Why Big Price Differences For Kusadasi/Ephesus Tours?

[RandB_Toronto]

Send them an e-mail and do it that way.

 

You mean send a credit card number by email????? That is DEFINITELY not secure!! Think of email as a postcard.

[CMHCruiseCouple]

Slightly off topic, or perhaps just a bend in the road ...

 

We visited Ephesus as part of a Princess tour during late Sept. Weather was perfect temperature. Can't imagine the the temps during peak season.

 

Our tour was excellent and our guide was a licensed by Turkey as an archaeologist; he worked on the excavation of the Terrace Houses. His insight was wonderful. As we walked down the main road he painted a wonderful picture of life ... finding the backgammon table near one of the fountains was almost eerie ... just imagining folks sitting and playing 2,000 years ago.

 

The Terrace Houses can not be missed. What isn't evident, or at least on our tour description, was how many steps are required to visit the Terrace Houses; they are many and steep!

 

Our tour lasted about 4-5 hours and did not include Mary's House. Just walking, talking, and imagining a very different life. This was the highlight of our 12 day Med cruise!

 

Take care,

Ron

[boogs]

I tried to book with EKOL but their reservation web page is not an "https" (secure) site. I refuse to put any of my credit card information to reserve a tour (or to pay for anything) without the safety incription. Was anyone else able to get around this and if so, how?

 

Yeah, this is a problem with EKOL and quite a few other sites in Turkey. We happen to think EKOL is an excellent company but they need to find a way to get themselves a secure server. When we have dealed with EKOL we normally fax our credit card info since that is relatively secure.

 

Send them an e-mail and do it that way.

 

You mean send a credit card number by email????? That is DEFINITELY not secure!! Think of email as a postcard.

 

My bank has an online function which creates temporary credit card numbers linked to the actual number. Whenever I have a concern about security, I order up one of these temporary numbers for an amount slightly higher that what is needed, with an expiration date only two months into the future. If someone intercepts that charge, they will only be able to charge up to the balance of the card, and only until it expires in a couple of months. If the original recipient has already charged his approved amount, there will only be a few dollars left on that card for the hijackers to steal. And even that will be refunded by the bank if I file a fraud report.

Edited February 28, 2012 by boogs

[PCWalton1]

A joke?? :mad:

 

There is no need to be insulting just because it wasn't your cup of tea. Perhaps a little research in advance would've revealed that it was a place you could skip.

 

However, there is no need to be insulting. I'm sure I'm not the only one with an interest in history, or mythology, or the ancient Wonders of the World, or the sites associated with Alexander the Great, or...... well, you get my point. Or more likely, you probably don't.

 

There are many that understand what you are saying, that's why they flock there in the 1000s every year. I don't need the Disneyworld in your face re-enactment to see the history in these ruins. Even with just one pillar left standing, I can visualize the majesty of what once was and be humbled. I look forward to seeing all these sights in May.

[Hlitner]

We could go off on a tangent about historical places. One person's interesting ruins are another persons ruins. In Turkey (and near Kusadasi) we can see two approaches to ruins. You have major digs like Ephesus where several large teams have been gradually restoring major parts of this ruined city. The restoration work on places like the Library of Celsus is popular with most visitors, however some purists might argue they should have left the ruins...ruined! But you can go outside Kusadasi to places like Didyma and Miletus which have not received the major restoration efforts found in Ephesus. DW and I enjoy both types of historical sites and love learning the history (and myths) associated with these areas. It might be a "joke" to some....but to us its totally fascinating. As an aside, we will be making our 4th visit to this city in a few weeks and it will again be a highlight of our very lengthy trip.

 

Hank

[walkinonsunshin]

Just returned from Turkey in August 2014. Our extended family group of 15 took a full day tour with Ephesus Deluxe to see Miletus, Didyma, The Ancient City of Ephesus & The Terrace Houses plus the Temple of Artemis. Had no idea there was a "government run" carpet factory scheduled too. We had a lovely time- until the carpet factory. Lunch was delicious but we were Pounced on when we entered the walls of the carpet factory. We were segregated from each other as couples and assured that we had time, although we did NOT. We missed much of Ephesus- the Basilica of St John, the large theater, the Stadium and didn't have time to enter the Celsius Library Because we were being strong armed into buying carpets at $1000 each. We had no idea and NEVER Intended on buying a carpet that day, let alone such an expensive carpet. The Carpet Salesmen were running after us as we approached the van we came in- as we tried to leave. I just kept saying- "We Don't have TIME for this." And We Didn't have time. So sad we missed part of Ephesus and had to spend valuable time fighting off the carpet salemen. The Carpet Salemen were worse than used car salesmen. So BE WARE!!!

