Choose Your Brand and Stateroom Strategy Very Carefully

[Sthrngary]

Opening: 

 

I have written extensively about the NCL Haven.  How to approach this premium investment to gain the most value and vacation enjoyment.  I called it the “Secrets” of the Haven.  After four (4) years, it is NOT a secret anymore. The people of CruiseCritic.com have uncovered every drop of pleasure one can gain with some thought, preparation, and strategy. 

 

The Outcome of Education: 

 

Watchout what you ask for when highlighting any aspect of a truly positive cruise experience.  People listen and want some of that same luxury experiences.  Now we must add some factual realities. When you add in:

 

1. Supply-chain issues making everything being more expensive;
2. The cruise brands attempting to improve profits to accommodate the huge loans they took on;
3. Cruisers still utilizing their Future Cruise Credits which are as much as 150% higher than their original money’s paid;

 

The prices for the Haven (and all other VIP areas of Mainstream Brands) have gone up substantially.  They are also selling out even more quickly than before the pandemic.

 

Brand New Ships Always Have An Additional Premium Investment: 

 

I want to add one more thing that has just become apparent to me.  The new ships like the NCL Prima (Viva).  Regardless of stateroom, the prices are higher then lets say, the NCL Encore, Bliss or Joy.  When you consider the Haven area, Prima (Viva) is a huge percentage higher.  I recently compared cruising on a Luxury and Ultra-Luxury Brand for a 10-day Mediterranean Cruise.  I used the same basic itinerary, dates, and amenities.  The results might surprise ALL of us.

First allow me to give a basic evaluation of Luxury and Ultra-Luxury cruise brands.  They are the Haven (Celebrity Retreat, MSC Yacht Club) on Steroids. Regardless of the cabin you are in, once you leave your cabin, everyone is treated the same.  This is not a “Ship within a Ship” concept.  It is the "Entire ship is the Ship" concept.

 

The Good and the Bad: 

 

The whole ship is the Haven.  In most cases as part of the fare, all specialty restaurants are covered, the premium drink package is included (specialty coffee's/Bottles Waters/Beverages in Suite), the dining is a cut above even in the main dining room, unlimited internet is included, Thermal Spa/Sauna/Steam Rooms are included, and the personalized service throughout the entire ship is a cut above.  The ships are smaller, the average age of the passage is older, and the ship spends more time at each port.  No waterslides, virtual reality, or go carts which is a downside, and the entertainment is ok but not as good as many mainstream brands.  So, some good thing and some bad.

 

When I priced out an average Haven Suite on the Prima (Viva) is was within a few hundred dollars of an all-inclusive ultra-luxury brand (The Luxury Brand Suite did NOT have a butler).  It was almost double the investment of the luxury brand with a butler and a much larger suite. 

 

This is today reality.  We all must decide if paying double is a worthy investment for the same basic ports, dates, and days.  We need to make the decision that is right for our family and budget.  My advice is look at ALL the options available, do some research, due diligence and make the decision best for you and your trip.  Don’t depend on a Cruise Consultant or Travel Agent.  Do the work yourself. I choose to upgrade my suite on a Luxury Brand and still it was half the price of the Prima (Viva) with more included amenities. 

 

I will always have the thought in my head, “Life is too short, I would have really liked cruising in the Haven on the Prima.”  I however know, life is about choices.  Be educated and have realistic expectations for the money you invest.  What every decision you make, don’t look back, just enjoy the vacation.

 

"Cruise well and enjoy every moment."

[seekatz]

Very informative thread, thank you.

[Sthrngary]

4 minutes ago, seekatz said:

Very informative thread, thank you.

Thank you.  If was fun researching and writing it. 

 

Cruise well and enjoy every moment. 

[detroitlions]

Great thread... But I missed the name of the luxury line was it the Oceania Riviara you have listed?

[kylenyc]

 

31 minutes ago, Sthrngary said:

1. Supply-chain issues making everything being more expensive;

1. 2. The cruise brands attempting to improve profits to accommodate the huge loans they took on;
2. 3. Cruisers still utilizing their Future Cruise Credits which are as much as 150% higher than their original money’s paid;

Nice thread. Thanks for nuggets to chew on.

