300+ days out

We are looking to purchase airfare to London (from the US) in mid October 2015. I did a check and the flight schedule for major airlines is not yet out for October. Three questions:

 

1 - When will a schedule be out?

 

2 - Is there a price advantage to booking as soon as the flights are released?

 

3 - Our cruise leaves on a Wednesday (out of Southampton), so if we fly out the Friday before (arrive on Saturday), that gives us 4-5 days to see London. Is there a recommendation fairly close to London that we could fly to instead... ahead of time, and then get to London a couple of days later?

 

We found that flying multiple city flights was the same price as flying round trip to/from our port city. For instance... last May, we flew to Berlin for touring a couple of days. We then flew to Dusseldorf to tour a couple of surrounding German towns before driving over to Amsterdam, before our cruise. We flew back home from Amsterdam.

 

Then in May 2013, we flew to Paris for 5 nights before taking a train to Venice to board our cruise. The cruise ended in Rome, where we spent a couple of nights. We also took a day train to Florence and back before flying home.

 

Just not sure about flying to surrounding areas of London, though.

Most major airlines' schedules come out 330 days in advance. (There are a small number that come out 350+ days in advance, but most at 330 days.) The lowest prices usually start 1-3 weeks after release, it seems to me. Booking the first day they are out doesn't get you the best prices. Start watching (and clearing the cookies out of your computer) 2-3 weeks in front of when you can actually buy. You will see the trends of what price is best.

 

Europe doesn't seem to follow the open jaw rules we have, so coming and going from different airports isn't usually a problem.

Edited November 2, 2014 by CruiserBruce

We are looking to purchase airfare to London (from the US) in mid October 2015. I did a check and the flight schedule for major airlines is not yet out for October. Three questions:

 

1 - When will a schedule be out?

 

2 - Is there a price advantage to booking as soon as the flights are released?

 

3 - Our cruise leaves on a Wednesday (out of Southampton), so if we fly out the Friday before (arrive on Saturday), that gives us 4-5 days to see London. Is there a recommendation fairly close to London that we could fly to instead... ahead of time, and then get to London a couple of days later?

 

We found that flying multiple city flights was the same price as flying round trip to/from our port city. For instance... last May, we flew to Berlin for touring a couple of days. We then flew to Dusseldorf to tour a couple of surrounding German towns before driving over to Amsterdam, before our cruise. We flew back home from Amsterdam.

 

Then in May 2013, we flew to Paris for 5 nights before taking a train to Venice to board our cruise. The cruise ended in Rome, where we spent a couple of nights. We also took a day train to Florence and back before flying home.

 

Just not sure about flying to surrounding areas of London, though.

1. Start looking around the first of December.

 

2. No. On the contrary, because of cost uncertainties (price of oil/fuel, etc.) airlines tend to start the booking period with higher prices in order to hedge against cost increases. There's really no need to book much before the spring of next year. Monitor airfares to be sure, and if you see some killer deal, jump on it, but I would not rush to let the airlines have your money too soon.

 

3. Depends on where in the UK you want to go. There are nonstops from the US to a few other British cities - Manchester, Glasgow, Edinburgh, and next year, Birmingham, but unless you want to visit Scotland or Yorkshire (or the Midlands) then I'd just go to Heathrow and call it good. Certainly prices are more competitive into LHR due to the... competition. From LHR it's very easy to head out into the south of England - Windsor is next door, Oxford close, the Cotswolds and West Country beyond that. But it depends on where you want to go and how you want to get about.

 

There are several airports in the London area, but only two (Heathrow and Gatwick) with transatlantic service.

If you're trying to go somewhere else but want service from the US, my recommendation would be flying in to Manchester and spending a couple days in Liverpool. It could be the Everton and Beatles fan in me, but I love Liverpool.

Most major airlines' schedules come out 330 days in advance. (There are a small number that come out 350+ days in advance, but most at 330 days.) The lowest prices usually start 1-3 weeks after release, it seems to me. Booking the first day they are out doesn't get you the best prices. Start watching (and clearing the cookies out of your computer) 2-3 weeks in front of when you can actually buy. You will see the trends of what price is best.

 

Europe doesn't seem to follow the open jaw rules we have, so coming and going from different airports isn't usually a problem.

