Royal Champions

[jaxon41]

Ladder 55,

 

I am wondering where and when this was posted -- does anyone know?

 

"I contacted Laura Sterling, Cruise Critic’s community manager about the Royal Champion program. She did not reply to my e-mails. However, she did write a general post to all board readers regarding the Royal Champion program where she says the program is for “influencing others who are not customers to sail on Royal Caribbean.” She adds, “It’s the new trend on the Web, and it will be here to stay. It’s the reason our site is so popular. The consumer voice sells product.”

 

We have become a nation of sceptics, and we have been given a million reasons to be. Politics has taught us that when one evades an interview, an email, etc., it is generally because the ducks are being put in a row. When one disparages a messenger, it is generally because they find the message unwelcome and discomforting. If you have been an adult in the last 40 years, and have not learned these lessons, you have been asleep in the body politic. For anyone to ask us to ignore what life has taught us nearly daily, is an outrage, or an agenda. Unfortunately, innocents can and do get caught in the whirl, but given the sceptics that we have become, innocence is not a given, but something that has to be proven. In a photoshopped, annonymous blogged, M$M world, that is not a bad thing.

[Ladylouwho]

I am not a Royal Champion, however I do know many of them. To the best of my knowledge, there are no rules in the program. Some have been invited to a pre inaugural and others, I believe, may have participated in focus groups. They are free to cruise on whichever line they choose and be as vocal for or against any cruise line or policy they wish..... no rules or contracts to sign!!

 

Right. That is exactly what I said. The other Loyalty programs have set rules and the RC program does not. We agree completely.

[jaxon41]

5 waldo's,

exactly! And the kicker is RCCL said it themselves:

"Rachel Hannock, Manager Loyalty Marketing and Royal Caribbean Cruises shared there story at a recent loyalty marketing conference. Hannock noted, “The key to success in viral marketing is to subtly influence the influencers without them overtly realizing they are being influenced.”

[bickee]

I have just found out about this by reading this thread today, and I will admit it rubs me the wrong way. Having been a member of CC for a few years now I know that ANYTHING and EVERYTHING has been discussed ad nauseum to the tiniest detail. Whether it's upgrades or loyalty programs or the newest RCI T-shirt. And yet we never heard anyone discuss how they had been chosen as a member of the "RC" club. Seems odd to me. Why is that? What is the secrecy for? It just seems a bit strange.

 

Also whether or not you've received "perks" doesn't mean that people don't have the mindset of posting more often for the possibility of perks...and no I don't expect these people to post 100% raving reviews...because the intelligent wouldn't take those seriously. I would, however, listen to a review which discusses highs and lows but leans toward the highs...definitely pushing RCI. I also recognize many of the "RC" usernames simply from being here looking and cruising for the past couple years. Coincidence? Now I wonder. Again it just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

 

Just so the RC's know where some of us are coming from. And no, not all of us check the site daily and post in every thread. But for some reason I felt compelled with this one.

[Ocean Boy]

sorry for what X seems to be doing, after reading through all of these post he for some reason feels the need to be very defensive.

 

 

My other thoughts=====

after reading lauras comment about how she would not disclose personal CC'ers imformation I thought well ya,thats a given we would never expect that, what needed to be disclosed was the behind the scenes arrangement of the relationship that has been going on between rccl and cc==

all that needed to be said or disclosed was that rccl contacted cc and asked for a few people to help with marketing, wasnt that easy? imo if that was posted none of this would be going on, so why wasnt it is my question if there is nothing wrong with the RC program??

Ladder, I realize that you only joined CC a short time ago so you were not here several months ago when many of us were asked to join this group. The fact is that most of what you are asking about was all discussed out in the open. When we were contacted for permission to release our info the first thing many of us did was come on here where a thread was started to find out what this was about. After a LOT of discussion, which Laura participated in as I recall, I, and others, agreed to it. Heck, since I had sailed with RCI they already had far more personal information on me than what they were asking for. I guess after all of that discussion it now seems strange to some of us that there are claims of secrecy, tainted postings, integrity, etc. Yes, it all just seems very odd.

