Crossing time through the years

[edwardh1]

maybe posted before

https://people.hofstra.edu/geotrans/eng/ch3en/conc3en/linertransatlantic.html

[BlueRiband]

Thanks for the link. From what I've read of tourist class conditions it wasn't very pleasant. I could see somebody making the calculation that five hours of airsickness was more endurable than five days of seasickness. :(

[edwardh1]

Thanks for the link. From what I've read of tourist class conditions it wasn't very pleasant. I could see somebody making the calculation that five hours of airsickness was more endurable than five days of seasickness. :(

 

Is tourist class somewhat lower in the ship? They might have been better off. Less roll?

[3rdGenCunarder]

Is tourist class somewhat lower in the ship? They might have been better off. Less roll?

 

Also smaller cabins and less ventillation. I don't know why, but the smaller the space, the sicker you'll feel. Often the cheaper cabins were closer to the "ends" of the ship, rather than midships where there is less motion.

Edited October 26, 2015 by 3rdGenCunarder

[Jim Avery]

Thanks for the link. From what I've read of tourist class conditions it wasn't very pleasant. I could see somebody making the calculation that five hours of airsickness was more endurable than five days of seasickness. :(

 

One thing to remember is that air fares were very expensive for the times compared to sea fares in tourist. About the same as First Class.

[guernseyguy]

Is tourist class somewhat lower in the ship? They might have been better off. Less roll?

 

First Class in the middle, on top.

 

Second class towards the stern

 

Third class forward and aft.

 

One of the great questions of ocean liner travel was why did the 'dowdy frumpy' Queen Mary so comprehensively thrash the 'glamorous luxurious' Normandie?

 

I reckon its because Queen Mary looked after her second class passengers better.....

[Austcruiser84]

First Class in the middle, on top.

 

Second class towards the stern

 

Third class forward and aft.

 

One of the great questions of ocean liner travel was why did the 'dowdy frumpy' Queen Mary so comprehensively thrash the 'glamorous luxurious' Normandie?

 

I reckon its because Queen Mary looked after her second class passengers better.....

 

According to Bill Miller in the 1997 documentary series 'The Liners' (episode three: The Great Duel - found on YouTube), many people felt the Normandie was too luxurious and it made people feel uncomfortable. The Mary was less pretentious and homely.

[guernseyguy]

According to Bill Miller in the 1997 documentary series 'The Liners' (episode three: The Great Duel - found on YouTube), many people felt the Normandie was too luxurious and it made people feel uncomfortable. The Mary was less pretentious and homely.

 

Sixty years on thats not an unreasonable rationalisation - but I think it was also a function of space - Queen Mary had quite a lot of 'Second Class' (called Tourist) space - advertised as 'better than First on other liners' (and indeed it was):

 

http://www.sterling.rmplc.co.uk/visions/dkside2.html

 

Lets not forget, Americans made up the bulk of First ("Cabin") Class passengers - while Brits the bulk of Tourist - so its hardly surprising a British liner was well equipped for Tourist passengers.

[Jim Avery]

Sixty years on thats not an unreasonable rationalisation - but I think it was also a function of space - Queen Mary had quite a lot of 'Second Class' (called Tourist) space - advertised as 'better than First on other liners' (and indeed it was):

 

http://www.sterling.rmplc.co.uk/visions/dkside2.html

 

Lets not forget, Americans made up the bulk of First ("Cabin") Class passengers - while Brits the bulk of Tourist - so its hardly surprising a British liner was well equipped for Tourist passengers.

 

That brings up a funny memory. As a kid on Queen Mary, I always had the impression those in First Class were the ones "cooped up". We in Tourist seemed to have most of the ship, or so it seemed to an impressionable youth.:D

[guernseyguy]

That brings up a funny memory. As a kid on Queen Mary, I always had the impression those in First Class were the ones "cooped up". We in Tourist seemed to have most of the ship, or so it seemed to an impressionable youth.:D

 

The old saying among Cunard crew was that the best class of person travelled Tourist at Third prices...;-)

[pepperrn]

... One of the great questions of ocean liner travel was why did the 'dowdy frumpy' Queen Mary so comprehensively thrash the 'glamorous luxurious' Normandie?

I reckon its because Queen Mary looked after her second class passengers better.....

Hi guernseyguy,

 

I agree with you totally (I'm sure you know most of what follows)

 

The Tourist Class areas on Normandie looked like an afterthought; some public rooms wrapped around the aft end of the superstructure (Like a giant "C") in those wonderful Art Deco terraces at the stern, while others were interior spaces (or nearly so)

(Queen Mary's Tourist spaces were clearly designed to be spacious and well-designed from the start. Besides being located across the stern, they went a long way forward as well, like a giant "U" shape.)

 

So much space was taken up by the vast Ist Class public rooms on Normandie, they really did have to squeeze in the other two classes where they could, so it seemed. I don't think any other major ship has dedicated so much space to 1st Class as did Normandie.

(At least her passengers in the Tourist Class Dining room had a glimpse of the sea, 1st Class were denied that of course).

 

However, as built, Normandie's Tourist Lounge was an entirely interior space, and by all accounts, a depressing one as well. Passengers hated it, preferring to spend time in other Tourist public rooms.

 

So a new Tourist lounge was built ready for 1936 (with glass walls on three sides), near the stern, near the top deck of the ship. Sadly this structure destroyed the views from the 1st Class Cafe Grill, and also spoiled the splendid isolation of the two top suites on board (their huge previously private terraces now had gawping ordinary mortals only feet away).

 

But this new lounge had the added benefit (besides upgrading Tourist accommodation) of ensuring Normandie would be decisively bigger than the new Queen Mary which was about to enter service (without this new lounge on Normandie adding to her gross tonnage, I think Queen Mary could have entered service as the world's biggest ship). With the new lounge Normandie measured approx 83,000gt against Queen Mary's approx 81,000gt.

 

Queen Mary consistently beat Normandie in passenger numbers, as one year (1937) shows: Normandie 37,583 (36 crossings), Queen Mary 56,921 (42 crossings) (1938 shows a similar difference: 32,953 v 52,282, as do '36 & '39)

As Austcruiser84 says, Normandie was seen as too grand, too over the top, too Deco.

Queen Mary's interiors may have been seen as a little boring, but it seemed that people liked the country house chintz feel, and toned down Deco, the ever-so-slightly dull look.

Edited October 29, 2015 by pepperrn

[Keith1010]

Thanks for posting this.

 

Keith