Sun Princess and missed port Montenegro

[ISABELLA]

2 hours ago, Sox Fan Cruiser said:

We skipped Kotor and went to Bar instead. The change was last minute and they had excursion online for us to book before the cruise. They also had excursions in our cabin when we arrived. No one complained that there was a “mad rush” to get tours. It was fine. We stayed on the ship as our Kotor guide told us that Bar was nothing special. Most people coming back confirmed that. Kotor was too far away to try and visit even though our guide was willing to come pick us up. 
 

We tendered in Santorini. There is nothing wrong with the ships tendering system because they could not sail if there was as it is also part of their emergency system. 
 

The landing is not for suite guests but an open area for all folks leaving the ship. There are seats for people to relax and a bar for selling water and other drinks. It’s used for both port stops and tendering. We never see the need for this space because we are never in the huge crowd waiting to go ashore. We always wait for most people to leave the ship and then we walk right off. 

We are on May 18 - June 1 sailing, NO SANTORINI, NO KOTOR. Got email prom Princess yesterday. This was my third attempt to visit Santorini - I guess, I will never see it. If they will replace Istanbul with something else, I will be very upset. 

[Sox Fan Cruiser]

Yeah, Princess has been pulling out of Santorini because of the cable cars.  It's a mess when there are a few ships in port.  We were the only ship in port and things started to get tense with the people waiting in line.  The long waits back to the ship leave a bad taste in peoples' mouths and they come back to the ship angry.  Princess is trying to avoid that negative experience.

 

But will STILL have never gotten and explanation for why they are skipping Kotor.  Very frustrating.

[cr2000]

1 hour ago, Sox Fan Cruiser said:

Bar is still Montenegro but I understand what you meant. 

Ah, yes, meant to say Kotor.

[TRLD]

5 minutes ago, Sox Fan Cruiser said:

Yeah, Princess has been pulling out of Santorini because of the cable cars.  It's a mess when there are a few ships in port.  We were the only ship in port and things started to get tense with the people waiting in line.  The long waits back to the ship leave a bad taste in peoples' mouths and they come back to the ship angry.  Princess is trying to avoid that negative experience.

 

But will STILL have never gotten and explanation for why they are skipping Kotor.  Very frustrating.

Did you go to any tender port on the Sun?  From what i.have seen on the schedules the only 2 are Kotor and Santorini and both have been replaced each cruise.

Edited April 26 by TRLD

[TRLD]

Just found this article

 

https://www.cruisehive.com/new-princess-cruises-ship-cancels-call-due-to-tendering-operations/125745

 

maybe it is a problem with the tender docks causing Santorini and Kotor to be replaced.

 

If so then these are changes due to a problem under the  control of the cruise line, not congestion or ship size, but a technical issue.

[EDVM96]

2 minutes ago, TRLD said:

maybe it is a problem with the tender docks causing Santorini and Kotor to be replaced.

 

No. Just read:

 

[TRLD]

3 minutes ago, EDVM96 said:

No. Just read:

 

Not on it's maiden call there on March 16 which the article was specifically about.

[TRLD]

3 hours ago, Esprit said:

The Sun has definitely tendered in Santorini. Can't remember if it was in March or earlier this month though!

Not on its maiden March 16 call. Every cruise after that seems to have been changed.

 

Other than Kotor the first tender port for the Sun is now Nov 12 in Belieze City  Kotor still showing on some itineraries.

Edited April 26 by TRLD

[EDVM96]

12 minutes ago, TRLD said:

Not on it's maiden call there on March 16 which the article was specifically about.

What I wanted to say is skipping Kotor or Santorini has nothing to do with the ships tender operations.

[TRLD]

Just now, EDVM96 said:

What I wanted to say is skipping Kotor or Santorini has nothing to do with the ships tender operations.

Then why?

 

They are the only 2 tender ports on the Sun's schedule. Princess sent out a letter for its planned maiden call on Santorini saying it was changed due to a problem with tender operations.

 

As far as I have tried to find any example of the Sun completing a call on a tender port without success.

 

A couple of posts where people have indicated that they though it did, but no hard date.

[Sox Fan Cruiser]

I was on the Sun Princess April 8th voyage and we went to Santorini using tenders.  It is not a tendering issue.  (And please don't respond that we didn't use the ships tenders so they must be broken.) It's a cable car issue in Santorini.

[capriccio]

5 minutes ago, TRLD said:

As far as I have tried to find any example of the Sun completing a call on a tender port without success.

 

 

@Sox Fan Cruiser has first hand experience

1 hour ago, Sox Fan Cruiser said:

Yeah, Princess has been pulling out of Santorini because of the cable cars.  It's a mess when there are a few ships in port.  We were the only ship in port and things started to get tense with the people waiting in line.

 

But will STILL have never gotten and explanation for why they are skipping Kotor.  Very frustrating.