[texancruzer]

Just returned from Turkey in August 2014. Our extended family group of 15 took a full day tour with Ephesus Deluxe to see Miletus, Didyma, The Ancient City of Ephesus & The Terrace Houses plus the Temple of Artemis. Had no idea there was a "government run" carpet factory scheduled too. We had a lovely time- until the carpet factory. Lunch was delicious but we were Pounced on when we entered the walls of the carpet factory. We were segregated from each other as couples and assured that we had time, although we did NOT. We missed much of Ephesus- the Basilica of St John, the large theater, the Stadium and didn't have time to enter the Celsius Library Because we were being strong armed into buying carpets at $1000 each. We had no idea and NEVER Intended on buying a carpet that day, let alone such an expensive carpet. The Carpet Salesmen were running after us as we approached the van we came in- as we tried to leave. I just kept saying- "We Don't have TIME for this." And We Didn't have time. So sad we missed part of Ephesus and had to spend valuable time fighting off the carpet salemen. The Carpet Salemen were worse than used car salesmen. So BE WARE!!!

 

You DO realize that 3 of the 4 threads you posted this EXACT same story in were from 2012 right ?

 

I realize you are trying to warn people but you will have better chance if you post in current threads….. I guess maybe you did a search for Kusadasi tours or the like and they came up……

 

There are numerous threads on here about making sure you know exactly where your private tour is or is not taking you…… sorry to hear you found out the hard way to be specific. Tour operators in Turkey are pressured by the government to visit the rug factories. Some people like them (we do) but we usually don't try to fit as much in one day as you did. We also always request that we go to Ephesus FIRST. Other places after. Beat some of the crowds that way too.

 

Sorry to hear you missed so much of a very unique and amazing place….. perhaps a return trip ???? ;)

[Host Star]

we have a tour set up for our roll call and made it clear we do not want to stop at a carpet factory.. we have an email reply that there will be no stopping at any carpet places.. you just have to make it clear prior to the tour and its with ephesus deluxe tours

Edited September 22, 2014 by Host Star

[cruisemom42]

we have a tour set up for our roll call and made it clear we do not want to stop at a carpet factory.. we have an email reply that there will be no stopping at any carpet places.. you just have to make it clear prior to the tour and its with ephesus deluxe tours

 

I don't doubt you, but be prepared to argue the point with your tour guide on the day of your tour, even if you have it in writing that you do not want to stop at the carpet place.

 

And for those others who are not averse to stopping there, I would really recommend not purchasing from them without a VERY sound understanding of what you are getting, and full understanding that in Turkey a salesman closing in on a sale is under absolutely no compulsion to be honest with you.

 

I have read some very unsettling stories over the years about purchasing carpets in Turkey, so let me hunt up a few of my favorites for you:

 

Below is a long thread from Tripadvisor that starts with the story of a man who supposedly purchased a "genuine" Hereke carpet made in Turkey and ended up with a fake produced (in all probability) in China. It goes on to detail even more unsavory practices, including a scam attempted on someone once they had returned home -- raising unsettling questions about whether you are "marked out" as a likely target if you make a purchase while on vacation.

 

http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopic-g293974-i368-k1390846-Is_my_newly_bought_carpet_a_genuine_Hereke_silk_rug-Istanbul.html

 

Here's a funny but oh-so-true blog post on cultural differences in what constitutes honesty when one is selling goods in Turkey. Full disclosure, Hank has said as much on these forums for years (perhaps a bit more bluntly):

 

http://www.kirazlivillage.com/wordpress/the-cultural-rules-of-trade/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Feed%3A%20BeingKoy%20%28Being%20Koy%29

 

Finally, this post calls into question the very idea that some of these rug stores are actually "government run" -- something I've doubted for years. It just doesn't make sense that they would be. Color me cynical:

 

http://www.turkeycentral.com/topic/11504-how-to-buy-a-carpet-in-turkey/

 

Enjoy! :cool:

[Choochala]

You are sweating 20-30 bucks :eek: How much did your flight and cruise cabin cost :D

 

One of the nicest things about the Turkey stop is the price. Splurge and go with the most expensive, sometimes you don't get what you pay for but often when you skimp you can get suprirsed both in a good and bad way.

