No Gratuities

You tipped $850 for an excursion???:eek: how much was the excursion ?

 

Were your generous tips on top of the Auto tips or were you on a cruise where gratuities were not added to you onboard account ?

I think they used excursion figuratively and did not mean it was a tip for ONE excursion.

I think they used excursion figuratively and did not mean it was a tip for ONE excursion.

I sure hope so

Maybe the meaning was lost in the translation ;)

i agree that all personnel on the ship work very diligently and deserve to be compensated fairly. Perhaps there should be some thought if the $13.50 gratuity/person established by the cruise industry is fair to the customer. For example, based on the Carnival. Corp. & PLC Consolidated Statements of Income for the six month period ending 5/31/16, total revenues were 7.4 billion. After expenses, a six month net profit of 747 million. Can Carnival afford to pay the cabin attendants, waiters, etc. more in light of this net profit and reduce the recommended daily gratuity? Also, does the cruising public deserve to know the formula by which the gratuities are divided?

Again, I am in favor of fair compensation but do we deserve some transparency? Thank you.

i agree that all personnel on the ship work very diligently and deserve to be compensated fairly. Perhaps there should be some thought if the $13.50 gratuity/person established by the cruise industry is fair to the customer. For example, based on the Carnival. Corp. & PLC Consolidated Statements of Income for the six month period ending 5/31/16, total revenues were 7.4 billion. After expenses, a six month net profit of 747 million. Can Carnival afford to pay the cabin attendants, waiters, etc. more in light of this net profit and reduce the recommended daily gratuity? Also, does the cruising public deserve to know the formula by which the gratuities are divided?

 

Again, I am in favor of fair compensation but do we deserve some transparency? Thank you.

but do we deserve some transparency? Thank you.

Actually, no.

If your list of past cruises represents actual experience, you should be aware that the employees of those lines are not permitted to retain cash tips received from passengers who have removed the service charge.

 

I am not suggesting that you are untruthful - rather that you do not seem to know what you are talking about when you claim that you are effectively choosing "... who (you) want to reward".

 

Consider your eyes rolled back to you.

Like I said, what they do with the money is not my concern. I walk away satisfied I have given a tip to those I consider deserve it. My conscience is clear. And yes my list of past and future cruises is correct.

Difficult for me to understand how you can condone behavior such as that by the staff because they didn't receive a tip. Unbelievable! You are saying that the cruise line accepts that type of behavior from their employees? The cruise line leaves the option to the staff to wash toilets with the guests toothbrush because they didn't receive a tip? I don't believe that for a moment.

Couldn't agree more. Someone is big noting themselves here claiming knowledge that is obviously fabricated.

Sorry, but you are thoroughly wrong. On NCL, it is called the DAILY SERVICE CHARGE. It is NOT gratuities. You are NOT charged both DSC and gratuities. This is the way it is set up on the US side of cruises for NCL.

The GRATUITIES that are posted automatically are the ones for spa service and drinks. That is not part of the DSC. How many of you who want to cheap out on the DSC also ask that those spa and drink gratuities are removed so you can tip your $.25...

Firstly you conveniently only mentioned NCL. What about the other lines? Secondly we don't have the option to remove gratuities on drinks or spa services so we wouldn't try. They are mandatory so we comply.

Couldn't agree more. Someone is big noting themselves here claiming knowledge that is obviously fabricated.

I hope you are not referring to Bruce Muzz.

Nice attitude. :rolleyes: To you, giving a tip is all about making yourself feel good. It clearly has nothing to do with caring about the person you are giving it to.

 

I have always had the belief that giving a tip to someone was all about rewarding them and not about taking credit for what a great guy I think I am.

Grow up. Giving a tip for me is about saying thank you in person and giving a reward, not through some automatic process which is anonymous.:rolleyes:

i agree that all personnel on the ship work very diligently and deserve to be compensated fairly. Perhaps there should be some thought if the $13.50 gratuity/person established by the cruise industry is fair to the customer. For example, based on the Carnival. Corp. & PLC Consolidated Statements of Income for the six month period ending 5/31/16, total revenues were 7.4 billion. After expenses, a six month net profit of 747 million. Can Carnival afford to pay the cabin attendants, waiters, etc. more in light of this net profit and reduce the recommended daily gratuity? Also, does the cruising public deserve to know the formula by which the gratuities are divided?

 

Again, I am in favor of fair compensation but do we deserve some transparency? Thank you.

Best post on this thread.

Grow up. Giving a tip for me is about saying thank you in person and giving a reward, not through some automatic process which is anonymous.:rolleyes:

Bless your heart. You still don't understand the system?

Grow up. .....:rolleyes:

Best post on this thread.