[Ocean Boy]

Did anyone get a reply back from the second email? I sent my info in again but i havent received a reply.

 

No. That was the first, and only, contact that I have ever had with them.

[jaxon41]

Ladder, I realize that you only joined CC a short time ago so you were not here several months ago when many of us were asked to join this group. The fact is that most of what you are asking about was all discussed out in the open. When we were contacted for permission to release our info the first thing many of us did was come on here where a thread was started to find out what this was about. After a LOT of discussion, which Laura participated in as I recall, I, and others, agreed to it. Heck, since I had sailed with RCI they already had far more personal information on me than what they were asking for. I guess after all of that discussion it now seems strange to some of us that there are claims of secrecy, tainted postings, integrity, etc. Yes, it all just seems very odd.

 

For those of us to whom this was all new, it would be very helpful to the transparency discussion if you would link to that thread.

[PeterPan]

I have been unable to find the exchange of which you speak -- perhaps you could be so kind as to provide a link, so we can judge for ourselves.

 

http://www.expertcruiser.com/blog/royal-caribbeans-penny-per-share-earnings-likely-to-lead-to-more-onboard-nickel-and-diming/

[critterchick]

Should i take that the good or bad way? The only reason i started Bennie was to bring fun to Cruise Critic.

 

And you have. And I commend you for being able to get a bunch of adults to bend to your will!:)

[Ladylouwho]

There are many many years and hundreds of studies which demonstrate how easy it is to influence judgement. Nobody should be suggesting that RCs are posting anything that they do not truly believe. But how easy it is to very subtly shift peoples opinions. It doesn't take a lot and especially doesn't take rules to follow. For example, change the name or the gender on a job application and the person will be seen as significantly more or less prepared for a job. Smile at someone and touch them lightly on the arm apparently randomly while they are watching one of two stories and they will prefer that one to the one you didn't smile during. The examples could go on and on. And believe that the agency that came up with the idea of the RCers KNOW this. That is what advertising is based on. None of you are lying or doing anything you don't feel is correct. It's just that in very subtle ways your impressions have almost certainly have been shifted.

 

This is not opinion. This is fact which is backed up by huge amounts of scientific evidence. Now, if you wish to claim that science knows nothing then that is your decision. But don't imagine that you are immune from this basic part of human nature. Educated or not, smart or not, honest or not. These things do not change the fact that opinions can be shifted. And you will NOT be aware that you have been influenced. It does not take huge rewards- simply having been selected as in some unknown way as special is enough. Would you lie for them? NO. Would you not see real problems as problems? NO. But in many small ways it is highly likely that you will see things as slightly more positive than you would otherwise.

 

And to my mind, therein lies the rub. It was intentional and part of a program designed to do just that.

 

Well, RCL knew exactly what is was doing when it hired professionals to find people to become their Royal Champions (RC's). They invited many of these RC's on a pre-inaugural cruise on a new ship, Liberty of the Seas. The RC's that went met each other personally, partied together and many became good friends. I am sure they had a blast. Many are still posting on their original M & M for that pre-inaugural.

 

This is NOT PERSONAL. I am not saying there is, was, or ever will be anything wrong with having gone on that pre-inaugural and having had a great time. Good for all of you that got to go and have that experience. But because many of you experienced that together and became friends it changed the dynamic of the Boards a little. So many people who now not only personally know each other but also belong to the same elite, select club on CC, and are also Royal Caribbean Champions (hence the name). Once you actually know someone and may even be friends on a message board your behavior toward your new friend(s) will change as compared to not knowing them personally.

 

And I don't think it takes a Behavioral Scientist to figure that out, but I wouldn't be surprised if the developers of the RC Program (and there are similar programs regarding any product) counted a Behavioral Scientist among them.

 

This has nothing to do with any individual RC and is not personal. Probably any one of us, had we been invited, would have joined the program. But even most of the RC's that have posted recently admitted they were not really sure what the program was all about.

