HAL vs Royal (thoughts on changing)

[richstowe]

3 hours ago, Hawaiidan said:

I think your shortchanging yourself.....  Brand loyality, Airlines, Hotel and Cruise ship really do pay off big benifits   I would rather pay a bit more and get reliable quality  and have my patronage rewarded.   In the beginning be patient...  build miles, points that you have concentrated on  Then the rewards start and dont stop.   I have been doing this for 25 years and   get the best cabins and rooms at the best prices or even free    I can fly  to Europe or Aisia   business class for $5.60 !!!     I use only a hotel Marriott and UAL/ Star alliance  cc   and use it for EVERYTHING  not just travel paying it off at the end of each month.

Jumping from line to line, over time will not benefit you the way you think it will!!!

I don't want to overstate this but I couldn't disagree with you more . I'm only taking about loyalty with regards to cruise brands and not referring to the wisdom of using shareholder benefits . Perhaps loyalty in other spheres is a good idea but I'm not sure . Certainly it is for marriages . 🤩

When it comes to cruises I have saved thousands by starting every cruise search with a blank slate . I use a very good internet site to put in my parameters in as a starting point . Flexibility is the key in getting the best value . Flexibility of course in cruise brands and some flexibility in dates , departure port an cabin category will save thousands each and every cruise . 

The rewards for loyalty , until you reach the very high levels , are meager and one sided . Cruise lines only care about your future cruises with them , not your past . Perhaps " Jumping from line to line, over time will not benefit you" in hotels or airlines . It certainly does in cruising . Plus you get the advantage of getting a fuller picture of the options available . I do have preferences and take these into account when booking . 

Edited February 6, 2019 by richstowe

[BethID]

Different strokes for different folks... I have two teenagers (17 & 14) who enjoyed HAL much more than RCL.  In 2017, we did RCL with all the bells and whistles like the flow rider, ice skating rink, etc.  My kids never did any of those things.  They also did not like the late night food choices.  Last spring break, we did HAL.  We all loved it.  There was really great food; my oldest son loved the later evening buffet.  We also liked that it didn't feel crowded and that it was really laid back.  We did get a retreat cabana, which gave us a perfect place to hang out, read, and play games.  HAL's entertainment was so-so, but we always found something to do.  We loved it so much we are doing another trip on the Oosterdam for spring break.

[knittinggirl]

Love less wait time at the elevators.

[Hawaiidan]

18 hours ago, richstowe said:

I don't want to overstate this but I couldn't disagree with you more . I'm only taking about loyalty with regards to cruise brands and not referring to the wisdom of using shareholder benefits . Perhaps loyalty in other spheres is a good idea but I'm not sure . Certainly it is for marriages . 🤩

When it comes to cruises I have saved thousands by starting every cruise search with a blank slate . I use a very good internet site to put in my parameters in as a starting point . Flexibility is the key in getting the best value . Flexibility of course in cruise brands and some flexibility in dates , departure port an cabin category will save thousands each and every cruise . 

The rewards for loyalty , until you reach the very high levels , are meager and one sided . Cruise lines only care about your future cruises with them , not your past . Perhaps " Jumping from line to line, over time will not benefit you" in hotels or airlines . It certainly does in cruising . Plus you get the advantage of getting a fuller picture of the options available . I do have preferences and take these into account when booking . 

Yes, cruise lines are still in the dark ages of loyalty rewards.They have a lot to learn from Airlines and Hotels.     The current trend in  loyalty programs  is to focus on not the number of miles or nights  but on the $$$ you spend.   

  Should a passenger who sails  days in a cheap inside at  say $60 a day   get the same rewards as a passenger  who sails in a suite at$ 250 a day and eats every meal in a specialty and runs a $100 a day bar tab?        If your the guy in the economy cabin you say yes..  But how about the guy in the much more expensive cabin  who would say heck no !    It would be wise  for a line then to want to keep that guy  who spends 10K a week coming back. 

 Maybe instead of being a 2 or more star your a  25K a 50K and a 100K customer !   With airlines it is both miles and Dollars  not just miles.

 The airlines are in the process of doubling their most expensive seats and reducing the economy ones.   They want more revenue per passenger.   Maybe cruise lines are listening....  I note  they are turning regular cabins into special sounding names and charging way more for the same product    

 

I agree flexibility is key   but it can also  be applied to a restricted number of cruise lines  Thus you can amass loyalty and do so at  the best price relative to the line.   The problem is that when you jump for a better price, what do you give up in quality experience .  Is it the equal or is it not quite the same?  Apples to Apples   ?    You do get what you pay for  it is not an even playing field.

