Carnival lost my daughter from Camp Carnival

[bcs819]

glad to hear your daughter's ok.

 

Wondering why you signed up today just to post this?

[mistyinca]

Does anyone find it odd that this is the OP's first post and the OP has not returned to respond to anything? Hmmmm....

 

Not really. I figure when people pop up and complain about something as a new member, they really felt a need to tell their story to someone. They probably did a search, found CC, and unloaded it.

 

I would be mad too. But then, I don't know what Carnival's policy is on signing in and out at that age. My kids are teens and I know they can handle that responsibility, and they can find their way around. At 10, my kids probably wouldn't have been able to (though I know many people's kids can). In which case, I would not have given them permission to sign themselves out.

 

If Carnival has a policy for 10 year olds, like they do for teens, where at that age they can sign themselves out, then it is the parents' responsibility to know what their own children can handle.

 

JMHO, FWIW :)

[A&Jfamily]

Every kid is different. My son is just a little over 7 and I can't imagine in less than a year he would be capable of signing himself out and navigating the ship by himself. However, that is my son specifically. Another 8 year old may do just fine.

 

However, just because there are 8 year olds who can do this, it does not mean every single 8 year old has the same capabilities. It also doesn't mean that the parents of the less capable kids have been deficient in their parenting.

 

6-8 year olds signing in and out is not an option; they must be at least 9 years old.

 

And no one was suggesting that just because your child is of an age, that it is appropriate to let them sign in and out. Only the parent can know whether the child is ready and both are comfortable with the idea. While I let my DS (11) have privileges, and have done so since he was just shy of 10, he is a brown belt in karate and an honor roll student who is very independent. He is a rule follower and cautious by nature. He had been on a cruise @ 8 and demonstrated that he knew how to navigate the ship; it was fun for him to plan how we would get from point A to point B. It works fine for him. I cannot say that the same will be true for my DS (5) when he reaches that age; I'll just have to wait and see.

 

My issue is with the OP - who posts a title - "Camp Carnival lost my child." That is an incorrect statement. Assuming normal operating procedure, the parents of the 10 year old in question granted sign in/out privileges and at 10, the child was told to return to the room(if not, and CC then "kicked" the child out, then CC is clearly in the wrong - but the OP has not come back to explain the circumstances). The parent granted this privilege without making sure that the child was prepared for them. That is the problem. The OP should not be blaming CC for the parent's mistake.

 

I am truly sorry that the child was scared - but I think it was a situation that could have been prevented by the parents with a little preparation.

[Jill_GA]

When I was 10 back in 1980, my mom and I went on a cruise, the Dolphin, and it stayed overnight in Nassau. She left me alone pretty much all night. For some reason there weren't many kids on board, so I was left to myself. I wandered around, played games in the game room, ate some food and went to bed. Luckily there weren't any creeps harassing me but I was a little uncomfortable being alone all night. I think she went to the casino. For the record, I would not do this with children, pretty much at any age. I still mention this bad-parenting moment to my mom. This was just one of many bad ideas she had.

By the way, this cruise was horrible, there was no kids club, the pool was closed, and I really didn't enjoy it. In fact, I didn't go on another cruise until 3 years ago, about 25 years later.

Ten year olds are going into 5th grade and most are fairly mature, so I am fairly sure my kids would have gone looking for me or gone to the room. Some ten year olds are pretty sheltered and just go into panic mode.

[crusinmama06]

For those kids that have "full run of the ship"....what happens if someone grabs them into one of the cabins? :eek: These are floating cities. I just can't be that trusting. :(

[Rochmom]

My oldest, when only five, would have marched herself to the nearest crew member and asked for help. Yet I know a 13 year old today who would most definitely sink to the deck and cry hysterically, and not ask for help.

 

But keeping with the thought of preparing your kids, on our first cruise, our dd14 and dd12 went to Circle C. We actually took them ourselves - every time - and waited until a counselor acknowledged that they were joining the activity. We made sure the girls - and often the counselor, too - knew where we were going to be. If we decided to leave that place, one of us waited in the original spot while the other went to tell the girls where we were going.

 

In the evening, if one wanted to go to Circle C and the other didn't, my husband went to pick the single girl up from the evening activity and walk her back to the cabin.

