Summer 2015 Cruises QOTS

[FIRELT5]

I'm logged into my C&A account and I'm not seeing anything past April either.

 

RCL IT is doing some systems maintenance with the reservations data-base this weekend.

Friday into Saturday.

[HUBison2008]

So by Wednesday then? Oh my gosh, this is just too much.

 

 

They have me bitting my nails. I need to change our reservation by Thursday.

 

 

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[divaofdisney]

Well I just checked the site once again- still nothing past April yet. I am so sad but I guess we all have no choice but to wait it out. I suppose they will be out at some point and all we can do is to simply keep checking. I will keep looking and if I see them I will let you all know. Keep the faith everyone!! :)

[jjtt]

Hello all! I have been checking this post out daily as well. I'm looking for August 2015 sailing. I have called RCCL every day this week and also Crown and Anchor to see when the summer schedules will be available. I have heard anywhere from now until mid March. Last night when I called the person I spoke with gave me a date... Wednesday, February 26th.

Time will tell... Until then, I will keep checking.

Edited February 15, 2014 by jjtt

[roe2ship]

Hello all! I have been checking this post out daily as well. I'm looking for August 2015 sailing. I have called RCCL every day this week and also Crown and Anchor to see when the summer schedules will be available. I have heard anywhere from now until mid March. Last night when I called the person I spoke with gave me a date... Wednesday, February 26th.

Time will tell... Until then, I will keep checking.

What can I say other than "Royal...you really do WOW me!":(

[Annefran]

What can I say other than "Royal...you really do WOW me!":(

 

I read on a facebook site that the issue is Bermuda. Something about Bermuda not wanting to dredge the pier area to accomodate the bigger ship. But who knows? That could just be speculation. I thought I had heard months ago that the Bermuda tourism had already started plans to upgrade the pier etc for Quantum?

 

Keeping my fingers crossed we will all hear soonner than later. Have a good weekend everyone!

[roe2ship]

I read on a facebook site that the issue is Bermuda. Something about Bermuda not wanting to dredge the pier area to accomodate the bigger ship. But who knows? That could just be speculation. I thought I had heard months ago that the Bermuda tourism had already started plans to upgrade the pier etc for Quantum?

 

Keeping my fingers crossed we will all hear soonner than later. Have a good weekend everyone!

Yes, Anne, I have read about those issues as well and actually that was the first thing that came to mind when I saw Serenade in Cape Liberty in September. Thankfully Ken cleared that up.:)

 

If Bermuda hasn't made a final decision on upgrading the pier, I have to say they have some nerve. With the amount of money that cruise passengers bring in....there should be nothing to think about.

 

Have a great weekend!:)

[DEIx15x8]

Yes, Anne, I have read about those issues as well and actually that was the first thing that came to mind when I saw Serenade in Cape Liberty in September. Thankfully Ken cleared that up.:)

 

If Bermuda hasn't made a final decision on upgrading the pier, I have to say they have some nerve. With the amount of money that cruise passengers bring in....there should be nothing to think about.

 

Have a great weekend!:)

 

Bermuda has announced plans to build a new floating pier near St. George where the ships first make there approach. This would allow for any future ship to reach Bermuda including Oasis class and larger without navigating any narrow channels. This was announced as being in the early stages of planning before the Quantum issues were discovered. If they are serious about this future development in the near future they could very well be determining if they will actually earn enough money from the extra Quantum capacity for a summer or 2 in order to pay off the dredging. Royal Caribbean would likely not want to give up it's very exclusive Bermuda slots and is more likely to add a smaller ship to supplement the route during these periods. So Bermuda would likely not lose out completely, just get slightly less which may be worth the loss compared to the cost and impact of dredging. The people of Bermuda are pretty tired of the dredging and impact it has on the environment which is why the floating pier plan was first started. It also will help spread guests out on the island as really small ships still reach all ports including Hamilton, mid sized ships can still go to dockyard in addition to the new one, and large ships can stay at the new pier.

