NCL has big revenue dreams - Bloomberg

[david_sobe]

If Del Rio's vision is successful then my guess is that it will be with a new demographic. (And from what I saw on NCL's site the other day it looks like the Sky test has been made permanent, or at least that is what the wording suggested anyway.)

Its permanent as long as the ship sails full. I thought it did not being until January 2016.

When the budget weekend cruisers start price shopping and the Sky is forced to slash prices......I doubt those "free" drinks will stick around much longer.

Too early to tell.

[sparks1093]

Its permanent as long as the ship sails full. I thought it did not being until January 2016.

When the budget weekend cruisers start price shopping and the Sky is forced to slash prices......I doubt those "free" drinks will stick around much longer.

Too early to tell.

 

I was looking as 2017 cruises. A three day started at $349 pp/pd and a four day started at $349 pp/pd. As with anything else NCL is doing only time will tell.

[Golfin55]

Del Rio is taking a cruise line that many have loved and transforming it into a completely different animal. It is what it is (in other words business is business), but for me it reduces my realistic choice of cruise lines to choose from. I will miss the old NCL.

 

 

I suggest all of you start reading what Richard Fain, Donald Arnold said during Cruise360 & Cruiseworld 2014 speeches. I could care less about FDR, I have no stake in NCL. However, know what the competition is dong and reducing, and charging. Disney, Royal, Carnival, Princess have all raised prices. No CEO would ever knowingly just give market share over to the other guy.

[perditax]

I can't afford the Havens but we do have 2 friends, that have stayed in them, plus our daughter and granddaughter, not on the Breakaway, all have done nothing but priase the experience. You can't take one ship and generalize the experience will be the same on all the other ones.

 

If you trace back in this thread, you'll see that the Haven sub-discussion started from someone who didn't enjoy their Haven experience on Breakaway, and someone questioned them on it. I've seen so many complaints about recent sailings in Haven on that ship that I now know the concierge's name (Virginia) even though I've never set foot on it. Just commenting on a trend I've seen.

[sparks1093]

I suggest all of you start reading what Richard Fain, Donald Arnold said during Cruise360 & Cruiseworld 2014 speeches. I could care less about FDR, I have no stake in NCL. However, know what the competition is dong and reducing, and charging. Disney, Royal, Carnival, Princess have all raised prices. No CEO would ever knowingly just give market share over to the other guy.

 

The only thing that I need to read are the mock bookings that I do that consistently show NCL's fares as being higher than RCCL and CCL for the times when I can book. Does NCL still offer deals? Yep, they do based on what other's are experiencing.

 

None of the competition is trying to transform their line into a semi-premium line either, last I checked, which is one of Del Rio's main goals.

[newmexicoNita]

If you trace back in this thread, you'll see that the Haven sub-discussion started from someone who didn't enjoy their Haven experience on Breakaway, and someone questioned them on it. I've seen so many complaints about recent sailings in Haven on that ship that I now know the concierge's name (Virginia) even though I've never set foot on it. Just commenting on a trend I've seen.

 

ok, we are talking one ship and I assume one concerge. I have know chocierges I did not like, but that doesn't mean throughout the line. Remember, it is always easier to complain about a bad experience than a positive one. This is human nature: we expect to be satisfied, so we are not always quick to praise, but when something doesn't go the way we would expect it to go, we jump on the bandwagon. Have you read all the positive comments about the Haven? Looking for the negatives is being very one sided.

[wilmingtech]

This is a simplified overview...

 

When you operate a transportation business the most money you an make is when the seats are full. But that is it. If its 100 seats at 10$ a seat its a 1000.00 a run. Transportation is a flatline invesment. Now..while limited, there are few ways to increase revenue -

 

1. Increase the cost of the seat.

2. Sell trinkets or other amenities...nicer seats, food, drinks

3. Reduce operating costs

4. Increase the number of run hours per vehicle (not going to happen on a cruise)

5. For overall corporate revenue increase as opposed to per vehicle then you would just add more vehicles. 300 seats make more money than 100 seats.

 

Being a publicly traded company, FDR's sole job it to increase revenue for NCL.

So far he has -

1. Increased cost of the seat

2. Increased the number of trinkets and costs of those trinkets including DSC becoming a company managed item (we will take the tips and distribute) as opposed to a personnel managed item (Employee receives an envelope and keeps it)

3. Reduced operating costs (fewer personnel per ship)

4. Cant do on a cruise line.

5. Buy more ships.

 

But in the end, you can only make so much money per ship. You are not creating something that can be bought and sold as a commodity. It has no more value than the experience of the cruise itself.