 

It is just that now, RCL itself seems to have shined a light on this Program and its connection to CC and it makes some people a little uncomfortable.

 

Royal Caribbean hired people who knew exactly what they were doing in formulating this program.

[Ladder55]

Ladder, I realize that you only joined CC a short time ago so you were not here several months ago when many of us were asked to join this group. The fact is that most of what you are asking about was all discussed out in the open. When we were contacted for permission to release our info the first thing many of us did was come on here where a thread was started to find out what this was about. After a LOT of discussion, which Laura participated in as I recall, I, and others, agreed to it. Heck, since I had sailed with RCI they already had far more personal information on me than what they were asking for. I guess after all of that discussion it now seems strange to some of us that there are claims of secrecy, tainted postings, integrity, etc. Yes, it all just seems very odd.

 

This is fine , but was not my point

 

my point is that it should have been stickyed somewhere that cruise critic does work with rccl

its that simple!

 

if it was ALL discussed out in the open then why all this irritation?

it seems like some things were left out when the RC's talked about their position. not everything was disclosed

 

 

btw =anyone know if NCL has a few working for them over there

<<<<<

some real winners I tell ya

[Ocean Boy]

I have just found out about this by reading this thread today, and I will admit it rubs me the wrong way. Having been a member of CC for a few years now I know that ANYTHING and EVERYTHING has been discussed ad nauseum to the tiniest detail. Whether it's upgrades or loyalty programs or the newest RCI T-shirt. And yet we never heard anyone discuss how they had been chosen as a member of the "RC" club. Seems odd to me. Why is that? What is the secrecy for? It just seems a bit strange.

 

Also whether or not you've received "perks" doesn't mean that people don't have the mindset of posting more often for the possibility of perks...and no I don't expect these people to post 100% raving reviews...because the intelligent wouldn't take those seriously. I would, however, listen to a review which discusses highs and lows but leans toward the highs...definitely pushing RCI. I also recognize many of the "RC" usernames simply from being here looking and cruising for the past couple years. Coincidence? Now I wonder. Again it just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

 

Just so the RC's know where some of us are coming from. And no, not all of us check the site daily and post in every thread. But for some reason I felt compelled with this one.

 

We can't discuss HOW we have been chosen because we don't know. But we had many discussions speculating on WHY were we chosen. It was all in open threads on the board. Where do people keep coming up with this secrecy? As far as that bad taste that you have, I've been on these boards for seven year. I came here a few months before my first cruise. 5000 of my posts, plus about 1000 lost ones, occured long before this R.C. thing came along. So I guess it is only my last hundred or so posts that people have to worry about.

 

Personally, I really don't care any more. I'm done defending myself and others in the same position as myself. It is a tiring excercise. My posts speak for themselves. People can take them anyway that they want. I will keep posting because I have enjoyed talking about cruising for the past seven years with others who share my passion. I post mostly on the RCI board, and ports of call boards, because this is the line that I know best and the one that I enjoy the most. Those who want to read what I write that is great. For the rest, feel free to put me on your ignore list and then there will be no further issue anything that I write.

[Ocean Boy]

This is fine , but was not my point

 

my point is that it should have been stickyed somewhere that cruise critic does work with rccl

its that simple!

 

if it was ALL discussed out in the open then why all this irritation?

it seems like some things were left out when the RC's talked about their position. not everything was disclosed

 

 

btw =anyone know if NCL has a few working for them over there

<<<<<

some real winners I tell ya

 

Just as long as folks keep things in perspective.... that is the reason for the irritation. If everything was not disclosed it is not the R.C. folks who did the non-disclosing.

[critterchick]

There are many many years and hundreds of studies which demonstrate how easy it is to influence judgement. Nobody should be suggesting that RCs are posting anything that they do not truly believe. But how easy it is to very subtly shift peoples opinions. It doesn't take a lot and especially doesn't take rules to follow. For example, change the name or the gender on a job application and the person will be seen as significantly more or less prepared for a job. Smile at someone and touch them lightly on the arm apparently randomly while they are watching one of two stories and they will prefer that one to the one you didn't smile during. The examples could go on and on. And believe that the agency that came up with the idea of the RCers KNOW this. That is what advertising is based on. None of you are lying or doing anything you don't feel is correct. It's just that in very subtle ways your impressions have almost certainly have been shifted.

