Impact of Change in COVID Testing Policy

[Kamfish642]

Just interested if there has been any significant COVID issues on cruises since Viking revised its COVID testing policy?  HAL is doing test cruises eliminating need for pre-COVID testing on 3 upcoming cruises in July on the Rotterdam leaving Amsterdam for Norwegian ports.

[sabrefan]

We disembarked from the Orion on June 22, 2022. We were aware that some crew members came down with Covid during our cruise. My wife tested positive for covid on June 29, 2022 when we were at home. We did spend 4 days in Homer, Alaska and 1 day in Anchorage after the cruise. I don’t believe my wife contracted covid on the ship. However, I observed about 10 to 15% of the passengers wearing masks in public spaces on the the ship. We did test negative in Vancouver before boarding the cruise. It is one thing to test before boarding but it would seem that if passengers were required to wear masks in public spaces while on board the probability of covid cases would be greatly reduced. Still hard to understand the fuzzy logic around pre boarding testing and  a voluntary use of masks on board. Yet, Viking still requires crew to wear masks. 

[sabrefan]

If masks do no good, why do surgeons wear them? The point that I made is a mask reduces the probability of getting the virus or disease. They do help.

[janetcbl]

A K95 mask will keep 95% of COVID viruses from reaching you according to various medical websites. A K95 means it was made in the US(?), a KN95 means it was made elsewhere but meets US standards. We are on a Viking ship; maybe 10-15% of the passengers are wearing masks; 100% of the crew are. 

[Heidi13]

4 hours ago, janetcbl said:

A K95 mask will keep 95% of COVID viruses from reaching you according to various medical websites. A K95 means it was made in the US(?), a KN95 means it was made elsewhere but meets US standards. We are on a Viking ship; maybe 10-15% of the passengers are wearing masks; 100% of the crew are. 

 

The ratings are only attainable when the mask creates an effective seal around the edges. This is the reason my crews had to be clean shaven and had to pass an annual fit test.

[hutch1994]

7 hours ago, janetcbl said:

A K95 mask will keep 95% of COVID viruses from reaching you according to various medical websites. A K95 means it was made in the US(?), a KN95 means it was made elsewhere but meets US standards. We are on a Viking ship; maybe 10-15% of the passengers are wearing masks; 100% of the crew are. 

And you have to feel sorry for the crew that are put in the awkward position of unmasked people  wanting to have their pictures taken with them.  

[OnTheJourney]

20 hours ago, sabrefan said:

However, I observed about 10 to 15% of the passengers wearing masks in public spaces on the the ship.

Probably about the same (or actually I'd say less) on the Chairman's cruise. 

 

20 hours ago, sabrefan said:

it would seem that if passengers were required to wear masks in public spaces while on board the probability of covid cases would be greatly reduced. Still hard to understand the fuzzy logic around pre boarding testing and  a voluntary use of masks on board.

 

Agree with both of these points. I couldn't understand the logic behind having to do daily PCR testing but yet not wear masks either onboard or ashore (with the exceptions of most of the shore excursion busses and in certain churches, etc.) You have loads of pax traipsing through those narrow streets in Europe crowded with people eating in those plentiful outdoor cafes. DW and I generally wore masks during those times. The whole shebang - effectiveness of masking / distancing and so forth is a debate that will probably continue on for years. 

[Gig Harbor Explorere]

We were on Viking Mars “Into the Midnight Sun” June 11-25. Testing stopped literally the day we boarded. We heard much coughing within days of boarding. There were leaked reports of dozens of positive PCR tests by the mid-point of the cruise. For every positive test, there were many people who simply went on about their business coughing and spreading virus. Although there was very little masking at the beginning of the cruise, many were masked by the end as what was going on around us was obvious. We believe that, conservatively, there were literally hundreds of Covid cases on our ship. Staff and entertainers steadily disappeared as we assume they were sick and isolated. At no time did Viking address the issue in any way. No resumption of testing, no required masking, no distancing on shore excursions, and no information of any sort. In fact, staff indicated they had been instructed not to speak about the obvious outbreak. Viking still has not acknowledged the outbreak, and still has not reintroduced more effective prevention and mitigation measures. Our disappointment at Viking’s failure to intervene was, and is, enormous. 

