I thought I wouldn't miss 2x a day room cleaning... I was wrong.

[Ret MP]

8 hours ago, BND said:

They weren't.  Usually it's every 3-4 days at most.

I do remember the days at both hotels and on cruises the sheets were, in fact, changed daily (I remember having to put a sheet of paper or disk on your bed if you wanted to have you sheets changed.  Also, even after they changed to every other day, you could still request to have them changed daily.  But, my point or premise is, if we had twice-a-day service, you have a better chance of getting towels and sheets changed after having a nap (perspiring) or other noon activities.  Also, the ship has changed and gotten bigger, bigger means more occupancy, more revenue, and a larger margin.  To go back to the 40s, 50s, and/or 60s and look at the cost of cruising is like comparing apples to oranges.  Back in the day, many of us couldn't afford to cruise in Steerage Class.  I think we are all talking about last year's, the year before that, the year before that, you know in this Century.  

[Dizzly]

I’ve been cruising with Royal for a few decades now, and have definitely seen the “death by a thousand service cuts” while prices slowly rose. I agree that any one single “minor” (to me) service cut most likely won’t cause me to switch cruise lines, but it certainly leaves me less loyal to Royal and makes me more likely to explore other vacation/cruise options. And yes, given a forum, I’ll mildly complain about the missing services too.

 

Growing up, my family were never big spenders, so a cruise vacation was a splurge. We were inside cabin all the way, never saw a window cabin till my honeymoon. My father, who controlled the purse strings, was adamant that he would pay no more than $100pp/per day for that inside cabin, and I’m not talking a cheaper transatlantic either. Just a regular 4-7 night out of some Florida port.

 

For that $100pp/per night, we had fine dining in the main dining room (don’t even remember extra-$ restaurants, but if they existed we certainly would not have visited them. Midnight buffets every evening with one special Chocolate midnight buffet each cruise. Twice a day cabin service with turndown, a cruise compass delivered without having to specifically request it, and chocolates on every pillow. Drink of the day being hawked on the pool deck right to your lounger if you wanted to pay, after dinner shots in souvenir glasses brought around the dining room each night (also for $$). We didn’t have water slides, flowriders, rock walls, etc. back then, but there was plenty to do on-board for free. And that’s just a small example of what used to be available to all, regardless of C&A or Suite status.

 

As for me, I miss what was lost in the little cuts. I’m still cruising on Royal when the itinerary and price are good, but I’ve also gone on other lines as well. As different lines come to my home port, I’ll branch out further and see who offers me the best cruise value for my $$.

[mac_tlc]

1 hour ago, Dizzly said:

I’ve been cruising with Royal for a few decades now, and have definitely seen the “death by a thousand service cuts” while prices slowly rose. I agree that any one single “minor” (to me) service cut most likely won’t cause me to switch cruise lines, but it certainly leaves me less loyal to Royal and makes me more likely to explore other vacation/cruise options. And yes, given a forum, I’ll mildly complain about the missing services too.

 

Growing up, my family were never big spenders, so a cruise vacation was a splurge. We were inside cabin all the way, never saw a window cabin till my honeymoon. My father, who controlled the purse strings, was adamant that he would pay no more than $100pp/per day for that inside cabin, and I’m not talking a cheaper transatlantic either. Just a regular 4-7 night out of some Florida port.

 

For that $100pp/per night, we had fine dining in the main dining room (don’t even remember extra-$ restaurants, but if they existed we certainly would not have visited them. Midnight buffets every evening with one special Chocolate midnight buffet each cruise. Twice a day cabin service with turndown, a cruise compass delivered without having to specifically request it, and chocolates on every pillow. Drink of the day being hawked on the pool deck right to your lounger if you wanted to pay, after dinner shots in souvenir glasses brought around the dining room each night (also for $$). We didn’t have water slides, flowriders, rock walls, etc. back then, but there was plenty to do on-board for free. And that’s just a small example of what used to be available to all, regardless of C&A or Suite status.