[tandtmk04]

"Carnival didn't lose your child...your child got lost" WHAT??!!! When Carnival MADE a 10 year old girl "sign herself out" then am sorry THEY DID lose that child!! As a parent who's kids are EVERYTHING to me, I would have been hurting someone! it would not have been good! This is a little girl on a BIG ship alone at 10:00 pm! I am sorry but they don't check the sex registery before booking a cruise, they will let ANYONE on the ship and who knows what could have happened!

 

OP....... I am so glad that it turned out good for your daughter!

[A&Jfamily]

For those kids that have "full run of the ship"....what happens if someone grabs them into one of the cabins? :eek: These are floating cities. I just can't be that trusting. :(

 

My kid doesn't have the "run of the ship." He is allowed to go to camp, and if he choses to leave early, he must either return to the room, or come straight to us. So, he is moving on the public floors - not just randomly roaming the hallways.

 

I have never understood the "grabbing the kid into the cabin thing." First of all, how would someone know that my kid was walking to the room at that moment?

 

I have posted this on this board before, but I will say so again. Basically, there are 2 types of child molsters - groomers and abductors. A groomer is your preacher, soccer coach, uncle, scout master...you get the idea. It is someone in a position of trust with the child that has the ability to mentally groom the child and keep them from telling what goes on in private. On a ship, there is no time or ability to have this type of relationship. The other would be the abductors. They are the ones that snatch the kids into the cars - "help me find my puppy" or "would you like a piece of candy?" Those children disappear forever to horrible ends. But that can't happen on a cruise ship because they can't get away with the child. It is far too risky a crime in that scenario. Am I saying that attacks have never happened? No. But I think it would be far less likely on a cruise ship than at say soccer camp or on a scouting trip.

 

Again, it all goes back to knowing if your kid is ready, and if you as a parent are ready to let them. My kid is VERY aware of child predators and what they do. He is cautious by nature and knows a fair amount of self defense.

 

What I don't understand is the parents who say "I won't let my 15 year old daughter walk around the ship." Do you let her go to the mall? Do you follow her around at school? You cannot be with your child 24/7 and while you must protect them, you must also teach them to deal with life - the good, the bad and the ugly.

 

JMHO

[tandtmk04]

For those kids that have "full run of the ship"....what happens if someone grabs them into one of the cabins? :eek: These are floating cities. I just can't be that trusting. :(

 

I am right there with you!:)

[misguidedangel]

My mother and I took my niece who was 10 at the time on a cruise onthe Conquest and before the end of the first day she had the layout of the ship mapped out, knew where everything was, and the quickest way back to the cabin. We let her sign in and out of Camp Carnival, we left post it notes and checked in periodically as to where we would be during the day (on a sea day) and no problem!!!

 

The one day she did give us crap was the second sea day we were up earlier and went to breakfast on lido and didn't leave a note, but we told her the night before if we weren't there when she woke up we'd be on lido having breakfast...She lectured us on how we still could have left a note...

 

The kids need to know the layout of the ships public space like the back of their hand on the first day, which means explore, explore, explore instead of plopping down on a deck chair and getting some sun...explore!!!!!

[SqueakyDust]

No one's asked this, so I will :p

Whether the child was given the privilege of signing herself out or not, why was a parent not there to collect her at 10pm if they didn't want to pay for the babysitting service?

[wentworth]

A child signing themselves out versus a child being asked to leave are

two different situations. In this case it looks like the child did not want

to leave. 10:30 at nite is a little late for a child to be roaming the

decks looking for their rooms. The OP said they went to pick her up

at ten so that must have been the plan.

 

 

There is no way I could let my children at ages 8 9 10 or 12 have free

rein of the ship, especially at nite, but how can anyone justify letting

them roam with NO CURFEW:eek:

[crusinmama06]

But that can't happen on a cruise ship because they can't get away with the child.

JMHO

 

I wasn't referring to anyone in particular but I will reply to you. :D

 

Being around here (on CC) for a while, you start to see some pretty heinous crimes reported. So I have to disagree that things can't happen on a cruise ship.

 

Just some things off the top of my head, some guy asked some young kids to come into his cabin. He (according to the report) forced them to do sexual things to one another. Afterward they left immediatly and reported the incident to their parents.

 

Another, a child pornographer was arrested coming off a ship (it was RCCL). The authorities had gone to his home to arrest him, he was on a ship, so they just waited for him at the terminal.

 

Another, two boys in a ship's hot tub reported that a man got into the hot tub with them and started touching them.

 

And how risky would it be? You grab a child. Do whatever. And throw them off the balcony? How could they prove which one of the 2,000 passengers it was?

