Treatment by HAL

[Home at last]

I know this was posted below, but I was on a cruisetour on the Statendam and received pretty much the same treatment. Here is a copy of the letter I am sending to HAL and just about everyone else. This was not our first cruise with them. It may very well be our last.

 

We have just returned home from what should have been the trip of a lifetime. Unfortunately, we discovered that Holland America has no idea of how to handle an emergency and their representatives truly need some customer service training.

My husband and I have been loyal Mariners over three cruises with HAL. At the end of this last cruise to Alaska, we decided to take a land tour to Denali National Park. This being Alaska, there was plenty of rain during the entire trip. Right after our arrival in Denali, the road and railroad washed out. And so it started.

We were told to put our bags outside our hotel room as usual on the morning of our departure. That was the last we saw them (it is now 5 days later). No one seemed to know how we were going to leave. But leave we must..there were other cruises that had to be brought in. Since the road to Anchorage was closed due to a bridge being out, along with the railroad that was supposed to be our way back to Anchorage, we were put on busses to Fairbanks. No one could tell us where our luggage was, nor could they tell us how we were going to get out of Fairbanks. The pat answer was, “We’re doing the best we can.” To me, this meant they were doing nothing. They did put us up in a hotel, but the next morning, the answers were still the same. “We’re doing the best we can.”

They finally were able to put those of us who made the most noise on planes to Anchorage. We still had no luggage. And then…we were on our own.

I cannot believe that a multi-billion dollar company such as Carnival Cruise Lines, the parent company of Holland America, has never had such an emergency. I’m not blaming them for the weather. I am blaming them for the total lack of communication, the lack of caring for their passengers (many of whom were senior citizens and possibly not in the best of health), and the lack of any customer service except to those who yelled the loudest.

All of this took place on Sunday, August 20 and Monday, August 21. Today is August 27 and our baggage supposedly was just located, still in Fairbanks. The only way we found out that much was due to our travel agent. We called directly and couldn’t even reach a human being.

So, be aware that, should anything untoward happen during a land tour, Holland America will do nothing they do not have to, to help their passengers. Be sure to purchase travel insurance. And have a good travel agent to act on your behalf. Otherwise, you may be stuck in some out of the way location and never see your baggage again.

[sail7seas]

I am so sorry for what you and the other poster (and all those on your tour) endured. What a terrible end to a great cruise.

 

I have repeatedly said on this BB that I have no desire to cruise Alaska.....your experience certainly does not encourage me to change my mind.

 

Good luck. I hope your luggage turns up soon and hope you will keep us up to date as to whatever else occurs in this matter.

 

[Krazy Kruizers]

So sorry to hear about your sad ending to a wonderful cruise.

 

Hopefully you will get your luggage back,

[R&R on a cruise]

Yes, I can really sympathize with you. Were all of the people in your tour without their luggage or any support from Holland America too? They do such a wonderful job of being organized on their cruises, it is too bad it all falls apart on the land tours. I would never do a land tour again. I would rather be on my own and able to make my own decisions. Hopefully you will soon have your luggage.

 

By the way, whom did you send the letter to? I have one to write too!!!

[Love Cruises]

I know this was posted below, but I was on a cruisetour on the Statendam and received pretty much the same treatment. Here is a copy of the letter I am sending to HAL and just about everyone else. This was not our first cruise with them. It may very well be our last.

 

We have just returned home from what should have been the trip of a lifetime. Unfortunately, we discovered that Holland America has no idea of how to handle an emergency and their representatives truly need some customer service training.

My husband and I have been loyal Mariners over three cruises with HAL. At the end of this last cruise to Alaska, we decided to take a land tour to Denali National Park. This being Alaska, there was plenty of rain during the entire trip. Right after our arrival in Denali, the road and railroad washed out. And so it started.