[Dave85]

Bermuda has announced plans to build a new floating pier near St. George where the ships first make there approach. This would allow for any future ship to reach Bermuda including Oasis class and larger without navigating any narrow channels. This was announced as being in the early stages of planning before the Quantum issues were discovered. If they are serious about this future development in the near future they could very well be determining if they will actually earn enough money from the extra Quantum capacity for a summer or 2 in order to pay off the dredging. Royal Caribbean would likely not want to give up it's very exclusive Bermuda slots and is more likely to add a smaller ship to supplement the route during these periods. So Bermuda would likely not lose out completely, just get slightly less which may be worth the loss compared to the cost and impact of dredging. The people of Bermuda are pretty tired of the dredging and impact it has on the environment which is why the floating pier plan was first started. It also will help spread guests out on the island as really small ships still reach all ports including Hamilton, mid sized ships can still go to dockyard in addition to the new one, and large ships can stay at the new pier.

 

 

Very interesting. Is there any indication how long it would take to construct this floating pier? I know you mentioned dredging to accommodate Q for a "summer or two."

 

 

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[Dave85]

One thing I'd love to know but we probably never will: did/does RCI have a plan B for Quantum itineraries in case Bermuda falls though? I guess we'd find out if Bermuda does fall though lol but otherwise probably never.

 

They could figure out the 9 night easily enough... Port Canaveral or Nassau could possibly I be worked in instead without messing up the other reservations... But where would they go for the 5 night if not Bermuda? Almost seems that they'd have to scratch the 9/5 concept entirely unless they revert to the old school 5-night Canada cruises they did when Voyager first came to Bayonne. But, with such few ships down there in the summer I imagine they could rework their berthing reservations if necessary.

 

 

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Edited February 15, 2014 by Dave85

[roe2ship]

Bermuda has announced plans to build a new floating pier near St. George where the ships first make there approach. This would allow for any future ship to reach Bermuda including Oasis class and larger without navigating any narrow channels. This was announced as being in the early stages of planning before the Quantum issues were discovered. If they are serious about this future development in the near future they could very well be determining if they will actually earn enough money from the extra Quantum capacity for a summer or 2 in order to pay off the dredging. Royal Caribbean would likely not want to give up it's very exclusive Bermuda slots and is more likely to add a smaller ship to supplement the route during these periods. So Bermuda would likely not lose out completely, just get slightly less which may be worth the loss compared to the cost and impact of dredging. The people of Bermuda are pretty tired of the dredging and impact it has on the environment which is why the floating pier plan was first started. It also will help spread guests out on the island as really small ships still reach all ports including Hamilton, mid sized ships can still go to dockyard in addition to the new one, and large ships can stay at the new pier.

Wow, thanks for the info and explaining it so well. I thought the main issue was upgrading the existing pier (Kings Wharf) something similar as the upgrade at Heritage Wharf to accommodate NCL Breakaway.

[DEIx15x8]

Very interesting. Is there any indication how long it would take to construct this floating pier? I know you mentioned dredging to accommodate Q for a "summer or two."

 

 

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The first murmurs came in fall 2012 when they held a press conference to announce there intent to start looking at it. In fall 2013 it sounded more solid with them announcing a target visitor number for 2015 that many believe is only possible if this new pier is in place by that time. The only cruise line mentioned in the conversation seems to be Disney who does not currently have a spot in Bermuda and can't get one since they are at capacity. The new pier could be used to add more slots for Disney and give Quantum a location she can fit.

 

One thing I'd love to know but we probably never will: did/does RCI have a plan B for Quantum itineraries in case Bermuda falls though? I guess we'd find out if Bermuda does fall though lol but otherwise probably never.

 

They could figure out the 9 night easily enough... Port Canaveral or Nassau could possibly I be worked in instead without messing up the other reservations... But where would they go for the 5 night if not Bermuda? Almost seems that they'd have to scratch the 9/5 concept entirely unless they revert to the old school 5-night Canada cruises they did when Voyager first came to Bayonne. But, with such few ships down there in the summer I imagine they could rework their berthing reservations if necessary.