 

FDR's goal is to increase the experience of the cruise, justifying the cost of the cruise, increasing percentage of seats filled thereby increasing revenue.

 

The downside that every investor knows of transportation is that if you have a perfect year (100% seats full, operating costs lean and all trinkets are sold) then that is the best you will do. You can't increase revenue any further than that. Its flatline - This is the most we can possibly make from a single ship.

 

Investors want to see the numbers go up every year. To that end the only way is to add more ships...but what number of ships is too many? How many people really want to cruise? And the more ships, the more competition, costs go down to get people on them...

 

-Sean

Edited November 4, 2015 by wilmingtech

[perditax]

ok, we are talking one ship and I assume one concerge. I have know chocierges I did not like, but that doesn't mean throughout the line. Remember, it is always easier to complain about a bad experience than a positive one. This is human nature: we expect to be satisfied, so we are not always quick to praise, but when something doesn't go the way we would expect it to go, we jump on the bandwagon. Have you read all the positive comments about the Haven? Looking for the negatives is being very one sided.

 

Yes, I know the drill on negativity. I didn't go looking for anything, I just read a lot of CC posts and I have a good memory, so I noticed the trend and commented on it when someone else brought it up. For contrast, I have not seen the same posting trend on, for example, the GA.

 

For me, personally, based on quite a few recent posts, I would not book Haven on BA anytime soon. Sounds a bit overcrowded and with support staff stretched thin. The reason I know the name Virginia is multiple people mentioned trying to go to her when they had problems.

 

I'm not making any other point than the one above: I would not book Haven on BA right now. I'm not speaking for anyone else, nor making a general claim about NCL or the Haven experience.

Edited November 4, 2015 by perditax

[Merriem]

Personally I think the article makes good business sense.

[swedish weave]

The only thing that I need to read are the mock bookings that I do that consistently show NCL's fares as being higher than RCCL and CCL for the times when I can book. Does NCL still offer deals? Yep, they do based on what other's are experiencing.

 

None of the competition is trying to transform their line into a semi-premium line either, last I checked, which is one of Del Rio's main goals.

 

A quick study of history will cast a dark cloud over Del Rio's vision of transforming NCL into an upscale cruise line. None of the lines that tried to go upscale or tried to remain upscale are still in business independently. They have either folded or have been absorbed by other mainstream cruise lines. Even Del Rio's own two cruise lines are now under NCLH.

 

I hope he succeeds in his endeavors, but if history has any bearing on the industry, the odds are not good.

[sparks1093]

A quick study of history will cast a dark cloud over Del Rio's vision of transforming NCL into an upscale cruise line. None of the lines that tried to go upscale or tried to remain upscale are still in business independently. They have either folded or have been absorbed by other mainstream cruise lines. Even Del Rio's own two cruise lines are now under NCLH.

 

I hope he succeeds in his endeavors, but if history has any bearing on the industry, the odds are not good.

 

Yes, I am reminded of the scene from the Perfect Storm when the Andrea Gail tried to top that last wave and made it three-quarters of the way up. I'm not certain which is worse- having Del Rio succeed and have NCL forever out of reach or having him fail and having NCL go belly up. In either event I lose out on sailing with them so I guess it doesn't really matter.

[newmexicoNita]

Yes, I know the drill on negativity. I didn't go looking for anything, I just read a lot of CC posts and I have a good memory, so I noticed the trend and commented on it when someone else brought it up. For contrast, I have not seen the same posting trend on, for example, the GA.

 

For me, personally, based on quite a few recent posts, I would not book Haven on BA anytime soon. Sounds a bit overcrowded and with support staff stretched thin. The reason I know the name Virginia is multiple people mentioned trying to go to her when they had problems.

 

I'm not making any other point than the one above: I would not book Haven on BA right now. I'm not speaking for anyone else, nor making a general claim about NCL or the Haven experience.

 

but you were, go back and read some of your comments: you are judging or it appears you are all haven experiences based on the Breakaway. Heck, from talking to people I know who have cruised the Breakaway I probably wound not cruise them period, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't cruise say, the Getaway. In fact we are booked on the Getaway next year. And I understand what you are saying about Virginia, again, any company can have a less than top employee. I find your comments to be overly negative, that is what I am saying.

[hypercafe]

I really do not know how FDR wants to position NCL however the more you charge, the more you say luxury the more people expect to be included in the base fare, not less. It seems low class to have your Butler serving dinner or brakefast in your expensive room and tell you its 3$ more for OJ and 10$ for a lobster tail.

