My kid's refused Circle C!

[irishnyc]

Agree 100%. The kids roaming the ship are the ones running in the halls, sneaking to little known areas etc. On land, they are the ones getting into trouble due to having no supervision.

 

Exactly why I said I wouldn't let my 12 year old roam on her own. She could go to Circle C, or she can be with me. I'm loathe the kids I see running in the halls, getting in elevators and pressing all the buttons as they get off, terrorizing the little ones in the water park (that was a HUGE problem on the Splendor last summer), or drinking out of discarded drinks left on tables. Nope. Not happening in my family. I'm not anywhere close to the possible "perverts" that could be on board, I'm just worried about what my kid is up to, so if she's not being supervised by Circle C, she'll be supervised by me or DH.

 

FWIW I didn't think the OP meant that the kids were drinking and smoking in Circle C, just that that's where the kids met up originally. I don't put any blame on Carnival, or Circle C for what those kids got up to. It's all on the parents that let their kids do whatever they want.

[weredawg]

If those 12 yr old kids hadn't been roaming around, I bet that Noro virus wouldn't have spread!??? :rolleyes:

[Cruisin 4 Ever]

Quick summary of this bizarre thread:

 

-title talks about refusal of Kid club! (Note usage of exclamation point)

-OP states there was drinking and smoking

-However had a great cruise, has another planned

-Someone notes thread starter has 6 posts and went on this cruise last summer, inferring entire post is odd?

-People are debating if the parents suck or is it Carnivals fault that kids were allegedly smoking and drinking.

-obligatory Justin Bieber joke-which made me lol :)

-One poster blames rum runners

-Other posters blame crummy parents who let 12 year olds roam

-Another poster lets her 12 year old roam, but assures us she is not a crummy parent

 

I predict the next poster will claim it's the 12 year old roamers who caused Noro on the RC ship.

 

Sorry to interrupt the thread, just making sure I had it all right. :D

 

LOLOL - funniest thing I've read all night

[elliair]

If only all parents were as sensible. I can't imagine letting my daughter roam around on land at the age of 12, I certainly wouldn't let her do it on a ship.

 

I agree with you there, I am astonished that any parent would allow their child under the age of 18 to just roam the ship unsupervised. We've had these kinds of threads before, and it's still an eye opener as to what parents will allow their underage child to do. I don't blame Carnival for anything, I blame the parents.

[NYcruzzer]

I took my 14 year old son and 12 year old daughter on the Dream last August.. I was pretty certain they would love joining the children's club activities but boy was I wrong!! Lol.

 

Fast forward a few days into the cruise I found out that some of the teens where smoking and drinking on the ship. I'm sure it was a handful of them but my kids made it a point to let me know that they made a right decision by not signing up for the Kid's club. They had a great time anyway and it was nice seeing them enjoy each other on the trip. I may plan another for us next year!!

 

I'm pretty sure there was NO drinking or smoking in Circle C. Did it ever occur to you that your kids cooked up this story as a way to "get out" of having to participate in kids clus activities ?

[Andoria]

I'm really sorry that you feel your daughter is old enough to "roam" around on land and on the ship. I guess I am just a really over-protective parent, but, I still worry about my grown children all the time. I just feel that 12 is NOT mature enough to be left to take care of themselves in a difficult situation, if one should arise. JMO

 

 

I never said I had a daughter. When my *son was 12 he was a 2nd degree black belt and yes I trusted him to roam around the ship. He is also the type of kid that has never liked to stray far so his "roaming" consisted of going to get a slice of pizza or an ice cream.

 

He's 15 now and we were just talking about how much freedom I've given him and I asked him why he's never taken advantage of it. His reply "I'd only want it if I didn't have it."

[irishnyc]

I never said I had a daughter. When my *son was 12 he was a 2nd degree black belt and yes I trusted him to roam around the ship. He is also the type of kid that has never liked to stray far so his "roaming" consisted of going to get a slice of pizza or an ice cream.

 

He's 15 now and we were just talking about how much freedom I've given him and I asked him why he's never taken advantage of it. His reply "I'd only want it if I didn't have it."

 

I wouldn't consider that roaming. I'm talking about the packs of kids that you see day in day out, same kids, same antics every time. What you're talking about - leaving me to go get a snack and then coming back - I'd allow that without question.