 

As for me, I miss what was lost in the little cuts. I’m still cruising on Royal when the itinerary and price are good, but I’ve also gone on other lines as well. As different lines come to my home port, I’ll branch out further and see who offers me the best cruise value for my $$.

That is a fabulous post and mirrors our feelings. As a matter of fact, my DW and I were just talking about the “thousand cuts” when I read your post. We find ourselves questioning the value proposition. Our future cruises, except one, were booked a while ago when the prices were a lot lower. Still, Royal and X can, and will, make changes that impact already booked cruises. 
 

I think we will be trying MSC YC, and maybe Oceania and Viking. 
 

mac_tlc

[Loracpin2]

10 hours ago, Dizzly said:

I’ve been cruising with Royal for a few decades now, and have definitely seen the “death by a thousand service cuts” while prices slowly rose. I agree that any one single “minor” (to me) service cut most likely won’t cause me to switch cruise lines, but it certainly leaves me less loyal to Royal and makes me more likely to explore other vacation/cruise options. And yes, given a forum, I’ll mildly complain about the missing services too.

 

Growing up, my family were never big spenders, so a cruise vacation was a splurge. We were inside cabin all the way, never saw a window cabin till my honeymoon. My father, who controlled the purse strings, was adamant that he would pay no more than $100pp/per day for that inside cabin, and I’m not talking a cheaper transatlantic either. Just a regular 4-7 night out of some Florida port.

 

For that $100pp/per night, we had fine dining in the main dining room (don’t even remember extra-$ restaurants, but if they existed we certainly would not have visited them. Midnight buffets every evening with one special Chocolate midnight buffet each cruise. Twice a day cabin service with turndown, a cruise compass delivered without having to specifically request it, and chocolates on every pillow. Drink of the day being hawked on the pool deck right to your lounger if you wanted to pay, after dinner shots in souvenir glasses brought around the dining room each night (also for $$). We didn’t have water slides, flowriders, rock walls, etc. back then, but there was plenty to do on-board for free. And that’s just a small example of what used to be available to all, regardless of C&A or Suite status.

 

As for me, I miss what was lost in the little cuts. I’m still cruising on Royal when the itinerary and price are good, but I’ve also gone on other lines as well. As different lines come to my home port, I’ll branch out further and see who offers me the best cruise value for my $$.

 BRAVO!!!! 

[Morecruisesplz]

14 hours ago, Dizzly said:

I’ve been cruising with Royal for a few decades now, and have definitely seen the “death by a thousand service cuts” while prices slowly rose. I agree that any one single “minor” (to me) service cut most likely won’t cause me to switch cruise lines, but it certainly leaves me less loyal to Royal and makes me more likely to explore other vacation/cruise options. And yes, given a forum, I’ll mildly complain about the missing services too.

 

Growing up, my family were never big spenders, so a cruise vacation was a splurge. We were inside cabin all the way, never saw a window cabin till my honeymoon. My father, who controlled the purse strings, was adamant that he would pay no more than $100pp/per day for that inside cabin, and I’m not talking a cheaper transatlantic either. Just a regular 4-7 night out of some Florida port.

 

For that $100pp/per night, we had fine dining in the main dining room (don’t even remember extra-$ restaurants, but if they existed we certainly would not have visited them. Midnight buffets every evening with one special Chocolate midnight buffet each cruise. Twice a day cabin service with turndown, a cruise compass delivered without having to specifically request it, and chocolates on every pillow. Drink of the day being hawked on the pool deck right to your lounger if you wanted to pay, after dinner shots in souvenir glasses brought around the dining room each night (also for $$). We didn’t have water slides, flowriders, rock walls, etc. back then, but there was plenty to do on-board for free. And that’s just a small example of what used to be available to all, regardless of C&A or Suite status.

 

As for me, I miss what was lost in the little cuts. I’m still cruising on Royal when the itinerary and price are good, but I’ve also gone on other lines as well. As different lines come to my home port, I’ll branch out further and see who offers me the best cruise value for my $$.