 

I will start watching for the 2015 flights soon, then. ;) So after they come out, I should put a YAPTA alert on the flights we prefer, and then wait for a possible rate drop in about 1-3 weeks from the time they are released...is that what you are suggesting?

 

I am not sure what you are saying in your bolded answer. :confused:

 

1. Start looking around the first of December.

 

2. No. On the contrary, because of cost uncertainties (price of oil/fuel, etc.) airlines tend to start the booking period with higher prices in order to hedge against cost increases. There's really no need to book much before the spring of next year. Monitor airfares to be sure, and if you see some killer deal, jump on it, but I would not rush to let the airlines have your money too soon.

 

3. Depends on where in the UK you want to go. There are nonstops from the US to a few other British cities - Manchester, Glasgow, Edinburgh, and next year, Birmingham, but unless you want to visit Scotland or Yorkshire (or the Midlands) then I'd just go to Heathrow and call it good. Certainly prices are more competitive into LHR due to the... competition. From LHR it's very easy to head out into the south of England - Windsor is next door, Oxford close, the Cotswolds and West Country beyond that. But it depends on where you want to go and how you want to get about.

 

There are several airports in the London area, but only two (Heathrow and Gatwick) with transatlantic service.

 

Starting to look the 1st of December or waiting until next Spring to book :eek:, seems to be contradicting from what CruiserBruce is suggesting. :confused:

 

Thank you so much for the information on other cities to fly into. That's just the thing, we didn't know where or what to see besides London. Scottland would certainly be interesting, but not sure it is doable. ;)

 

 

Zach1213

 

If you're trying to go somewhere else but want service from the US, my recommendation would be flying in to Manchester and spending a couple days in Liverpool. It could be the Everton and Beatles fan in me, but I love Liverpool.

 

Well this does sound interesting! :D How far is Liverpool from Manchester and how would we get over to London from there?

Manchester to Liverpool is about 30-40 minutes drive or 1h-1h15 train.

 

Liverpool to London by train or bus is easy - no more than a few hours

I will start watching for the 2015 flights soon, then. ;) So after they come out, I should put a YAPTA alert on the flights we prefer, and then wait for a possible rate drop in about 1-3 weeks from the time they are released...is that what you are suggesting?

 

I am not sure what you are saying in your bolded answer. :confused:

 

What I am saying is if you start test booking with imaginary dates a couple of weeks prior to when your dates are available, you will get an idea of what prices are, and what they are doing. The airlines are known for putting cookies on your computer to store previous airfare searches. It has been theorized they, when they see you searching again for the same fare, will quote a higher price than you previously found, to encourage you to buy NOW.

 

I don't use YAPTA, so can't comment there.

 

 

 

Starting to look the 1st of December or waiting until next Spring to book :eek:, seems to be contradicting from what CruiserBruce is suggesting. :confused:

 

 

 

What Gardyloo is saying is that there may not be any real demand until Spring, so you could wait until then to book, and fares probably won't go up. But if a) you see a reasonable fare, buy it, as b), without careful study and notetaking, you won't know when demand is suddenly going to kick fares up. Remember you have a very limited set of possible flight dates, so it isn't the best situation for a buyers market.

 

We just booked award seats to Australia for next year. We wanted to fly on a Wed, or a Thurs, but the Saver Awards weren't popping up. However, they did pop up for the Tuesday of the same week. If you have that sort of flexibility, it would help, not hurt, your chances of getting a slightly better fare.

Edited November 2, 2014 by CruiserBruce

1 - When will a schedule be out?

 

2 - Is there a price advantage to booking as soon as the flights are released?

1. Schedules are coming online now for mid-October 2015 for some airlines. I have just been looking this evening at some flights then for some rather inchoate plans I may put together.

 

2. Probably not. Often the lowest standard fares have not been filed when flights are released. And even if they have been filed, often the airline does not release seats in the booking classes needed for the lowest fares. And you can pretty much guarantee that when booking opens, there will be no fare sale covering those travel dates (which is when it's cheapest to buy).

 

The most important thing to know is that airline pricing is not a first come, first served system and there is no particular merit in being first in the queue.

 

What you really need to know are what are the likely lowest standard fares, what are the likely lowest sale fares, and when you might see the latter for your dates. But you need an expert in your specific market to know all that.