[T. Advisor King]

Frankly it's parents with attitudes like yours who profess to have watched their kids so carefully when something happens to them. It's not just pedophiles and while I agree it is a very safe environment, the OP also said she lets her 12 year old roam around at home as well. It's not pedophiles I would be concerned with, with a 12 year old. Adults are drinking - have you seen what most 12 year girls look like these days? - like 18 year olds. There's inappropriate language and behaviour that can go on that a young person just doesn't need to be exposed to. If it's a family vacation, the 12 year old should be with her family, and the fact that she prefers to roam around alone rather than be with her family speaks volumes to me.

 

Actually, I did not "profess to watch my kids carefully". Rather I incrementally expose them to age-appropriate situations where they can demonstrate judgment and indepencence and in doing so, gradually learn to keep themselves safe in environments that are gradually less and less controlled. It's not about them behaving well and making smart choices because I'm watching them. They're behaving well and making smart choices because they've learned along the way.

 

I'm lost on your point about what 12 year old girls look like. Are you saying I should watch my 16 year old son more carefully because he might be seduced by a pre-teen masquerading as an 18 year old?

 

You're really worried about teenagers being exposed to swearing? Really?

 

As for your last point, if I had a 12 year old who wanted to be with me 24/7, I'd be concerned about their emotional development. As for my family, we all love spending time together and that's how the vast majority of our vacation time is spent. But it shouldn't be 24/7 by 12 years old. It is important to encourage kids to move outside their narrow shell, even if it is only for, say, an hour a day in a controlled environment like a cruise ship.

 

I actually think that the issue with some parents (and more often mothers than fathers, in my experience) is that they begin to see so much of their own self-worth in terms of their function as a parent that they will fight tooth and nail to hang onto that value by inserting themselves into their children's lives without limit. Rather than guide and teach, they control and smother. The parent can't accept that their children can actually learn to grow and flourish without them. It isn't really about "protecting" the child, it is about the parent trying to preserve her or his own sense of self-importance.

Edited January 28, 2014 by T. Advisor King

[Crusin6]

My kids never did the clubs on 6 cruises. We have 4 of them and have fun together no need for new "best friends" made from total stranger kids that do not want to spend time on a cruise with their family

 

Yes I know the clubs are loved by many kids I am referring to the teen types who want to avoid their parents. There are issues there that we do not want to know about.

 

I have 3 teens at the moment in my family so I feel somewhat qualified in my assessment of certain types of teens

[larkz]

This is a very good point. Kids tend to make friends at the club and then hang out on board with the kids they meet. And just like school, there are packs or cliques. Sometimes a kid will end up with the "wrong" group of kids. But most kids know what kind of kid they are and hang with that group. Rarely do packs of "bad" kids lure in "good" kids just for the fun of corrupting them. The troublemaking kids would rather hang with other troublemaking kids.

 

 

-------------------------------

 

 

 

Agree. While some posters will have you believe there are pedophiles waiting behind every cabin door to lure in any unaccompanied minor, the truth of the matter is that a ship is a highly controlled environment with hundreds (thousands?) of closed-circuit monitors. Add to that there is a fee to get on board and there is nowhere to run or hide if a manhunt starts, it is excruciatingly unlikely that something untoward will happen to an unaccompanied 12 year old.

 

That isn't to say that the odds are zero percent (although maybe zero percent after rounding), but they are so infinitessimally small that if you're going to overprotect your kids that much, you'd better get out the bubble wrap. And don't think about ever driving them anywhere in a car.

 

Perfect, fluent answer. Couldn't have said it better.

[larkz]

Actually, I did not "profess to watch my kids carefully". Rather I incrementally expose them to age-appropriate situations where they can demonstrate judgment and indepencence and in doing so, gradually learn to keep themselves safe in environments that are gradually less and less controlled. It's not about them behaving well and making smart choices because I'm watching them. They're behaving well and making smart choices because they've learned along the way.

 

I'm lost on your point about what 12 year old girls look like. Are you saying I should watch my 16 year old son more carefully because he might be seduced by a pre-teen masquerading as an 18 year old?

 

You're really worried about teenagers being exposed to swearing? Really?

 

As for your last point, if I had a 12 year old who wanted to be with me 24/7, I'd be concerned about their emotional development. As for my family, we all love spending time together and that's how the vast majority of our vacation time is spent. But it shouldn't be 24/7 by 12 years old. It is important to encourage kids to move outside their narrow shell, even if it is only for, say, an hour a day in a controlled environment like a cruise ship.

