Oil prices tumble; gas falls to 2004 levels

[Sue L]

I dont think there are issues with the changes to the fuel surcharge for 2009 and going forward. My comments relate solely to right now today through the end of December. If they are starting in January, I dont understand why it would be so difficult to do something for December 2008 cruisings. Even if it it just a 50% consideration. That is all I am saying. Jeez - who knew this would be such a hot topic. I would think the customers would all be on the same side.....

 

 

If this had happened more midyear then you would have seen a 2008 date. January is a new year so it won't show in the last quarter profits which are already in the tank. I would rather pay the small fee and have them not cut any services then to have them make cutbacks to appease those sailing in 2008. I just paid 240$ fuel surcharge for my Sept cruise.

[Dive Master]

They would be wise to give OBC on any cruise that is saling after December 1, 2008. Failure of RCCL to do so will cause some consumer issues and I am sure they don't want that as earlier in the year I read about a class action suit dealing with some ship and the winner in any class action is not the Cruise ship or the consumer but the Trial attorney.

 

So Hopefully RCCL will be consumer oriented and deal wih the issue as its about customer satisfaction and creating Wow Moment!

 

 

RCCL sure created a "WOW Moment" for us last November when they instigated their new unilateral contract and fuel surcharges.Consumer satisfaction did not seem to be much of a priority at that time.The C &A Rep and the Resolutions Dept said :" You can sign the new contract and pay the price increase (fuel surcharge) or Wow--you can't cruise."I don't much like ultimatums and broken promises, so I had a "WOW Moment" and told RCCL to take their crown, anchor, and cruise and stick them up their smokestack!!!! I would urge you not to hold your breath waiting for the consumer oriented :Wow Moment".

[cruiserbryce]

paid $1.88 today:Dthought I was in heaven for a second

[land lover]

2.16 today in Orange County, CA

[gbcruise]

Our final payment is Dec 27th for our March 14th cruise. We currently owe almost $200 in fuel surcharges. What I dont understand is if Royal determines on Dec 18th that this quarters sailings will receive OBC, why on Dec 27th am I paying it to them only to have it converted as OBC? I already having several hundred in OBC & really wont need all of that as we dont spend much on board. This just doesnt make sense to me.

[Sue L]

Our final payment is Dec 27th for our March 14th cruise. We currently owe almost $200 in fuel surcharges. What I dont understand is if Royal determines on Dec 18th that this quarters sailings will receive OBC, why on Dec 27th am I paying it to them only to have it converted as OBC? I already having several hundred in OBC & really wont need all of that as we dont spend much on board. This just doesnt make sense to me.

 

 

 

that is the way the computer is set up to deal with it. Go to the purser and cash out some of the OBC at the beginning of the cruise. If you go to the casino you will be charged 3%

[Merion_Mom]

Look, I would love to get the $40 back on my Majesty cruise in 12 days.

 

The fact of the matter is, they didn't start CHARGING the fuel surcharge in the first place until well after the price per barrel had been sky high. They were paying with their hedged fuel contracts then.

 

Then that fuel was used, and their new contracts were at a much higher price.

 

There is never going to be price simultaneity. It's just the way that the business works.

 

RC was the last to institute fuel surcharges, was never the highest, and is one of the first (and least complicated) to refund.

 

Stop whining, or stop cruising.

[The Big Booper]

Just back from the TA Indy and a week in Fla. Gas is $1.75 in Joisey, yeeaaahh.

[popeye0429]

:oUpstate New York.. our area is still in the $2.35 range.. check this sight & just type in the zipcode for anywhere.. (try 51593 for a rude awakening):

 

http://gasprices.mapquest.com/searchresults.jsp?search=true&latitude=&longitude=&gasPriceType=3&address=&city=&stateProvince=&postalCode=14532&radius=10&brand=&sortOrder=2

[petesweet]

I dont think there are issues with the changes to the fuel surcharge for 2009 and going forward. My comments relate solely to right now today through the end of December. If they are starting in January, I dont understand why it would be so difficult to do something for December 2008 cruisings. Even if it it just a 50% consideration. That is all I am saying. Jeez - who knew this would be such a hot topic. I would think the customers would all be on the same side.....

