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What's in a name? (For Cunard's new ship)

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My English companion suggested Queen Boudica (also Boadicea), who was a British Celtic queen who led an uprising against the occupying forces of the Roman Empire in AD 60 or 61.

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Queen Amidala the leader of the Naboo and mother to Luke Skywalker and Princess Leia and comes to mind. :p

 

In all seriousiness though the question to be answered is does Cunard intend to operate 4 ships at once something they would not have done for 25 years by 2022? If not than you are looking at Queen Mary 3 or Queen Victoria 2.

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I can't see them retiring any of the current fleet yet so QM2 will still be the flagship.

 

Not if the new ship is larger and better presented than the QM2 which it probably will be given Cuanrd's attention to detail. And especially if this new ship is assigned to transatlantic routes and the Mary is assigned elsewhere.

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I haven't seen anything in the information published so far to suggest that's the case. QM2 will still be the only liner in the fleet, the others are very nice cruise ships.

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I haven't seen anything in the information published so far to suggest that's the case. QM2 will still be the only liner in the fleet, the others are very nice cruise ships.

 

It is not coming out for 5 years by which time that lovely liner will be 19 years old and probably won't get another refit before 2022. We will wait to see cunard's move. I am personally surprised at the construction of a 4th ship as I think the cunard brand is in a little bit of trouble they seem to be doing a few less transatlantic runs these days when they are only the game in town apart from relocation cruises and that is the company's niche.

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ace2542, just a few of my thoughts about this discussion ...

 

As of now, Cunard certainly intends to be operating four ships when the new ship is brought into service in 2022. Their press release announcing the new ship is titled "Cunard Will Add Fourth Ship To Its Fleet" and it states "The first time since 1998 that the luxury cruise brand will have four ships in simultaneous service".

 

As several others have observed in other discussions on this forum, the new ship as currently envisioned appears to be an MS Koningsdam knock off. As Host Hattie has mentioned, she will no doubt be a fine cruise ship, but I don't see her taking the place of QM2 in regular transatlantic service.

 

QM2's next refit is scheduled for 2020.

 

As you have indicated, a lot could change between now and 2022, but that's what the current situation with the new ship looks like to me for what that's worth.

 

Regards, John

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Queen Berengaria, I rather like that, and the original ship was BEAUTIFUL. Come to think of it, were any of the ocean liners of yesteryear ugly in the same way as some modern cruise ships?

 

UGLY ships of yore? YES, there were many ugly ships under most flags. Their number included some hideous looking ships like the ugly "nautonaphtes", French liners with square chimneys in place of funnels (as built) although some had fantastic interiors...odd cabin arrangements though...

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It is not coming out for 5 years by which time that lovely liner will be 19 years old and probably won't get another refit before 2022. We will wait to see cunard's move. I am personally surprised at the construction of a 4th ship as I think the cunard brand is in a little bit of trouble they seem to be doing a few less transatlantic runs these days when they are only the game in town apart from relocation cruises and that is the company's niche.

19 years isn’t even halfway into her fatigue life of 40 years, so QM2 will quite possibly even outlast this new ship in service! The fact they are building a new ship - a considerable investment whichever way you look at it - suggests Cunard are not ‘in trouble’ but rather the opposite, doing well enough that they are expanding. Mickey Arison has suggested QM2 is constantly sailing full on her transatlantic crossings, but there is some doubt over whether adding a second liner and doubling capacity would be too much for that market.

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19 years isn’t even halfway into her fatigue life of 40 years, so QM2 will quite possibly even outlast this new ship in service! The fact they are building a new ship - a considerable investment whichever way you look at it - suggests Cunard are not ‘in trouble’ but rather the opposite, doing well enough that they are expanding. Mickey Arison has suggested QM2 is constantly sailing full on her transatlantic crossings, but there is some doubt over whether adding a second liner and doubling capacity would be too much for that market.