 

Just because its a ship, doesn't mean predators stay home. :(

[notme1955]

It was the last night of the cruise. Do the same rules for Camp Carnival apply (i.e: 10:00 p.m. closing) or does it close earlier? I'm not sure I understand why she was made to sign out earlier than 10:00 p.m? What time did she sign out?

[A&Jfamily]

"Carnival didn't lose your child...your child got lost" WHAT??!!! When Carnival MADE a 10 year old girl "sign herself out" then am sorry THEY DID lose that child!! As a parent who's kids are EVERYTHING to me, I would have been hurting someone! it would not have been good! This is a little girl on a BIG ship alone at 10:00 pm! I am sorry but they don't check the sex registery before booking a cruise, they will let ANYONE on the ship and who knows what could have happened!

 

OP....... I am so glad that it turned out good for your daughter!

 

Are you aware of the rules of the 9-11? In order for the girl to sign herself out, the parents would have had to grant that privilege - it is NOT automatic. If the kids are scheduled for the late night party, then they stay. If not, then it is time to leave. Until the OP comes back and says that the child do not have sign in/out privileges and that CCL forced her to leave, CCL did not lose the child.

 

As I said in an earlier post, the child was in much more danger of sexual abuse from a family, church or extra-curricular activity member than some random person on a cruise, who would just have to happen to know that the child would be walking to her room at that moment.

 

Let's thing about this from a "liability" perspective - since the OP suggested "further action." Do you think that CCL would agree to give parents the option for kids signing in/out if it was a risk? Can you imagine the exposure they would have? They would not let it happen for purely financial reasons if it posed a real risk to the kids.

 

As for the poster who talked about falling over board? Could you please explain how that could happen as the railings are all chest height. Jumping yes. Falling no. And my kid is not so stupid as to jump.

[bplazo]

I would not allow a young child (under the age of 14) to roam the ship by themselves at any time.

[readytogo2]

I'm glad the OP found her child safe and sound. While some children have a better sense of directions,others do not. Same goes for adults. If the same thing happened to me, I don't think I would freak out, my kids always knew their way around(guess we were lucky)

It's really a shame how we make our kids so dependent. I'm 54yrs old and when I was 10yrs old, I was way more independent than our children are. It's maybe not our fault as times have changed so and not in a good way. We now have 'play dates' for our kids where as when we were kids...we just went out and played. But now,with both parents having to work, and so many weirdos roaming the streets, we keep a closer eye on our kids and they don't have the freedom we did.

[emdia43]

I still make dd17 walk places with friends on the ship - I would never let a 10 year old have sign-out privileges and walk alone at night. However, even a child should know that if they are "in trouble" to go to a security officer, or a crew member for help. (they all wear Carnival gold name badges - even when off duty) I would tell her to go to a female crew member, just to play it safe. Glad everything turned out okay. Hope the op returns to this thread shortly. (I also have my suspicions about this being a first post with such a "hot topic", and then not returning to check in now and then)

 

No matter where they are, what they are upset about, if they are in an unfamiliar place and don't know what to do, I tell them to approach the first lady they see with children and ask for help...:)

[A&Jfamily]

I wasn't referring to anyone in particular but I will reply to you. :D

 

Being around here (on CC) for a while, you start to see some pretty heinous crimes reported. So I have to disagree that things can't happen on a cruise ship.

 

Just some things off the top of my head, some guy asked some young kids to come into his cabin. He (according to the report) forced them to do sexual things to one another. Afterward they left immediatly and reported the incident to their parents.

 

Another, a child pornographer was arrested coming off a ship (it was RCCL). The authorities had gone to his home to arrest him, he was on a ship, so they just waited for him at the terminal.

 

Another, two boys in a ship's hot tub reported that a man got into the hot tub with them and started touching them.

 

And how risky would it be? You grab a child. Do whatever. And throw them off the balcony? How could they prove which one of the 2,000 passengers it was?

 

Just because its a ship, doesn't mean predators stay home. :(

 

I'm not disagreeing with you that bad things happen. Believe me, I am far from naive on these subject. I work in a world where sexual predators are an everyday thing. What I am saying is that it is more likely that your child would be victimized in their everyday world, than on a cruise ship. My child also knows rules - don't go in anyone's room; no one allowed in our room; if steward comes in - leave etc. My point is that we cannot watch our children 24/7. They grow up and they have to learn how to live in the real world. All in all, I feel a cruise ship is a safer environment to have a little freedom, than say a land based resort - where an abductor can get away.