3 - Our cruise leaves on a Wednesday (out of Southampton), so if we fly out the Friday before (arrive on Saturday), that gives us 4-5 days to see London. Is there a recommendation fairly close to London that we could fly to instead... ahead of time, and then get to London a couple of days later?

 

We found that flying multiple city flights was the same price as flying round trip to/from our port city. For instance... last May, we flew to Berlin for touring a couple of days. We then flew to Dusseldorf to tour a couple of surrounding German towns before driving over to Amsterdam, before our cruise. We flew back home from Amsterdam.

 

Then in May 2013, we flew to Paris for 5 nights before taking a train to Venice to board our cruise. The cruise ended in Rome, where we spent a couple of nights. We also took a day train to Florence and back before flying home.

 

Just not sure about flying to surrounding areas of London, though.

I'm not sure what you mean by "surrounding areas". Heathrow, Gatwick and Stansted are all "fairly close to London". Amsterdam, Duesseldorf, Paris, Rome and Venice are not.

2 - Is there a price advantage to booking as soon as the flights are released?

 

3 - Our cruise leaves on a Wednesday (out of Southampton), so if we fly out the Friday before (arrive on Saturday), that gives us 4-5 days to see London. Is there a recommendation fairly close to London that we could fly to instead... ahead of time, and then get to London a couple of days later?

 

When to book for the best price is really anyone's guess, and very difficult for the layman to pinpoint with any accuracy. That said, if you can have flexibility with regard to both date of travel and arrival airport, you can afford to wait a little and see what kind of seat sales the spring brings, or even later. I've personally seen some fabulous deals from Air France in the spring and also this fall to various cities in Europe, so worth a look.

 

As for where to fly to - I have just booked a TA on the QM2 for January, and booked my return air (with Aeroplan miles) out of Brussels so as to avoid the UK departure tax (nearly $250/person per FF ticket). Cost less to take the Eurostar to Brussels (39 pounds/person) and stay the night (free night at the Courtyard near BRU).

Thanks all! I'll keep all the information in mind. :)

Just a quick glance at Sept/Oct 2015 fares to London (don't know where you're coming from, so just plugged in Chicago) are $100 - $300 more than flights leaving the week after next. Yes, it's November instead of October, but take it for what it's worth.

 

Are you traveling one way or round trip? And where from? There are more seats from North America to London than any other European city, so competition can be quite intense, pushing prices down. It also means that flights are NOT going to sell out between now and... well, flight day, although the prices will fluctuate as fare buckets are filled and/or opened. If anything, by October, over-capacity may well be a problem, leading to such things as easier mileage "award" availability. With airfares, early birds don't always get the best worms.

What city are you departing from ??

You should also look to LGW when doing a flight search.

Just a quick glance at Sept/Oct 2015 fares to London (don't know where you're coming from, so just plugged in Chicago) are $100 - $300 more than flights leaving the week after next. Yes, it's November instead of October, but take it for what it's worth.

 

Are you traveling one way or round trip? And where from? There are more seats from North America to London than any other European city, so competition can be quite intense, pushing prices down. It also means that flights are NOT going to sell out between now and... well, flight day, although the prices will fluctuate as fare buckets are filled and/or opened. If anything, by October, over-capacity may well be a problem, leading to such things as easier mileage "award" availability. With airfares, early birds don't always get the best worms.

 

What city are you departing from ??

You should also look to LGW when doing a flight search.

 

 

We would be flying out of TRI. Brother and SIL out of GSP or ATL. I should also mention that we prefer a non-stop from CLT or ATL once we leave our destination city. We have a target (feel comfortable with) price in mind, based on the fares that we are used to paying when traveling to Europe.

 

Depending on whether we fly into London (LGW or LHR) or to Manchester (don't know code) or someplace else, we may or may not fly round trip. We can use round trip as a starter. ;)

 

From what I am reading above, unless there is any advantage to fly into Manchester (cheaper flight?), we can take a train to Liverpool from London. We would have our base in London and do day trips like we did out of Rome. :)

 

We will definitely be flying back out of LGW or LHR because the cruise ends on a Sunday and DH would need to get back to work on Monday. Which of the 2 (LGW or LHR) is quickest/closest to get a flight home from Southampton?