[hutch1994]

And the Viking social media influencers won't acknowledge the presence of covid outbreak on current cruises either.  They actually applaud the lack of mask wearing ordinance.

[Mpc524]

13 hours ago, Gig Harbor Explorere said:

We were on Viking Mars “Into the Midnight Sun” June 11-25. Testing stopped literally the day we boarded. We heard much coughing within days of boarding. There were leaked reports of dozens of positive PCR tests by the mid-point of the cruise. For every positive test, there were many people who simply went on about their business coughing and spreading virus. Although there was very little masking at the beginning of the cruise, many were masked by the end as what was going on around us was obvious. We believe that, conservatively, there were literally hundreds of Covid cases on our ship. Staff and entertainers steadily disappeared as we assume they were sick and isolated. At no time did Viking address the issue in any way. No resumption of testing, no required masking, no distancing on shore excursions, and no information of any sort. In fact, staff indicated they had been instructed not to speak about the obvious outbreak. Viking still has not acknowledged the outbreak, and still has not reintroduced more effective prevention and mitigation measures. Our disappointment at Viking’s failure to intervene was, and is, enormous. 

We were also on your cruise and agree that Covid was rapidly multiplying among guests and crew. Cruise director did acknowledge once that several of the entertainers were “in isolation”. Did you notice that officers and entertainers no longer ate at the cafe after a couple of days? And they canceled the Captains Farewell also. We did personally see several people taken off the ship at a couple of ports. There were, presumably, a number of quarantined on our floor as the Do Not Disturb signs never came off the doors and the nurse in her bright red scrubs was coming and going out of the rooms with those dreaded spit tubes….oh, and that heavy, phlegmy cough going around was scary, too! 

[wcGma]

Thank you for sharing your experiences. It sounds like you were able to avoid contacting the virus on the cruise and have returned home safely, thankfully. What measures did you take that you think helped you avoid the transmission that was occurring on your cruise? Did you go on the cruise shore excursions?  Eat in the Cafe? Did you notice problems with service due to staff shortages from crew illness?  It does appear that the attraction of what Viking promoted as having implemented a higher standard of Covid monitoring and concern for health has been abandoned.  While there was no guarantee of certainty with their prior program, this complete change and lack of transparency as to how these increased case are being handled is concerning. 

[Gig Harbor Explorere]

We started showing symptoms by the end of the cruise. Given the total situation, we did not bother to test until we left the ship. We could not possibly have unrung that bell. As a practical matter, there was no reliable way to avoid Covid on this cruise. We believe that any cruise line that wishes to avoid significant Covid outbreaks onboard must test everyone daily and strictly isolate positive cases. As your comment indicates, our disappointment with Viking was with the failure to follow their own protocols that had served them so well up to that time, and with abandoning their commitments to us without warning or notification. Prior to our cruise, Viking had repeatedly proudly stated that their excellent track record of avoiding Covid rested on their practice of daily testing and prompt isolation for all. It is inexplicable to us that Viking simply decided to pretend that Covid is over. Our disappointment at this breach of trust is enormous. 

[shadowlover]

6 hours ago, Gig Harbor Explorere said:

We started showing symptoms by the end of the cruise. Given the total situation, we did not bother to test until we left the ship. We could not possibly have unrung that bell. As a practical matter, there was no reliable way to avoid Covid on this cruise. We believe that any cruise line that wishes to avoid significant Covid outbreaks onboard must test everyone daily and strictly isolate positive cases. As your comment indicates, our disappointment with Viking was with the failure to follow their own protocols that had served them so well up to that time, and with abandoning their commitments to us without warning or notification. Prior to our cruise, Viking had repeatedly proudly stated that their excellent track record of avoiding Covid rested on their practice of daily testing and prompt isolation for all. It is inexplicable to us that Viking simply decided to pretend that Covid is over. Our disappointment at this breach of trust is enormous. 

