Don't Take Passports Off the Ship

Like global warming.:rolleyes:

 

Yes, just like global warming - or as the informed among us would call it, "climate change". It amazes me how some people will reject the overwhelming evidence and research done by virtually the entire scientific community on climate change and instead believe radio talk show pundits who have zero scientific credentials, but plenty of biased, party line opinions. These people prefer to go through life with their heads firmly buried in the sand - or more appropriately, up a portion of their anatomy.

 

Like climate change, a majority of the experts recommend a course of action regarding passport protections, but a few "doubters" insist on living in their world of opinions rather than our world of facts. Whether climate change, evolution, or passport protections, when the majority of the experts say something is true, any reasonable person would accept their collective wealth of knowledge as factual.

 

As well respected astrophysicist Neil deGrasse Tyson explained recently on the Colbert Report http://thecolbertreport.cc.com/videos/42g6iq/neil-degrasse-tyson-pt--2:

 

"When different experiments [actions] give you the same results, it is no longer subject to your opinion. It is true whether or not you believe in it."

Edited April 22, 2014 by fortinweb

... These people prefer to go through life with their heads firmly buried in the sand...

Last month there was a special election in Florida's 13th Congressional District to fill the open seat for the US House. That district is essentially Pineallas County (St. Petersburg), and over half the district is less than 12 feet above sea level. The successful candidate denies that climate change is happening. I'd say when their homes flood, they have no one to blame but themselves.

 

Thom

No, but why unnecessarily put yourself in that position? :confused:

 

Because when it comes to choosing between 1) worrying about whether the port agent will indeed have my passport if I miss the ship, or 2) dealing with replacing it when I get home if I happen to lose it while ashore, I choose the latter. That's my preference.

 

Deep rooted trust issues are a pain, aren't they? :)

 

Whatever. I simply believe that I will do a better job of making sure I have my passport when I need it than someone else will.

 

Here is where your argument falls flat. Without it, you won't be allowed back into the states, if that is where you are from. And, you probably won't be allowed to board an international flight without one in most countries.

 

So you think all the US citizens who have ever shown up at the border without their passport have been permanently denied entry and wandering around just across the border, homeless and begging, LOL? No.

As for flying internationally, I'm well aware that it would be extremely difficult if not impossible to board a flight without my passport and that's my whole point. TO ME, the risk of missing the ship, and thus needing to fly internationally, is greater than the risk of losing my passport or having it stolen. Anything can happen, but when I weigh the risks that's my conclusion FOR ME. You feel the greater risk is having your passport lost/stolen and that's fine. That's you.

Agreed. As my father used to say: "Everyone has the right to be wrong". :D

 

When the US State Department, the cruise lines, and most travel experts recommend something, that advice should be strongly considered. When the majority of experts agree on something, it must be valid advice. But then again, we are occasional travelers, so we must know much more than they do about such things. :cool:

 

First of all, I don't consider myself an occasional traveler. I cruise 3-5 times per year and take an average of 3-4 additional international trips per year. But that's really not the point. There's a difference between advice and laws/rules/policies. With advice, it is something to consider, but each person must also take into account their own personal situation, risk tolerance and a zillion other things and make the decision they feel is best for them.

 

I am curious however, about the State Dept advice. Do you have a link to where the State Department tells you to never take your passport with you and always leave it in the hotel/ship? I know they suggest making copies, but I would like to read the actual verbiage where they say only take a copy out and about, and never your actual passport. Thanks!

Regarding the State Department, their info/advice varies by country. But if you want an example just go to the state department web site and look under Brazil (and this is just one example).

 

Here is a copy of what is posted under "Safety and Security"

 

 

"Street crime remains a problem for visitors and local residents alike. Foreign tourists, including U.S. citizens, are often targets, especially in Sao Paulo, Rio de Janeiro, Salvador, and Recife. While the risk is greater during the evening and at night, street crime also occurs during the day, and safer areas of cities are not immune. Incidents of theft on city buses are frequent. You should keep a copy of your passport with you while in public and keep your passport in a hotel safe or other secure place. You should also carry proof of your health insurance with you."

 

If you still are a "doubter" the link is

http://travel.state.gov/content/passports/english/country/brazil.html

 

While we agree that all this is simply a matter of personal choice, our own experience through forty-six years of extensive international travel (to about 100 countries) and more then 3 1/2 years on cruises has taught us it is good advice. Personally, we do not carry our Passports unless there is a very specific reason (i.e. might need it to rent a car, or it could be a legal requirement).