 

Well, if they did that, then what would the November people say? There will always be a cutoff date for everything, and that will always eliminate the guy one day before the cutoff date. That's life.

[Guest nhrich]

I dont think there are issues with the changes to the fuel surcharge for 2009 and going forward. My comments relate solely to right now today through the end of December. If they are starting in January, I dont understand why it would be so difficult to do something for December 2008 cruisings. Even if it it just a 50% consideration. That is all I am saying. Jeez - who knew this would be such a hot topic. I would think the customers would all be on the same side.....

 

Let's suppose for a moment that the same policy was in effect for fourth quarter of 2008. On September 19 (I didn't find the 18th with a quick search), the closing price of oil was $104.55, so there would not have been a refund of the fuel charges.

[mohavemommy]

:oUpstate New York.. our area is still in the $2.35 range.. check this sight & just type in the zipcode for anywhere.. (try 51593 for a rude awakening):

 

http://gasprices.mapquest.com/searchresults.jsp?search=true&latitude=&longitude=&gasPriceType=3&address=&city=&stateProvince=&postalCode=14532&radius=10&brand=&sortOrder=2

 

Nice... thanks... try zip code 77001.... close to the oil. :p

[SCUBA Mark]

Our final payment is Dec 27th for our March 14th cruise. We currently owe almost $200 in fuel surcharges. What I dont understand is if Royal determines on Dec 18th that this quarters sailings will receive OBC, why on Dec 27th am I paying it to them only to have it converted as OBC? I already having several hundred in OBC & really wont need all of that as we dont spend much on board. This just doesnt make sense to me.

 

I was wondering the same thing. Our final payment is on 12/22 for our 3/8/09 cruise.

 

The only thing that makes it OK is that it will be like pre-paying our tips. I just remembered we already have a $100 OBC credit. I better start worrying.

 

Mark

[TEXASMUNK]

WTI jumped back up to $52.67 this morning. Wed, Nov 26, 08

[Cruising89143]

Look, I would love to get the $40 back on my Majesty cruise in 12 days.

 

The fact of the matter is, they didn't start CHARGING the fuel surcharge in the first place until well after the price per barrel had been sky high. They were paying with their hedged fuel contracts then.

 

Then that fuel was used, and their new contracts were at a much higher price.

 

There is never going to be price simultaneity. It's just the way that the business works.

 

RC was the last to institute fuel surcharges, was never the highest, and is one of the first (and least complicated) to refund.

 

Stop whining, or stop cruising.

 

Wow, the best post on this entire thread. :)

[996turbos]

So let's look at this from a different angle. The cruise line buys in bulk and is loaded with higher price fuel. Are we to assume the "lower" price fuel bought in bulk prior to the expensive fuel was used surcharge free? How many cruises sailed with the cheaper fuel but also included the surcharges as well? Companys will hedge thier prices before the increase takes affect. I say take your ill got gain from double dipping the consumer at the outset of this and apply it to the back end of your "expensive" fuel contract. :mad: That at least would be fair, but who ever accused RCL of being fair.:p

[Gonzo70]

[quote name='996turbos']So let's look at this from a different angle. The cruise line buys in bulk and is loaded with higher price fuel. Are we to assume the "lower" price fuel bought in bulk prior to the expensive fuel was used surcharge free? [/quote]

Yes, it was. Royal Caribbean did not begin a fuel surcharge until oil had been high for quite some time. The "cheap" oil was used up well before they began instituting a fuel surcharge. I think the manner in which RCL is dealing with rescinding the surcharges is extremely fair and logical.

[996turbos]

[quote name='Gonzo70']Yes, it was. Royal Caribbean did not begin a fuel surcharge until oil had been high for quite some time. The "cheap" oil was used up well before they began instituting a fuel surcharge. I think the manner in which RCL is dealing with rescinding the surcharges is extremely fair and logical.[/quote]
So what inside info do you have to back that up? Hello, basic economics calling. You don't hit the brakes after the wall you start before the wall. I'm sorry but I give the suits at RCL more smarts then you do I guess. Also, by the very definition of futures contracts, they extend into the future. The futures market and oil prices react up or down on a daily basis. Only a fool would run a buisness such as this with out buying contracts that extend price protection for at least 6 months or longer. I was envolved in the future contracts, for sugar, for an major American candy company. Buisness will hedge it's prices and not wait for the wild swings in price you suggest.