 

This is not opinion. This is fact which is backed up by huge amounts of scientific evidence. Now, if you wish to claim that science knows nothing then that is your decision. But don't imagine that you are immune from this basic part of human nature. Educated or not, smart or not, honest or not. These things do not change the fact that opinions can be shifted. And you will NOT be aware that you have been influenced. It does not take huge rewards- simply having been selected as in some unknown way as special is enough. Would you lie for them? NO. Would you not see real problems as problems? NO. But in many small ways it is highly likely that you will see things as slightly more positive than you would otherwise.

 

And to my mind, therein lies the rub. It was intentional and part of a program designed to do just that.

 

Sorry, I'm not going along with any implication that I have been influenced by RCI to report on them, or to think of them, more positively. And I defy you to go through all of my posts to show me where I have. (that'll keep you busy for awhile!).

 

I have just found out about this by reading this thread today, and I will admit it rubs me the wrong way. Having been a member of CC for a few years now I know that ANYTHING and EVERYTHING has been discussed ad nauseum to the tiniest detail. Whether it's upgrades or loyalty programs or the newest RCI T-shirt. And yet we never heard anyone discuss how they had been chosen as a member of the "RC" club. Seems odd to me. Why is that? What is the secrecy for? It just seems a bit strange.

 

Also whether or not you've received "perks" doesn't mean that people don't have the mindset of posting more often for the possibility of perks...and no I don't expect these people to post 100% raving reviews...because the intelligent wouldn't take those seriously. I would, however, listen to a review which discusses highs and lows but leans toward the highs...definitely pushing RCI. I also recognize many of the "RC" usernames simply from being here looking and cruising for the past couple years. Coincidence? Now I wonder. Again it just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

 

Just so the RC's know where some of us are coming from. And no, not all of us check the site daily and post in every thread. But for some reason I felt compelled with this one.

 

Go find the Liberty pre-inaugural thread from 2007 and you will realize that many of us had no idea why we were the "chosen." As I have already said, it was not a bribe - none of us knew of the program before boarding the ship, and it wasn't played up at all. Or if it was, I was too tipsy to notice. All that free booze, you know.:o But we're not keeping any secrets from you, really.

 

Well, RCL knew exactly what is was doing when it hired professionals to find people to become their Royal Champions (RC's). They invited many of these RC's on a pre-inaugural cruise on a new ship, Liberty of the Seas. The RC's that went met each other personally, partied together and many became good friends. I am sure they had a blast. Many are still posting on their original M & M for that pre-inaugural.

 

This is NOT PERSONAL. I am not saying there is, was, or ever will be anything wrong with having gone on that pre-inaugural and having had a great time. Good for all of you that got to go and have that experience. But because many of you experienced that together and became friends it changed the dynamic of the Boards a little. So many people who now not only personally know each other but also belong to the same elite, select club on CC, and are also Royal Caribbean Champions (hence the name). Once you actually know someone and may even be friends on a message board your behavior toward your new friend(s) will change as compared to not knowing them personally.

 

And I don't think it takes a Behavioral Scientist to figure that out, but I wouldn't be surprised if the developers of the RC Program (and there are similar programs regarding any product) counted a Behavioral Scientist among them.

 

This has nothing to do with any individual RC and is not personal. Probably any one of us, had we been invited, would have joined the program. But even most of the RC's that have posted recently admitted they were not really sure what the program was all about.

 

It is just that now, RCL itself seems to have shined a light on this Program and its connection to CC and it makes some people a little uncomfortable.

 

Royal Caribbean hired people who knew exactly what they were doing in formulating this program.

