HAL Ryndam insult to British & American passengers

[kazu]

I come from a family of WWII veterans (long generations in our family). One thing on my bucket list is to see the Normandy beaches for myself and the Canadian cemetery. My dad's 3 brothers landed on that day. I do not expect HAL to do this for me. When it is time I will book a cruise with that on the itinerary or do a land vacation so DH can locate the WWI trenches which is something he has told me he wants to do since we were dating.

 

I have seen pictures that bring tears to my eyes and I will do it. I would not expect HAL, in all regions of the world, to honour all countries special dates/events in history. It is up to us to keep the torch lit and I would not have given this dinner a second thought as I personally feel that the OP has taken the meaning of the dinner out of context. I am not saying they are wrong in any way, just for us, I would have enjoyed the international dinner and said a prayer with my family over the D-Day anniversary. It just so happens that the dinner and the anniversary where on the same night. I probably would not have connected the dots myself, seing as the ship was in Norway and not France.

 

So the OP was more clued in than me. I think the OP is to be commended for their desire to remember and that is what is important as history forgotten is bound to be repeated. But I don't think it is a cruise line's job to remember for us. We need to take responsibility for it ourselves and teach each new generation the importance of these events.

 

So nicely said. Our guide in Normandy was superb. (I am happy to share her name with you if you like - just email me or post here). She knew the Canadian spots as well as the U.S. and I cannot find the words to even begin to describe the day or the emotion. The gratitude in Normandy is very touching. You will see a LOT of Canadian flags and the cemeteries are kept spotless due to the love of the Normandy people.

[Copper10-8]

I strongly urge you and your husband to plan on a multiple day trip. The beaches themselves as well as the adjacent cemeteries require a good deal of time and you definitely don't want to be constantly checking your watch to be sure you're back to the ship on time.

 

There's so much more to see and do such as a visit to Pont de Hoc, which I found incredibly moving. There are still a few German fortifications there as well. Then there's Sainte Mere-Eglise, where a paratrooper had his chute snag on the church roof.

 

In honor of the bravery of the D Day invasion the church in Sainte Mere-Eglise actually has stained glass windows depicting the swarm of parachutes that landed on D Day.

 

But what was most memorable to us was how much gratitude there remains among the local folks in Normandy several generations later. We were treated so wonderfully by the folks who were genuine when they asked if we were Americans and when we said yes, we heard several say "God bless you."

 

And finally the WW II memorial in Caen, about an hour south of the Normandy beaches is worth a full day.

 

My suggestion is don't put it off. Get it off your bucket list by booking a land trip now and make sure you plan for a multiple day trip. You'll create lasting memories for yourself and your husband.

 

Don't forget the D-Day Museum at Arromanches-les-Bains in the former British sector/Gold Beach

[I_r_a]

This should be the worst thing that ever happens to anyone.

 

Ira

[Host Walt]

Don't forget the D-Day Museum at Arromanches-les-Bains in the former British sector/Gold Beach

 

Didn't forget. But failed to mention it just because there's so many places to visit.

 

BTW, I strongly suggest watching "The Longest Day" before visiting the area.

[serendipity1499]

You take a cruise on the lovely Ryndam, through gorgeous Norway, and this is your takeaway?

You have blown the lack of specific flags all out of proportion.

 

Good One Ruth!

 

could someone maybe explain why or how the OP was insulted and just why he made such a complaint?

 

I agree that the lack of U.S. & Canadian flags is not an insult! I'm sure there were many Psgrs on board from different countries who enjoyed having the Intl dinner with the flags of other countries....

 

What I don't understand is, why the complaint was made to HAL? There was no insult at all..

 

I'm a U.S. citizen & lived in a two family house close to Mitchell Field on LI in 1941.. Mom had Friends with their Kids over for dinner.. No TV in those days, but the family living below us called up to tell us that Pearl Harbor was just bombed.. My little Friend & I were frightened & sat on a window seat watching for planes..We fully expected to see planes come over our house & bomb us. too..

 

My dear Mom was an Air Raid Warden & those nights were scary too for us little kids, when all lights were out & the siren was going off..

 

IMO it's insulting when U.S. Psgrs feel that their way is the only way. & the only country which should be represented on cruise lines...

 

Reminds me of the joke we had in our office about a U.S. Psgr in Europe asking our Tkt. office people "What is this in real money! Now that's insulting!!!

Edited June 16, 2014 by serendipity1499

[sammygoose]

I didn't quite 'get it' at the time:

 

Snip<But what was most memorable to us was how much gratitude there remains among the local folks in Normandy several generations later. We were treated so wonderfully by the folks who were genuine when they asked if we were Americans and when we said yes, we heard several say "God bless you." >

 

Thanks HostWalt.