[canadianeh934]

but you were, go back and read some of your comments: you are judging or it appears you are all haven experiences based on the Breakaway. Heck, from talking to people I know who have cruised the Breakaway I probably wound not cruise them period, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't cruise say, the Getaway. In fact we are booked on the Getaway next year. And I understand what you are saying about Virginia, again, any company can have a less than top employee. I find your comments to be overly negative, that is what I am saying.

 

 

I think that the poster has been very clear....feels that booking a Haven suit on the Breakaway is not something he/she is interested in doing based on reading poor reviews.

 

You your self are saying you would not book at all on the Breakway, yet you feel that the other poster is being overly negative:eek::confused:

[Merriem]

but you were, go back and read some of your comments: you are judging or it appears you are all haven experiences based on the Breakaway. Heck, from talking to people I know who have cruised the Breakaway I probably wound not cruise them period, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't cruise say, the Getaway. In fact we are booked on the Getaway next year. And I understand what you are saying about Virginia, again, any company can have a less than top employee. I find your comments to be overly negative, that is what I am saying.

 

We thought Virginia was very pleasant.

[perditax]

but you were, go back and read some of your comments: you are judging or it appears you are all haven experiences based on the Breakaway. Heck, from talking to people I know who have cruised the Breakaway I probably wound not cruise them period, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't cruise say, the Getaway. In fact we are booked on the Getaway next year. And I understand what you are saying about Virginia, again, any company can have a less than top employee. I find your comments to be overly negative, that is what I am saying.

 

Your opinion on my negativity levels has been noted. If it continues to bother you, I will understand if you need to bring my posts to the attention of a moderator and/or put me on ignore.

[luvtheships]

Yes, I am reminded of the scene from the Perfect Storm when the Andrea Gail tried to top that last wave and made it three-quarters of the way up. I'm not certain which is worse- having Del Rio succeed and have NCL forever out of reach or having him fail and having NCL go belly up. In either event I lose out on sailing with them so I guess it doesn't really matter.

 

 

Well for me and mine we do try to cruise at rock bottom prices so we can travel for longer periods of time and more often

 

I've been know to book higher end ships though for example I could have done Ncl spirit for $3000 less than the ruby princess

 

Booked the ruby and glad we did

 

Could have done rccl on the same exact 12 itinerary as the much much cheaper (true ksf plus it was January) Ncl ba. Booked the ba. Glad I did

 

Now if Ncl starts trying to be a more a expensive line i will still cruise but if I have to pay more than I really want to for Ncl....I will just try rccl

 

I've been wanting to try them but they are costly out of port liberty

 

Ncl has been cheaper out of NYC

 

Now if Ncl and rccl are the same or close in price for jan 2017 12 day to Carib......I'm willing to try rccl

 

The ba is nice but the casino smoke ruins it and the pool is too small

 

I have no clue what I'll find on rccl but what the heck I'll give it a try....I'm sure others will too....over Ncl

 

If I must pay more why not experience something new and bigger?

[sparks1093]

Well for me and mine we do try to cruise at rock bottom prices so we can travel for longer periods of time and more often

 

I've been know to book higher end ships though for example I could have done Ncl spirit for $3000 less than the ruby princess

 

Booked the ruby and glad we did

 

Could have done rccl on the same exact 12 itinerary as the much much cheaper (true ksf plus it was January) Ncl ba. Booked the ba. Glad I did

 

Now if Ncl starts trying to be a more a expensive line i will still cruise but if I have to pay more than I really want to for Ncl....I will just try rccl

 

I've been wanting to try them but they are costly out of port liberty

 

Ncl has been cheaper out of NYC

 

Now if Ncl and rccl are the same or close in price for jan 2017 12 day to Carib......I'm willing to try rccl

 

The ba is nice but the casino smoke ruins it and the pool is too small

 

I have no clue what I'll find on rccl but what the heck I'll give it a try....I'm sure others will too....over Ncl

 

If I must pay more why not experience something new and bigger?

 

I found the same thing when pricing cruises out of the northeast (which I actually haven't done lately) but now that DW and I have the ability to fly to the port of departure it does open up a few more options. Right after I booked our cruise for next year I looked at RCCL and they had a comparable cruise for about $100 more than CCL and that's close enough for me to give them a try. I don't want to cruise on any of the larger cruise ships, regardless of price. Too much time on an aircraft carrier while in the Navy:o.

[Jane Don]

Your opinion on my negativity levels has been noted. If it continues to bother you, I will understand if you need to bring my posts to the attention of a moderator and/or put me on ignore.

 

 

She gave me the same speech yesterday but your reply was far more tactful than my, "I don't care how you feel, this is Cruise CRITIC", reply.

[perditax]

She gave me the same speech yesterday but your reply was far more tactful than my, "I don't care how you feel, this is Cruise CRITIC", reply.

