Have the Gay Charters Outpriced Themselves?

[SakeDad]

I have friends on a few of the RSVP, Atlantis and other gay Europe trips that have reported very poor attendance. One told me that he was told since the Baltics sailing was so poorly sold they won't be offering it again for a couple of years.

So, have they over-priced their product or is it simply a reflection of the overall economy? As gays & lesbian cruisers have you pulled back for one reason or the other from these cruises? And if so what was the reason and what would get you to book with them (ANY company) in the future?

When looking at some of the websites I see some sailings are totally sold out while others are wide open. What do you look for when booking one of the GLBT cruises?

[SakeDad]

SORRY FOR THE DOUBLE POST!!!!!! Computer froze.

[REALgetaway]

for me and my partner the price was what kept us away from a gay cruise. we would love to be on board a ship that was mostly gay people.. but we could not afford it.

 

I think both the economy and the fact that for some reason it appears that gay cruises are overpriced.. I think both of those combined are keeping a lot of people away.

 

I just don't seem to see the same type of cruise deals to be had for a gay cruise. Why is that?

 

Why do gay cruises have to be priced to high?

[Willem Ruys]

the higher rates are because of the very nature of a full ship charter. The shipowner sets a desired per diem rate per bed and charges the charterer accordingly. If an all gay passenger load makes you more comfortable, then it would be worth what the charterer MUST charge to pay the shipowner, his marketing, administrative expenses, et al. Otherwise, if you are comfortable with all kinds of people and don't need a possible dating pool of 1,000s, it may not be worth the extra money BUT the organizers of gay charters usually provide special entertainment, acts often geared to gay audiences (or used to -- is there still any such thing as "gay sensibility" like there used to be?) and the crew LOVES charters for gay men because we gay men are known to spend more in the bars, tip well, party and laugh...Just my 2 cents after a career in the steamship business/cruise industry onboard and ashore...

[LuvCelebrity]

for me and my partner the price was what kept us away from a gay cruise. we would love to be on board a ship that was mostly gay people.. but we could not afford it.

 

I think both the economy and the fact that for some reason it appears that gay cruises are overpriced.. I think both of those combined are keeping a lot of people away.

 

I just don't seem to see the same type of cruise deals to be had for a gay cruise. Why is that?

 

Why do gay cruises have to be priced to high?

 

This is why I travel with the gay groups, such as Pied Piper. Their prices are much more reasonable. They may not have all that the all gay charters have. But, it's a great way to travel on my favorite ships and cruises with other gays. I always meet a lot of fun people and have a great time. And the prices are really affordable.

 

David

[johhnnyt]

I have friends on a few of the RSVP, Atlantis and other gay Europe trips that have reported very poor attendance. One told me that he was told since the Baltics sailing was so poorly sold they won't be offering it again for a couple of years.

So, have they over-priced their product or is it simply a reflection of the overall economy? As gays & lesbian cruisers have you pulled back for one reason or the other from these cruises? And if so what was the reason and what would get you to book with them (ANY company) in the future?

When looking at some of the websites I see some sailings are totally sold out while others are wide open. What do you look for when booking one of the GLBT cruises?

 

I do think it is a trade off. I've done 3 with Atlantis, 1 with RSVP , and 7 with Pied Piper, and really prefer the gay group cruises over the gay charters for a few reasons.

1. Price is obvious the 1st one, balcony stateroom on a 7 day atlantis ~$1400pp, pied piper equivalent 10 day for ~$1300 pp

2. Entertainment-The performers on the charters are much better geared for a gay audience, but most cruise ship performers are pretty forgettable an hour after the show, so to me this doesn't really matter.

3. Atmosphere-Last Atlantis one (about 3 years ago) I was on was like being trapped in a gay bar for a week. People seemed to have no consideration for anyone but themselves, too many people drunk or high continuously on that one for me. Doesn't matter to me what they want to do, but the handfuls that were obnoxious drunks can really put a damper on things for the rest.

4. Showing people who we are-I know this might sound like a silly one, but will say it anyway. One of the things that I've liked about the gay group voyages is it helps (I think) to show mainstream America that gay men & women are just like themselves. It shows them two men hugging or dancing isn't a threat to them on neutral territory. You can't change the world, but maybe you can change a perception or two.

Would I book an all gay cruise again. ABSOLUTELY. I like to think that most G&L are above average shoppers, and right now for me the price point for 100% gay cruises is just a bit too high compared to what I get out of it. My guess is I'll try one again soon though.

[MDDCFlyer]

Answering this question this year is going to be difficult. The global recession is defiantly a factor here. However, my assumption is that the capture group of people who will go on a all gay charter is limited. Now considering that in 2010 Atlantis has offered 9 cruises (yes - 9 cruises), it would be foolish for them to think they can fill them up just with the "regulars". How many of us can take the time off for more than 2 of these a year (not to talk about the price)? Without rapid increase in the number of unique individuals to go on those cruises, it was a problem bound to happen. Now add to that the global economy and you'll understand Atlantis predicament.

 

As for the original question about pricing - yes Atlantis is more expensive - but for the price you'll get the Atlantis experience. Is it good or bad depends on your expectation of course. The prices are expensive but not over the top, like other all gay cruises in Europe.