 

I actually think that the issue with some parents (and more often mothers than fathers, in my experience) is that they begin to see so much of their own self-worth in terms of their function as a parent that they will fight tooth and nail to hang onto that value by inserting themselves into their children's lives without limit. Rather than guide and teach, they control and smother. The parent can't accept that their children can actually learn to grow and flourish without them. It isn't really about "protecting" the child, it is about the parent trying to preserve her or his own sense of self-importance.

 

And more good stuff. This is not only textbook Parenting 101, but likely wisdom that comes from experience as well.

 

I recommend the book "Culture of Fear" for anyone interested in a good dose of reality versus the paranoia that suffocates so many people (we are actually living in what may the safest and most peaceful time in all of human history -- that's not to say throw all caution to the wind, but there is such a thing as balance).

[Mutumbojimbo]

My question to you veterans. If you let your children roam, what is the best way to check in with them? We're so used to texting and that's too expensive on the ship.

 

We used walkie-talkies, with decent results. The only problems we really had were user related, as in our 15 year old would turn it off!

[JustCruiseMe]

I think maybe your kids told you this to justify to you their decision not to go was the best one. That just sounds like something kids would say.

[mousey]

Our DS never liked the kid's clubs. Although we took him on his first cruise, a 4-day one out of San Diego, when he was 5, we didn't really start cruising with him on a steady basis until he was 9, when we took him on his first spring break cruise. We've been cruising with him every spring break since then. He is 18 and 1/2 now.

 

On that first spring break cruise when he was 9 and we realized he hated the kid's club, we didn't know what to do so the DH took him to the game room and played air hockey with him. While playing air hockey, a boy the same age as our son came up and asked if he could play the winner. The boy and our son hit it off and the DH left them together (leaving the DS with his walkie talkie) and came back to our room. At first, I freaked out at the DH leaving him alone. But within a couple of hours, our DS proved he was responsible by calling us whenever he moved from one area to another and meeting us wherever we asked him to and at the time and place we asked him to. We never looked back. From then on, we'd get on a ship and the DS would go off to make friends and would end up hanging out with a group of kids for the whole cruise when he wasn't with us. We never let him go off alone on shore excursions...ever. Only on the ship, and not even at home, was he allowed this kind of freedom. To our minds, it made him a more independent, mature, and happy kid. Not once, except when he was 16 and broke curfew for the first time (for which there were consequences and it never happened again...ever), did he ever get into any kind of trouble. As a matter of fact, I often had strangers (mostly parents of kids he would befriend and hangout with) come up to me and tell me that they loved my kid because he always had a big smile on his face and would give them conversation and was polite. My kids no Saint, but he is very respectful when speaking to anyone and excludes no one. He'll just as soon as speak to adults or younger siblings of his friends, as to his peers.

 

My point is that just because your child is young, it doesn't mean he/she isn't capable of making good choices and decisions. Yes, he was exposed to drunk people smoking and swearing. Big deal, it taught him how glad he was that while his parents might have a couple of glasses of wine now and then, they didn't smoke (a personal choice) or make fools of themselves by getting drunk as a skunk..and that was the way he liked it.

 

Now he's 18, in college, is very sociable, and has had many life experiences on cruises that have helped him to be able to live on his own at college without having to depend on Mommy and Daddy for his every move. He's very independent because he was given the space to learn how to make his own choices...not that they were always great ones..but he learned from his mistakes and he owned them.

 

In the beginning we used walkie talkies to stay in touch on the ship...as he got older...12 I would say, we used notes on the cabin doors. Most of the time we'd bump into him on the ship and set up places and times to meet. With few exceptions, we had dinner together most nights and most breakfasts also. Lunchtime he was off with his friends unless we were on shore together or if he decided he wanted to do lunch with us. We did all our shore excursions together and still do to this day.

 

Alas, those days are over and now this year for spring break he's off to Cabo with his frat brothers (he'll be 19 when he goes) He's an adult now, and I can't stop him from going. Now, I'm really scared, but I know from all these years of cruising with him, that he's quite capable of making, for the most part, good choices. As his mom, I'll always fear for his safety but keeping him tied to my apron strings is not an option for me.

 

While it is possible, anything is, I don't believe that smoking and drinking goes on in the kid's clubs on ships. We've been on several different cruise lines (mostly Carnival) and my son's never mentioned this..he started going to the teen club as he got older (starting at 16) to make friends but then they'd go off on their own and didn't really stay in the club area too much. He did do some activities with the teen club (he won a Ship-On-A-Stick playing ping pong twice) but not a lot.