I think Viking has stopped these practices because it is not sustainable anymore.  It's incredibly expensive, time consuming, anxiety producing and caused people to be quarantined when many of them simply had bad cold symptoms.   People were cancelling their cruises because of the possibility of this.  Can we please now stop beating this dead horse?!  Covid can be serious for some- so can other illnesses/ accidents etc.  Cruises are petri dishes because you are living in close contact with many others thus the noro virus outbreaks you see from time to time.  Traveling comes with all sorts of possible dangers.  I can attest to masking being very effective against contracting covid.  Keep wearing them especially if you are nervous about contracting covid.

[lackcreativity]

Our first cruise post pandemic cruise in April still had most of the  covid related measures in place. We were both willing and happy to comply.

 

However, I think that ship has sailed and there is no putting that horse back in the barn. (Do I get extra credit for two cliches in one sentence?)

 

Even on our cruise, there was limited but constant pushback against even common sense measures. Wearing masks on buses was required, but it seemed that on every excursion, there were a few who would not cooperate. Generally, those individuals would put their masks on to get past the Viking staff, and then remove them as soon as they were seated.

 

For better or worse, society at large seems to have decided that we are in the "just will have to live with it". Even here on Cruise Critic, we hear from those who wouldn't cruise when there were restrictions, and now some will make the opposite decision. 

 

We were grateful for the level of precautions when we sailed back in April. We don't cruise again until June 2023. I wonder where we will be at that point.

[Mpc524]

15 hours ago, wcGma said:

Thank you for sharing your experiences. It sounds like you were able to avoid contacting the virus on the cruise and have returned home safely, thankfully. What measures did you take that you think helped you avoid the transmission that was occurring on your cruise? Did you go on the cruise shore excursions?  Eat in the Cafe? Did you notice problems with service due to staff shortages from crew illness?  It does appear that the attraction of what Viking promoted as having implemented a higher standard of Covid monitoring and concern for health has been abandoned.  While there was no guarantee of certainty with their prior program, this complete change and lack of transparency as to how these increased case are being handled is concerning. 

We were diligent about wearing our masks from day 1. We do not cruise to meet other people, we go to enjoy each other’s company, so we really don’t mingle a lot with others. On buses and tenders, we sit in the back, which ends up being less crowded than the front. We ate at the cafe, but not with others. Once, at the restaurant we refused the table because it was wedged in between two other tables..they had no problem showing us another table that wasn’t elbow to elbow with other tables. Note that on day 1, we had about 10% wearing masks. By the end of the cruise, it was up to about 50-60%….word got around….

[rudychance]

Ugh, this thread is so depressing - we paid over 15K this year - oh, to go next year, partially use a Viking voucher for Empires of the Mediterranean. When the pandemic is over, (years?, good grief).  All of this testing,  masking nonsense is in place because of those who will not let go and obviously need to stay home for their piece of mind.  Why, oh why, do the minority alarmists not think most others are on expensive vacations 🤔 and would actually want to enjoy meeting people, enjoy ports, NOT wear masks, spit in tubes before 8 AM daily?  We'll lose the $, go to pool,  lake, great restaurants and have a much better time if restrictions go back.

[Mpc524]

3 hours ago, rudychance said:

Ugh, this thread is so depressing - we paid over 15K this year - oh, to go next year, partially use a Viking voucher for Empires of the Mediterranean. When the pandemic is over, (years?, good grief).  All of this testing,  masking nonsense is in place because of those who will not let go and obviously need to stay home for their piece of mind.  Why, oh why, do the minority alarmists not think most others are on expensive vacations 🤔 and would actually want to enjoy meeting people, enjoy ports, NOT wear masks, spit in tubes before 8 AM daily?  We'll lose the $, go to pool,  lake, great restaurants and have a much better time if restrictions go back.