 

We went with the top dollar and at least in Kusadasi with the guide EKOL gave us, WONDERFUL!

 

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that when we were in Istanbul and Ephesus, we hired Ephesusdeluxe (dot com). we were in Ephesus for one full day and Istanbul for 1 and a half days. They did all three of our tours and gave us a deal for booking both places and it was only $179 UDS per person. Some of the best money we spent on that cruise!

 

The most fantastic tours and guides we could ever have asked for. I wanted to take the one gal home with me - in fact she is married to a Canadian and spends half her year in Turkey and the other half in Montreal. What a wonderful gal. She also helped me negotiate a great deal - in my opinion - on a beautiful Turkish rug. I would definitely book them again if ever back in Turkey and I'm sure the people we toured with would do the same.

[Hlitner]

Some of these posts are a bit mis leading so lets try to clear the air. If you book a private tour, you have a lot of control over the itinerary. The Turks are great entrepreneurs and the professional guides are Turks (get my drift?). Sure, they will take you to the faux carpet factories (many exist as tourist places) or jewelry factories where you can spend much of your valuable port time, spend much of your money, and help enrich your tour guide/company who get a nice kick-back (or possibly own a piece of the "factory'). However, there are quite a few tourists that enjoy this entire shopping thing, even if they are getting ripped-off.

 

However, for those that prefer to avoid the shopping traps (you can always walk into the bazaar of Kusadasi and shop to your heart's content....after your tour) you can certainly control your own tour. Simply make it clear to your tour guide that you do not want to do any shopping.... When we did our own 2 person tour with Ekol, we had already been to Kusadasi and Ephesus several times. We hired a personal guide because we wanted a more in depth tour of the ruins (which we got). When we met our guide (who was terrific) we immediately made it clear we wanted to spend more time in the ruins and did not want to go to any shops, factories, etc. Our guide was a little disappointed (I am sure he got over it) but followed our instructions.

 

So my friends, if you book a private tour and find yourself trapped in a jewelry, pottery, or carpet factory you have only yourself to blame!

 

Hank

[texancruzer]

Some of these posts are a bit mis leading so lets try to clear the air. If you book a private tour, you have a lot of control over the itinerary. The Turks are great entrepreneurs and the professional guides are Turks (get my drift?). Sure, they will take you to the faux carpet factories (many exist as tourist places) or jewelry factories where you can spend much of your valuable port time, spend much of your money, and help enrich your tour guide/company who get a nice kick-back (or possibly own a piece of the "factory'). However, there are quite a few tourists that enjoy this entire shopping thing, even if they are getting ripped-off.

 

However, for those that prefer to avoid the shopping traps (you can always walk into the bazaar of Kusadasi and shop to your heart's content....after your tour) you can certainly control your own tour. Simply make it clear to your tour guide that you do not want to do any shopping.... When we did our own 2 person tour with Ekol, we had already been to Kusadasi and Ephesus several times. We hired a personal guide because we wanted a more in depth tour of the ruins (which we got). When we met our guide (who was terrific) we immediately made it clear we wanted to spend more time in the ruins and did not want to go to any shops, factories, etc. Our guide was a little disappointed (I am sure he got over it) but followed our instructions.

 

So my friends, if you book a private tour and find yourself trapped in a jewelry, pottery, or carpet factory you have only yourself to blame!

 

Hank

 

Wow Hank. While all of this is true - you are coming across a bit harsh. There are MANY MANY people here on Cruisecritic who aren't as well traveled as yourself. Not even close. Most of us will never have the opportunity to get to that level. They have never been to Europe or hardly any other place for that matter - have never done a private tour and don't have a clue about cutbacks etc work …… Many go to the websites of the various recommended tour companies, see a list of available tours and book one. Many of those figure you do the tour as written.

 

I think we all would agree that this is why people come here (once they find Cruisecritic) and learn how to travel better, smarter, cheaper without getting a lecture from those more experienced.