 The cruise market is just wakening up to preserving its  passengers who are regular performer$

[jb008]

4 hours ago, Hawaiidan said:

Yes, cruise lines are still in the dark ages of loyalty rewards.They have a lot to learn from Airlines and Hotels.     The current trend in  loyalty programs  is to focus on not the number of miles or nights  but on the $$$ you spend.   

  Should a passenger who sails  days in a cheap inside at  say $60 a day   get the same rewards as a passenger  who sails in a suite at$ 250 a day and eats every meal in a specialty and runs a $100 a day bar tab?        If your the guy in the economy cabin you say yes..  But how about the guy in the much more expensive cabin  who would say heck no !    It would be wise  for a line then to want to keep that guy  who spends 10K a week coming back. 

 

Small addendum on this, HAL actually gives you cruising "day" credits for $ spent while onboard.  So we got credited for 11 sail days on our last cruise even though we only sailed 7 actual days (7 + 4 credited for onboard spending).  So bigger spenders will get to a higher loyalty status faster.  AFAIK that was not available on Royal Carib., Princess, or Celebrity (although cabin category can be credited at a higher rate of "sailing" days/points for all 3 of those lines, with Celebrity having the most credit tiers IIRC).

 

Also IMHO Princess probably has one of the better loyalty benefits, at their Platinum level (5 completed cruises or >50 "days) you get an internet credit.

[Hawaiidan]

7 minutes ago, jb008 said:

 

Small addendum on this, HAL actually gives you cruising "day" credits for $ spent while onboard.  So we got credited for 11 sail days on our last cruise even though we only sailed 7 actual days (7 + 4 credited for onboard spending).  So bigger spenders will get to a higher loyalty status faster.  AFAIK that was not available on Royal Carib., Princess, or Celebrity (although cabin category can be credited at a higher rate of "sailing" days/points for all 3 of those lines, with Celebrity having the most credit tiers IIRC).

 

Also IMHO Princess probably has one of the better loyalty benefits, at their Platinum level (5 completed cruises or >50 "days) you get an internet credit.

All well and good.  I fully understand.  But the cruise lines are going to dig a lot deeper into their  pockets to shell out real rewards    Like when you spend 60,000 you  get a free 7 day cruise for 2.  Or after spending 30k  you get free unlimited specialties for you and your travel partner or 50% off a 7 day cruise.   after 25 K you get 20% off your next cruise of 14 days or free liquor for 1   and free laundry      and at 40,000 you get  25% off a 14 day, or free liquor for 2 for 14 day   ( AFAIK...I dont know that program.)  I am just shooting from the hip on these  but this is the kind of pay back the lines need to consider for around $35,000 spent and airline will give me a$ 8-9,000 business ticket to australia

orr Europe

Seriously there are lines right now that after 20 cruises of 7 or more days you get a free14 day cruise in the cabin you most frequently book.  Right now !!  thats around  $48,000

 

Free internet and 50% off dining  is a sad payback

[jb008]

I agree with you that the cruise lines need to reevaluate their loyalty programs, and I'm a great case for that because I'm not really loyal between X, PCL, and now HAL - so the internet credit on PCL as a loyalty perk could definitely be a factor when I choose my next cruise (but wasn't enough of a factor to keep me sailing PCL over HAL on my last vacation).

 

X offers free cruises to their top tier loyalty members.  Similarly, most of them offer some amount of free drinks at some level of loyalty program.  At the 5 sailings (which could be less than $2.5k per person) level most don't offer much (and part of why many switched to days/points versus sailings was the people who'd log the 1 or 2 night sailings to help get to higher status levels), with Princess having the best perk IMHO of internet credit on your 6th cruise and beyond.

 

Idk about you, but for me I've easily been gifted the value of a 7-day cruise in onboard credit during the course of my 4 sailings on X, and I got back 18% of my all-in cruise fare (fare, taxes, fees) as OBC on my last HAL sailing.  I can't complain about the givebacks I'm getting from the cruise line, especially vis-a-vis the paltry benefits I've gotten for being a Gold Medallion on Delta over the several years I kept that status.  Also some of the lines will give better/more perks if you book a higher category cabin, so instant gratification versus delayed gratification of a longterm loyalty.  

 

I don't think the system is as broken as your view of it would indicate though.  And one factor on cruise line loyalty programs versus hotels/airline loyalty programs is that many people don't do that frequent of vacation, much less cruises, relative to flights/hotel stays.  I'm sure the accountants and analysts have compared the benefit to the bottom line of promoting immediate spend (e.g., buy up to a better cabin, speciality restaurant, excursions, spa treatment, drinks/drink pkg) versus rewarding brand loyalty.