 

 

Having a linear, rational conversation around here can be like trying to walk in a wind tunnel.

[wilmingtech]

Having a linear, rational conversation around here can be like trying to walk in a wind tunnel.

Oh no...smoke some weed...drop a hit of acid, kick on some Grateful Dead tunes and it all kinda starts to make sense....

[Rou-Dyliq]

If you ask posters like maywell you and I are the only people looking else where, I do not see this current business model holding steady for NCL, it has got new people in the door now but time will tell how many repeat the Experience. I too was a Sheehan Sheep, by that I mean I would follow his direction of the line faithfully without question, because he had a transparency about him that made you feel valued, not just a piggybank to squeeze. This article has repeated my very own thoughts on next quarter glad to see I'm not crazy, even if I was branded a complainer here by some. Happy cruising all no matter what boat you're on.

 

My next two cruises are booked with Celebrity. I really like their product, as far as balcony cabin to balcony cabin comparisons go. I haven't been in their suites. I priced two cruises for next December, same basic itinerary. Even if I went with the "best" promotion on Celebrity's sailing, NCL was a tad bit more expensive. NCL was on a newer ship, but would not include as many perks.

 

I've enjoyed NCL, but am not happy with the major price increases that run along with minor value decrease (my opinion but what is changing is a value decrease to me). What bothers me more is they WAY they roll them out, and do not always honor what was in place when the passenger booked. What they offered just might have been the deciding factor for someone to book and I find that disregard for customer satisfaction arrogant at best and deceptive at worst.

[jingle5616]

Here's what Jack Del Rio said at the conference call:

 

Frank J. Del Rio - President & Chief Executive Officer

 

"I think you need to look at it over a two-year program. We dry-docked Epic and Gem, and those were extensive dry-docks in Q3, Q4 this year. As Wendy mentioned, we have eight dry-docks next year, two with the Regent brand, one at the Oceania brand, five at the Norwegian brand. And I think – I know that it will – that kind of dry-dock heavy schedule will now continue into 2017. I believe that by 2017 every one of Norwegian's ships except the brand new ones will have been dry-docked except for one vessel. So that gives us a very unique opportunity to upgrade the fleet over a short, concentrated time so that the whole brand gets elevated in terms of product delivery and allows us to continue to raise prices more so than if you hadn't done these things."

 

He's blowing smoke you know where. NCL like every cruise line regularly schedule their ships for dry dock. It could be that the schedule for those five ships are due. FDR will use just about anything to justify a price increase. Maybe there will be "extensive" refurbishment, but that goes again the industry norm. Carnival tried it on a couple of their ships to lack luster reviews and results. Time will tell about the genius of Frank Del Rio and his ships!

[MMMD]

I liked the part where it said 'the consumer has choices'.

 

Very true. I was absolutely disappointed on my Breakaway cruise & the Haven experience. I felt I paid for for an experience I didn't receive. (yes -before anyone asks, I did complain. Nothing changed. Let's leave it at that please)

 

Now I'm looking into all inclusive resorts & the RCI Anthem of the seas.

 

This consumer is looking into choices other than NCL.

 

Thank you OP for posting the article -I didn't see this one before.

 

Agree. We met in the Haven lounge & compared our experiences.

Worst Suite experience I ever had.

I've been checking the RCI threads too & am considering switching from NCL.

 

Would also like to thank the original poster for the article.

[MMMD]

 

thiswillbefunnj: you were disappointed in the Haven experience? wow I don't think I have heard many, if anyone say that. I wonder what disappointed you?

 

I don't wish to jump in ahead of thiswillbefunnj, but we were on the same cruise & met one another in the Haven lounge. The Haven was a waste of money & not the special experience it's advertised as. Of course NCL can't know who your fellow Haven passengers will be, but I think the time has come to make it an adults only area. Screaming children running through the Haven restaurant, pool area & lounge constantly is unacceptable. Teens & kids taking over the pool & hot tub, screaming, splashing & asking for food & drinks that were left everywhere. We even tried to sit in the lounge to have a drink before dinner & had to leave. The noise level from kids & drunk adults was too much. The Haven restaurant was nice looking, but tables are close together & just one family with unruly children can ruin your dinner -now add 3 or 4 families & you can understand why we rarely spent time there. The buffet was quieter.

I had an invisible Butler. Actually the same one as thiswillbefunnj. Never brought one thing we asked for.

As she stated, we did complain & nothing changed. Well, something changed. Now I'm thinking of sailing with another line. Not worth paying Haven prices if we don't even receive the minimum 'special' treatment.

 

Didn't mean to hijack the thread. Just wanted to answer you.