 

I visited the Netherlands as a 17 year old and we went to Scheveningen.

Sure we knew about WWII but we didn't FEEL it. On our visit the locals asked us where we were from, we said Canada. They were elated calling us the crazy Canucks , offering to buy us a beer. We knew it was WWII related but thought they were crazy.

Age and perspective says I missed a real opportunity to sit down and have that beer...and listen.

 

Damn.

[1of4]

My thoughts exactly and I knew if I waited long enough someone would express them more eloquently than I could. You are that person, no surprise, and I thank you.

 

Thank you Sapper. It is your picture last year that I saw that really cemented my desire to go and see for myself. Seeing the Canadian flag against the beach really brought on how I wish I could have brought my dad to see it for hiself. Too late for that, but not too late to teach my children what happened and our family's (small) role in it.

[1of4]

I strongly urge you and your husband to plan on a multiple day trip. The beaches themselves as well as the adjacent cemeteries require a good deal of time and you definitely don't want to be constantly checking your watch to be sure you're back to the ship on time.

 

There's so much more to see and do such as a visit to Pont de Hoc, which I found incredibly moving. There are still a few German fortifications there as well. Then there's Sainte Mere-Eglise, where a paratrooper had his chute snag on the church roof.

 

In honor of the bravery of the D Day invasion the church in Sainte Mere-Eglise actually has stained glass windows depicting the swarm of parachutes that landed on D Day.

 

But what was most memorable to us was how much gratitude there remains among the local folks in Normandy several generations later. We were treated so wonderfully by the folks who were genuine when they asked if we were Americans and when we said yes, we heard several say "God bless you."

 

And finally the WW II memorial in Caen, about an hour south of the Normandy beaches is worth a full day.

 

My suggestion is don't put it off. Get it off your bucket list by booking a land trip now and make sure you plan for a multiple day trip. You'll create lasting memories for yourself and your husband.

 

Thank you for this. You are right and I will start planning. We have wanted to bring the children back to Scotland too so it is a good idea to make it a land vacation.

 

I appreciate your tips.

[sapper1]

Thank you Sapper. It is your picture last year that I saw that really cemented my desire to go and see for myself. Seeing the Canadian flag against the beach really brought on how I wish I could have brought my dad to see it for hiself. Too late for that, but not too late to teach my children what happened and our family's (small) role in it.

 

That beach picture is my favourite cruise photo ---ever. I get emotional every time I see it. It was Kazu's idea to bring the flag. Gigianne made beautiful British style poppies for us to wear and my husband and I had saved our poppies from Remembrance Day to leave on a grave.

The Juno Beach Centre museum is a short distance from where the photo was taken.

 

Because of old movies and news clips, one tends to think of WW2 as being conducted in black and white but seeing the area in all its beautiful and peaceful colour gives another perspective. Like---it all took place in this gorgeous setting.

 

The cemetery is off by itself in the countryside and is kept in absolutely perfect condition. I mentioned to our taxi driver about the complete lack of any security there and she said it is not necessary. Nobody has ever done any damage there.

Edited June 17, 2014 by sapper1

[NMLady]

This wasn't an insult.

 

I agree. IMO the OP is being a bit over the top with calling it an insult.

[iancal]

Way, way over the top.

 

So far over the top that it could not be seen with the naked eye!

 

It would be difficult to go through life choosing to be offended at things such as this.

[runnergirl71]

IMO it's insulting when U.S. Psgrs feel that their way is the only way. & the only country which should be represented on cruise lines...

 

Reminds me of the joke we had in our office about a U.S. Psgr in Europe asking our Tkt. office people "What is this in real money! Now that's insulting!!! [/size]

 

Exactly. There are some people who make me NOT proud to be an American, and the OP with his attitude is one of them.

[iancal]

We've heard it referred to as 'Monopoly' money a few times when we have been travelling. Less than complementary.

[chrispb]

Exactly. There are some people who make me NOT proud to be an American, and the OP with his attitude is one of them.

 

Relax - the OP is a Brit, I believe. He's talking about the Union Flag and is from East , unless there's an East Anglia in the USA???:cool:

[serendipity1499]

Exactly. There are some people who make me NOT proud to be an American, and the OP with his attitude is one of them.

 

Relax - the OP is a Brit, I believe. He's talking about the Union Flag and is from East , unless there's an East Anglia in the USA???:cool:

 

However he included American Psgrs in the title of his thread:

 

Quote "HAL Ryndam insult to British & American passengers" Unquote

 

Most of the Americans on this thread do not feel this was an insult at all..