Exactly!

[Morecruisesplz]

12 hours ago, mac_tlc said:

That is a fabulous post and mirrors our feelings. As a matter of fact, my DW and I were just talking about the “thousand cuts” when I read your post. We find ourselves questioning the value proposition. Our future cruises, except one, were booked a while ago when the prices were a lot lower. Still, Royal and X can, and will, make changes that impact already booked cruises. 
 

I think we will be trying MSC YC, and maybe Oceania and Viking. 
 

mac_tlc

We tried MSC and really liked it. No Yacht Club. Bella was great.

Will try Virgin in December just to see.

[Tatka]

  I don’t know … things change. Everything cannot stay the same as it was 20-30-40 years ago. Some things went away, but some arrived. I love nostalgia … but cruising is much more available now than it was in 80-es. Ships offer much more. Much more than is lost. 
 

Remember … that even though much more was included, but much more exists on ships and is still available. Additional dining? You aren’t required to use it, but your vacation is cheaper if cruise lines get additional profit from it. I’m not bothered at all by the fact that other people use it. It’s their priorities.

 

Chocolate on pillow … nice touch, but in some reason I don’t miss it one but. So much food is available on every ship. I think HAL still does it, but I won’t switch because of that.

 

Tons of free things and activities are on ships. Just because lines introduce something per fee is ok in my book. I’d rather sail 5 times a year without mortgaging my house than have everything included for high price. I’d pick what I need from everything offered 

[mac_tlc]

6 hours ago, Tatka said:

  I don’t know … things change. Everything cannot stay the same as it was 20-30-40 years ago. Some things went away, but some arrived. I love nostalgia … but cruising is much more available now than it was in 80-es. Ships offer much more. Much more than is lost. 
 

Remember … that even though much more was included, but much more exists on ships and is still available. Additional dining? You aren’t required to use it, but your vacation is cheaper if cruise lines get additional profit from it. I’m not bothered at all by the fact that other people use it. It’s their priorities.

 

Chocolate on pillow … nice touch, but in some reason I don’t miss it one but. So much food is available on every ship. I think HAL still does it, but I won’t switch because of that.

 

Tons of free things and activities are on ships. Just because lines introduce something per fee is ok in my book. I’d rather sail 5 times a year without mortgaging my house than have everything included for high price. I’d pick what I need from everything offered 

I just want what I booked 18 months ago, not 18 years ago. 
 

mac_tlc

[Tatka]

47 minutes ago, mac_tlc said:

I just want what I booked 18 months ago, not 18 years ago. 
 

mac_tlc

I thought I’d miss it too, but I didn’t.

I hope you didn’t book cruise because of two services per day. We cruised about 8-9 times in last 18 months and haven’t noticed any downgrades with 1 service a day.

 

[LobsterStalker]

7 hours ago, Tatka said:

  I don’t know … things change. Everything cannot stay the same as it was 20-30-40 years ago. Some things went away, but some arrived. I love nostalgia … but cruising is much more available now than it was in 80-es. Ships offer much more. Much more than is lost. 
 

Remember … that even though much more was included, but much more exists on ships and is still available. Additional dining? You aren’t required to use it, but your vacation is cheaper if cruise lines get additional profit from it. I’m not bothered at all by the fact that other people use it. It’s their priorities.

 

Chocolate on pillow … nice touch, but in some reason I don’t miss it one but. So much food is available on every ship. I think HAL still does it, but I won’t switch because of that.

 

Tons of free things and activities are on ships. Just because lines introduce something per fee is ok in my book. I’d rather sail 5 times a year without mortgaging my house than have everything included for high price. I’d pick what I need from everything offered 

I don't believe that is necessarily true . The cruiseline could also be experiencing higher profit margin from this. It's not like they have to return extra money to the cruiser when their end goal is returns for the stakeholders....?

JMHO

[S.A.M.J.R.]