 

I'm sure that they did. If I took it more seriously, I would feel rather icky-do about it at this point. As for an "elite" group - there are plenty of those on CC - the Mustard of the Seas gang, Ohanas, Polar Bears, etc., all of which started here. Clicques (sp?) abound.

[Ocean Boy]

Well, RCL knew exactly what is was doing when it hired professionals to find people to become their Royal Champions (RC's). They invited many of these RC's on a pre-inaugural cruise on a new ship, Liberty of the Seas. The RC's that went met each other personally, partied together and many became good friends. I am sure they had a blast. Many are still posting on their original M & M for that pre-inaugural.

 

This is NOT PERSONAL. I am not saying there is, was, or ever will be anything wrong with having gone on that pre-inaugural and having had a great time. Good for all of you that got to go and have that experience. But because many of you experienced that together and became friends it changed the dynamic of the Boards a little. So many people who now not only personally know each other but also belong to the same elite, select club on CC, and are also Royal Caribbean Champions (hence the name). Once you actually know someone and may even be friends on a message board your behavior toward your new friend(s) will change as compared to not knowing them personally.

And I don't think it takes a Behavioral Scientist to figure that out, but I wouldn't be surprised if the developers of the RC Program (and there are similar programs regarding any product) counted a Behavioral Scientist among them.

 

This has nothing to do with any individual RC and is not personal. Probably any one of us, had we been invited, would have joined the program. But even most of the RC's that have posted recently admitted they were not really sure what the program was all about.

 

It is just that now, RCL itself seems to have shined a light on this Program and its connection to CC and it makes some people a little uncomfortable.

 

Royal Caribbean hired people who knew exactly what they were doing in formulating this program.

 

But you could also say that about anyone who has gone on a cruise and attended an M&M meeting. Many of those folks become friends and spend the cruise together and come back here and post. So that changes the dynamics also. You could also say that about folks who have been on these boards for awhile. Even though we have never "met" each other we have been talking to each other for a long time. Many types of things go into effecting the dynamics of a chat board.

 

And yes, it is very true that most of us have very little understanding of what the program is all about. Maybe that is why we get a bit defensive about the attacks.

[Ladylouwho]

5 waldo's,

exactly! And the kicker is RCCL said it themselves:

"Rachel Hannock, Manager Loyalty Marketing and Royal Caribbean Cruises shared there story at a recent loyalty marketing conference. Hannock noted, “The key to success in viral marketing is to subtly influence the influencers without them overtly realizing they are being influenced.”

 

Yeah, like why are they publicly saying this? Kind of like letting the cat out of the bag.

 

I think that ANYONE picked to be an RC would have been subtly influenced here. RCL could have picked a completely DIFFERENT group of people to be RC's and they probably would have been subtly influenced also. If they had picked me, I would have probably been subtly influenced as well. Advertising, marketing, behavioral science, these folks are professioals, they know what they are doing.

[pcur]

However, she did write a general post to all board readers regarding the Royal Champion program where she says the program is for “influencing others who are not customers to sail on Royal Caribbean.”

 

I never saw that, and I never, ever try to influence others to sail on RCCL who are not interested. Wow!! That's really reaching far beyond MY understanding of what this is all about.

[pcur]

I have just found out about this by reading this thread today, and I will admit it rubs me the wrong way. Having been a member of CC for a few years now I know that ANYTHING and EVERYTHING has been discussed ad nauseum to the tiniest detail. Whether it's upgrades or loyalty programs or the newest RCI T-shirt. And yet we never heard anyone discuss how they had been chosen as a member of the "RC" club. Seems odd to me. Why is that? What is the secrecy for? It just seems a bit strange.

 

Actually, there were quite a few threads about this when it first got going. I am really tired of being painted with such a sinister brush. There IS NO SECRECY. I, for one, have had a grand total of 3 emails, two of which were to ask for contact information. No other "supersecret handshake or password or influence" kind of stuff.

 

Geez, you guys, as I said before this is like getting comped at a Las Vegas casino.

 

There's no discussion because NOTHING IS HAPPENING!!!! No contact, nada, nothing.