 

About # 3, the US dollar and inflation

I'd also widen choices geographically. Where you will get the most out of the (temporarily?) strong US dollar. What kind of luxury experience can you buy with the equivalent amount in US dollars in europe or asia (land or sea vacation)?

 

Early this year, I booked way more cruises than I ever have to simply lock in the price expecting inflation to continue to erode the value of the US dollar domestically while strengthening it compared to foreign  currencies. (Sorry for what other countries are going through). I plan to cancel half. The price on many of them have since gone up about 10-20% ... NCL indexed to inflation?

 

I've seen anecdotes of many American taking air to land vacations in Europe to take advantage of the strong US dollar while it lasts. News reports of flights full and european hotels packed. I'm considering further canceling even more than half of my cruise reservations in order to do a European land vacation.

Edited October 27, 2022 by kylenyc

[Sthrngary]

1 hour ago, detroitlions said:

Great thread... But I missed the name of the luxury line was it the Oceania Riviara you have listed?

Yes. I am always trying to be transparent with my posts.  It was the Oceania Riviera. Still an NCL product.  They had a four category upgrade event for Labor day.  I used my American Express Platinum Card Perks.  My total for a Penthouse with a butler was about $10,000.00.  That seems like a lot of money but compared to other with smaller suites, and no butler; it was half the investment.  I fully know by paying double you get more however it is a matter of if the additional is work the more you get.  That is a very personal decision.

 

Regardless, I hope I answered your question.  

 

Cruise well and enjoy every moment. 

[detroitlions]

5 minutes ago, Sthrngary said:

Yes. I am always trying to be transparent with my posts.  It was the Oceania Riviera. Still an NCL product.  They had a four category upgrade event for Labor day.  I used my American Express Platinum Card Perks.  My total for a Penthouse with a butler was about $10,000.00.  That seems like a lot of money but compared to other with smaller suites, and no butler; it was half the investment.  I fully know by paying double you get more however it is a matter of if the additional is work the more you get.  That is a very personal decision.

 

Regardless, I hope I answered your question.  

 

Cruise well and enjoy every moment. 

Yes you did and thank you. I actually looked at that ship for a 9 day end of December it was $11000 without any discounts. Looks great I cant wait to see what folks say about it.

[Sthrngary]

1 hour ago, detroitlions said:

Yes you did and thank you. I actually looked at that ship for a 9 day end of December it was $11000 without any discounts. Looks great I cant wait to see what folks say about it.

This is a NCL Mainstream Cruise Blog.  My comment below will address NCL but focus on "Over commenting" on the Oceania Brand.  I am not trying to hijack my own post but it will make sense as I describe it. I just wanted to start out by saying that.

 

I am so happy and used to NCL that it was a learning experience to book another brand even though it is part of the NCL family.  It took some research and I got lucky on the the four category upgrade sale. Our fare included coach airfare or a credit of $1,000.00 per person if you use your own airfare.  I will use my own airfare.  I also included in that fare a Pre-Cruise Hotel in Athens and included gratuities.  So the fare was $8,000.00 ish without the airfare and $10,000.00 ish with the airfare.  

 

I booked two suites.  One for my wife and I; another for our best friends whom don't know I did that booking as of yet.  I am a planner, they wait until the last minute.  Waiting to the last minute only works if you live by the port.  I will surprise them next year.  

 

The difference I have found is when you really know NCL, you can navigate it very well.  The NCL Free at Sea program is pretty simple for the most part.  On this cruise, you have to choice one of three perks.  The only way I could figure out which would be the best for us was to ask a lot of question on the brands CruiseCritic.com site.  It was a complete education for me I assure you.  After I learned, it was an easy decision to take the beverage program and when I get on the ship, upgrade it to the premium beverage program.  It took me two weeks to figure that out.

 

I know this was a long response but I wanted you and other to know the importance of really understanding what you get.  Know the plus/minus so you are fully aware of the situation when you get onboard.  That approach has made my last 20 years of cruising a very positive experience.

 

Cruise well and enjoy every moment. 

[dandelpino]

2 hours ago, Sthrngary said:

The ships are smaller, the average age of the passage is older, and the ship spends more time at each port.  No waterslides, virtual reality, or go carts which is a downside, and the entertainment is ok but not as good as many mainstream brands. 

