Art Auction dilema!!

[arlanamay]

I was on the Conquest 1-22-29 and attended all the art auctions. I bid on and won something for $150. It was a pretty water color and BIG. I had to take it off the ship with me. Well when I got it home I looked at it close up and it looked like an original painting. I tried to do some research on it but found nothing on that painting. Anyway I looked at my reciept to help me with my search and on it was a different title than what was on the painting itself. I thought well maybe it was in a series. Yesterday I received my letter of authenticity and I noticed the size they had stated was wrong and also that it was not signed in gold ink like the letter stated but in pencil. I called the Park West Gallery in Michigan and she sounded a little concerned and said she would call me back. Well she called me and wants to pick up the painting. I asked her how I could be sure I got my painting back and she said that I would get the other titled seriolithograph. I told her that the painting I have is the one that was put upon the eisle and up for bid. She said "Oh, I need to talk to my supervisiors and I will get back to you." I think I own it fair and square. What do you all think? Sorry this is so long.

[HeidiHo]

I think I own it fair and square.

 

I agree. Why would you want any painting other than the one you bid on. They need to get the proper certificate of authenticity to you.

[cherylandtk]

I think you own it too. It is possible that they just sent you the wrong COA, that happens quite a lot from what I hear. But it sounds as if it probably started when they wrote out the receipt on the ship, for a different item than what you actually bid on and paid for. All their subsequent records are a mistake based on that error. But what you bid on and took home is probably what they described in the auction and they just need to correct their records. They don't need to pick up your art or replace it with whatever they think they sold you. They need to correct their records to accurately reflect what you bid on. (It would have been easier if you had noticed the artist name/title on the receipt did not match what you bought while still on the ship, but its not a fatal error)

 

Give them as much information as you have and ask for a corrected receipt and COA: dimensions, artist, medium and send them a digital photo of your art. They should be able to sort this out eventually.

[arlanamay]

Your right about looking at the painting. I did ask to see it when I went to pay for it and they said that it was in cargo being wrapped so I sould take it off the ship. I think they made a mistake in the begining. I don't think they meant to start bid on an original work of art for $150. I'm not sure of that and I'm only speculating as to what might have happened. The painting I have is the one I bid on. It is framed and the frame has some chips in it because it's been around awhile. I think they want it back because it might be worth a whole lot more than $150. I believe that even if they accidentally sold an original Picasso the person who bought it is the legal owner. Just like if I bid on this painting and it's only worth $1 well I'm still legally bound to pay the $150 I bid at. I guess I'm getting worked up that they might try and intimidate me into giving the painting back.

[DqALEX]

I sailed on the Triumph on the 28 and I still waiting for my art to come

[Iamthesea]

I would take plenty of photo's before handed the painting back, but how can YOU prove to them that your painting is what you bid on? Perhaps it is the painting you bid on, but the company gives you a copy, thinking the customer will not notice. Sounds like a scam that went bad and the original was packed up for you.

 

If you really love the painting and want to keep it, you may have to hire a lawyer if things don't work out the way you want them.

[arlanamay]

I hope I don't have to hire a lawyer. I really think that they either messed up when they put the painting up for auction or when I went in to pay. After you win a bid they take the art away and you don't see it again until it's shipped to you. I have the art I bid on complete with dinged up frame. I also think that when they pulled up the painting on their computer to get a figure to start the bidding on they had the wrong one. Again I'm I'm speculating.

[Iamthesea]

I also think that when they pulled up the painting on their computer to get a figure to start the bidding on they had the wrong one. Again I'm I'm speculating.

This sounds like where the mistake was made. I think you will have a fight on your hands. Can you find anything out about the artist at all?

[Lewdog]

If I am reading you correctly, the painting you got is an original? an actual painting? If that is the case, absolutley DO NOT let them take that away from you in exchange for a seriolithograph.

 

A "litho" is not a painting it is a print, a reproduction of the original. They are usually numbered say like 25/250 meaning the 25th print out of 250 prints made.

 

If there is a gallery close to you take the painting to them, they should be able to authenticate it and tell you what you have.

 

I know I have never seen any original works on any of my cruises, they have been lithos.

[zqvol]

Do not surrender the painting to anyone unless ordered to do so by a court. Carnival seems to have messed up but that is their problem, just like going in a store taking your item to the rgister and paying what you are told. If they later discover that they made a mistake in the price youwould not even think about returning it. This is no different.

[gypsyrose]

And just how do you think they are going to get this painting away from you? You paid for it fair and square, if they call again pretend you don't know what they are talking about. That is, if you are happy with it and want to keep it. What difference does a certificate mean?

[arlanamay]

I will definately not let them take it without a court order. I'm sorry they made a mistake, but it was theirs not mine. I'm trying to google auction legal rules but nothing I've seen comes close to what I need to know. I don't remember if the auctioneer gave any details about the painting. What if he did and they were wrong? Do I legally have to give it back? That's what I'm trying to find out. I'm regetting having called them about it. I suspected it was original when I opened it up when I got home so I should have just taken it to an appraiser and let them figure it out later if they ever figured it out.

[Iamthesea]

I'm regetting having called them about it.

I probably would have done the same thing.

 

just like going in a store taking your item to the rgister and paying what you are told. If they later discover that they made a mistake in the price youwould not even think about returning it. This is no different.

I have to disagree a bit with this statement. I purchased a middle of the road DVD player for a Christmas present. I had been looking at a higher end brand (about $200 more!) I decided it was too much and paid the price for the middle line. The folks at Circuit City loaded the player into the back of my SUV. Not until I got home, did I realize that the clerk had given me the higher end DVD player. Once I saw the mistake, I took the player back. You should have seen the look on their faces when I tried to exchange it for the other model when I could have kept it.