[Ladylouwho]

But you could also say that about anyone who has gone on a cruise and attended an M&M meeting. Many of those folks become friends and spend the cruise together and come back here and post. So that changes the dynamics also. You could also say that about folks who have been on these boards for awhile. Even though we have never "met" each other we have been talking to each other for a long time. Many types of things go into effecting the dynamics of a chat board.

 

And yes, it is very true that most of us have very little understanding of what the program is all about. Maybe that is why we get a bit defensive about the attacks.

 

OB, I am Not attacking the RC's. Certainly not attacking you. I have tried to make that very clear. This is a discussion about the RC PROGRAM and the RCL/CC connection regarding it. Not about RC's personally or individually.

 

And yes, my point exactly, people do make connections on these boards and when people meet the dynamics change. That is human behavior. I met a friend on a M & M thread on 2006, now our two families cruise together every summer. I understand this.

 

I am uncomfortable with the RCL/CC connection regarding this program. I feel it is a proper topic to discuss on these boards, and for those of us who have been long term CC members and long term/frequent RCL cruisers it is especially interesting.

 

Colleen

[Ship's Wake]

5 waldo's,

exactly! And the kicker is RCCL said it themselves:

"Rachel Hannock, Manager Loyalty Marketing and Royal Caribbean Cruises shared there story at a recent loyalty marketing conference. Hannock noted, “The key to success in viral marketing is to subtly influence the influencers without them overtly realizing they are being influenced.”

 

There you have it in a nutshell.

 

Well done Cruise Critic and Royal Caribbean!

[Ladylouwho]

[quote name=critterchick;18542878

I'm sure that they did. If I took it more seriously' date=' I would feel rather icky-do about it at this point. As for an "elite" group - there are plenty of those on CC - the Mustard of the Seas gang, Ohanas, Polar Bears, etc., all of which started here. Clicques (sp?) abound.[/quote]

 

Oh there is nothing to feel icky do about. You did nothing wrong nor anything anyone else would not do. It is not a personal thing about you.

 

As far as cliques on CC, yes, there definitely are cliques on CC. But there is a big difference between a clique between posters/friends with common interests, cruises together, etc. and a group selected professionally by an advertiser on cruise critic to help influence other members of CC to try/prefer their product. RCL has admitted this is the reason for the program. CC has admitted they assisted RCL in contacting members to become a part of this program.

 

Colleen

[glgolfer]

There were studies done years ago that showed different colors in the workplace increased production. Then they tried lighting and found the same results. They eventualy realized that just because someone was paying attention to the workers was the real reason production increased.

 

This ''''program" seems based on essentially the same premise.

 

Anyone that has been to a repeaters party or any other event put on by RCI has been exposed to the same influences.

 

It's been interesting and I will continue to enjoy participating.

[pcur]

Oh there is nothing to feel icky do about. You did nothing wrong nor anything anyone else would not do. It is not a personal thing about you.

 

As far as cliques on CC, yes, there definitely are cliques on CC. But there is a big difference between a clique between posters/friends with common interests, cruises together, etc. and a group selected professionally by an advertiser on cruise critic to help influence other members of CC to try/prefer their product. RCL has admitted this is the reason for the program. CC has admitted they assisted RCL in contacting members to become a part of this program.

 

Colleen

 

Actually, I think the sequence of events was RCCL monitoring the boards, asking Laura to contact people, she does and requests permission to give them our name and email addy, they contact us for whatever. For me it was Rachel Hancock's one night invite on the Mariner; docked overnight with dinner. We had to cancel because my hubby had surgery and was still in the hospital.

[Arizona Laura]

Again the point I am making...CC's decision to participate as a go-between in contacting their posters for RCCL or any cruise line for that matter was a poor judgement call especially for the purpose discussed in this thread.

CC should have had the vision to see what repercussions could occur from that action. The question is were they in some way a victim used by RCCL also or well informed participants?

Just some thoughts.

Laura

[glgolfer]

Have you read my last couple posts to you?