 

But they are doing less transatlantic runs the last couple of years aren't they? So if they are constantly sailing full why do less runs when they are only game in town? I may be wrong but the QM 2 never used to do runs to the Fjords or the Baltic states did it? But this year it has.

 

You have to consider for whatever reason no other company has tried to take cunard on on direct transatlantic crossings have they? What would have happen if Holland America decide to attempt to return to their former glory of Amsterdam to New York crossings and if Celebrity whose luxury and levels of service blow cunard away so I have been informed and are widely considered the top in the industry what would happen then?

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Holland America is unlikely to compete with Cunard since they are both owned by Carnival. Celebrity recently considered buying the United States, but the financial projections were a no go.

 

Sent from my SM-J700T using Forums mobile app

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But they are doing less transatlantic runs the last couple of years aren't they? So if they are constantly sailing full why do less runs when they are only game in town? I may be wrong but the QM 2 never used to do runs to the Fjords or the Baltic states did it? But this year it has.

 

You have to consider for whatever reason no other company has tried to take cunard on on direct transatlantic crossings have they? What would have happen if Holland America decide to attempt to return to their former glory of Amsterdam to New York crossings and if Celebrity whose luxury and levels of service blow cunard away so I have been informed and are widely considered the top in the industry what would happen then?

Actually the number of QM2 transatlantic crossings each year have stayed about the same since the QM2 entered service in 2004. It is unlikely that Holland America would return to doing regularly scheduled transatlantic crossings because first they would have to build an Ocean Liner to do these crossings and you know how much more expensive it is to build an Ocean Liner vs a Cruise Ship and second the Carnival Corporation owns both Cunard and Holland America so it is unlikely that Carnival Corporation would want to compete against itself in the transatlantic market. Concerning whether Celebrity would want to enter the transatlantic market again they would have to build an expensive Ocean Liner and since Celebrity is owned by Royal Caribbean International who would probably not want to enter the transatlantic market knowing that the transatlantic market can only support one Ship and that Ship is the Queen Mary 2. Regards,Jerry

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I am sure QM2 will remain the flagship no mater what. I always opted for Queen Alexandera- nice name- and it matches well with the other Queen Consorts. The would not built a 4th Queen if Cunard did not see the need for another ship! However the name will not stated before hand- of that im quite sure- so we have a few more years to speculate!

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But they are doing less transatlantic runs the last couple of years aren't they? So if they are constantly sailing full why do less runs when they are only game in town? I may be wrong but the QM 2 never used to do runs to the Fjords or the Baltic states did it? But this year it has.

 

You have to consider for whatever reason no other company has tried to take cunard on on direct transatlantic crossings have they? What would have happen if Holland America decide to attempt to return to their former glory of Amsterdam to New York crossings and if Celebrity whose luxury and levels of service blow cunard away so I have been informed and are widely considered the top in the industry what would happen then?

I think the above posters have explained the reasons quite well; I’d add though that in order to have the ship’s sailing full (not just transatlantic on QM2 but all cruises on all ships) Cunard are having to make little cuts and cost savings to keep the prices somewhat deflated from what you’d have paid on QE2 in that era - this is likely another reason they won’t add a second liner as the extra sailings to fill would create even more downward pressure on prices to keep the ships full. My guess as to why despite this, they are adding a further cruise ship is that they will deploy it (or one of the existing ships) to a new market once it is in service - they are already using Queen Elizabeth for Alaska cruises, maybe that could be developed further, or maybe they will base a ship in Australia where Cunard enjoys a similarly high mindshare to the U.K. and where cruising is becoming a very popular choice of holiday. What we likely won’t see is more of the same

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I think the above posters have explained the reasons quite well; I’d add though that in order to have the ship’s sailing full (not just transatlantic on QM2 but all cruises on all ships) Cunard are having to make little cuts and cost savings to keep the prices somewhat deflated from what you’d have paid on QE2 in that era - this is likely another reason they won’t add a second liner as the extra sailings to fill would create even more downward pressure on prices to keep the ships full. My guess as to why despite this, they are adding a further cruise ship is that they will deploy it (or one of the existing ships) to a new market once it is in service - they are already using Queen Elizabeth for Alaska cruises, maybe that could be developed further, or maybe they will base a ship in Australia where Cunard enjoys a similarly high mindshare to the U.K. and where cruising is becoming a very popular choice of holiday. What we likely won’t see is more of the same

 

I can see the 4th ship doing transatlantic crossing during the time period of the Queen Mary 2 world cruise or maybe the Victoria doing transatlantic sailings and the new ship doing a world cruise with 3 ships doing world cruise.