Just because we wear wear masks and use our expensive cruises to have some couple time in this crazy, busy world, doesn’t make us “minority alarmists” nor mean we don’t enjoy our ports. We respectfully aren’t bothered if you don’t wear a mask, why should you care if we do? We have a fabulous time on every cruise we go on and come home rejuvenated and very satisfied that we were not one of the many quarantined in our cabin…now THAT would affect our good time! 🤣🤣

[Gig Harbor Explorere]

Rudy, although I have some trouble following your comment, you sound like the sort of fellow who would be very happy to cruise right now. By all means, go and have a ball! However, you seem to miss my essential point. Viking abruptly changed their successful Covid control protocols without warning or prior announcement. In fact, they were boasting about the effectiveness of their measures right up until the day we boarded. Transparency matters. Also, regarding the “masks will protect you” comment, we religiously wore masks prior to and during the cruise. We also maintained as much space from others as possible at all times. These measures were of no use given the large numbers of fellow passengers who couldn’t be bothered, and given the extreme amount of Covid all around us. We had been super careful, fully vexed, double boosted, and meticulously avoided Covid for two and a half years until we boarded our cruise.This pair of minority extremists paid for our expensive vacation too. We had been led to believe the protections we based our decision on would be there for us. We were misled. 

[OnTheJourney]

On 7/5/2022 at 9:23 PM, Gig Harbor Explorere said:

Our disappointment at Viking’s failure to intervene was, and is, enormous. 

Yikes. Somehow much of what you report is rather incongruous with Torstein's previous commitment to such extensive covid protocols. Sounds like it (elimination of testing) has been a move in the opposite direction. Maybe we'll still wind up canceling our January cruise. Most ironic that we planned to cancel it if the PCR tests were still taking place, but now might cancel due to the lack of testing, i.e. increased cases. Oh well....still a considerable way off yet. 

 

49 minutes ago, Gig Harbor Explorere said:

Viking abruptly changed their successful Covid control protocols without warning or prior announcement.

Not really true. Tor's latest video on viking.tv alludes to the change in protocol. 

 

4 hours ago, rudychance said:

All of this testing,  masking nonsense is in place because of those who will not let go and obviously need to stay home for their piece of mind. 

Seriously? 

Edited July 8, 2022 by AnyWayIsGood

[Gig Harbor Explorere]

We boarded June 11. Viking’s change of policy was effective that day. We were not notified in any way prior to boarding. Indeed, it is the incongruity with Viking’s many statements prior to our boarding that we find so disturbing. We knew there were risks in traveling, but we relied strongly on the measures Viking had so effectively out in place. If we had had even a few days’ notice before the change, we certainly would have canceled. In retrospect, we should have walked off the boat the minute we learned of the change, and demanded a full refund. 

[OnTheJourney]

1 hour ago, Mpc524 said:

very satisfied that we were not one of the many quarantined in our cabin…now THAT would affect our good time

Amen to that. At that point I really would rather be at home, but not for the reason that Rudy is referring to. This 'if you're worried about getting sick then maybe you should just stay home and let us (non-maskers) go out and have a good time' mentality got old real quick as the pandemic started to come along. "Let them die and decrease the surplus population". 

[OnTheJourney]

8 minutes ago, Gig Harbor Explorere said:

In retrospect, we should have walked off the boat the minute we learned of the change, and demanded a full refund. 

No, I can't say that we would have felt that way, but surely can understand your position if you only decided to cruise based on the expected protocol. We came at it from a different angle - not being pleased about the daily PCR testing for various reasons, so had it been announced that we no longer had to do it, we would have been happy enough. Did a cruise back in March (not Viking) that only required pre-cruise testing - nothing at all onboard - and very honestly it felt more relaxing. True that masking was sparse, but so was it on the Viking Chairman's cruise this past May. It made NO sense to me to require all that testing and yet masking was optional. The constant testing just made us think TOO much about covid and thus always wondering...will we wind up positive one of these days?

 

Oh my...this debate on both sides of the fence will just go on and on. Guess the "good old days" of cruising are probably a thing of the past. Travel will likely never be the same at least for the foreseeable future. IF another variant comes along (and it surely will) that is even more vaccine-resistant, watch the protocol be reinstated. People have had enough...so at some point it could affect the number of people signing up for cruises especially if other cruise lines do not increase their currently relaxed protocols as well. Who knows....