 

 

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The thing about plan B itineraries is that most people aren't happy but have to accept them. For the Caribbean it's often swapping east and west which is still tropical islands. For individual islands it's even less of a big deal but for Bermuda it's usually Canada that gets swapped in for bad weather. The 9 night sailings don't matter since they can just stick 1-2 more caribbean ports in and it's fine, but for the 5 night itinerary I doubt if they sell an entire summer of Bermuda sailings and change them all to Canada many people would accept it. Those are certainly not comparable ports and when not forced by things out of the lines control it is certainly not something people would accept, so I'd expect if they have any issue we'll see them not wanting to sell itineraries they don't think can be done.

That's the main reason we haven't seen any line jumping on being the first to offer sailings through the new panama canal, too much uncertainty about when it will be ready and no one would accept a substitute port for something like that.

Edited February 16, 2014 by DEIx15x8

[FIRELT5]

As I understand the Enviromental focus groups from BDA are on board with this project.

IMHO the delay of the Summer 2015 Opening of the QOS has to do with the reclassification

Of the categories since this is a newbuild. I'm still planning on a Summer 2015 visit to Bermuda.

 

 

http://bernews.com/2014/01/ministry-looks-into-widening-shipping-channels/

[Annefran]

Lots of great information all. Thanks for sharing and keeping us up on the latest greatest news. Hope to see the Summer schedule sooner than later. Happy Cruising!

 

 

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[Dave85]

The thing about plan B itineraries is that most people aren't happy but have to accept them. For the Caribbean it's often swapping east and west which is still tropical islands. For individual islands it's even less of a big deal but for Bermuda it's usually Canada that gets swapped in for bad weather. The 9 night sailings don't matter since they can just stick 1-2 more caribbean ports in and it's fine, but for the 5 night itinerary I doubt if they sell an entire summer of Bermuda sailings and change them all to Canada many people would accept it. Those are certainly not comparable ports and when not forced by things out of the lines control it is certainly not something people would accept, so I'd expect if they have any issue we'll see them not wanting to sell itineraries they don't think can be done.

That's the main reason we haven't seen any line jumping on being the first to offer sailings through the new panama canal, too much uncertainty about when it will be ready and no one would accept a substitute port for something like that.

 

The even bigger problem with Canada as a Plan B option beyond not being comparable ports is the difference in cost between cruises to Bermuda and Canada of comparable length. Bermuda is a premium destination and I can't see how they could sell a premium Bermuda season then tell all of those people who paid the premium to go to Bermuda that they're instead going to Canada... and that RCI is still pocketing the premium fare! Of course when there's a hurricane or something and they have to divert to Canada that's one thing... but I can't imagine RCI would put themselves in that situation despite it being within their contractual rights to change itinerary. If this really is the issue, and FIRELT is probably right and it isn't, then I'd expect them to wait as long as they need to publish Summer '15.

 

Hopefully it's just the classification issue and we have itineraries by next Wednesday. Either way, I'll be very disappointed if they don't do the 9 night Caribbean itineraries, which I've always felt is the absolutely perfect length out of the NY area and I've been itching to do again for several years now (but didn't want to sail Explorer for a third time).

Edited February 16, 2014 by Dave85

[FIRELT5]

Bermuda has announced plans to build a new floating pier near St. George where the ships first make there approach. This would allow for any future ship to reach Bermuda including Oasis class and larger without navigating any narrow channels. This was announced as being in the early stages of planning before the Quantum issues were discovered. If they are serious about this future development in the near future they could very well be determining if they will actually earn enough money from the extra Quantum capacity for a summer or 2 in order to pay off the dredging. Royal Caribbean would likely not want to give up it's very exclusive Bermuda slots and is more likely to add a smaller ship to supplement the route during these periods. So Bermuda would likely not lose out completely, just get slightly less which may be worth the loss compared to the cost and impact of dredging. The people of Bermuda are pretty tired of the dredging and impact it has on the environment which is why the floating pier plan was first started. It also will help spread guests out on the island as really small ships still reach all ports including Hamilton, mid sized ships can still go to dockyard in addition to the new one, and large ships can stay at the new pier.

 

I believe that you where referring to this idea

Which has a bit of opposition due to the widening of the Town Cut.

This is DOA at the moment as per the local folks.