 

Over the years we have known (first hand) of multiple incidents where cruisers either lost or had their passports stolen while carrying them ashore. The most recent example happened in Ashdod, Israel while on the Silhouette in 2012 when a New York City Policeman had his passport (and other valuables ) stolen off a beach in Tel Aviv while he was taking a quick swim. A year earlier, while we were in Constanta, Romania a good friend was mugged (on a main street in daylight) and the mugger managed to grab his Passport. Fortunately he was able to snatch the stuff back (and also relieve the mugger of his coat) thus saving the day. But he broke an expensive camera in the fight. He later told us that the only reason he fought the man (and risked his life) was because the guy took his Passport! That Passport was probably worth approximately $10,000 on the black market.

 

As to what happens if you cannot get back to a ship and your Passport is locked in your cabin...the normal policy is that your cabin (and safe) would be searched by security and your Passport (and any drugs they see) turned over to the port agent so you can retrieve them at a later time. If you doubt this policy, look for a CC poster called "Brucemuzz" who is a cruise line Hotel Manager (who has worked on several lines and ships) and he will verify this is what is done.

 

Hank

Edited April 22, 2014 by Hlitner

I am curious however, about the State Dept advice. Do you have a link to where the State Department tells you to never take your passport with you and always leave it in the hotel/ship? I know they suggest making copies, but I would like to read the actual verbiage where they say only take a copy out and about, and never your actual passport. Thanks!

 

They don't say "never". They say keep it in your safe unless required to have it with you. Quoted directly from their website: http://travel.state.gov/travel/tips/...fety_1747.html

 

"Carry the minimum number of valuables, and plan places to conceal them. Your passport, cash and credit cards are most secure when locked in a hotel safe. When you have to carry them on your person, you may wish to put them each in a different place rather than all in one wallet or pouch. Avoid handbags, fanny packs and outside pockets that are easy targets for thieves. Inside pockets and a sturdy shoulder bag with the strap worn across your chest are somewhat safer. One of the safest places to carry valuables is in a pouch or money belt worn under your clothing."

Edited April 22, 2014 by fortinweb

I agree. When we are on a land vacation we definitely leave our passport locked securely in the hotel safe. But then again, we eon't have to worry that our hotel might sail away to another country before we could get back!

We decide on a port to port basis whether we will take our passport or not. If we are not far from the port no problem, but on our private full day tours, even leaving a 2 hr window to get back to the ship, we usually take our passports.

Edited April 22, 2014 by Christine Frances

No one doubts street crimes occur everywhere. And I'm thinking how ridiculous it is that a NYC police officer would leave all his valuables unattended while he went for a swim. Not even Insurance would cover that loss.

Regarding the State Department, their info/advice varies by country. But if you want an example just go to the state department web site and look under Brazil (and this is just one example).

 

As to what happens if you cannot get back to a ship and your Passport is locked in your cabin...the normal policy... If you doubt this policy, look for a CC poster called "Brucemuzz" who is a cruise line Hotel Manager (who has worked on several lines and ships) and he will verify this is what is done.

 

Thank you for trying to help. There were prior replies that seemed to imply that the state dept had a blanket suggestion to always leave your passport in the safe. I was looking for a link to such a blanket statement, not one about Brazil, or any particular country. Thank you though.

 

As for the policy, I do not for one minute doubt that that is the POLICY. But having a policy and adhering to it 100% of the time without exception are two different things.

 

They don't say "never". They say keep it in your safe unless required to have it with you. Quoted directly from their website: http://travel.state.gov/travel/tips/...fety_1747.html

 

"Carry the minimum number of valuables, and plan places to conceal them. Your passport, cash and credit cards are most secure when locked in a hotel safe. When you have to carry them on your person, you may wish to put them each in a different place rather than all in one wallet or pouch. Avoid handbags, fanny packs and outside pockets that are easy targets for thieves. Inside pockets and a sturdy shoulder bag with the strap worn across your chest are somewhat safer. One of the safest places to carry valuables is in a pouch or money belt worn under your clothing."

 

I tried to click on the link but it didn't work; I was hoping to read the quoted text in context. i.e. See if it is indeed a blanket statement, or a statement in reference to a particular country or area. Thanks anyway

Edited April 23, 2014 by waterbug123

No one doubts street crimes occur everywhere. And I'm thinking how ridiculous it is that a NYC police officer would leave all his valuables unattended while he went for a swim. Not even Insurance would cover that loss.