1 hour ago, mac_tlc said:

I just want what I booked 18 months ago, not 18 years ago. 
 

mac_tlc

Have you tried calling Royal and saying you want to cancel with a full refund because they've significantly changed what you were looking for?  

 

 

[S.A.M.J.R.]

1 minute ago, LobsterStalker said:

I don't believe that is necessarily true . The cruiseline could also be experiencing higher profit margin from this. It's not like they have to return extra money to the cruiser when their end goal is returns for the stakeholders....?

JMHO

Saw these articles last night... 

https://www.thestreet.com/travel/royal-caribbean-bad-news-for-customers-good-for-disney

 

https://fortune.com/2023/07/29/royal-caribbean-earnings-profit-pandemic-recovery-revenge-spending-travel/

 

So expect prices to go even higher. 

[mac_tlc]

14 minutes ago, S.A.M.J.R. said:

Have you tried calling Royal and saying you want to cancel with a full refund because they've significantly changed what you were looking for?  

 

 

Our first experience with the cutback was last month in Jewel of the Seas. Our only other upcoming Royal cruise is next week on Oasis, and that’s the annual family bonanza with the kids and grandkids. Most important thing for that is that everyone is together.

 

For the first time in 20ish years, we have no other Royal cruises on the books, and barring a unique itinerary I don’t foresee any others unless things change, which is about as likely as me winning Powerball without buying a ticket. 
 

 

mac_tlc

[mac_tlc]

24 minutes ago, Tatka said:

I thought I’d miss it too, but I didn’t.

I hope you didn’t book cruise because of two services per day. We cruised about 8-9 times in last 18 months and haven’t noticed any downgrades with 1 service a day.

 

That’s the insidious nature of these individual cuts: no one is a make or break but in total they lessen  the experience and, for us, have us questioning the value. 
 

mac_tlc

[Tatka]

30 minutes ago, mac_tlc said:

That’s the insidious nature of these individual cuts: no one is a make or break but in total they lessen  the experience and, for us, have us questioning the value. 
 

mac_tlc

Honestly after cruising from restart after pandemic and knowing what is going on in the world I’m honestly amazed RCI survived and provides experience it does.

 

If you love cruising you would too. Cuts are minor in comparison. If they diminish your experience that much imagine you have no cruising at all. RCCL lost about $21 billions. They continued losing money up to the fourth quarter of 2022.

 

Changes are not done to make you unhappy. Somehow people notice inflation and other issues on land, but cruise lines in their mind exist in different universe and must adjust so you won’t notice. 
 

I prefer to have cruses with minor cuts, but multiple and affordable. By the way while cruising was not available we (being hungry for real vacations, not camping or Myrtle beach) had several vacations in all inclusive resorts. Nice ones. If you think there are no changes there … you would be in for surprise. 

Edited July 30, 2023 by Tatka

[Tatka]

52 minutes ago, LobsterStalker said:

I don't believe that is necessarily true . The cruiseline could also be experiencing higher profit margin from this. It's not like they have to return extra money to the cruiser when their end goal is returns for the stakeholders....?

JMHO

They lost $21 billion, so we are talking about getting some losses back. They are private businesses, and for the most part foreign businesses so they don’t get assistance from government for their losses.

[Mum2Mercury]

On 7/29/2023 at 9:00 AM, Dizzly said:

I’ve been cruising with Royal for a few decades now, and have definitely seen the “death by a thousand service cuts” while prices slowly rose. I agree that any one single “minor” (to me) service cut most likely won’t cause me to switch cruise lines, but it certainly leaves me less loyal to Royal and makes me more likely to explore other vacation/cruise options. And yes, given a forum, I’ll mildly complain about the missing services too.

Well said, especially the portion I highlighted.  

[Tatka]

I was never loyal to Royal, so I watched 8 lines for several decades to realize nothing is perfect. Even though we sail almost exclusively with RCI now due to many advantages. (variety of ships and itineraries they do not far from us) , they all have cuts. Many have similar cuts. Not because they suddenly became greedy. 