We were told to put our bags outside our hotel room as usual on the morning of our departure. That was the last we saw them (it is now 5 days later). No one seemed to know how we were going to leave. But leave we must..there were other cruises that had to be brought in. Since the road to Anchorage was closed due to a bridge being out, along with the railroad that was supposed to be our way back to Anchorage, we were put on busses to Fairbanks. No one could tell us where our luggage was, nor could they tell us how we were going to get out of Fairbanks. The pat answer was, “We’re doing the best we can.” To me, this meant they were doing nothing. They did put us up in a hotel, but the next morning, the answers were still the same. “We’re doing the best we can.”

They finally were able to put those of us who made the most noise on planes to Anchorage. We still had no luggage. And then…we were on our own.

I cannot believe that a multi-billion dollar company such as Carnival Cruise Lines, the parent company of Holland America, has never had such an emergency. I’m not blaming them for the weather. I am blaming them for the total lack of communication, the lack of caring for their passengers (many of whom were senior citizens and possibly not in the best of health), and the lack of any customer service except to those who yelled the loudest.

All of this took place on Sunday, August 20 and Monday, August 21. Today is August 27 and our baggage supposedly was just located, still in Fairbanks. The only way we found out that much was due to our travel agent. We called directly and couldn’t even reach a human being.

So, be aware that, should anything untoward happen during a land tour, Holland America will do nothing they do not have to, to help their passengers. Be sure to purchase travel insurance. And have a good travel agent to act on your behalf. Otherwise, you may be stuck in some out of the way location and never see your baggage again.

Sorry to read of your dilemma. It is very disappointing that HAL did not handle the matter well. Your letter is really good and I hope others read it. We have been to Alaska already on CRYSTAL but were thinking of doing a tour on HAL because of the land tour. Now, I am really not that prone to want to book one because of your problems which were so uncalled for. Again, this is really very disappointing. Hopefully, it will not sour you on any future cruises.

[Tinknock50]

Personally, I don't reccommend Cruisline land tours to beigin with. Way overpriced when you consider the cost is per person.

 

Rent a car or take the train yourself. Of course, with the bad weather , no one could get through, but it doesn't sound like you fared very well relying on the cruisline.

 

Also, you can book just about any tour with the Alaska Railroad.

 

I will never forget being able to board the train at Denali while the HAL passengers had to wait in those roped off pens. Made me feel special because I could just walk on. The regular cars we were not as fancy as HAL cars, but very nice, uncrowded and comfortable.:)

[jhannah]

So ground transport to Anchorage was out, right? I wonder how often this happens ... where rail is out as well as roads/bridges? Probably not all that often. Such departures from the norm are extremely hard to make allowances for. So many factors have to be looked after, with people being first ... ahead of the proper disposition of luggage.

 

Once in Fairbanks, how many afternoon/evening flights are available running to Anchorage? And how many of those have available space? I think it's safe to say that not everyone could be accommodated the same day. That's a shame. Truly a disappointing way to end your cruisetour.

 

What, specifically, do you think HAL should have done? Lots of people you never see are working the issues, so truly those people you did see likely did not know what exactly was going to happen next. Economically this had to be a real blow to their margins on this sailing. It was in HAL's best interest to resolve things as quickly as they could for everyone. Maybe it wasn't what you wanted ... but I'm sure it wasn't what HAL wanted, either.

[thomasale]

So ground transport to Anchorage was out, right? I wonder how often this happens ... where rail is out as well as roads/bridges? Probably not all that often. Such departures from the norm are extremely hard to make allowances for. So many factors have to be looked after, with people being first ... ahead of the proper disposition of luggage.

 

Once in Fairbanks, how many afternoon/evening flights are available running to Anchorage? And how many of those have available space? I think it's safe to say that not everyone could be accommodated the same day. That's a shame. Truly a disappointing way to end your cruisetour.

 

What, specifically, do you think HAL should have done? Lots of people you never see are working the issues, so truly those people you did see likely did not know what exactly was going to happen next. Economically this had to be a real blow to their margins on this sailing. It was in HAL's best interest to resolve things as quickly as they could for everyone. Maybe it wasn't what you wanted ... but I'm sure it wasn't what HAL wanted, either.