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This conversation sparked my curiosity to learn how many transatlantic crossings QM2 has done (and will be doing) each year. Here is the count I have come up with after examining her past itineraries and brochures showing her schedule for the next couple years.

 

QM2 Crossings Per Year

2004 = 15

2005 = 26

2006 = 20

2007 = 23

2008 = 24

2009 = 23

2010 = 21

2011 = 21

2012 = 20

2013 = 18

2014 = 18

2015 = 22

2016 = 21

2017 = 24

2018 = 24

2019 = 24*

 

* The count for 2019 includes a westbound crossing in December prior to the Christmas cruise which has not yet been announced.

 

Regards, John

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Thanks John, I was hoping someone would have the patience/information to be able to answer the question, I should have known it would be you !

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I can see the 4th ship doing transatlantic crossing during the time period of the Queen Mary 2 world cruise or maybe the Victoria doing transatlantic sailings and the new ship doing a world cruise with 3 ships doing world cruise.

I’d imagine if they wanted to extend the transatlantic season they’d take the time off QM2’s world cruise - why go to the expense of building a dedicated liner and then not use her for Atlantic crossings? Especially as those crossings would be in the stormier winter where her better seakeeping abilities would be put to most use! The QV and QE do crossings now only as a part of a larger cruise route that requires it, they don’t go across to New York and turn around and come back again.

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I’d imagine if they wanted to extend the transatlantic season they’d take the time off QM2’s world cruise - why go to the expense of building a dedicated liner and then not use her for Atlantic crossings? Especially as those crossings would be in the stormier winter where her better seakeeping abilities would be put to most use! The QV and QE do crossings now only as a part of a larger cruise route that requires it, they don’t go across to New York and turn around and come back again.

 

The 4th vessel will be the second largest in the fleet larger than the Elizabeth and Victoria but smaller than the Mary. We will wait to see their move. There are any number of ways it could go.

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The entire world will be her oyster.

 

I think the obvious choice will be Queen Anne.

 

I'm guessing Queen Camila is not timely.

 

Dark horse candidate is Queen Eleanor (of Aquitaine).

 

Most creative candidate is Queen Eadgifu (c904–after 966)

 

They could go in another direction: Queen of Anglia, Queen of Australia, Queen of India, Queen of Britannia, Queen of Canada, Queen of the Seas, my personal favorite, Queen of Boaty McBoatface, you get the idea.

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Queen Anne is a good name though sad to say the queen will probably be dead by then so that might open up another couple of possibilities

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QEII will be gone by 2022? Not if she takes after her mother! Otherwise, I like Berengaria. Of course the original was actually, first, the German Imperator (but you all know that). Frankly, I think the proposed external design for this ship is cruise ship / apartment block hideous. Just stick a Carnivore or HAL funnel on it!

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Hello,

i also think Queen Anne will be the name. But what about

 

"Princess Diana" ....at least it ends with an "a" ;)

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Hello,

i also think Queen Anne will be the name. But what about

 

"Princess Diana" ....at least it ends with an "a" ;)

 

Cunarders traditionally ended IA and it might get confused with being a Princess ship.

 

 

Queen Charlotte has a nice ring to it,

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"Branding? Bah!"