Edited July 8, 2022 by AnyWayIsGood

[Heidi13]

3 hours ago, Gig Harbor Explorere said:

Rudy, although I have some trouble following your comment, you sound like the sort of fellow who would be very happy to cruise right now. By all means, go and have a ball! However, you seem to miss my essential point. Viking abruptly changed their successful Covid control protocols without warning or prior announcement. In fact, they were boasting about the effectiveness of their measures right up until the day we boarded. Transparency matters. Also, regarding the “masks will protect you” comment, we religiously wore masks prior to and during the cruise. We also maintained as much space from others as possible at all times. These measures were of no use given the large numbers of fellow passengers who couldn’t be bothered, and given the extreme amount of Covid all around us. We had been super careful, fully vexed, double boosted, and meticulously avoided Covid for two and a half years until we boarded our cruise.This pair of minority extremists paid for our expensive vacation too. We had been led to believe the protections we based our decision on would be there for us. We were misled. 

 

So true.

 

Having spent a couple of months on a Viking ship during the onset of COVID, I can attest that Viking did take the health & safety of pax seriously. This was reinforced with their policy developed and promulgated in December 2020, when they were the only cruise line to implement daily testing and other safety measures. These were based on science and provided a quantifiable standard of virus load aboard each ship. No other cruise line provided the same level of information and consequently health & safety.

 

Unfortunately, with the combination of the complaints about masking and daily testing, the vocal minority and using the recent US CDC decision, Viking opted to rescind their best-in-class health and safety procedures. Unfortunately, COVID hasn't gone away and having spent over 35 years at sea on passenger ships, I am not surprised when reading the reports of the coughing on recent cruises. Yes, what we used to call "Cruz Crud", is probably now COVID.

 

Yes, the latest COVID variants may not kill as many people as the initial variants, but it still is dangerous for many older people, regardless of vaccine status. From experience, most Viking pax are 60+, which is the start of the higher risk categories.

 

Noro is another infectious disease prevalent on cruise ships, but they have no way of conducting daily testing, so you must wait for symptoms to develop. Having experienced a cruise with well over 50% of the pax infected, the implications of the local authorities are completely unpredictable. I, for one, cannot comprehend why, with reliable non-invasive testing available, that anyone would complain about preventing the spread of an infectious disease, to not only their fellow passengers, but also the hard-working crew, who strive to meet their every need. Having worked on ships, I can assure you there is nothing worse than being sick and confined to quarters. BTW - the crew don't have nice balcony cabins, they are stuck in a tiny inside cabin.

 

I also posted previously that in my experience, many pax, who have a contagious disease do not report to the medical centre for treatment and the resultant quarantine, instead relying on over-the-counter medications to mask symptoms, so they can continue enjoying their expensive holiday. Based on reports, this is clearly the case.

 

Well, we have just cancelled 2 cruises comprising 165-days and while the primary reason was a medical issue, I can assure you that having spent 4 or 5 months on ships for many years, the lack of testing was definitely a concern before we cancelled. At least when I worked on the ships, when in "Red" zone we had minimal to no contact with pax.

[DGHOC]

I'm sorry to read that you've had to postpone your upcoming trips Andy. I send all good wishes to you and your wife.

Thanks once again for exhibiting the common sense that is your trademark. Some of these halfwitted, non scientific, ill-considered posts make me despair. I think it's often that the keyboard is engaged before the brain.

Think I'll give CC a miss for a while.

[CurlerRob]

8 hours ago, Heidi13 said:

Noro is another infectious disease prevalent on cruise ships, but they have no way of conducting daily testing, so you must wait for symptoms to develop.

Sorry to hear of your cancellations, Andy - it's only fitting for you to touch some of the spots you missed in 2020!

 

Your post reminded me of an interesting side issue. There actually is testing for Noro - it's the very same PCR technology used for COVID. While lab testing is not the norm for pax with Noro (any competent medical professional can diagnose it from the symptoms), it's been used for many years to confirm the source of an outbreak.

 

Norovirus Laboratory Diagnosis | CDC

 

When Viking implemented their on-board labs, I wondered if they would be serving a dual purpose over time, however, that speculation appears wrong. One of the things I do wish for is the inclusion of COVID reporting in the CDC VSP - having also experienced a large Noro outbreak, we use that data as a consideration for our travel choices. 🍺🥌