Is there a lack of maintenance of HAL ships?

[peaches from georgia]

To do that they can raise the fares. How many are willing to ponie up more? You get what you pay for.

I don't care how cheap a cruise may be, everyone expects working toilets. And A/C in warm climates. These continuing problems and excuses are ridiculous.

[Boytjie]

I don't care how cheap a cruise may be, everyone expects working toilets. And A/C in warm climates. These continuing problems and excuses are ridiculous.

 

Oh, I agree that everyone expects a decent, comfortable and working cabin!

 

But there must be a point where the cruise fare and onboard spending doesn't cover the expenses of running and maintaining a ship-shape ship. I am not implying that it has reached that point at HAL. But most people seem to want the cheapest cruise possible no matter how much operating costs may have increased.

[Boytjie]

My distinct impression is that HAL is deferring mtce. Not a great idea when you have an older fleet.

 

What gets you to that point of view? Just a sense of it happening or have you noticed or witnessed it happening?

[ColumbiaSC]

I was on the 2012 World Voyage on the ms Amsterdam.

 

Decks 4 and 5 are, of course, the Decks where the "public rooms" are mainly located. The windows were streaky and dirty when the World Voyage began on January 6th in Fort Lauderdale, and they were in the same sad condition when we returned on April 28th, 2012. They were some occasionally half-hearted wash-downs which did very little good. It was something that certainly detracted from the voyage since one does sit and watch the seas and the views! I have no ax to grind. I am simply reporting what I saw, or didn't see. Better to have spent money to fit this matter than to send the CEO of HAL to host a Mardi Gras event.

 

Don.

[SwissMyst]

I don't care how cheap a cruise may be, everyone expects working toilets. And A/C in warm climates. These continuing problems and excuses are ridiculous.

 

Is a delayed-flush toilet a "working toilet"?

 

What is the range of acceptable cabin temperature in degrees and does this vary within a reasonable degree, depending upon climate zones visited?

[3rdGenCunarder]

Oh, I agree that everyone expects a decent, comfortable and working cabin!

 

But there must be a point where the cruise fare and onboard spending doesn't cover the expenses of running and maintaining a ship-shape ship. I am not implying that it has reached that point at HAL. But most people seem to want the cheapest cruise possible no matter how much operating costs may have increased.

 

Yes, people want the cheapest cruise possible. But maybe HAL needs to take another look at what's possible. One of my favorite "Lenny lines" from Law & Order is, "They lose a little on each sale but they make it up in volume." Well, that math doesn't work. Sooner or later doing things on the cheap catches up with a company.

 

Yes, I know, they cut fares because they expect people to spend money on board. But do pax spend as much as they used to? I hear more and more people saying (here and onboard) that they do their own thing in ports, carry on wine, refuse to pay the inflated photographer's prices, etc.

[SwissMyst]

My distinct impression is that HAL is deferring mtce. Not a great idea when you have an older fleet.

 

It is called 'cheating your customers'....charging them four star prices for what turns out to be, for a few unfortunate cruisers, a two star experience.

 

We have not noticed any deferred maintenance ourselves. Not sure what one would look for to corroborate this conclusion. All cruise lines have periodic reports of individual problems from time to time, but not sure how this is evidence of overall "deferred maintenance".

[Unca Pete]

I don't care how cheap a cruise may be, everyone expects working toilets. And A/C in warm climates. These continuing problems and excuses are ridiculous.

 

And, Holland America cruises are not "cheap." I've booked heavily

discounted fares on other lines and never had these problems.

The service, food and staff were outstanding. The ship's facilities

were lacking. I'd like to sail on HAL again, but would I pony up over

9K for a 14-day Alaska fare only to face the same problems?:confused:

 

Pete

[Viesczy]

As Pete said, I don't think any of us have a behind the scenes view as to the reason but just some conjecture, so I'm going to give mine! :D

 

Fingering the wear/tear on the boats and constant use, I think that most cruise companies do what they can to keep their boats afloat with as little inconvenience to the passengers while making sure that the line can make as much profit as possible in order to excuse the unjustifiably large salaries of those at the top who wouldn't know a boat from their backend.