 

Honesty is always the best policy, but in the case of the painting, the OP bid on this particular painting and took home what she had won.

[zqvol]

I probably would have done the same thing.

 

I have to disagree a bit with this statement. I purchased a middle of the road DVD player for a Christmas present. I had been looking at a higher end brand (about $200 more!) I decided it was too much and paid the price for the middle line. The folks at Circuit City loaded the player into the back of my SUV. Not until I got home, did I realize that the clerk had given me the higher end DVD player. Once I saw the mistake, I took the player back. You should have seen the look on their faces when I tried to exchange it for the other model when I could have kept it.

 

Honesty is always the best policy, but in the case of the painting, the OP bid on this particular painting and took home what she had won.

Just to clarify my scenario was different. I said that you took the item to the register and they rang it up. That is different than them loading the wrong item in your car without the clerk actually running it though the register.

 

The store is assumed to know the correct price. Same thing is if the price on the shelf says one thing, but rings up higher you are entitled to the lower price. If it rings up lower than shelf price unless you have done something to make it ring up lower you are entitled to the lower price.

 

Here the OP bid on a painting, paid for it and received it. THe seller seems to have messed up but that is not the OP's fault. There should be no reason to even thinking of returning the painting.

 

If they sold you a painting that appraised for $50 but you paid $750, do you think they would give you back the $700 that is more than the value?

[cusyl]

They just sent you the wrong paperwork. At least 95% of all works of art sold on the ships are mailed in tubes from their galleries. Only those older items in their stock which are one of a kind are framed and to be carried off the ship.

They wrapped it for you and you can be sure they knew what they sold.

You should easily be able to tell an original from a print.

[Lewdog]

You know too, the frame is probably worth more than you paid for the painting. Assuming of course it is not a mass produced frame.

[springfire]

Good Luck!!! If it were me, I would keep the painting and demand the certificate. You bid on it and won! Congrat!!!

[Pianogrl]

Interesting scenario here.....let us know how it turns out. I'm pulling for you - you bid, you paid, you took......it's yours! IMHO

[sagiter]

I don't remember if the auctioneer gave any details about the painting. What if he did and they were wrong? Do I legally have to give it back? That's what I'm trying to find out. I'm regetting having called them about it. I suspected it was original when I opened it up when I got home so I should have just taken it to an appraiser and let them figure it out later if they ever figured it out.

 

First, if you carried this painting or print off of the cruise I can pretty much guarantee that the auctioneer said, several timnes, that that was the case. he probably also said that if you're flying you might not want to bid on a particularly large piece, etc. etc. Second, auctions are meant to be visual, yes the auctioneer will attempt to cajole you into bidding BUT the only thing that really sells art on a ship is the visual. They accepted your bid for the painting on the easel. They then took your money and handed you the item. Why in the world would you think to send your art back to them ? Call them and ask very nicely that they send the correct COA for the specific piece of art you bid on and won. I couldn't imagine them getting in front of a judge, let alone a jury and announce that their expert auctioneer is so dumb that he sold a really expensive painting in lieu of a serigraph, that was completely different than what he was talking about, had it bid on and won, paid for and actually handed to the buyer. That would be awesome for business.

 

Now as to will you need a lawyer. If they pursue it, understand that they have weighed the cost of looking like an idiot in court, attorneys fees, time and any additional costs against the value difference between $150 that you paid and what the item is actually worth. Before getting an attorney, get a good, real art appraisal. It will be way cheaper and will tell you whether it's worth the fight.

 

I'm not an attorney this all just seems like common sense to me.

 

Good luck !!

[MikeM]

Did you find it on their web site. We found the one we like on the ship and ordered direct for less $

MikeM

AP

 

http://www.parkwestgallery.com/

[ChicagoMan]

Possession is 9/10 of the law.

 

I'm not sure what the COA is going to do for you if you're just going to hang the painting in your home, so screw 'em even if they don't give you the right one.

 

If you need the COA in order to turn around and sell the thing on eBay, then you might have a legal battle on your hands. Although that would be an interesting business idea......

[Lewdog]

You know really I would forget about the certificate it is just a useless piece of paper when you are dealing with an unknown artist.

 

Be glad you got an original and enjoy it.

[arlanamay]

I think I will get an appraisal on it. The artist isn't well known but as I was researching background on him and the painting I noticed that his seriolithographs run $400+. The painting I won I'm sure is an original. It even has pencil marks at the corners so the artist could use as reference. I don't even think there are any seriolithograph copies of it. It might even be a one of a kind. Imagine that for $150. I don't have that kind of luck so I'm waiting for the other shoe to drop so to speak. I will keep you all posted as to what happens.

[Timmys_mom]

Don't forget about us. I am dying to find out what they say.

 

IMHO - it's yours. Keep it.

[cruisecastle]

I was on the Conquest 1-22-29 and attended all the art auctions. I bid on and won something for $150. It was a pretty water color and BIG. I had to take it off the ship with me. Well when I got it home I looked at it close up and it looked like an original painting. I tried to do some research on it but found nothing on that painting. Anyway I looked at my reciept to help me with my search and on it was a different title than what was on the painting itself. I thought well maybe it was in a series. Yesterday I received my letter of authenticity and I noticed the size they had stated was wrong and also that it was not signed in gold ink like the letter stated but in pencil. I called the Park West Gallery in Michigan and she sounded a little concerned and said she would call me back. Well she called me and wants to pick up the painting. I asked her how I could be sure I got my painting back and she said that I would get the other titled seriolithograph. I told her that the painting I have is the one that was put upon the eisle and up for bid. She said "Oh, I need to talk to my supervisiors and I will get back to you." I think I own it fair and square. What do you all think? Sorry this is so long.

 

You own it and probably have a much more expensive painting that what you paid