I have to say probably Carnival’s biggest success with Cunard is in this area, both in terms of re standardising the black and white livery with traditional black and red funnel, and (in particular) in onboard experience. It must have been very odd when you could book a cruise on QE2, Vistafjord/ Sagafjord, Princess/ Countess, or royal viking sun and in each case be sailing with ‘Cunard’ but have a completely different experience with each! And particularly as the Internet wasn’t available to offer the info you were looking for and it was brochure/ word of mouth only...

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Sorry fellow cruise critics, I cannot cope with emotions...

 

I followed the link in the original post.....

And found this....

 

cunard-new-ship-1.jpg?w=680&ssl=1

 

 

It's a shame for the Brand #1 at sea if this is what the new Cunard ship is going to be.

The HAL Koningsdam "platform" is easily recognizable in this block of flats.

Please, please no Queens' names next to this awful example of cruise industry degradation.

 

Name it Oliver Cromwell, or Francis Drake, or simply as is: Betrayal of Cunard.

 

Thanks god, we'll not see this ship under Cunard flag for at least four years..

 

P.S.

The new ship in one picture:

 

4scg1l.jpg

Edited by ronbe65

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Oh ronbe65 I am totaly and absolutley with you! I could life with the Top Heavy Bow, I could life with the ugly stern. I absolutley refuse to board this new Cunarder when there is no propper promenade deck! Queen with no view! Oliver Comwell- very matching- they guy who had done away with Monarchie - for short time anyway!

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Everyone seems to be overlooking a choice that was already used, albeit without the "Queen." Berengaria. Former Hamburg America liner Imperator. Named for the wife of Richard the Lionheart.

 

Sent from my XT1254 using Forums mobile app

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If they’re going to be stretching the Koningsdam design (which would be consistent with the cunarder being 113,000gt vs koningsdam’s 99,500gt) then I wonder if they might ditch at least one or two of the stack of cabin decks at the front as the extra length will allow them to include more cabins in the design anyway - they have repeatedly stressed this is only a preliminary rendering so far (and probably based on Koningsdam as the designs for the new cunarder don’t exist yet)

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Since 1066 England has had two Queen Marys, two Queen Elizabeths, one Victoria, one Anne plus a Jane and finally a Matilda as queens regent rather than Queens consort. Scotland has one Mary, Ireland none and Wales is a Principality so no kings or queens.

Weeding it down Jane was only queen for a 9 days and usurped the crown from Mary I anyway, Matilda could qualify because she did rule for a time when she was getting the better of King Stephen but ultimately Stephen won and the name Matildais a little suspect anyway as she also gets called Queen Maude.

That leaves Queen Anne she was the younger sister of Queen Mary II so it would be very apt to name the ship after her.

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Someone on another thread cleverly noted that the four forward suites on Deck 10 of QM2 are named: Queen Mary, Queen Victoria, Queen Elizabeth and Queen Anne.

 

Based on the fact the other three ship names already apply to vessels still used today, Queen Anne certainly does seem the likely choice based on this observation.

 

Until Camilla decides at the naming ceremony to name it after herself. It's happened before (Queen Mary thought herself England's most loved queen and so we got RMS Queen Mary instead of RMS Queen Victoria).

 

Queen Anne seems a very likely and worthy name.

 

Regarding Camilla Duchess of Cornwall at the time of their wedding in 2005, it was announced that upon the Prince of Wales’s accession to the throne, Camilla would take on the title of HRH The Princess Consort instead of the traditional title of HM The Queen. Primarily taken to quell the hostility to the couple, it was a message that went widely unchallenged by the then ambivalent press and public, with many asserting it to be the right move. Ten years on Clarence House’s position persists: Camilla will become Princess Consort, not Queen.

 

Time will tell.

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Takes a lot of squinting (and it causes terrible wrinkles don't you know) to imagine attaching some bona fide British Royal connection to an American-owned, Italian-built, mostly Filipino-crewed, Bermuda-registered cruise ship. So she may be named "Queen Something or Rather" but surely the days of trotting out the Royal Family to christen Cunarders is long passed.

 

The obvious name is... QUEEN OF BERMUDA

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