 

I think this explains why 'ship within a ship' concepts command high prices rivaling all-inclusive small luxury ships. You get the amenities of a megaship and the service of a luxury ship all in one vacation. Millennials -- the generation that famously values experiences over material items -- have grown up and now have families. Millenials are no longer broke college students and are now mid-career professionals. The luxury experience on a fun filled ship is the best of both worlds.

 

On the other hand, the cruise line will amortise the cost of the amenities across thousands of pax in steerage and then sell fron- row/priority access to those amenities to suite pax at a high price. It's the best of both worlds for the cruise lines too. 

Edited October 27, 2022 by dandelpino

[cruiseny4life]

14 minutes ago, dandelpino said:

 

I think this explains why 'ship within a ship' concepts command high prices rivaling all-inclusive small luxury ships. You get the amenities of a megaship and the service of a luxury ship all in one vacation. Millennials -- the generation that famously values experiences over material items -- have grown up and now have families. Millenials are no longer broke college students and are now mid-career professionals. The luxury experience on a fun filled ship is the best of both worlds.

 

On the other hand, the cruise line will amortise the cost of the amenities across thousands of pax in steerage and then sell fron- row/priority access to those amenities to suite pax at a high price. It's the best of both worlds for the cruise lines too. 

You certainly nail the reasons I cruise on NCL, with the added bonus of not needing to dress up. I don't know about the rest of my generation, but my husband and I sure don't want to put anything more on than we have to when vacationing. We actually have looked at Regent and Oceania. They were tossed out as contenders due to their dress code. Yes, I know it's not that stringent, but it's too strict for us. 

 

I will say we are discount Haven cruisers. We're not going to be throwing five figures out for a room, but mid-four figures works for our budget. Additionally, many of the smaller ships don't have thermal suites, plus they seem a little stuffy with all the "enrichment" offered. Great if you want it, but I'll pass. I do think I'd enjoy the afternoon tea, but I can kind of make my own when I want it. 

 

We're too fat for the slides and go-karts (working on it, ok!), so those aren't really an attraction, but we did enjoy shooting hoops on our last cruise. 

 

Sorry Gary, not sure I just hijacked your post, but I thought it'd be helpful to show why this Millennial chooses the Haven over those smaller luxury ships. Not gonna lie though, you might find us on a Star Clipper or Uncruise cruise soon enough! 

[rxlowry]

I’m trying Oceania next year also.  Oceania is considered ultra premium though not luxury.  It doesn’t claim to be as it wants to fill the gap.  It doesn’t included alcohol and all luxury lines do.  It makes it a great option for non-drinkers since they don’t have to pay for something they do not use.  Oceania spends more per passenger on food than any line though so I’m very excited to try out their cuisine. 

[Laszlo]

I have to say on our cruise January 8th sailing on the Getaway their are a lot of Haven cabins still available and the price has been dropping. This morning I switched our Spa Balcony to a Haven Spa Balcony because I realized I could get it for less than my "Fair" bid on it. Maybe this is not the norm, I don't think the first or 2nd week of January is a popular time to cruise. But I'll take the savings

[Sthrngary]

26 minutes ago, cruiseny4life said:

Sorry Gary, not sure I just hijacked your post,

Do not be sorry.  That is why I wrote it.  Hijack away.  All comments are great comments and help people.  That is why I most mostly on CruiseCritic.com.  Folks have opinions and can give them with professionalism as you did.

 

Cruise well and enjoy every moment. 

[Sthrngary]

26 minutes ago, rxlowry said:

Oceania is considered ultra premium though not luxury.  

Yes, it is call both Ultra Premium and Luxury.  Vs. Ultra Luxury.  I should have used both in my post. Sorry, my bad.

 

28 minutes ago, rxlowry said:

 It doesn’t included alcohol and all luxury lines do.

One of the three perks, you have to choose on, is the drink program.  It is only beer and wine at meals.  You can upgrade to the Premium Drink Program when you get on the ship for $200.00 per person.  I am all in on that.  It took a while to figure out which one of the three perks I would take but this one was my strategy.  Food is very important to me.  We are going with our best friends and this will be their first cruise.  One drinks (a lot, lol) the other does not drink at all.  