 

What is the idea now, better, faster, cheaper? Meatloaf sang it best, 2 out of 3 ain't bad and corporations are getting the last 2--faster and most importantly to them cheaper.

 

Derek

[twinkletoes4445]

I don't care how cheap a cruise may be, everyone expects working toilets. And A/C in warm climates. These continuing problems and excuses are ridiculous.

 

I was unhappy because we were in an SA, but as thought about it, it doesn't matter what we are paying ... working toilets, A/C and decent furniture is something we shouldn't have to worry about when we are booking a cruise.

 

Another posted you get what you pay for ... well, we sure got hosed. Another thing, the price of our cruise went up dramatically ($2,000) from one year to the next. After that increase we started thinking about other vacations (and we're going on a river cruise in Europe).

 

I will say that the staff was awesome. They were constantly cleaning, and smiling. No complaints there. This goes much higher up.

 

I agree ... the continuing problems and excuses are ridiculous.

[twinkletoes4445]

And, Holland America cruises are not "cheap." I've booked heavily

discounted fares on other lines and never had these problems.

The service, food and staff were outstanding. The ship's facilities

were lacking. I'd like to sail on HAL again, but would I pony up over

9K for a 14-day Alaska fare only to face the same problems?:confused:

 

Pete

 

Same here. There's not a snowball's chance in you-know-where that we'd pony up 8-9K for another cruise. There are just too many other things we can do with that amount of money.

[Responder]

In a nutshell, Krazy Kruiser's post #4 echos what we were told by the hotel manager onboard Maasdam during our 2009 cruise. The ships are HAL's revenue source and taking them out of commission long enough to do major upgrades, particularly needed on the older ships, is not feasible. Our cabin had no air conditioning for the entire two weeks of the cruise, we had no hot water for about 3 days until we learned the secret (don't turn off the hot water - let it drip constantly), and we had a water pipe leaking in the wall and soaking our carpet. At least our toilet worked! ;)

 

And you tolerated that?

 

Coming from long time cruisers, if this scenario happened on a cruise we were on, we would be off at the next port and on the way home.

Sure, small stuff happens in every aspect of life but to have paid your fare to experience what you did is ridiculous.

 

It's not really my concern how and when HAL or any other merchant maintains or schedules their maintenance....only what works for me after my check clears. And of course, in a case such as yours, I guarantee they would never see my $$$ again.

 

Interesting, as I continue to read CC, how many people go out of their way to find excuses for HAL....that's why they get away with it.

We booked the Maasdam for 9 of our family for a June sailing. Should anything like this occur....think Mutiny on the Bounty. :D:D

[CtheW0rld]

short answer: yes. many a/c and plumbimg problem have been reported for many years, now.

[SwissMyst]

In a nutshell, Krazy Kruiser's post #4 echos what we were told by the hotel manager onboard Maasdam during our 2009 cruise. The ships are HAL's revenue source and taking them out of commission long enough to do major upgrades, particularly needed on the older ships, is not feasible. Our cabin had no air conditioning for the entire two weeks of the cruise, we had no hot water for about 3 days until we learned the secret (don't turn off the hot water - let it drip constantly), and we had a water pipe leaking in the wall and soaking our carpet. At least our toilet worked! ;)

 

Curiosity here and no need to answer if you don't want to, but why are you still following the HAL forum when you have not sailed HAL in years and all past cruises have mainly been with RC and all your listed future cruises are with Celebrity? What keeps you reading the HAL website when your last cruise was in 2009?

[kazu]

And you tolerated that?

 

Coming from long time cruisers, if this scenario happened on a cruise we were on, we would be off at the next port and on the way home.

Sure, small stuff happens in every aspect of life but to have paid your fare to experience what you did is ridiculous.