 

Jim, with all due respect, it always surprises me that when someone experiences and expresses what they perceive as a problem, there is someone defending the cruiseline. I, too look for the positive and do not believe my reaction to this problem would have been the same as OP but I empathize with them.

 

Please do not read into this as an attack against you or your fine posts as that is NOT what it is meant as. I have come to appreciate your valuable postings and most of all your positive attitude, however I have come to believe that when someone expresses an experience such as this that it is better left uncommented on. JMHO...

 

Respectfully,

[ocngypz]

Hello Home:

 

I empathize with you. I was caught in the mess the same as you.

 

No, this has not happened before. The rains,,, the washed out railbeds, bridges, rock slides........it was not a pretty sight.

 

After you left, it got worse before it got better.

 

All the land operators did the best they could under the circumstances and tried to keep people and baggage moving as expeditously as possible with people taking precedence. Flights out of Alaska were oversold, a couple were cancelled.

 

Oh.. what a week.

 

BUT, I saw McKinley, a good display of the Northern Lights, hit paydirt in my gold pan, frolicked with husky puppies, many animal sightings... even a crazy moose who decided to cut in front of our coach..talk about a personal encounter. And I ate like a piggie, slept like a baby.

 

Did I like the delays?? A tortuous train ride? Late arrival? Flight bumps? NO!

 

But I loved Alaska.

 

No one could say for certain where any luggage was. It was pulled at the designated time, and sent ahead. Some coaches/trucks had to stop. They couldn't get through. Getting folks reticketed for flights which did not have room a nightmare. Securing hotel space for unexpected guests when known arrivals due, difficult. It situations such as these, there are no definite answers.

[kryos]

I have repeatedly said on this BB that I have no desire to cruise Alaska.....your experience certainly does not encourage me to change my mind.

I'm with you, Sail. I have absolutely no desire at this point in my life to set foot in the 49th state. To me a cruise should be warm weather climates ... not an icy (not to mention rainy) tundra.

 

I wonder too how much HAL controls the land tour portion of their cruise product? Betcha they have a cooperative arrangement with an outfit that actually provides the services. Hence, HAL is only going to have so much control.

 

No thanks. When I take a cruise ... I want to focus on the cruise experience ... not a land tour. With Alaska, pretty much if you want anything more than a seven-day vacation, you've got to tack on a land tour ... either that or do a b2b cruise.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[PRINSENDAM]

I'm with you, Sail. I have absolutely no desire at this point in my life to set foot in the 49th state. To me a cruise should be warm weather climates ... not an icy (not to mention rainy) tundra.

 

 

 

You are missing a great expereience. Everyone should cruise Alaska at least ONCE. Pick the right cruise and you might have perfect weather and the place is beautiful. Pick the wrong cruise and, weather wise, it can be disappointing. Remember, it rains in the Caribbean as well... AND you can get a hurricane. In Alaska you only get Force 12 winds and heavy seas!!!!!! But you are right, if warm sunny weather is a main requirement on a cruise.... booking Alaska can be risky. Honestly, in more than 15 cruises to Alaska for the most part I've enjoyed very good weather. Late September and you can be pushing your luck. June, July.... it is usually OK.

 

I wonder too how much HAL controls the land tour portion of their cruise product? Betcha they have a cooperative arrangement with an outfit that actually provides the services. Hence, HAL is only going to have so much control.

 

 

It is my understanding that HAL controls most of the land tours. Remember the name was HAL-Westours.

 

No thanks. When I take a cruise ... I want to focus on the cruise experience ... not a land tour. With Alaska, pretty much if you want anything more than a seven-day vacation, you've got to tack on a land tour ... either that or do a b2b cruise.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

 

The 'cruise' experience to Alaska is just fine. When most pax are ashore the ship is yours!

Two weeks today and I shall be on the WESTERDAM for a 7 day run out of Seattle...... then join STATENDAM for a b2b. OK, three weeks in Alaska is a bit much by any standard. That's why we will stay on STATENDAM for the 4 week run across the Pacific to Auckland!