 

@Sox Fan Cruiser We were posting at the same time.  I was looking up the name of your great thread

 

 

Edited April 26 by capriccio

[Sox Fan Cruiser]

2 minutes ago, Sox Fan Cruiser said:

I was on the Sun Princess April 8th voyage and we went to Santorini using tenders.  It is not a tendering issue.  (And please don't respond that we didn't use the ships tenders so they must be broken.) It's a cable car issue in Santorini.

But now that I look at the article they did say for "tendering reasons" so I am confused too.  But I really think that Santorini is because of the cable car experience when there are a lot of ships in port.

 

[TRLD]

3 hours ago, Sox Fan Cruiser said:

We skipped Kotor and went to Bar instead. The change was last minute and they had excursion online for us to book before the cruise. They also had excursions in our cabin when we arrived. No one complained that there was a “mad rush” to get tours. It was fine. We stayed on the ship as our Kotor guide told us that Bar was nothing special. Most people coming back confirmed that. Kotor was too far away to try and visit even though our guide was willing to come pick us up. 
 

We tendered in Santorini. There is nothing wrong with the ships tendering system because they could not sail if there was as it is also part of their emergency system. 
 

The landing is not for suite guests but an open area for all folks leaving the ship. There are seats for people to relax and a bar for selling water and other drinks. It’s used for both port stops and tendering. We never see the need for this space because we are never in the huge crowd waiting to go ashore. We always wait for most people to leave the ship and then we walk right off. 

Which date did you tender?

 

Actually keep in mind that emergency use of the life boats is totally different then use as a tender.

 

When used as life boats they are loaded from the deck, on most princess ships deck 7. Then lowered to the water.

 

When used as tenders they are lowered and then pull up to the tender dock. 

 

Totally different operations.  If there was an issue with one or more tender docks, would have no impact on emergency operations.

 

 when you tendered were they using both tender docks?  In Santorini they would have used local boats. How fast was tendering operations? Any delays? Anything seem unusual compared to other ships.

[TRLD]

17 minutes ago, Sox Fan Cruiser said:

But now that I look at the article they did say for "tendering reasons" so I am confused too.  But I really think that Santorini is because of the cable car experience when there are a lot of ships in port.

 

I crossed posts so did not have the date during my last post. i just keep coming back to the only tender ports are the ones getting swapped.

 

They apparently paid OBC for the first change. Which makes sense if it was a technical issue.

 

Now except for your call on Samtorini they have rescheduled the tender calls but not giving obc or reason, though I think I just read someone post that they said technical tender restrictions for a recent Kotor cancellation.

 

If it is a technical problem they should be giving obc.

Edited April 26 by TRLD

[Sox Fan Cruiser]

We stopped in Santorini on April 14th using the Santorini tender boats.  They took Princess shore excursions to the far port as they boarded buses to then go on their excursions and then took the rest of us to the cable car port.  

 

All shore excursions were supposed to drop their passengers at the top of the cable cars to get back to the ship but since the line was so long the took some back by bus to the other dock and they ran tenders from there as well.

 

They even pulled up anchor and moved the ship close to the dock to make the tender ride shorter!  I've never experienced that before.  

 

And again, we were the only big cruise ship in port!  Full disclosure:  There was one smaller ship that got there in the afternoon and was saying until 11 so they weren't in our queue to leave the island.

 

To answer your other question, tendering seemed as normal as any other ship.  We were the first ones off the ship on the first tender (a suite perk) but didn't notice any difference either to the island or back to the ship.

Edited April 26 by Sox Fan Cruiser

[TRLD]

22 minutes ago, Sox Fan Cruiser said:

We stopped in Santorini on April 14th using the Santorini tender boats.  They took Princess shore excursions to the far port as they boarded buses to then go on their excursions and then took the rest of us to the cable car port.  

 

All shore excursions were supposed to drop their passengers at the top of the cable cars to get back to the ship but since the line was so long the took some back by bus to the other dock and they ran tenders from there as well.

 

They even pulled up anchor and moved the ship close to the dock to make the tender ride shorter!  I've never experienced that before.  

 

And again, we were the only big cruise ship in port!  Full disclosure:  There was one smaller ship that got there in the afternoon and was saying until 11 so they weren't in our queue to leave the island.

The use of the old and new ports is normal upon arrival is normal.

 

 Taking some passengers back to the new port is not, unless the excursion was designed to end there.

 

Have been there with 11000 passengers in port and Princess still ran normally back in 2015 though I recall that Santorini started limiting passengers to 8000 in 2017, though do not know what limit is today.

 

Santorini exercises very tight control over tender operations.

 

Were they using both tender docks or running everyone through 1.

 

Normally they will have both tender docks on the same side open for tender operations.  Using both docks. The docking location  and which ever side is most sheltered determines which side.

 

 

 

Edited April 26 by TRLD

[Esprit]

Thanks @Sox Fan Cruiserfor confirming your stop at Santorini. I remember seeing from the land based webcam that it was particularly windy that day.

 

As for the tendering process. In all the years I have visited Santorini (either with Princess or Celebrity) we have never been on the ship's own tenders. The Islanders provide them and they are more than adequate to transport passengers back and forth without too much delay for sometimes up to 4 ships at anchor! The tenders also always took us to the dock nearest the cable car and entrance to the 588 steps up!