 

LOL. It was a popular topic on the ship and we think the poor cop wanted to wear a mask :). But what happened to him is an all too common problem. Folks that carry their passports, valuable cameras, etc.. do not consider what to do with this stuff if they decide to go to a beach and swim. In most cases they just take their chances or ask a complete stranger to keep an eye on things (this is what the cop did). Beach and car thieves are common all over the world and they will watch for just such situations. Cruise passengers are usually easy to spot and thieves know that cruisers tend to carry valuables. And I should mention that DW and I have actually seen cruisers walking around European cities with their cruise cards hanging on lanyards. Go figure.

 

We live in Puerto Vallarta for much of the winter and have a balcony overlooking the southside Malecon. DW figures she can almost always pick out cruisers from the locals. Show me somebody carrying a bottle of water, wearing a fanny pack, and often with a backpack, and you can almost bet that they are on a cruise ship :). For some strange reason cruise ship passengers just do not make much of an attempt to blend into the crowd. It is almost like putting a bullseye on your back...and there are plenty of thieves who love to take target practice.

 

Hank

 

P,S. Things did work out for the cop and his wife. Since the ship was overnighting in Haifa the following two days they allowed him to cruise up the coast without his Passport. He then had to spend nearly his entire 2 days in Haifa dealing with the US consul and jumping through the hoops to get an emergency Passport. If we had been sailing to anywhere else in Europe they would have left him behind in Ashdod where he would have had to handle getting a replacement passport and then catching up to the ship (at his own expense),

Edited April 23, 2014 by Hlitner

That's a classic story Hank. I can see friendly looking "strangers" just waiting to be approached on the beach to mind every cruisers valuables. Fresh meat comes to mind.

 

People really do put their common sense in the drawer (maybe even put it in the safe :p) when on vacation.

Edited April 23, 2014 by Pushka

I tried to click on the link but it didn't work; I was hoping to read the quoted text in context. i.e. See if it is indeed a blanket statement, or a statement in reference to a particular country or area. Thanks anyway

 

That's odd. I just tried it as well and it didn't work for me this time. Perhaps they are doing site maintenance? I will admit that the link and quote I posted were from a recent thread and not from a visit to the website today. I remember that it was posted as a blanket statement and not specific to any country, area or current situation. Unfortunately, I'll have to ask you to trust me on this - it was recently available exactly as quoted. Sorry for any confusion.

Edited April 23, 2014 by fortinweb

.......I tried to click on the link but it didn't work; I was hoping to read the quoted text in context. i.e. See if it is indeed a blanket statement, or a statement in reference to a particular country or area. Thanks anyway

Maybe this will work for you - A link to another place where it is quoted

 

A Safe Trip Abroad | Infoplease

 

Travel light. You will be able to move more quickly and will be more likely to have a free hand. Also, you will be less tired and less likely to set your luggage down and leave it unattended.

 

Conceal your valuables. Leave your passport, cash, and credit cards locked in a hotel safe if possible. When you carry them on you, conceal them in several different places rather than all in one wallet, pocket, or bag. Avoid using handbags, fanny packs, and outside pockets that are easy targets for thieves.

 

 

Edited April 23, 2014 by fleckle

......While we agree that all this is simply a matter of personal choice, our own experience through forty-six years of extensive international travel (to about 100 countries) and more then 3 1/2 years on cruises has taught us it is good advice. Personally, we do not carry our Passports unless there is a very specific reason (i.e. might need it to rent a car, or it could be a legal requirement).

 

Over the years we have known (first hand) of multiple incidents where cruisers either lost or had their passports stolen while carrying them ashore. The most recent example happened in Ashdod, Israel while on the Silhouette in 2012 when a New York City Policeman had his passport (and other valuables ) stolen off a beach in Tel Aviv while he was taking a quick swim. A year earlier, while we were in Constanta, Romania a good friend was mugged (on a main street in daylight) and the mugger managed to grab his Passport. Fortunately he was able to snatch the stuff back (and also relieve the mugger of his coat) thus saving the day. But he broke an expensive camera in the fight. He later told us that the only reason he fought the man (and risked his life) was because the guy took his Passport! That Passport was probably worth approximately $10,000 on the black market.

We can all read statistics about the thousands of passports that are stolen each year, but they do not have the same impact as when it happens to someone you know personally, especially if it is someone you care about.

 

We are among the multitudes who blithely ignored the statistics about stolen passports of anonymous strangers, until members of our own family got mugged and had their passports stolen.

Maybe this will work for you - A link to another place where it is quoted

 

A Safe Trip Abroad | Infoplease

Conceal your valuables. Leave your passport, cash, and credit cards locked in a hotel safe if possible.