On an Alaska cruise you will find two types. First type is the cruise passenger. It is a ship. It cruises. It calls at Alaskan ports. Alaska, Norway, Chilie..... it is just another fjord. The second type are the outdoors type. Looking out for wildlife and enjoying nature. Easy to spot the difference. One group wears dinner jackets and the other will be wearing high visibility red hunting jackets! That's the guys. For the ladies, most will be dressed in nice cocktail dresses... with perhaps just a few wearing hiking boots.

Stephen

[kryos]

You are missing a great expereience. Everyone should cruise Alaska at least ONCE.

Oh, believe me, one day I will ... just not right now. There are still too many other cruises I want to take first ... so little time ... so little money. :(

 

But, I think when I do decide to cruise Alaska ... as much as I love HAL, I'd prefer to go on a much smaller ship ... perhaps Cruise West ... so as to enjoy the voyage in a more intimate setting ... not to mention getting much more "up close and personal" with the wildlife than is possible on a larger ship.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[PRINSENDAM]

Oh, believe me, one day I will ... just not right now. There are still too many other cruises I want to take first ... so little time ... so little money. :(

 

But, I think when I do decide to cruise Alaska ... as much as I love HAL, I'd prefer to go on a much smaller ship ... perhaps Cruise West ... so as to enjoy the voyage in a more intimate setting ... not to mention getting much more "up close and personal" with the wildlife than is possible on a larger ship.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

 

 

Rita,

 

Sail on the Vista ships and you can get 'up close and personal' with as much 'wildlife' as anyone would wish!!!!

 

Yes, a small ship would be a good way to enjoy Alaska. Would have to be at least two weeks though.

 

The advantage of sailing Alaska on HAL is the green pea soup served about the decks during the day in Glacier Bay. Not to be missed!

 

Stephen

[SDHALFAN]

 

But, I think when I do decide to cruise Alaska ... as much as I love HAL, I'd prefer to go on a much smaller ship ... perhaps Cruise West ... so as to enjoy the voyage in a more intimate setting ... not to mention getting much more "up close and personal" with the wildlife than is possible on a larger ship.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

 

 

Hi Rita,

 

I know that you are a pretty savvy cruiser but I am wondering just exactly what kind of wildlife you are expecting to see on a cruise ship in Alaska (apart from that mentioned by Prinsendam - that was funny:D )? Depending on the time of year one may have some "whale sightings" (or not). In places like Glacier Bay one can see seals resting on ice floes and an occasional bird, of some sort or another, flying overhead but that's about it, regardless of the size of the ship. I kept looking everywhere we sailed for Puffins but never did see one.

 

The advantage of a smaller ship is that it can get closer to the glaciers in Glacier Bay, and the other bays and fjords.

 

If you want to see Alaskan wildlife then you need to take a shore excursion or two. Trust me, you will see so many Bald Eagles there that you will wonder how on earth they can be considered "an endangered species". It got to the point on one shore excursion I took that when the tour guide said "oh look, there's a Bald Eagle in that tree," everyone on the bus yawned and said "oh another one - who cares?":D In order to see Bears and Salmon you will need to take an excursion that takes you to a river area.

 

There is an awful lot of fascinating wildlife in Alaska but you are not going to see it on a cruiseship, no matter what size it is.

 

That said, I enjoyed my cruise to Alaska but, honestly, have no desire to go back. I find the scenery in my home state of California to be equally amazing. Okay the highest mountain in the U.S. is in Alaska, but the highest mountain in the contiguous U.S. is here in California. Granted that area is not particularly attractive but you should see The Trinity Alps area in northern California, or our beaches here in southern California and our deserts which seem strange at first but the more you visit them the more fascinating they become, talk about Flora and Fauna!

 

I think that everyone should visit Alaska once - it truly is an experience that won't be soon forgotten.

 

I just realised that I have gone on and on and that I am totally off topic. I sincerely apologise. I just got carried away with the Alaska "thing".