 

To each his own, but I would never have forced my child to go to a club that he didn't like or have him stay stuck by me 24/7. Our son spent time with us on our cruises because he wanted to...not because he "had" to.

 

Sorry this is so long.:o

[fuddrules]

There's inappropriate language and behaviour that can go on that a young person just doesn't need to be exposed to.

 

Exposed? So when she was in kindergarten and got off the bus and asked grandma what does F mean, she wasn't exposed? She's did ride the bus most everyday to school from K to 4th grade.

 

At the dinner table that evening she blurts out (100% verbatim), "I know its a bad word, I just want to know what F means." BTW she wasn't saying the letter F.

 

Um, Ally, it's a bad word that means a lot of different things to different people. Just know its not a good word and it's inappropriate to use. It was an interesting, yet awkward, conversation....with a kindergartener. She was quite persistent in wanting to understand the meaning of the word F. It's not easy to explain.

 

I'm not going to keep my children from being exposed to unwanted words or actions of others. It won't happen. I can only help them understand how to act and respond appropriately in situations.

 

Generally speaking, they do, not always....but almost always. But then again, in certain situations, I don't always act appropriate either, I like it that way.

Edited January 28, 2014 by fuddrules

[bigpuma]

For those of you who wouldn't let your 12 year old "roam" the ship by themselves, how many of you would let your 9 year old ride the subway home by themself? :D

 

http://www.nysun.com/opinion/why-i-let-my-9-year-old-ride-subway-alone/73976/

[jlindemer]

[quote name=Agree. While some posters will have you believe there are pedophiles waiting behind every cabin door to lure in any unaccompanied minor' date=' the truth of the matter is that a ship is a highly controlled environment with hundreds (thousands?) of closed-circuit monitors. Add to that there is a fee to get on board and there is nowhere to run or hide if a manhunt starts, it is excruciatingly unlikely that something untoward will happen to an unaccompanied 12 year old.

 

 

 

That isn't to say that the odds are zero percent (although maybe zero percent after rounding), but they are so infinitessimally small that if you're going to overprotect your kids that much, you'd better get out the bubble wrap. And don't think about ever driving them anywhere in a car.[/quote]

 

 

YOU ARE MY HERO!!! I'm so tired of all of the bubble wrap parents telling people how to raise kids. Our kids will end up being their kids' boss because they will know how to live independently and think for themselves!

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

[jlindemer]

YOU ARE MY HERO!!! I'm so tired of all of the bubble wrap parents telling people how to raise kids. Our kids will end up being their kids' boss because they will know how to live independently and think for themselves!

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

 

 

This was supposed to quote the poster with the last name of King. Sorry.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

[T. Advisor King]

... that's not to say throw all caution to the wind, but there is such a thing as balance).

 

I just wanted to emphasize the point that you touched on so subtly that it might have been missed. It is entirely about "caution". As in, "proceed with caution". Notice that that expression includes equal parts "proceed" and "caution". It's not about stopping or preventing or protecting. It's about teaching kids to be cautious and gradually exposing them to situations of age-appropriate risk, to the point that as they become teenagers and on to young adults, they can handle the risk.

 

-----------------

 

This was supposed to quote the poster with the last name of King. Sorry.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

 

Thanks, I got it.

 

It isn't really my last name, of course! It was something that I came up with on the spur of the moment when I logged into another travel website for the something-dozenth time and was confronted with an instruction to immediately create a screen name for myself. I was in a particular mood and that's what came out. When I'm on any site but that site, I add the "T" to denote the origin site.

[Keel Haul]

Calling C J Knox you are a teenage Carnival Cruiser, so whats the inside gossip Knoxy are you a Justin B type of guy:)

[loxley]

For those of you who wouldn't let your 12 year old "roam" the ship by themselves, how many of you would let your 9 year old ride the subway home by themself? :D

 

http://www.nysun.com/opinion/why-i-let-my-9-year-old-ride-subway-alone/73976/

 

here is the story by Penn and Teller.

 

I think a lot of the parents commenting on this thread should watch the whole show. Warning, it is Penn and Teller so there is going to be some strong language.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53HU2Rje9vU

[Cruisin 4 Ever]

Actually, I did not "profess to watch my kids carefully". Rather I incrementally expose them to age-appropriate situations where they can demonstrate judgment and indepencence and in doing so, gradually learn to keep themselves safe in environments that are gradually less and less controlled. It's not about them behaving well and making smart choices because I'm watching them. They're behaving well and making smart choices because they've learned along the way.