 

Thanks, still hoping someone can post a working link that directly links to this blanket verbiage on the actual state dept website.

Maybe this will work for you - A link to another place where it is quoted

 

A Safe Trip Abroad | Infoplease

 

Travel light. You will be able to move more quickly and will be more likely to have a free hand. Also, you will be less tired and less likely to set your luggage down and leave it unattended.

 

Conceal your valuables. Leave your passport, cash, and credit cards locked in a hotel safe if possible. When you carry them on you, conceal them in several different places rather than all in one wallet, pocket, or bag. Avoid using handbags, fanny packs, and outside pockets that are easy targets for thieves.

 

 

 

Had to smile when we read that article. We noticed is was Copyrighted in 2007, and being a government document we assume it was written a few years prior to that time. The article suggest carrying "Travelers Checks" which we would mention is no longer a great idea. It is very hard to cash travelers checks in Europe...even most banks will not take them anymore. Cruise ships seem to be among the last places to readily accept TCs.

LOL.

We live in Puerto Vallarta for much of the winter and have a balcony overlooking the southside Malecon. DW figures she can almost always pick out cruisers from the locals. Show me somebody carrying a bottle of water, wearing a fanny pack, and often with a backpack, and you can almost bet that they are on a cruise ship :). For some strange reason cruise ship passengers just do not make much of an attempt to blend into the crowd. It is almost like putting a bullseye on your back...and there are plenty of thieves who love to take target practice.

 

Hank

 

This is one point that I totally agree with. If you stand out in a crowd anywhere, it increases your chances of being pickpocketed or worse. Blending in with your surroundings always helps.

 

Dave

...Blending in with your surroundings always helps.

Agreed, but not always possible. I had a nephew who was in the Peace Corps in the Congo. When I went to visit, we were the only two white people within four hours of travel - good luck on blending in:cool: On the other hand, everyone in his area knew who I was, and they made sure nothing bad happened to me:). In general I find that things are pretty safe if you are well off the tourist circuit; it is areas with lots of tourists flashing lots of money that seems to be most prone to bring out the thieves.

 

Thom

Agreed, but not always possible. I had a nephew who was in the Peace Corps in the Congo. When I went to visit, we were the only two white people within four hours of travel - good luck on blending in:cool: On the other hand, everyone in his area knew who I was, and they made sure nothing bad happened to me:). In general I find that things are pretty safe if you are well off the tourist circuit; it is areas with lots of tourists flashing lots of money that seems to be most prone to bring out the thieves.

 

Thom

 

That's true too. For the most part, I think people who are posting here are referring to Caribbean or Europe cruises.

 

Dave

Had to smile when we read that article. We noticed is was Copyrighted in 2007, and being a government document we assume it was written a few years prior to that time. The article suggest carrying "Travelers Checks" which we would mention is no longer a great idea. It is very hard to cash travelers checks in Europe...even most banks will not take them anymore. Cruise ships seem to be among the last places to readily accept TCs.

Even so, the information is still applicable as there are passengers who continue to use travelers checks and will likely keep on doing so as long as they are able to obtain them free of charge and the cruise ships will cash them.

 

They find them more convenient than needing to go find an ATM on land or being charged a fee to use the ATM on the ship.

 

Edited April 23, 2014 by varoo

Totally agree! I can get TC:s free of charge in USD, Euros as well as CND from my bank. As long as you don't ask the ship to convert the Euros to USD for example, Celebrity does not charge a fee.

No one doubts street crimes occur everywhere. And I'm thinking how ridiculous it is that a NYC police officer would leave all his valuables unattended while he went for a swim. Not even Insurance would cover that loss.

 

What makes you think insurance wouldn't cover the loss? If it's in excess of the deductible, theft is theft and it would most certainly be covered as long as it is covered property.

What makes you think insurance wouldn't cover the loss? If it's in excess of the deductible, theft is theft and it would most certainly be covered as long as it is covered property.

 

 

The items were not under personal control but left unattended on a beach. That (in Australia anyway) means you are not covered. It's the same as leaving them on a public bus or train. Unless items are in your personal possession or under your control they aren't covered by Insurance.

The items were not under personal control but left unattended on a beach. That (in Australia anyway) means you are not covered. It's the same as leaving them on a public bus or train. Unless items are in your personal possession or under your control they aren't covered by Insurance.

 

That is not the case in the United States. Theft is theft, it doesn't matter if the items were on your person or in your control.