 

To those of you who endured so much after your cruise (what with lost luggage, lack of any kind of information whatsoever, delayed/cancelled flights, etc.) once again you have my sincerest sympathy and I hope that HAL will at least offer to make reparations, and I am looking forward to hearing about the outcome if you care to share it with us.

 

Once again, you have all exhibited far more patience than I have considering the circumstances. You all handled it with Class - I probably would not have been nearly so classy.

 

Valerie:)

[ocngypz]

The hotels, coaches, trucks, tour directors, drivers.... all HAL employees.

The HAL rail cars are HAL owned.

 

The school buses into Denali are not HAL's. They belong to the park. The optional excursions available on landtours are contracted. Most provide their own transporation to and from the hotels/attractions.

 

The railroad is private. The cruiselines pay to have their cars pulled.

 

Naturally, the air... belongs to the airline.

[Home at last]

R&R...

 

I sent the letter to the CEO of Holland America, Stein Kruse.

 

It wasn't that there was a problem, just so everyone understands my point. It was the way we, as customers, were kept apprised of whatever arrangements were being made. You can tolerate a lot if you are treated honestly and fairly and with respect. We were not treated with any of those and THAT is why we finally had to take matters into our own hands.

[newmexicoNita]

Unfortunitely this is a story heard over and over from most all mass marketed lines these days. It seem the cruise lines don't know how to handle a bad situation.

 

As for not doing an Alaskan tour, I don't think I would book one in conjustion with a cruise either, but I would love to do the inside. we have done the cruise part; as someone mentioned, you won't see much wildlife. I think that is what disappointed us the most. What we thought we would see while sailing I have no idea, but we didn't see it, whatever it was.

 

I certainly hope your bags will arrive in the next day or two. Please keep us posted as to any response you get from HAL> NMnita

[hammybee]

Unfortunitely this is a story heard over and over from most all mass marketed lines these days. It seem the cruise lines don't know how to handle a bad situation. NMnita

 

In the real world, it's called business recovery/continuity . Each business determines the most likely risks, the consequences and then, where approprite, how to mitigate the damages and function.

 

It requires empowering the people on the front lines to make decisions within established protocols. And it extends to the contractual relationships the business maintains. It should be SOP, in a situation like this, to hand out vouchers for food, personal essentials and whatever else it reasonably takes to mitigate the situation. It also requires making sure that someone is designated to follow-though with the customer.

 

At the very least, if someone at HAL called the passengers, impacted by this mess, it might have gone a long way towards maintaining confidence and making them feel like cherished customers.

[RedmondCruiser]

Hammybe hit the nail on the head. Any business should be prepared for negative occurances. Besides mitigating action, the prime factor is communication. I fould, having owned a business for twenty years that people appreciate communication even though it may be bad news thats coming. They will be much more apt to forgive you if they at least know that you are trying. There will always be a 5 or 10% group that you can never please. Forget them -- its the other 90% that will appreciate your efforts.

 

A friend was working for Princess when the old Star Princess ran aground on the Lind Canal. It was a logistical nightmare, but they through every available persons in on the problem and empowered them to make rather large financial decisions on the spot. Thats the way to handle a problem.

 

A person who has a positive cruise expirience makes a great spoksman for your cruise line, while a customer who does not wants to tell everybody.

[hammybee]

Hammybe hit the nail on the head. Any business should be prepared for negative occurances. Besides mitigating action, the prime factor is communication. I fould, having owned a business for twenty years that people appreciate communication even though it may be bad news thats coming. They will be much more apt to forgive you if they at least know that you are trying. There will always be a 5 or 10% group that you can never please. Forget them -- its the other 90% that will appreciate your efforts.

 

A friend was working for Princess when the old Star Princess ran aground on the Lind Canal. It was a logistical nightmare, but they through every available persons in on the problem and empowered them to make rather large financial decisions on the spot. Thats the way to handle a problem.

 

A person who has a positive cruise expirience makes a great spoksman for your cruise line, while a customer who does not wants to tell everybody.