 

It's not really my concern how and when HAL or any other merchant maintains or schedules their maintenance....only what works for me after my check clears. And of course, in a case such as yours, I guarantee they would never see my $$$ again.

 

Interesting, as I continue to read CC, how many people go out of their way to find excuses for HAL....that's why they get away with it.

We booked the Maasdam for 9 of our family for a June sailing. Should anything like this occur....think Mutiny on the Bounty. :D:D

 

Now see, here's where we disagree - I wouldn't get off in the next port - I would be talking to whomever I had to to help solve our problems. I haven't had a lot of issues on cruises - but I have had some - I've always found that if I discussed it in a professional way - things were rectified and/or they found a way to make it better.

 

I really believe that if you address your issues - many times, things can be done - not always certainly - but mostly.:) Again, it's all in how I'm treated, the empathy shown and the understanding that makes the difference. :) (and yes, if the answer I get doesn't suit, I will go higher but that has rarely been necessary). Just my 2cents

[SwissMyst]

We were greeting upon arrival in our cabin our last Maasdam cruise with noisy fans and a soaked carpet. (Allegedly water coming in from an open balcony door when the outside of the ship was getting washed.)

 

We filed this immediately under "ship happens" and went about our life on board and merely worked around it. HAL unsolicited went out of their way to be solicitous with personal notes, follow-up plates of chocolates, and a complimentary Pinnacle dinner for the few hours of inconvenience for a few days this incident caused us.

 

We gave HAL high marks for their response and did not think this was anything more than the occasional "ship happens" even though this was our initial greeting on this HAL ship.

[Mary Ellen]

In a nutshell, Krazy Kruiser's post #4 echos what we were told by the hotel manager onboard Maasdam during our 2009 cruise. The ships are HAL's revenue source and taking them out of commission long enough to do major upgrades, particularly needed on the older ships, is not feasible. Our cabin had no air conditioning for the entire two weeks of the cruise, we had no hot water for about 3 days until we learned the secret (don't turn off the hot water - let it drip constantly), and we had a water pipe leaking in the wall and soaking our carpet. At least our toilet worked! ;)

I'm so sorry you had that experience. Thank you for for the valuable hint. Glad to see you back on the HAL forum. No need to answer any nosy nellies as to why you post - on any forum. ;)

[PCruzer]

Is a delayed-flush toilet a "working toilet"?

 

What is the range of acceptable cabin temperature in degrees and does this vary within a reasonable degree, depending upon climate zones visited?

We've been on ships where the toilet would flush 10 minutes after you hit the button. We did not find this to be a problem. As far as acceptable cabin temps....Personally I think that at night for sleeping, 68-70 degrees is acceptable. On our South Pacific cruise with the non-functioning cabin a/c, at night the room temperature was 80 degrees. And this was after keeping the curtains drawn during the heat of the day! 80 degrees was way too warm in a room with no fresh air!

[CoronaCRZR]

When I started cruising many years ago, I was never worried whether my onboard toilet would work.

 

The biggest problem HAL has is that their fleet is getting too old. a/c & plumbing problems are problems caused from many years of (over) usage, stress on equipment in heavy seas etc.

At some point in time the best built machinery will fail after enough time spent using them. This to me appears to be the case with a number of HAL ships (and all other lines for that matter)

 

The ability to continue the revenue stream is keeping HAL from really fixing these problems, because to really fix it would be to replace most of the a/c units with new ones and replace all pipes/ducting within the superstructure. this would cost a lot of money & especially time to do this right.

 

All cruise lines put their ships in drydock and bandaid the serious problems, throw down some carpet and add/or for fee venues... all in an effort to continue and improve the revenue stream.

 

I have no problem with all of this until they let a ship get run down to the point where too many a/c & toilets do not work as a norm, and I have to keep my fingers crossed to see if during my next cruise I may have to wait to go to the bathroom till the next port.

