payment processing costs.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-16301923

 

The OFT said surcharges for using a debit card should be banned.

[suekay]

OP here - back from a lovely cruise despite my niggles with the cruise agent who offers deals. My final niggle was finding that we had been charged deviation fee of £20 to fly to Dubai 2 days before the cruise despite being diamond level of C&A. Contacting Royal Caribbean direct, I received an apology and was assured that my TA would refund the overpayment of £20pp. After waiting in vain, I contacted the TA who told me that Royal Caribbean had refunded that amount to them ,but they had reduced their discount by the same amount so no refund was due! In effect they had pocketed the refund:rolleyes: Many, many thanks go to C&A dept of Royal Caribbean - they told me they would deal with the situation for me, and within hours I had a further email from the TA agreeing to refund the overpayment. I would LOVE to know what had been said:p

 

Ive learned my lesson - future cruises will be booked direct with RCI (if not through the US TA)