 

You have been posting a lot of these lately….. I, for one, hope we get the super-helpful happy traveling Hank back soon ;) Just sayin'

 

(My post will probably get my hand spanked by the moderators but thats ok)

[CintiPam]

How is it harsh to point out the reality? Clearly if you are paying for a private tour, you decide where you want to go.

 

You are not a prisoner of your guide.

 

Our very first stop on our very first cruise was in 2008 at Kusadasi. We booked a private tour with EKOL tours and specified in our emails ahead of time that there would be no shopping stops. I read on these boards that EKOL recently has been pressuring customers for carpet store stops so on our May return I booked with Ephesus Deluxe and had a fabulous day with this professional company.

Edited September 26, 2014 by CintiPam

[texancruzer]

How is it harsh to point out the reality? Clearly if you are paying for a private tour, you decide where you want to go.

 

You are not a prisoner of your guide.

 

Our very first stop on our very first cruise was in 2008 at Kusadasi. We booked a private tour with EKOL tours and specified in our emails ahead of time that there would be no shopping stops. I read on these boards that EKOL recently has been pressuring customers for carpet store stops so on our May return I booked with Ephesus Deluxe and had a fabulous day with this professional company.

 

No its not clear to many people who are not well traveled. I know, you know, Hank knows but not everyone knows.

 

As I posted many people go to the tour companies website, read the descriptions and think this is their tour. Period.

 

Some people travel BEFORE they know about Cruisecritic and just don't know.

 

I have actually been on flights to Europe with other cruisers and had struck up conversations with them. I asked them what ship they were on and GUESS WHAT ? She didn't have a clue !

 

So, no EVERYONE doesn't know they have control over their tour.

 

And its harsh to say that if you don't know you have no one to blame but yourself.

[cruisemom42]

I can see both sides of the issue. I agree it is a bit of a learning experience, but IF one is going to book a private tour, I do feel that one should do some research. It's not the same as going the easy route and taking the ship excursions (which I'd venture to guess is what 90% of those clueless people one meets -- the ones who don't have the vaguest idea what their ship's name is, let alone what the ports are -- are going to be doing). And that's fine for them.

 

If someone has booked a private tour, they likely either a) found Cruise Critic before sailing and joined a private tour group already set up, or b) did enough research online elsewhere to identify and book with a reputable private tour agency. In either case, it would be a logical part of that process to either read enough on Cruise Critic to understand what private tours entail or to do that research elsewhere.

 

A Mediterranean cruise isn't inexpensive. Most people heavily research expensive purchases. Yet oddly, I see people all the time on the roll calls who will simply glom onto an offered private tour without really understanding what it covers (or doesn't). :confused:

[Hlitner]

We do think calling my post "harsh" is a bit....ummmm "harsh" :). Pointing out a reality can sometimes seem mean or harsh, but its merely being informative and somewhat educational. People should understand that when you hire a private tour/guide they are working for you, not the other way around. In many countries of the world, tour guides can make extra money by steering their charges to certain restaurants, sites, stores, etc. This is very true in Turkey where the guides (and their companies) profit by taking their charges to certain places. So the guides motivation is often profit and not the best interests of their charges.

 

So, we again will post these "harsh" words. When you hire a private guide/tour YOU ARE THE BOSS! Now if some find this shocking and harsh....so be it :). And here is another "harsh" factoid. Because your guide can increase their personal income by taking you to a certain "factory," shop, restaurant, etc.. they may be resistant to a tourist that says "no." We actually experienced this when we hired our own private guide in Kusadasi who did push to take us to a "carpet factory." It was only when we made it very clear that we had been to the area several times, had no intention of wasting time in a "carpet factory" and had hired him to get a deeper perspective on the ruins, that he got with the program. Turks are usually warm friendly folks (with an excellent sense of humor), but they are very adept at not accepting "NO' as an answer. This is the way it is with guides, shop keepers, beggers, etc. One needs to take control or you may find yourself a prisoner being led to places for all the wrong reasons.

 

And to add to our own tale, when we used a private guide he did a fantastic job. We had hired him for a 5 hour tour and got what we wanted. At the end of the "tour" as we were driving back to Kusadasi he started pushing an idea that he would like to join us for lunch (so we could continue to chat about the local history) and of course he knew the "perfect restaurant." I just looked at him and rolled my eyes and even he laughed.... We are sure that restaurant would have been fine, but overpriced, with part of the meal cost going into the guides pocket. Such is Turkey.