[SwissMyst]

We've been on ships where the toilet would flush 10 minutes after you hit the button. We did not find this to be a problem. As far as acceptable cabin temps....Personally I think that at night for sleeping, 68-70 degrees is acceptable. On our South Pacific cruise with the non-functioning cabin a/c, at night the room temperature was 80 degrees. And this was after keeping the curtains drawn during the heat of the day! 80 degrees was way too warm in a room with no fresh air!

 

My experience has been the closer to the equator, the more strained any ship's A/C system. Agree, 80 degrees at night is uncomfortable if you can avoid it. But that happens even in un-A/C houses stateside in the summer. When I face these situations myself, I have to remind myself I chose to go to the tropics and the tropics is what I am getting - the full experience of them. Humbling. But then not sure a totally sanitized, hermetically sealed cocoon is a way to explore the world either.:(

[Unca Pete]

My experience has been the closer to the equator, the more strained any ship's A/C system. Agree, 80 degrees at night is uncomfortable if you can avoid it. But that happens even in un-A/C houses stateside in the summer. When I face these situations myself, I have to remind myself I chose to go to the tropics and the tropics is what I am getting - the full experience of them. Humbling. But then not sure a totally sanitized, hermetically sealed cocoon is a way to explore the world either.:(

 

They had to shut down the air conditioning and drain the "water"

due to a problem (leaking water chiller??) and they also had a

vacuum pump failure on the toilet system. I didn't hear why the

hot water system failed. We got over the air conditioning issues, and

the loss of the toliets. But the final straw was the loss of hot water the

day before departure. I hate showering and shaving in cold water.

I wish the cruise had ended on a high note. The last impressions are what

we carry with us. But, overall it was a bucket list cruise, and I don't regret

doing it. I just wish we were better informed about the problems when they

occurred. We should have been informed about the problems and told what

to expect. I didn't find the ships condition, overall, to be that bad. There was

some wear, but nothing objectionable. The crew always did their best and

smiled. We even were offered free telephone service to arrange flight changes

when it became apparent that the de-embarking would be delayed in San

Diego.

 

Peter

[PCruzer]

Agree, 80 degrees at night is uncomfortable if you can avoid it. But that happens even in un-A/C houses stateside in the summer.

When I go on a cruise to a warm weather climate, I expect that my cabin will have functioning air conditioning. And as far as stateside houses in the warmer months w/o AC, at least you can open some windows! Sorry, but I don't agree that passengers should not expect to have adequate AC when cruising to the tropics.

[Responder]

Curiosity here and no need to answer if you don't want to, but why are you still following the HAL forum when you have not sailed HAL in years and all past cruises have mainly been with RC and all your listed future cruises are with Celebrity? What keeps you reading the HAL website when your last cruise was in 2009?

 

Are you sure you don't want to be the moderator for HAL on the CC Forum.

Although you are certainly entitled to your opinion, it seems you can't wait to shoot down anyone who utters an unkind word about HAL.

[SwissMyst]

Are you sure you don't want to be the moderator for HAL on the CC Forum.

Although you are certainly entitled to your opinion, it seems you can't wait to shoot down anyone who utters an unkind word about HAL.

 

Stick around. I myself have uttered many an unkind word about HAL. I calls 'em like I sees 'em. And HAL has a good 85% positive rating with us. Of course we need not divert this thread into a study on internet insult irony, do we?

[kyriecat]

Swissmyst,

 

If you checked my sig a little closer, you would have noticed that I was on Zuiderdam in April 2011. I don't know if sailing HAL a little over a year ago meets your criteria for following this board. My booked cruises are currently with Celebrity but that doesn't mean that I won't book another cruise for the future, possibly with HAL. Also my mother cruises but does not follow these boards. She is in her 60s so HAL is a good fit for her. I try to stay informed about most of the cruiselines that interest either me or my family. That includes keeping up with the latest chatter about cruiselines and ships.