[Gonzo70]

[quote name='996turbos']So what inside info do you have to back that up? Hello, basic economics calling. You don't hit the brakes after the wall you start before the wall. I'm sorry but I give the suits at RCL more smarts then you do I guess. [/quote]

You might want to look up the facts before you act in such an arrogant and condescending manner and provide total misinformation. My comments were neither "inside" information nor an opinion; they are easily verifiable facts. Oil had already been surging for some time before RCL commenced their initial $5 per day fuel surcharge. They had been eating the cost of high oil.

Here are the facts: Royal Caribbean instituted the initial fuel surcharge for sailings on or after February 1, 2008. Oil had been rapidly escalating throughout 2007 (in January it averaged $46 per barrel, reached an average of $56 in April, $66 in July, $78 in October, and $87 in November). Another factor to conisder is they were stopped from enforcing the surcharge retroactively, so anybody who already had deposits down (or was paid in full) for cruises February 1, 2008 and later was exempted from the fuel surcharge. Oil shot to over $100 per barrel in April of 2008 and many people on sailings during early 2008 were exempt from paying the fuel surcharge.

[996turbos]

Gee Gonzo are we a little touchy today? No need to get personal and be a jerk about it. I merely do not believe you or I know how long the futures contract for lesser price fuel was for. I do believe they sent off sailings with lesser price fuel and tacked on the surcharges to boot IMO. I doubt they waited till thier cheap fuel was exhausted to charge a fuel surcharge and I also believe they should now drop the facade of fuel surcharges completely IMO. BTW my statements are not misinformation but are basic economics 101. :p

[Gonzo70]

[quote name='996turbos']Gee Gonzo are we a little touchy today? No need to get personal and be a jerk about it. I merely do not believe you[/quote]

Look at your previous post - you were the one who acted in a condcending manner. I do not comprehend what you mean by "I mere do not believe you." Again, I was not posting a personal opinion - I was posting easily verifiable objective factual information. Also, it is public knowledge how much fuel RCL hedges (for 2009 they are 39% hedged; they were 55% hedged in 2008) and for how far out they do so - just look at their quarterly reports. It is clear from their '08 quarterly reports that the spike in oil price wrecked havoc on their '08 profits - the fuel surcharges did not kick in until it was too late to stop the tremendous impact on their profits and even when they did kick in they only offset a small portion of their overall increased expenses.

RCL is a publicly traded company so their financial information is easily accessible by anyone. Your comments on this issue are based on your "hunch" which was erroneous. My comments are based on hard facts that are easily verifiable by anybody. Your opinion that RCL should immediatelty cease the fuel surcharge because they immediately began it once their fuel became expensive is based on 100% false information. I am not saying this to be harsh to you, but simply so that others are not drawn to erroneous conclusions based on false information you are providing.

[Gonzo70]

[quote name='SlovonaRP']Just a FYI - for your 'discussion' with this person - here is the historical price of West Texas Intermediate/Light Sweet that I do believe the fuel surcharge/refund is based on:

[URL]http://www.economagic.com/em-cgi/data.exe/var/west-texas-crude-long[/URL][/quote]

Yes, West Texas Intermediate (WTI) is the index key to what RCL pays. As can be seen from your link it went up nearly 70% from January of 2007 to December of 2007. I don't know if our "friend" will believe the chart you linked though.

[996turbos]

[quote name='Gonzo70']Yes, I believe you.[/quote]

Thanks Gonzo, apology accepted:p

[mo1parrothead]

Gas was $1.34 a gallon in Independence Missouri today. Lets just hope that it stays down and we can receive the OBC.

[DON M.]

I liked it alot better when gas was $4.20 and the stock market was gaining.