[Hawaiidan]

On 2/7/2019 at 2:29 PM, jb008 said:

I agree with you that the cruise lines need to reevaluate their loyalty programs, and I'm a great case for that because I'm not really loyal between X, PCL, and now HAL - so the internet credit on PCL as a loyalty perk could definitely be a factor when I choose my next cruise (but wasn't enough of a factor to keep me sailing PCL over HAL on my last vacation).

 

X offers free cruises to their top tier loyalty members.  Similarly, most of them offer some amount of free drinks at some level of loyalty program.  At the 5 sailings (which could be less than $2.5k per person) level most don't offer much (and part of why many switched to days/points versus sailings was the people who'd log the 1 or 2 night sailings to help get to higher status levels), with Princess having the best perk IMHO of internet credit on your 6th cruise and beyond.

 

Idk about you, but for me I've easily been gifted the value of a 7-day cruise in onboard credit during the course of my 4 sailings on X, and I got back 18% of my all-in cruise fare (fare, taxes, fees) as OBC on my last HAL sailing.  I can't complain about the givebacks I'm getting from the cruise line, especially vis-a-vis the paltry benefits I've gotten for being a Gold Medallion on Delta over the several years I kept that status.  Also some of the lines will give better/more perks if you book a higher category cabin, so instant gratification versus delayed gratification of a longterm loyalty.  

 

I don't think the system is as broken as your view of it would indicate though.  And one factor on cruise line loyalty programs versus hotels/airline loyalty programs is that many people don't do that frequent of vacation, much less cruises, relative to flights/hotel stays.  I'm sure the accountants and analysts have compared the benefit to the bottom line of promoting immediate spend (e.g., buy up to a better cabin, speciality restaurant, excursions, spa treatment, drinks/drink pkg) versus rewarding brand loyalty.

 No its not broken...but it is lagging behind the travel awards trends.    In

reading many posts I read many persons sail 2 or more cruises per year...  While not as frequent as airline or hotel stay ,  the goal would or should be  to get as many of these folks patronizing your line. and doing so more or less exclusively.. and being a disciple of the company   encouraging others to cruise with that line.     Too  like some hotel and CC companies are doing, is offer you bonuses if you refer new clients to them and they spend  X $ in the next 180 days.      Stuff like that   

  Time will tell and I think points would be best if tied to dollars spent rather than days.   That would benefit the company and  their bottom line and yours !!!   Time will tell

Edited February 9, 2019 by Hawaiidan

[Aquahound]

On 2/3/2019 at 1:17 PM, Jingerwoppy said:

My wife and I have stuck with Royal Caribbean to build some points but we’ve come to realize that the points probably aren’t worth it and there are a lot of other itineraries we’d like that RC really doesn’t service much. We’d also like a little something different to do on the sea days and a change of pace.

 

In looking around and speaking with some friends that cruise other lines, Holland America is one of the cruise lines recommended to us.  It looks like the layouts of the ships are somewhat different and I also see other activities such as the EXC Talks. When we took an RC transatlantic cruise a while back, they had lectures during the crossing and they were pretty good but I haven’t seen them on any other cruises.  How are the talks on HAL?

 

We’re pretty laid back cruisers and I’d like to hear about differences from some of you that have cruised on both cruise lines.

 

Thanks

 

HAL wouldn't be a bad choice but I highly recommend you look at Celebrity first.  Like jb008 said, your RCI status will be recognized and Celebrity has pretty good perks.  

 

I say this because HAL is a VERY different line from RCI.  HAL doesn't even come close to RCI's entertainment and they have pretty much eliminated all evening games shows.  You might get 1 if you're lucky.  Also, there's no lido entertainment.  

 

On Celebrity, you get the higher caliber dining and amenities, but you still have decent entertainment choices, especially in the evenings.  

 

I was a pretty loyal RCI cruiser.  I've since branched out and now I cruise pretty much any line.  Coming from RCI I recommend these lines in order......Celebrity, Princess, HAL.  

[Friend100]

Our last 2 cruises were on the Veendam and Oasis of the Seas.  Our next 2 cruises will be on the Koningsdam and Anthem of the Seas.  We like HAL for its itinerary, better food and service at a mass market price, and a more sophisticated experience.  We like Royal Caribbean for its onboard activities, entertainment, and more options cruising out of NY/NJ.