 

When I do a flight search, I am not getting anything past October 3rd. The calendar advances one day, each day. Our target leave date is October 16th,2015 with return on November 1st. The schedule needs to open up through 11/1 before considering a flight booking. :rolleyes:

 

I should also mention that we prefer a non-stop from CLT or ATL once we leave our destination city.

Edited November 3, 2014 by Iamthesea

Depending on whether we fly into London (LGW or LHR) or to Manchester (don't know code) or someplace else, we may or may not fly round trip. We can use round trip as a starter. ;)

 

Manchester UK: MAN (not to be confused with Manchester NH, which is MHT). You could also look at Birmingham - BHX (as opposed to Birmingham AL - BHM)

 

They'll be a quiz later... ;):D

 

When I do a flight search, I am not getting anything past October 3rd. The calendar advances one day, each day. Our target leave date is October 16th,2015 with return on November 1st. The schedule needs to open up through 11/1 before considering a flight booking. :rolleyes:

 

You're using ITA Matrix, aren't you? Here's a trick to search for dates beyond what the calendar gives you as a possibility: click on the 'See calendar of lowest fares' option, select the furthest date possible as the start date, and put in your length of stay range (e.g., 14-16 days). It will give you search results for beyond the officially open dates - in your case, pretty much the whole month of October 2015.

 

I should also mention that we prefer a non-stop from CLT or ATL once we leave our destination city.

 

Any particular reason?

We would be flying out of TRI. Brother and SIL out of GSP or ATL. I should also mention that we prefer a non-stop from CLT or ATL once we leave our destination city. We have a target (feel comfortable with) price in mind, based on the fares that we are used to paying when traveling to Europe.

 

Depending on whether we fly into London (LGW or LHR) or to Manchester (don't know code) or someplace else, we may or may not fly round trip. We can use round trip as a starter. ;)

 

From what I am reading above, unless there is any advantage to fly into Manchester (cheaper flight?), we can take a train to Liverpool from London. We would have our base in London and do day trips like we did out of Rome. :)

 

We will definitely be flying back out of LGW or LHR because the cruise ends on a Sunday and DH would need to get back to work on Monday. Which of the 2 (LGW or LHR) is quickest/closest to get a flight home from Southampton?

 

When I do a flight search, I am not getting anything past October 3rd. The calendar advances one day, each day. Our target leave date is October 16th,2015 with return on November 1st. The schedule needs to open up through 11/1 before considering a flight booking. :rolleyes:

 

I should also mention that we prefer a non-stop from CLT or ATL once we leave our destination city.

I asked round trip vs one-way. I regard open-jaws as round trips. In other words, you're flying back across the Atlantic, not cruising.

 

Unless something changes in a year, there won't be any nonstops from CLT or ATL to Manchester (MAN) by the time you travel. Delta is discontinuing its ATL-MAN nonstop early next year. You should also write off Gatwick (LGW) as there aren't any ATL or CLT nonstops to there, only a few from Florida and Las Vegas.

 

I think you need to do a little study on British geography. Liverpool is 2 1/2 hours and at least £80 round trip (train) from London, not counting the time and cost to get to/from Euston Station and to/from Liverpool Central. It's also worth noting that Liverpool is at the same latitude as Ketchikan, Alaska, meaning that in late October you're not going to have a great deal of daylight, but you probably will have plenty of liquid sunshine.

 

If you want to base in London and do day trips, then I'd definitely look at closer destinations, and probably in the south of England rather than in the north - Brighton, Oxford, Salisbury, maybe Cambridge or Bath...

 

If you have a price in mind that you're comfortable with, then I guess the easy answer is just to wait and hope.

Edited November 3, 2014 by Gardyloo

Just a quick glance at Sept/Oct 2015 fares to London (don't know where you're coming from, so just plugged in Chicago) are $100 - $300 more than flights leaving the week after next. Yes, it's November instead of October, but take it for what it's worth.

Although we are on the same page as far as the principle is concerned (ie the early bird doesn't always get the best worms), a quick look shows that in the case of these numbers, that is probably all to do with it being October rather than November.

 

In the case of both November 2014 and November 2015 (because ITA will just price into that time frame), the BA fares are about $300 more than the fares for October 2015. A slightly closer look at the fares shows that all of these are priced in O class (the lowest public booking class on BA) and that November in both years is season L, whereas October is season K and therefore has more expensive fares.