That is merely your opinion. Since I "grew up" decades ago, my opinion, which thankfully differs from yours in several ways, is based on years of experience. I don't need "transparency", as I am quite confortable to let the company executives determine how to run their own business without insisting that I know better than they do. :rolleyes:

Firstly you conveniently only mentioned NCL. What about the other lines? Secondly we don't have the option to remove gratuities on drinks or spa services so we wouldn't try. They are mandatory so we comply.

NCL is the line I am most familiar with. Sorry that it was "conveniently" the one that I mentioned.

As for fabricated things - if you have never worked in hospitality, you have no idea.

NCL is the line I am most familiar with. Sorry that it was "conveniently" the one that I mentioned.

 

 

 

As for fabricated things - if you have never worked in hospitality, you have no idea.

Bingo!

Bless your heart. You still don't understand the system?

No, he doesn't: he is determined to bring his comfort zone with him, rather than adapt to the realities of the environment he chooses to temporarily occupy.

I understood that cruise fare is taxable but gratuities are not, so in the American cruise business model, cost is lowered by not paying tax on that portion of cost. You pay less than if gratuities were included in fare.

decision.

If you notice a strange smell on your toothbrush, or there appears to be a shoe print on your steak, you will know why.

how do they do this to your toothbrush when my toothbrush is safely in my case that im carrying off the ship on my last morning just 5 mins after knocking the tips off my bill?

how do they do this to your toothbrush when my toothbrush is safely in my case that im carrying off the ship on my last morning just 5 mins after knocking the tips off my bill?

Not to worry.

If the service staff heard your British accent at the start of the cruise, they already reduced their services to you, anticipating a loss of income.

There are also some very clever and creative service staff who have discovered some very interesting ways to have some fun with you even after you have departed the ship.

Not to worry.

If the service staff heard your British accent at the start of the cruise, they already reduced their services to you, anticipating a loss of income.

There are also some very clever and creative service staff who have discovered some very interesting ways to have some fun with you even after you have departed the ship.

You know you paint an awful picture of the staff as mean spirited and vindictive.

It certainly doesn't make people want to tip more.

Lois

You know you paint an awful picture of the staff as mean spirited and vindictive.

Only if it's warranted.;)

It certainly doesn't make people want to tip more.

 

Lois

Once again, if it's warranted.:)

Hi, Whupper,

 

No, it's I who tip according to service.

YOU tip because it's the American (or North American) way, and because service staff in the US get low wages.

And its clear from your anecdotes that the US system is flawed & open to abuse by cheapskates.

When in America I tip in restaurants & bars 15% to 20% as most Americans do. But although front-liners might share their tips, I don't tip the "background" staff who launder the sheets or clean the pool or put out the kitchen garbage or man fast-food outlets. Neither do Americans - except on cruise ships.

 

But the $2.42 per hour wage that you mention would be illegal in the UK, where we have a minimum wage of currently about $8.60 per hour. Tips on top of wages are truly discretionary & earned by good service.

Bread and butter from the pay packet, jelly from tips.

 

The American way has gradually crossed the Pond, and more & more restaurants in tourist areas in Britain and elsewhere in Europe apply a service charge, usually 15%. And just like cruise lines, they do that to make their published prices look cheaper than they are.

The British way is that you pay the price on the ticket, and choose to give a tip. So I avoid such places as often as I can, because it's not the British way. And when I do use one, just like on US cruise ships I leave the service charge on but don't tip extra.

In other words, I tip - but I regard it as bonkers to tip twice for the same thing. :confused:

Matter of principle, not a matter of cheap-skating.;)

 

JB :)

I totally agree with you but this discussion will continue forever as the different cultures will never accept that the other party might be right. If your mentality and cultural practices have always included tipping, then that's what you think is the right thing to do. As you say, in the UK people get a decent basic rate per hour, whereas in the States, they do not. It's a shame that the American argument towards tipping everyone in the service industry because the tipper feels guilty that the worker doesn't get a decent wage, doesn't persuade U.S. employers to pay their staff a living wage and not treat them as virtual slaves. But until that happens, they will be paying 20% extra for everything whilst we will object to doing so. I'm looking forward to my 2017 cruise on the Thomson Discovery 2, where the staff will be paid a living wage and the tips are included in the cruise price. Of course I shall tip extra for exceptional service if I feel that it warrants a tip.

You know you paint an awful picture of the staff as mean spirited and vindictive.

 

It certainly doesn't make people want to tip more.

 

Lois

Cruise passengers have tipped less, and less, and less over the past 30 years.

Most of these cuts were not a result of poor service, but a result of cruise lines needing to attract larger numbers of passengers with lower incomes in order to increase profits.