[mac_tlc]

1 hour ago, Tatka said:

Honestly after cruising from restart after pandemic and knowing what is going on in the world I’m honestly amazed RCI survived and provides experience it does.

 

If you love cruising you would too. Cuts are minor in comparison. If they diminish your experience that much imagine you have no cruising at all. RCCL lost about $21 billions. They continued losing money up to the fourth quarter of 2022.

 

Changes are not done to make you unhappy. Somehow people notice inflation and other issues on land, but cruise lines in their mind exist in different universe and must adjust so you won’t notice. 
 

I prefer to have cruses with minor cuts, but multiple and affordable. By the way while cruising was not available we (being hungry for real vacations, not camping or Myrtle beach) had several vacations in all inclusive resorts. Nice ones. If you think there are no changes there … you would be in for surprise. 

There is nothing personal here, just business. They have to do what they have to do, so do I. At some point the value proposition isn’t there. As we have gotten older and are retired, we have fortunately been able to sail in a suite when it’s just the two of us. 
 

There suite prices have increased far above inflation and are outside our “value zone”. 
 

I understand the business dynamics and as a customer, I will look elsewhere. They won’t miss us, there are a line of folks ready to replace us. That’s OK too. 
 

mac_tlc

[Loracpin2]

On 7/29/2023 at 10:24 AM, mac_tlc said:

That is a fabulous post and mirrors our feelings. As a matter of fact, my DW and I were just talking about the “thousand cuts” when I read your post. We find ourselves questioning the value proposition. Our future cruises, except one, were booked a while ago when the prices were a lot lower. Still, Royal and X can, and will, make changes that impact already booked cruises. 
 

I think we will be trying MSC YC, and maybe Oceania and Viking. 
 

mac_tlc

You will definitely like Oceania!

[mac_tlc]

3 minutes ago, Loracpin2 said:

You will definitely like Oceania!

Very close to booking Vista for either a TA or Panama Canal for 2025. 

[Seville2Cabo]

51 minutes ago, mac_tlc said:

There is nothing personal here, just business. They have to do what they have to do, so do I. At some point the value proposition isn’t there. As we have gotten older and are retired, we have fortunately been able to sail in a suite when it’s just the two of us. 
 

There suite prices have increased far above inflation and are outside our “value zone”. 
 

I understand the business dynamics and as a customer, I will look elsewhere. They won’t miss us, there are a line of folks ready to replace us. That’s OK too. 
 

mac_tlc

Royal thinks they are behind in the value versus land vacations.

 

https://www.travelweekly.com/Cruise-Travel/Price-gap-resorts-versus-cruises

 

[Seville2Cabo]

38 minutes ago, mac_tlc said:

Very close to booking Vista for either a TA or Panama Canal for 2025. 

We keep looking at Oceana and Viking and every time for a similar itinerary with Royal, they are at least twice the cost.  Trying to figure if the extra service an amenities is worth the extra cost.

[Tatka]

1 hour ago, mac_tlc said:

There is nothing personal here, just business. They have to do what they have to do, so do I. At some point the value proposition isn’t there. As we have gotten older and are retired, we have fortunately been able to sail in a suite when it’s just the two of us. 
 

There suite prices have increased far above inflation and are outside our “value zone”. 
 

I understand the business dynamics and as a customer, I will look elsewhere. They won’t miss us, there are a line of folks ready to replace us. That’s OK too. 
 

mac_tlc

Wait a second, so you are sailing in suites?
Suites get service twice a day.

 

Other changes do not apply to suites too

[mac_tlc]

14 minutes ago, Tatka said:

Wait a second, so you are sailing in suites?
Suites get service twice a day.

 

Other changes do not apply to suites too

Not always. Especially with the recent high prices. Our Royal suite experience was on cruises that were booked before the current price increases and service changes. 

 

Last month on Jewel we had a regular balcony, and next week in Oasis we will too.  
 

There have been changes that affect every cabin category differently. Deposit amounts,  on board booking changes, menus, price, stateroom service, buffet offerings ……….

 

 

mac_tlc