[ksqueak]

To add my two cents, someone asked about 9-11. I was on the Prinsendam last year Sept 11th. No mention was made, nothing in the program, nada.

[emeraldead]

I don't think war/devastation events are meant to be "celebrated." If you want to honor your country and a specific historic event, bring your own flags.

 

But to suggest a holiday liner make a point of remembering and somehow celebrating such an event makes no sense to me. Taking insult from it is completely incredulous.

[CowPrincess]

As a Canadian, I could be insulted by the thread title " HAL Ryndam insult to British & American passengers"

[Down-Unders]

I don't think you understand the meaning of the International Dinner. The operative word is 'International'. Not just a few nationalities.

 

 

Thank you for your response, I believe the OP is referring to June 6th not the International dinner. Do you know what June 6th means and the brave men who lost their lives in order that we can enjoy the freedom we have to-day.

[jbhcw]

To add my two cents, someone asked about 9-11. I was on the Prinsendam last year Sept 11th. No mention was made, nothing in the program, nada.

 

We boarded the Carnival Fantasy a few years back on 9-11...and they had the biggest US Flag I have ever seen hanging in the Atrium...I even took a picture of it...touching...

[enjoyingtheworld]

:eek: We just back from HAL cruise to western Mediterranean and once again HAL did not go to Tunisia. They blame it on visa problems but as we know that is the responsibility of the cruiser. So instead of going to a nice port we got stuck in a hell hole. Sent a letter to HAL and all I got back is we can do what we want. If you want to go to Tunisia, don't go with HAL. Should have listened to cruise critic, won't make that mistake again.

 

My wife and I sailed with Holland America Line (HAL) MS Ryndam to the Norwegian Fjords on 31st May 2014. The Captain had already told us that 70% of the passengers were British and the remainder were mainly American's or Canadian's. On Friday 6th June the theme in the main dining room was International Around the World and each table had a flag setting. I asked the waiter where the Union Flag was as we were 5 British people but he just shrugged. My friend & I checked the upper level of the dining room and could find only 1 Union Flag & 1 American flag so I complained to the person in charge of the upper level. I asked him if he knew the relevance of the day and he said it was the 70th anniversary of D-Day. I told him that I felt insulted that in the pre-dinner announcements no mention was made of the anniversary and that the Union flag was represented on only 1 table. The response I got was that he would pass on my comments. I e-mailed HAL with my complaints and have had a response but with no mention of my complaint re-lack of Union flags & D-day.

 

I know other passengers were suitable disgusted at Ryndam's apparent inability to amend the normal Around the World night to recognise such an important Anniversary relevant to the overwhelming majority of it's passengers.

 

It is interesting to note that the captain of the Ryndam is British although he now lives in the USA.

 

NB I would have written quite a good review of Ryndam (excluding dreadful organisation on outside decks & in the Lido alternative dining area) if it had not been for their totally unacceptable response to my criticisma of their treatment of 70th Anniversary of D-Day

[Jemima]

Possibly the day is more prominent in the UK or Australia than it is in the US. Other than possible mention of the anniversary on the news, I do not ever recall any notice being taken of the day. Those who died in various wars were already honored about a week before this date.

Edited June 17, 2014 by Jemima

[sapper1]

:eek: We just back from HAL cruise to western Mediterranean and once again HAL did not go to Tunisia. They blame it on visa problems but as we know that is the responsibility of the cruiser. So instead of going to a nice port we got stuck in a hell hole. Sent a letter to HAL and all I got back is we can do what we want. If you want to go to Tunisia, don't go with HAL. Should have listened to cruise critic, won't make that mistake again.

 

Anyone who cruises a lot has had the experience of a missed port. It happens for various reasons and we live with it.

[IRL_Joanie]

The dinner was not a D-Day dinner. It was an International Dinner such as is held on the last night of every Holland America cruise. It is supposed to be a happy celebration. I have never looked to see if there is a specific flag on my table. It could be any flag for all I care. It is an International Dinner---period. It has no historical significance.

 

To suggest that RuthC or anyone else on this thread does not understand the meaning of D-Day or does not have an appreciation of the loss of life and the debt owed is outrageous and unkind. I am sure I am not the only one who feels you owe Ruth an apology.

 

Best doggoned post in the entire thread!!!!

 

 

Joanie

[Lizzie68]

As a Canadian, I could be insulted by the thread title " HAL Ryndam insult to British & American passengers"

 

Bingo!