 

Hank

Edited September 27, 2014 by Hlitner

[texancruzer]

If someone has booked a private tour, they likely either a) found Cruise Critic before sailing and joined a private tour group already set up, or b) did enough research online elsewhere to identify and book with a reputable private tour agency

 

Or their "helpful" travel agent booked a private tour for them (perhaps getting some type of kickback") in which case they might now have a clue what they were getting.

 

We do think calling my post "harsh" is a bit....ummmm "harsh" :). Pointing out a reality can sometimes seem mean or harsh, but its merely being informative and somewhat educational. People should understand that when you hire a private tour/guide they are working for you, not the other way around.

Hank

 

I understand the reality….. I research all my trips to death and book all my own details. I know exactly what I am getting. But many people rely on travel agents or others and therefore may not know. They SHOULD know but IF they don't cut them some slack…..I just thought your wording was a bit hash…… "only yourself to blame" Thats the end of my rant.

[Choochala]

Since the "harsh" post came right after my response, I feel a necessary urge to respond - I took it as the insinuation was I was the foolish one and "deserved what I got".

 

Far from it! I researched what I was doing, where and how - to death, add nauseum. We told the guide where we wanted to go and what we wanted to see - she obliged. I also researched, to death - the type of Turkish rug I wanted and just how much I wanted (or should) pay for the item. If some of that money went into the gal's pocket who was our "absolutely fabulous, knowledgeable and brilliant tour guide" so be it. She deserved it!

 

You see, sometimes the ancient art of carpet weaving is interesting to some and we enjoyed seeing how it's done. Please be cognizant of that. We didn't spend hours and hours of our time there - it was approximately 45 minutes and thoroughly enjoyed by all of the tour participants. It was also a great break from all the walking in the ruins we had just finished and a prelude to another intense walking tour.

 

I think you're overlooking something else as well - we live in different places in the world and unlike you, may never get the opportunity to go back there again. What we saw and experienced was perfect in our opinions. Please don't minimize or degrade our choices of what others want to see and do when on OUR vacations.

 

JMHO (jumping off my soapbox)

Edited October 2, 2014 by Choochala

[cruisemom42]

Since the "harsh" post came right after my response, I feel a necessary urge to respond - I took it as the insinuation was I was the foolish one and "deserved what I got".

 

Far from it! I researched what I was doing, where and how - to death, add nauseum. We told the guide where we wanted to go and what we wanted to see - she obliged. I also researched, to death - the type of Turkish rug I wanted and just how much I wanted (or should) pay for the item. If some of that money went into the gal's pocket who was our "absolutely fabulous, knowledgeable and brilliant tour guide" so be it. She deserved it!

 

You see, sometimes the ancient art of carpet weaving is interesting to some and we enjoyed seeing how it's done. Please be cognizant of that. We didn't spend hours and hours of our time there - it was approximately 45 minutes and thoroughly enjoyed by all of the tour participants. It was also a great break from all the walking in the ruins we had just finished and a prelude to another intense walking tour.

 

I think you're overlooking something else as well - we live in different places in the world and unlike you, may never get the opportunity to go back there again. What we saw and experienced was perfect in our opinions. Please don't minimize or degrade our choices of what others want to see and do when on OUR vacations.

 

JMHO (jumping off my soapbox)

 

I don't think anyone was targeting your post.

 

It's commonly understood on message boards that when someone is specifically addressing another poster's comments, they will "quote" those comments. Otherwise, the assumption is that they are addressing the original poster and/or just joining the general conversation around a topic.

[Wiltonian]

Back on topic:

 

Just back from the $50 Ephesus Deluxe semi-private full day tour. Included lunch. Excellent guide. Bus was a bit ancient, and 17 or us, not the advertised 12 max. But lunch (and low key carpet-sell!) included. Superb value IMHO.

 

Stuart

[aggie63]

We did a private, all day tour with Ephesus Deluxe and had a great day & guide with lunch included. Just be prepared to firmly say NO, Thank you to special showings of jewelry store or any other sales pitch if you really aren't interested in shopping. Would use them again.