Although we are on the same page as far as the principle is concerned (ie the early bird doesn't always get the best worms), a quick look shows that in the case of these numbers, that is probably all to do with it being October rather than November.

 

In the case of both November 2014 and November 2015 (because ITA will just price into that time frame), the BA fares are about $300 more than the fares for October 2015. A slightly closer look at the fares shows that all of these are priced in O class (the lowest public booking class on BA) and that November in both years is season L, whereas October is season K and therefore has more expensive fares.

 

Right, which goes back to your point about which fare buckets are released and when. I didn't want to get too far into YM esoterica, but it's not that the fares change, it's that the bookable fare categories come and go.

I am sorry. I prepared a long reply. For some reason, the reply was lost when I hit Submit. I don't much feel like typing it over. The bottom line is that you have been very helpful, and I have learned so much. Thank you all!

 

In a nutshell...Our airport options are now more limited, and no Liverpool this trip. We will stay south for day tours. :D

 

Have not discounted flying into Paris or Brussels and then taking a train to London after a couple of days of touring. This option, especially if the flights were easier and a better deal than flying into LHR. We could cover more territory (more bang for the buck!). Never been to Belgium, and we have friends that live not too far away.

 

My SIL has been to London a couple of times, so she could get us around quicker if we only spent 2 days, versus 4 days before our cruise. We'll see!

 

I do have one more question...How far is LHR from Southampton? Is it closer than LGW would have been?

I was going to mention that with the OP's dates, it might be worth considering using airline miles for this trip. As far as I can tell, a round trip ticket from TRI to LHR is probably going to run in the $1200 range, but almost certainly not less than $1000.

 

Departing after October 15 puts one into the "off peak" period for award travel using American Airlines miles, 20,000 miles per person each way to Europe.

 

Assuming the OP doesn't have any AA miles, they can be bought through AA.com, and at the moment AA is offering a decent bonus on purchased miles. For example, if two people are traveling, one can buy 65,000 miles for $1787 and receive 15,000 miles as a bonus, i.e. 80,000 miles, enough for two passengers round trip. After taxes, you're looking at an out-of-pocket expense of around $1850, or around $925 per person.

 

Mid-November isn't available for award (or purchase) booking yet, but my experience is that there is seldom any problem with scoring award seats on the specific days you want to travel at that time of year (transatlantic). For example, even though it's shortly before Thanksgiving, you could book TRI-xCLT-LHR for almost any day between now and this Nov. 18, with wide open availability. This is due (as I mentioned above) to over-capacity across the pond during the autumn/winter months.

 

So buy the miles, wait a couple of weeks until award booking is possible for the OP's trip, and badda bing, two tickets in hand for way less than the cash price. Using US Airways (which will be AA by then) the total fees will be $5.60 pp outbound, higher return due to UK taxes, but still a decent deal.

 

I do have one more question...How far is LHR from Southampton? Is it closer than LGW would have been?

Heathrow is closer; there are bus transfers but most have their inconvenient aspects, particularly with cruise-type luggage. A private car transfer will run around £120.

 

I'd also mention that the mileage redemption angle mentioned above would be excellent for trips to other destinations in Europe than London. AA redemptions are all one-way, so you could easily fly to Brussels or Paris or Amsterdam, take the train to London, then fly out of Heathrow, or vice-versa.

Edited November 3, 2014 by Gardyloo

 

Have not discounted flying into Paris or Brussels and then taking a train to London after a couple of days of touring. This option, especially if the flights were easier and a better deal than flying into LHR. We could cover more territory (more bang for the buck!). Never been to Belgium, and we have friends that live not too far away.

 

 

If you are going to do that to get a cheap flight. Why not just drive to Orlando. Virgin Atlantic has generally good prices. We paid $1800 R/T pp to LGW for premium economy.

 

From the port to LGW was around 100 pounds for a sedan for 3. Likely another 20 for a larger sedan. We used Smith for Airports --- highly recommends them.

For some reason, I am not able to quote anyone using the multi-quote feature. Very frustrating!:(

 

PaulMCO - I'd pay $500 more a ticket to avoid a drive to Orlando. :D Many years ago, I vowed to never drive to FL after a nightmare trip to Disney.

 

Gardyloo - $1200-$1450 is our target price. We have paid as much as $1650 to fly to Europe. That was from ATL to Rome when booking it in January 2008 for a May trip. $1000 would be wonderful, but using free points would be even better!