This has been a great success ( for some ); the cruise lines make more profit, the passengers get cheaper cruises.

But for the service staff, workload has increased every year, while earnings and benefits have decreased every year.

The few remaining long-term service staff on ships are now earning less than 50% of what they earned 2 or 3 decades ago. Their benefits are now almost non-existent.

If your employer cut your earnings and benefits by over 50%, what would your reaction be?

Then your employer allows customers to cut your earnings even further just because they can?

There actually aren't very many bitter, mean, or vindictive service staff left on ships today.

They all quit, and found better paying jobs back home.

They were replaced by inexperienced younger staff who only took the job because they lack skills and experience to find a decent job at home. The cruise line had to hire these less than ideal employees because good service staff can no longer afford to work on cruise ships. There is a worldwide shortfall of about 250,000 cruise line employees this year. That number is growing rapidly. The cruise lines are forced to hire nearly any warm body they get their hands on.

Those "frugal" passengers who think they are so clever or righteous in failing to tip staff are creating a new environment where there are actually good reasons not to tip. Too many new staff have no experience, no skill, and really don't care if you are happy or not. If the staff hear a British or Aussie accent, they give minimal service or they just walk away. They know the odds are that no tips will be coming from those passengers. Why work for free?

A few decades ago a job on a cruise ship was like winning the lottery. Service staff were highly motivated to do anything and everything to avoid losing that dream job. Sure, the work was difficult, but the earnings were great. A good service crewmember could work very hard for 20 or 30 years and then comfortably retire.

Not anymore. The money is no longer there.

Today a good waiter in Jakarta can earn more money in a local hotel or restaurant, working shorter hours, with days off, and see his family every day.

Unqualified staff now take these cruise jobs because they are just slightly better than no jobs. If they lose the job for any reason, they can easily get another one with another cruise line - that is also desperate to hire any warm body they can find.

So if I am a young first-time service staff working on a ship, and I know or suspect that you are not going to tip me for my hard work, what will I do?

Try to convince my supervisor that I was doing a good job -even though you refused to tip me?

Explain to my wife that the money I will be sending home this month will be less than hoped?

Help myself to your belongings in the cabin?

Water down your drinks and sell the extra alcohol to someone else?

Go through your suitcase after you put it in the corridor on the final night?

Pull some nasty tricks with your belongings or food?

Report your credit cards stolen after you depart the ship?

Give/sell your credit card information to somebody?

If I get caught doing something like this, I will lose my job and be flown home - where I can get another cruise job by next week and be working on a new ship a week later.

If that same service staff member works hard, is treated well and tipped by you, he has nobody to blame for his situation. He took the job, expecting a certain pay. He received it.

You had a good cruise. He worked hard and got paid for it. Case closed.

As I posted earlier, life is a gamble.

You pay your money - or not - and you take your chances.

Not to worry.

If the service staff heard your British accent at the start of the cruise, they already reduced their services to you, anticipating a loss of income.

There are also some very clever and creative service staff who have discovered some very interesting ways to have some fun with you even after you have departed the ship.

Funny isn't it that when my cabin steward hears my British accent, they are generally really polite and give me great service. Possibly because this is because I treat them as equals and not as some sort of "native servant" or lesser beings, which I have seen many of those who boast constantly about how many tips they give, treat the service staff on board the ship. I have worked as a cleaner and a waitress back in the day and whilst I liked to get tips, I also got personal satisfaction from giving a good service to everyone I served, whether they tipped me or not. I feel that this is the same for the service staff on the ship. If you treat them as they are - educated people earning their living working on a cruise ship so that they can send money back to their families, and not some lower form of life that you treat in a condescending way, they will respond accordingly. Your comment says more about you than it does the staff on the ship!

If your employer cut your earnings and benefits by over 50%, what would your reaction be?

 

Then your employer allows customers to cut your earnings even further just because they can?

I wouldn't blame my clients, I'd blame my employer.

The cruise lines are forced to hire nearly any warm body they get their hands on.

They are not forced to do this, they do it because they don't want to cut into their profits to pay their staff. this is a choice. And when the quality drops enough, people will stop sailing, which will cut into their profits, so they are creating what they are trying to prevent.

They could make the service charge part of the fare. The prices fluctuate so much would people really notice?

Help myself to your belongings in the cabin?

Water down your drinks and sell the extra alcohol to someone else?

Go through your suitcase after you put it in the corridor on the final night?

Pull some nasty tricks with your belongings or food?

Report your credit cards stolen after you depart the ship?

Give/sell your credit card information to somebody?

None of these things are justifiable and most are illegal.

So you are saying because the staff are from poor countries and make less money that they have no morals? They are thieves?

I hope the people you work with have a better opinion of you than you have of them.

Lois