 

With every choice you make on cruising and brands, just know the deal.  We need to do our own research and make the best choice for us.  The Haven is and always will be my first choice.  Yet when weight costs and considering our friends budgets, sometimes you have to deviate.  In this case, our friends ability to join is more important than the Haven on this trip. 

 

Cruise well and enjoy every moment.

[rxlowry]

I’m all about exploring options you might find something you like more than Haven.  We just returned two weeks ago from MSC Yacht Club in the Med which compared to my Joy Haven earlier this year had some things we liked and others we didn’t.  But doing research is key always!   I’m very excited to try Oceania though.  Just didn’t want others thinking it was luxury (Regent, Seabourn, Silversea, Seadream)

 

[thespiritmovesme]

Sometimes Oceania will have a "Get all 3" perks for selected cruises. We booked with "Choose 1" & then were able to upgrade to all 3 for no additional cost. It made an even better deal than originally. Watch ANY cruise you book for changes that may apply to you.

[Sthrngary]

12 minutes ago, thespiritmovesme said:

Sometimes Oceania will have a "Get all 3" perks for selected cruises. We booked with "Choose 1" & then were able to upgrade to all 3 for no additional cost. It made an even better deal than originally. Watch ANY cruise you book for changes that may apply to you.

Oh boy you just made my day. I watch every day.  That is great information. Thank you.

 

Cruise well and enjoy every moment.

[Sthrngary]

24 minutes ago, rxlowry said:

I’m all about exploring options you might find something you like more than Haven.  We just returned two weeks ago from MSC Yacht Club in the Med which compared to my Joy Haven earlier this year had some things we liked and others we didn’t.  But doing research is key always!   I’m very excited to try Oceania though.  Just didn’t want others thinking it was luxury (Regent, Seabourn, Silversea, Seadream)

 

Just a question for you. Did we cruise on the Joy together? I did the Joy twice. Once with my family in the Haven. Three months later solo in a Club Balcony Suite. You online name seems so familiar. 

[rxlowry]

4 minutes ago, Sthrngary said:

Just a question for you. Did we cruise on the Joy together? I did the Joy twice. Once with my family in the Haven. Three months later solo in a Club Balcony Suite. You online name seems so familiar. 

We have not yet had the pleasure of sailing together.  Just a long timer here on CC.  I have done a few LIVE reports here.  Just did the one on MSC and I guess I'll do a Breakaway one next week!

[Sthrngary]

7 minutes ago, rxlowry said:

We have not yet had the pleasure of sailing together.  Just a long timer here on CC.  I have done a few LIVE reports here.  Just did the one on MSC and I guess I'll do a Breakaway one next week!

I am very interested in your Breakaway comments.  I will be sailing her on December 4, 2022.  Have a great trip.

[phillygwm]

5 hours ago, Sthrngary said:

I will always have the thought in my head, “Life is too short, I would have really liked cruising in the Haven on the Prima.”  I however know, life is about choices.  Be educated and have realistic expectations for the money you invest.  What every decision you make, don’t look back, just enjoy the vacation.

Of course, as the novelty of Prima (and ultimately later ships) wears off, those prices will come down.  So unless you expect your time with us to be extremely limited, I fully expect I'll be reading your reviews of Prima Haven...maybe in another year or two.

[Dr. Cocktail]

Your thread is an excellent reminder for all - check ALL available possibilities!

 

If you're determined to visit a particular area on a particular date, you choices may be limited but with a little flexibility, your choices may greatly expand.

 

Having some upcoming cruises booked on Ultra-deluxe lines, I'm sort of shocked that my mid-level suites are actually cheaper than The Haven or Retreat on Celebrity.

 

I lOVE the Haven and have been lucky enough to have cruises many times but .... (first world worries) I hate always pulling out my card to purchase a drink, dislike all of the tipping (just include it and pay all your staff fairly) and dislike the additional charges for specialty restaurants. 

 

I have a couple of cruises booked on a cruise line that promises to be a MAJOR disruptor in the luxury division - Explora Journeys. They are MSC's entry into the luxury division and I like everything that they're promising.  I'm quite intrigued that they are under the radar of most cruisers out there ...