 

http://mobile.royalgazette.com/article/20131002/NEWS/131009943

[DEIx15x8]

I believe that you where referring to this idea

Which has a bit of opposition due to the widening of the Town Cut.

This is DOA at the moment as per the local folks.

 

http://mobile.royalgazette.com/article/20131002/NEWS/131009943

 

http://www.royalgazette.com/article/20131007/NEWS04/131009771

The article from the same site 5 days later uses quotes from people like:

We are in conversations with the cruise industry reviewing the options for a cruise pier in St George’s

and

That is something that’s high on our agenda and something we have to do for that area.

which doesn't sound like the discussion of a dead plan.

 

It does sound like the plans may have changed though. In 2012 the project was to be located in Murray's Anchorage which would not require anything to be changed with the channel. The pier was to be a distance out to sea with a long floating bridge connecting it to the land to avoid any major impact to the coast line. (Venice has considered the same thing) Not sure why they have cheapened things to try and build in the bay again (which doesn't actually seem that much cheaper to do with all involved), but it still seems to be progressing ahead.

 

 

Edit: Here was an article I found from 2012. Seems like fall is a big time for them to discuss this project. We may have to wait another 6 months to hear any updates. http://www.royalgazette.com/article/20121215/NEWS04/712159935 Still looking for the one on the floating concept.

Edited February 16, 2014 by DEIx15x8

[DEIx15x8]

Did some more searching on floating piers. Can't find the article about Bermuda but I did find 2 different concepts behind it. The first one that seems most inline with what Bermuda was thinking involves a series of pylons with the floating dock attached and then bridges connecting to the land. This seems to be used in several places in Canada/Alaska, though at a smaller distance away from the shore than Bermuda was thinking of.

http://www.pccharbormasters.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/Pacific_Ports_NOTTINGHAM.pdf

http://www.npa.ca/files/6013/8483/5518/Open_House__2010.pdf

 

The more interesting one that I found though involves no construction of a pier but a hybrid of mooring and docking. The ships moor in the bay and a large floating dock with essentially a tug boat built in expands the pier to connect to the side of the ship so guests can walk right ashore. This seems more inline with what Bermuda wants and is currently used by multiple ports in northern Europe.

http://www.seawalk.no/index.html

 

With both of these as options that would decrease the impact on the environment I'm not sure why they would even consider expanding the channel into St. George which could be devastating in a hurricane or other major storm.

[FIRELT5]

http://www.royalgazette.com/article/20131007/NEWS04/131009771

The article from the same site 5 days later uses quotes from people like:

 

and

 

which doesn't sound like the discussion of a dead plan.

 

It does sound like the plans may have changed though. In 2012 the project was to be located in Murray's Anchorage which would not require anything to be changed with the channel. The pier was to be a distance out to sea with a long floating bridge connecting it to the land to avoid any major impact to the coast line. (Venice has considered the same thing) Not sure why they have cheapened things to try and build in the bay again (which doesn't actually seem that much cheaper to do with all involved), but it still seems to be progressing ahead.

 

 

Edit: Here was an article I found from 2012. Seems like fall is a big time for them to discuss this project. We may have to wait another 6 months to hear any updates. http://www.royalgazette.com/article/20121215/NEWS04/712159935 Still looking for the one on the floating concept.

 

I am fortunate and had the pleasure to cruise to Bermuda for the past 24yrs. Yearly, on various cruise lines and had docked in St.George at Penno's Wharf & Ordinace island. It was a pleasure docking for 2 or 4 days as St. George had a quaint and unique feeling compared to the Dock Yard or Downtown Hamilton. I was quite excited with the possibility of the Talk of the proposed new facility which was discussed during the spring and Summer months of 2013. While on my last cruise in late August 2013, I took the high speed ferry over to St.George and spoke to several citizens along with various employees of the government and brought up the suggestion of the new facility. Unfortunately, it was there belief that this was hyperbole. The building and facility at Penno's wharf was reconstructed due to the damage from a tropical storm. The actual structure is small and was used as a ferry terminal. Unfortunately, St. George is a different place and practically a ghost town due to the decline in Cruise traffic.