 

So what age should a parent allow a child freedom? The same thing could happen to an 18 year old, or a 15 year old. It's all about the child and the parents being comfortable that the child is ready to handle a little bit of independence.

[trock]

omg!

 

I was bursting a vein in my forehead just reading this! I can't even imagine being there in your shoes! I can't imagine leaving my child anywhere upon returning finding out she was not there.

 

Rest of thoughts will remain behind this keyboard before i type something i may regret.

 

 

ditto

[A&Jfamily]

I would not allow a young child (under the age of 14) to roam the ship by themselves at any time.

 

Just curious - what is magic about 14? On CCL, the 12-14 are free to come and go as they please. And what do you mean by "roam"- my kid can go from dinner to camp by himself - I don't consider that roaming, but perhaps you do. I wouldn't let him "roam" the ship either - meaning wandering aimlessly around. He can leave camp, grab an ice cream and go back to the room if he wants, though.

[LemurCat]

No one's asked this, so I will :p

Whether the child was given the privilege of signing herself out or not, why was a parent not there to collect her at 10pm if they didn't want to pay for the babysitting service?

 

And futhermore, why didn't this family have some sort of emergancy plan in place? We certainly didn't cruise when I was a kid, but my folks drilled into my siblings and I that we, as a family need to HAVE A PLAN IF YOU GET SEPERATED. I dunno, sounds like common sense to me. I mean, it's usually easy enough -- even for a scared and confused 10 year old -- to get to the atrium and go to the information desk.

[LemurCat]

So what age should a parent allow a child freedom? The same thing could happen to an 18 year old, or a 15 year old. It's all about the child and the parents being comfortable that the child is ready to handle a little bit of independence.

 

And the child being mature enough and having enough sense to act responsibily in case of emergancy or even a situation that is out of the ordinary.

[djhsolara]

I wasn't referring to anyone in particular but I will reply to you. :D

 

Being around here (on CC) for a while, you start to see some pretty heinous crimes reported. So I have to disagree that things can't happen on a cruise ship.

 

Just some things off the top of my head, some guy asked some young kids to come into his cabin. He (according to the report) forced them to do sexual things to one another. Afterward they left immediatly and reported the incident to their parents.

 

Another, a child pornographer was arrested coming off a ship (it was RCCL). The authorities had gone to his home to arrest him, he was on a ship, so they just waited for him at the terminal.

 

Another, two boys in a ship's hot tub reported that a man got into the hot tub with them and started touching them.

 

And how risky would it be? You grab a child. Do whatever. And throw them off the balcony? How could they prove which one of the 2,000 passengers it was?

 

Just because its a ship, doesn't mean predators stay home. :(

 

 

I'm replying to a few posts (but I don't know how to quote multiple posts)...I do not have children, but am in total agreement with you. I am completely appalled at the attitude of some who think it could not happen to their child. It could happen to anyone...anywhere. If someone is on the ship that is meaning harm to someone, then it is going to happen to whomever this person chooses as their victim...no matter how much you seem to think that you are exempt from it.

 

As far as "falling" overboard...I didn't see the poster mention "falling" overboard. I see them mentioning being thrown overboard. There are certainly parts of the ship that are not busy areas or hallways and what happens if a predator just happens to be ready to attack their prey and steps out in the hall and drags someone into their room, attacks them and then just disposes of them off of the balcony. Away they are and although I've heard that nothing is off camera on the outside of the ships...but think about it...if it is dark I cannot believe that it wouldn't be possible to put someone overboard without being seen...and it could be hours later until the person is known as officially missing...and they are floating in the ocean somewhere downstream.

 

I don't care what Carnival's policy is, but if I had children I would never allow someone that young to be out alone in a ship. I think back to when I was a child and I remember travelling with my parents to lavish resorts and hotels and "having the run" of the resort or hotel...but that was a different day and time...25-30 years ago. You just didn't hear so much about the kind of things that you hear about today.

 

I don't mean to sound so negative here, but I just think that anyone who thinks that it couldn't happen on a ship is seriously mistaken. As the poster said, a ship is a floating city...and I would never send a 10-year-old out alone in a city.

 

That's my two cents...and I'm sticking to it. :) :)

[crusinmama06]

So what age should a parent allow a child freedom? The same thing could happen to an 18 year old, or a 15 year old.

 

Yep, that's true. And I don't have an answer. I guess I can just say that for my family 9 is too young. :)