 

No AA points, but we each have enough for a round trip with US Air. Could we use those points? Been saving for a couple of years, but I really don't have any idea how to use them or look it up. :o

 

Heathrow is closer; there are bus transfers but most have their inconvenient aspects, particularly with cruise-type luggage. A private car transfer will run around £120.

 

Good...and very reasonable transfer. ;)

 

I'd also mention that the mileage redemption angle mentioned above would be excellent for trips to other destinations in Europe than London. AA redemptions are all one-way, so you could easily fly to Brussels or Paris or Amsterdam, take the train to London, then fly out of Heathrow, or vice-versa.

 

Talked to DH, and he liked the idea of flying into Brussels if our friends from Germany could meet us there. They make great tour guides. We have been to Paris and were in Amsterdam in May, so he had no desire to go back to either just now. ;)

Edited November 3, 2014 by Iamthesea

No AA points, but we each have enough for a round trip with US Air. Could we use those points? Been saving for a couple of years, but I really don't have any idea how to use them or look it up. :o

 

How many? Wait 'til next year, and they'll become AA miles: http://www.aa.com/i18n/AAdvantage/AAdvantage2015/index.jsp

 

Talked to DH, and he liked the idea of flying into Brussels if our friends from Germany could meet us there. They make great tour guides. We have been to Paris and were in Amsterdam in May, so he had no desire to go back to either just now. ;)

 

I'll be doing this in reverse in January, and will report back. I can tell you right now that booking the Eurostar online was easy-peasy.

How many? Wait 'til next year, and they'll become AA miles: http://www.aa.com/i18n/AAdvantage/AAdvantage2015/index.jsp

 

I'll be doing this in reverse in January, and will report back. I can tell you right now that booking the Eurostar online was easy-peasy.

 

I have almost 50,000, and DH has 44,000. So I guess the answer is "no" to using them now with a purchase on an AA flight?

 

We were a little intimidated about using the trains in Europe, but after using them a few times in the last few years, they are easy and VERY handy.:D

Edited November 3, 2014 by Iamthesea

For some reason, I am not able to quote anyone using the multi-quote feature.

CC is set up so that you can only quote two posts using multi-quote. I agree, it's frustrating!

No AA points, but we each have enough for a round trip with US Air. Could we use those points?

How many? Wait 'til next year, and they'll become AA miles: http://www.aa.com/i18n/AAdvantage/AAdvantage2015/index.jsp

I have almost 50,000, and DH has 44,000. So I guess the answer is "no" to using them now with a purchase on an AA flight?

As AA and US are both in oneworld now, you ought in theory to be able to use US miles to get AA flights (and vice versa). Or, indeed, to use US miles to get a flight on any other oneworld airline.

 

However, there will always be the questions of whether you have enough miles, and whether there's availability, and whether (even if there is availability) it's actually good value to use miles.

No AA points, but we each have enough for a round trip with US Air. Could we use those points? Been saving for a couple of years, but I really don't have any idea how to use them or look it up. :o

 

I have almost 50,000, and DH has 44,000. So I guess the answer is "no" to using them now with a purchase on an AA flight?

 

The AA and US programs won't be integrated until sometime next year, and in the meantime each airline is sticking with its "old" award scheme. However, you can certainly buy enough miles from US Airways (who are also having a big "bonus" sale at the moment) to get to the required number of miles. With the current bonus it looks like it would cost around $350 for you and $420 for your DH to get to the 60,000 miles each you'd need for an economy award with US. https://membership.usairways.com/en-US/dividendmiles/usemiles.html (Note you'll need your US FF numbers to get to the right screen.)

 

Once you have 60K miles each, you can either book the trip online or via the phone (probably a $25 phone booking fee) but in either case way cheaper than $1200 a pop. As I said, you're almost certain to be able to get seats on your desired dates by doing so, but as always, flexibility is key.

 

The US miles will probably be converted to AA miles by the time you fly, and because AA's redemption requirement to Europe is "cheaper" (20K each way per person, 40K round trip) than US', you might get a "refund," but I surely wouldn't bet on it.

 

US awards are still only for round trips or open-jaws (all AA awards are now just one way) but flying into, say, Brussels, and back from London, would be no problem.