[FIRELT5]

Did some more searching on floating piers. Can't find the article about Bermuda but I did find 2 different concepts behind it. The first one that seems most inline with what Bermuda was thinking involves a series of pylons with the floating dock attached and then bridges connecting to the land. This seems to be used in several places in Canada/Alaska, though at a smaller distance away from the shore than Bermuda was thinking of.

http://www.pccharbormasters.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/Pacific_Ports_NOTTINGHAM.pdf

http://www.npa.ca/files/6013/8483/5518/Open_House__2010.pdf

 

The more interesting one that I found though involves no construction of a pier but a hybrid of mooring and docking. The ships moor in the bay and a large floating dock with essentially a tug boat built in expands the pier to connect to the side of the ship so guests can walk right ashore. This seems more inline with what Bermuda wants and is currently used by multiple ports in northern Europe.

http://www.seawalk.no/index.html

 

With both of these as options that would decrease the impact on the environment I'm not sure why they would even consider expanding the channel into St. George which could be devastating in a hurricane or other major storm.

 

Placing a hybrid dock out 1/4 mile into the open ocean is not a viable solution. On a calm day you could have 2'-3' swells in this area. On many occasions throughout the 1990's and up until 2008, vessels had great difficulty passing through the town cut due to adverse sea & wind conditions.

 

Just recently, 2009-2012 the HAL Veendam, had difficulty tendering passengers from this anchorage into St.George due to the adverse sea & wind conditions. HAL aborted this operation and docked at Downtown Hamilton which was great.

 

Again, IMHO the delay of the QOS is due to a cabin reclassification not an issue with Bermuda.

The finance department is attempting to maximize a profit on the QOS and other vessels, to keep us shareholders happy :):):)

Edited February 16, 2014 by FIRELT5

[DEIx15x8]

Placing a hybrid dock out 1/4 mile into the open ocean is not a viable solution. On a calm day you could have 2'-3' swells in this area. On many occasions throughout the 1990's and up until 2008, vessels had great difficulty passing through the town cut due to adverse sea & wind conditions.

 

Just recently, 2009-2012 the HAL Veendam, had difficulty tendering passengers from this anchorage into St.George due to the adverse sea & wind conditions. HAL aborted this operation and docked at Downtown Hamilton which was great.

 

Again, IMHO the delay of the QOS is due to a cabin reclassification not an issue with Bermuda.

The finance department is attempting to maximize a profit on the QOS and other vessels, to keep us shareholders happy :):):)

 

Heard the Veendam's renovations prevented her docking but didn't hear they had tender issues later (didn't actually hear anything about her once she started going there). The anchored floating dock can handle some rougher seas, but the true floating dock isn't much different than tendering when it comes to the sea conditions so that certainly wouldn't be possible then.

[FIRELT5]

As of 0800 this morning, nothing loaded into the reservation system for the QOS 2015 Summer/Fall season.

[divaofdisney]

As of 0800 this morning, nothing loaded into the reservation system for the QOS 2015 Summer/Fall season.

 

Awe poo!!!!!! Well I guess we all need to keep checking periodically. I will for sure and let you all know first thing I see. Let's all keep each other up to date thanks for the update FIRELT5. It has to happen sooner or later. :rolleyes:

[FIRELT5]

Heard the Veendam's renovations prevented her docking but didn't hear they had tender issues later (didn't actually hear anything about her once she started going there). The anchored floating dock can handle some rougher seas, but the true floating dock isn't much different than tendering when it comes to the sea conditions so that certainly wouldn't be possible then.

 

Unfortunately, we experienced this chaos as we were on several voyages. The Veendam would off load the passengers to the Bermudian, which was part of the Govt., Ferry transportation system. On several voyages, passengers were stranded on shore, due to sudden adverse sea conditions, and the Veendam had to reposition to Hamilton.

[FIRELT5]

Awe poo!!!!!! Well I guess we all need to keep checking periodically. I will for sure and let you all know first thing I see. Let's all keep each other up to date thanks for the update FIRELT5. It has to happen sooner or later. :rolleyes:

 

I also double checked with my T/A. Nothing in cruisepower either.