 

I am hopeful our Sun visit on 13 August will go ahead as the other three ships in that day are arriving and leaving at different times which will ease the pressure on the cable cars, but the passenger count will be 12,000 in total!

 

 

[mikemonster]

We finally received the "Booking Itinerary Change" Notice last night (I'm in NorCal)

 

Still no excursions on Personalizer. I've noticed that Princess usually sends out emails and does web updates around 9:00AM (PST) so we'll see if there are any updates.

 

Regarding speculation on the port changes.( ports are controlled by local authorities)

Santorini- (I can't find the article I read) but earlier this year the port was performing work on the gondola system and closed the port to all ships while the work was being performed. There was also discussion at that time to limiting the number of ships/passengers in port at daily as the port could not handle the ever increasing number of visitors.

 

Kotor- Similar to the passenger overload issue in Santorini coupled with possibly number of tenders could possibly the problem with Kotor which has shifted to using Bar.

[SPECULATION] Princess may have run into issues with Montenegro port authority which they most likely have agreements in place to use their ports which may have forced the change to Bar (an alternate Montenegro port) rather than switching to Dubrovnik for instance , who knows. 

bottom line is Kotor is out for Sun Princess.

 

As for this latest change to Bar, we are traveling with 2 other couples and have cancelled our Kortor excursion, with no options being offered yet by Princess, our research finding few options in Bar and the weather forecast for showers,.

 

We have developed our own excursion for Bar, Montenegro.

"BAR CRAWL"

With 29 bars onboard we have decided to "visit" as many as we can while in port, taking advantage of our "Plus and/or Premier drink packages"

.'when life deals you lemons, make limoncello.....'

mike. 

Edited April 26 by mikemonster

[cruisequeen4ever]

After experiencing multiple canceled ports in the Med by Princess over the years due to “operational reasons”, my husband has long stated that the bigger ships are more problematic for these ports. 

[TRLD]

3 hours ago, Esprit said:

Thanks @Sox Fan Cruiserfor confirming your stop at Santorini. I remember seeing from the land based webcam that it was particularly windy that day.

 

As for the tendering process. In all the years I have visited Santorini (either with Princess or Celebrity) we have never been on the ship's own tenders. The Islanders provide them and they are more than adequate to transport passengers back and forth without too much delay for sometimes up to 4 ships at anchor! The tenders also always took us to the dock nearest the cable car and entrance to the 588 steps up!

 

I am hopeful our Sun visit on 13 August will go ahead as the other three ships in that day are arriving and leaving at different times which will ease the pressure on the cable cars, but the passenger count will be 12,000 in total!

 

 

Yes Santorini has required their tenders for years. 

 

When I say tender operations I am not saying the tenders themselves more likely an issue with the tender docks.

 

Could be any number of potential issues. Problems with one of more of the hatches/dock themselves, the height relative to the tenders, the way the tenders tie off, etc. Anything that impacts the loading/unloading process or potentially could make it less safe. If there is any potential known safety issue they would certainly not tender.

 

What we do know is that Princess said that they canceled their maiden voyage to Santorini saying that there was a technical problem with tender operations.

 

There has been 1 stop with tendering in Santorini but no other tender stops. Which might indicate that they thought they had resolved the issue but then discovered that it was not resolved. 

 

Would be interesting to know if on that cruise if Kotor was scheduled before or after Santorini. If after if Kotor was cancelled before or after the Santorini stop. @Sox Fan Cruiser

 

A couple of the Kotor cancellations have been for technical tendering restrictions. Without saying if those were port restrictions, of ship technical restrictions.

 

They have said  that the Santorini cancellations have been due to congestion. Which does match with a couple of dates in June and late May where there is about 15000 passengers in port and the Sun is in port with larger NCL ships.

 

However it does not match with some of the cancelled dates where there were 5000 to 7000 in port. A light load as far as Santorini is concerned.  In the past Princess has gone to Santorini with much heavier passenger numbers in port.

 

 

Edited April 26 by TRLD

[Globaler]

I will never sail a new ship within a one year period. Nothing but problems, broken promises and total disappointment. Too much money and so many other cruise ships and cruise lines. wow Princess has caused some major brand damage on this one.

Edited April 26 by Globaler

[capriccio]

28 minutes ago, Globaler said:

wow Princess has caused some major brand damage on this one.

Definitely amongst those of us paying close attention.  I  wonder how many Signature Suite passengers that don't read Cruise Critic or FB will be shocked when they board after October 14th at the changes to what they were promised.  There is an uproar now, imagine what the reactions when confronted with the changes upon boarding.

Edited April 26 by capriccio

[mofurd]

Just got an email from my TA with the notification from Princess attached: 

 

“Please be advised that due to technical restrictions affecting our water shuttle operations, Sun Princess will no longer call to Kotor, Montenegro on Monday, May 27. Instead, we will now call to the historic town of Bar, Montenegro from 7:00 AM to 6:00 PM on that day.”

[TRLD]

Now if only we knew what they mean by technical restrictions.