 

I'm lost on your point about what 12 year old girls look like. Are you saying I should watch my 16 year old son more carefully because he might be seduced by a pre-teen masquerading as an 18 year old?

 

You're really worried about teenagers being exposed to swearing? Really?

 

As for your last point, if I had a 12 year old who wanted to be with me 24/7, I'd be concerned about their emotional development. As for my family, we all love spending time together and that's how the vast majority of our vacation time is spent. But it shouldn't be 24/7 by 12 years old. It is important to encourage kids to move outside their narrow shell, even if it is only for, say, an hour a day in a controlled environment like a cruise ship.

 

I actually think that the issue with some parents (and more often mothers than fathers, in my experience) is that they begin to see so much of their own self-worth in terms of their function as a parent that they will fight tooth and nail to hang onto that value by inserting themselves into their children's lives without limit. Rather than guide and teach, they control and smother. The parent can't accept that their children can actually learn to grow and flourish without them. It isn't really about "protecting" the child, it is about the parent trying to preserve her or his own sense of self-importance.

 

1. I said parents with attitudes like yours are the first to claim to have watched their kids so carefully IF SOMETHING GOES WRONG, not that you are already saying your watch your kids carefully

2. At no time in your post did you speak of gradually exposing your kids to age appropriate situations gradually. The OP said:

"I've let my 12 year old roam around on land and at sea. That doesn't make me insensible." and you stated "agree" - big difference there

3. Not sure how you could have lost the point on 12 years looking older these days but I was assuming the OPs child was a girl and that young girls look so much older now. Perhaps you haven't seen the Lido deck when folks are drinking too much but it can get a bit rowdy, and yes, even when I've been with my daughter I've seen MUCH older guys try to "hit on her" until they see me coming up behind her.

4. A 12 year old is not a teen so yes I do think offensive language should not be going on around them. I would not personally swear in front of my child so why would I want them in a situation where others are?? Does that mean she's never heard (or even used) a swear word. Of course not, but that still doesn't mean I would want me 12 year old around that

5. I did not say your child should want to be around you 24/7. The OP you were responding to was talking about the child wanting to roam around on their own and you were bashing parents who don't think that is ok. At no time did you say it was for short periods of time. Of course kids should want to have SOME time on their own. There is a time and place for that and many of us simply do not believe that time is while on family vacation. Someone has now conveniently clarified they are only talking about going to get a slice of pizza. OK LOL, quite sure that's not what they were saying initially.

6. Perhaps some parents do measure their self worth by being overly involved in their childs life, not I. Perhaps some other parents make a whole lot of judgements on other parents who believe in watching their children carefully because they themselves are too lazy to do so.

[Trizzy]

Wow. I am really surprised by some of the responses. I only have 6 post ...because I simply don't post much. I am planning a cruise with my Girlfriends this summer and I am spending a lot of time reading reviews on this site to help plan. I recalled something that happened on my last trip and decided to post it. Maybe it wasn't clear but I never said that children were smoking and drinking IN the Kid Club. I actually overheard kids outside the club talking about doing it as well as met a young man who says that he was approached by some teenagers to buy them alcohol. Some kids will do this whether they are on ship or hanging with friends in their neighborhood.

 

I really enjoyed the vacation and I am glad that my children decided to spend the time with me..Too bad that this post took a wrong turn.. With that said I'll just continue to read reviews and not post. Good day all.

[Crusin6]

For those of you who wouldn't let your 12 year old "roam" the ship by themselves, how many of you would let your 9 year old ride the subway home by themself? :D

 

http://www.nysun.com/opinion/why-i-let-my-9-year-old-ride-subway-alone/73976/

 

Actually extenuating circumstances aside a parent can and I know of a local case up here in the north suburbs of NYC where a parent was arrested for leaving a kid home alone to do their homework. Kid didn't want to do it and called 911 kid was 10 and apparantly in nys can be considered child abandonment. Please note I said CAN not IS considered abandonment

 

 

 

I have no opinion of the kid except to say he certainly has some sort of issue

 

As for a 9 yo alone in the NYC subway? Are you nuts? But of course it made for a great little article for the liberal majority to wave around

 

I am no " helicopter parent" but no way I will be an "ostrich parent" either nor do I give in to every whim of my kids and only a nut leaves there kid alone at bloomies in NYC. Especially at 9 yo

Edited January 28, 2014 by Crusin6

[Trizzy]

I think maybe your kids told you this to justify to you their decision not to go was the best one. That just sounds like something kids would say.

 

That's exactly what they were doing.. Lol