 

Back in the days when people used phones to shop the catalogs, there was a company that, when innundated with calls, had a recorded message telling customers that they were overwhelmed with calls and asked them to be patient. At the same time, they made it worth the customer's time to wait because the wait = a discount and the longer the customer had to wait, the greater the discount.

 

As anyone who frequently shopped the catalogs by phone, during holiday time knows, the waits were often frustrating. This company however, made the wait a game. Instead of growing frustrated with each passing minute, I was thinking, " take all the time you need". In fact, as the minutes passed, I thought about what else I might order, given the discount and ended up buying more than I originally planned, a win-win for the company and the customer. And heck for all I know, that might have been their strategy all along. There are just some companies that really, really get it.

 

As it relates to OP and related situations, assume that for whatever reason, the passengers were inconvenienced and potentially put at risk, if they had meds in the MIA luggage and the front line was not empowered to take action. HAL, or any cruise line in a similar situation, still had the opportunity to control the damage, after the fact.

 

What might be the passengers' reaction if HAL took the initiative and called them afterwords to appologise and then followed up with a "Be our Guest" invitation equal to a meaningful but reasonable discount or shipboard credit. Might the passengers be on this board singing the praises of HAL, instead of expressing this woes. Most people know that ship happens everywhere and it is often those that are best able to effect damage control, after the fact, that win the day.

 

I am not suggesting that HAL take responsibility for door to door care of passengers. If an airline loses a passenger's luggage, the problem exists between the passenger and the air carrier, not the cruise line. But when on a pre or post cruise tour, especially in HAL dominated Alaska, and things go haywire, yeah, I think HAL is a stakeholder and they missed a good opportunity to turn the situation around.

[jagsfan]

What exacerbates the problem every time is the perception of lack of caring

by the people that represent the cruise line/tour company/airline.

Seems like every other time I fly there's a delay that doesn't get explained,

you're left to sit and wait, and airline staff starts getting snippy. If HAL

ees or anyone elses pastes on a smile and knocks themselves out to at least

appear concerned about the person they are talking to, it would all be

easier to bear. Communication and empathy go a long way when there are

problems. Too bad that didn't happen for these people who had such a

terrible end to their cruise and tour.

[Home at last]

You are so right!

 

Here's the latest...I had a call today from HAL that stated they did not have my street addy to send the bags to. I know it was given to them 3 times..once by my husband while in Fairbanks and twice by the TA (while we were sitting in the office). So they got it again.

 

Supposedly, the bags will be shipped back tomorrow and we will have them in 2-3 days. We'll see.

 

PS..Vegas Jim..I would like to see how forgiving of the line you would be had you been with us.

[MBeamTX]

The advantage of sailing Alaska on HAL is the green pea soup served about the decks during the day in Glacier Bay. Not to be missed!

And the Glacier Baileys! :D

[MBeamTX]

What might be the passengers' reaction if HAL took the initiative and called them afterwords to appologise and then followed up with a "Be our Guest" invitation equal to a meaningful but reasonable discount or shipboard credit. Might the passengers be on this board singing the praises of HAL, instead of expressing this woes. Most people know that ship happens everywhere and it is often those that are best able to effect damage control, after the fact, that win the day.

 

A couple of years ago, I was in the middle of a business trip that had me hopping around among cities in Texas. I was flying on American Airlines. My boss and I got to DFW and went hurtling between terminals trying to make our connection. We got to the gate to find the plane was delayed. And delayed. And delayed some more. It was irritating and we got to our destination hours late. But it seemed like business as usual for the airlines, right?

 

That's why I was amazed to get an email a week or so later from some VP at American apologizing for the delay and saying that they were crediting 7,000 frequent flyer miles to my account for my inconvenience. I was really impressed - so much so that I kept the email and came across it again the other day.

 

I still fly American whenever possible. They don't always "get it." But sometimes they do.

 

Happy cruising (and flying),

Susan

[Home at last]

Today is Friday. We arrived home over a week ago. We got the first of our 4 bags delivered by DHL today. No one can give me any information about the other 3.

 

Can anyone guess why I'm not happy?