 

RSVP is even more affordable with prices similar to those on a regular cruise (before discounts). RSVP entertainment is also lower key than Atlantis. Which is again, depending on what you are looking for can be good or bad.

[dcikon2]

My partner and I love to travel. We alternate between land vacation and cruise. This past Mya/June we took a cruise out of San Juan. We have only been on "straight" cruises and are not interested in all-gay cruises due to the 1) cost being higher than other cruises and 2) appearance of amount of money being devoted to drinking/parties. We are past the party time and t-dances. Plus, we enjoy meeting people on the ships.

[Boytjie]

I think Atlantis has expanded to too many cruises to fast and then the economy took a dive. To my surprise though the did sell out the Oasis charter, I did not think they could get 5,000+ gays onboard. Their other cruises do not seem to be doing all that well.

 

RSVP is recovering from a financial mess and have been careful with expanding their offerings to soon. Last they offered the always popular and (recently) always sold-out Caribbean cruise, an Alaska cruise and two river boat cruises. This year it had the Caribbean cruise (50% of which was booked onboard the previous year's cruise) and the upcoming Hawaii cruise in November. Nest year's offerings are the Caribbean cruise and a Mediterranean cruise.

 

RSVP cruise fares have not really increased that much in the last few years. They have to figure how to price it so they can sell it well enough, cover the charter cost and turn a profit too. Not an easy task if you are signing a charter contract at least a year (or more) in advance of the cruise and they don't know what the economy will be like.

 

After 5 RSVP cruises and a short Pied Piper cruise on the QM2, I will still book gay charters since they are so much fun and different from a regular cruise. But when we did get off the Eurodam in February I sad that I would like to take a regular cruise for a change just so that I can relax and enjoy the ship more - RSVP cruises are just too jam-packed with activities, but oh so much fun.

[keithm]

I have friends on a few of the RSVP, Atlantis and other gay Europe trips that have reported very poor attendance. One told me that he was told since the Baltics sailing was so poorly sold they won't be offering it again for a couple of years.

So, have they over-priced their product or is it simply a reflection of the overall economy? As gays & lesbian cruisers have you pulled back for one reason or the other from these cruises? And if so what was the reason and what would get you to book with them (ANY company) in the future?

When looking at some of the websites I see some sailings are totally sold out while others are wide open. What do you look for when booking one of the GLBT cruises?

We just find the RSVP/Atlantis cruises to be overpriced & too much of a booze/drug clique. We do Cunard & find plenty of fellow gay travellers. We are well past the drug/booze/circut bashes. We were never into that stuff anyways.

[geekguy75]

I have friends on a few of the RSVP, Atlantis and other gay Europe trips that have reported very poor attendance. One told me that he was told since the Baltics sailing was so poorly sold they won't be offering it again for a couple of years.

So, have they over-priced their product or is it simply a reflection of the overall economy? As gays & lesbian cruisers have you pulled back for one reason or the other from these cruises? And if so what was the reason and what would get you to book with them (ANY company) in the future?

When looking at some of the websites I see some sailings are totally sold out while others are wide open. What do you look for when booking one of the GLBT cruises?

 

My partner & I love the all gay cruises. We were on the Shanghai - Hong Kong Atlantis cruise earlier this year and had a fantastic time. There are a lot of people posting in this thread about how they think Atlantis/RSVP don't offer good value - but I personally think the mostly-gay atmosphere is worth the premium even without the extra entertainment. Any other vacation is not going to be able to offer that. For the record the people I've met on the cruises have been, for the most part, extremely nice. We've left every Atlantis trip with new friends.

 

Someone else in this thread said it, I think - the gay charter companies are overextended. There is a limited market for gay cruises in the first place, and it has shrunk some percentage since the current financial crisis hit. I expect that 2011 will offer significantly fewer gay cruises than this year has - also they will also likely travel to less exotic places. I just hope that Atlantis is able to survive this rough year and that 2011 is a better one for them.

[OCruisers]

Hope it's OK for us to post here. No, we aren't gay BUT do have several dear friends and family members who are.

 

All seem to feel the ones noted as "Gay/Lesbian" are way over priced!!!

[Bloom9]

for me and my partner the price was what kept us away from a gay cruise. we would love to be on board a ship that was mostly gay people.. but we could not afford it.

 

I think both the economy and the fact that for some reason it appears that gay cruises are overpriced.. I think both of those combined are keeping a lot of people away.

 

I just don't seem to see the same type of cruise deals to be had for a gay cruise. Why is that?

 

Why do gay cruises have to be priced to high?

 

I felt the price was pretty high as well but did take the plunge and I definitely got my money's worth, it was an awesome experience.

 

The current economic condition plays a big part in not filling these charters, main stream sailings have also been impacted and forced into deep discounts to fill the ships.

 

There is still a market they sold out the Allure of the Seas in a very short time frame with no advertising! You can't judge the value of it until you experience it first hand.

[rummenroman]

1) Price....I can do two mainstream cruises verses one chartered cruise. I'm all about the quantity of vacations.

 

2) I don't believe we as a community are "special" and therefore we don't need all chartered cruises. The GLBT community wants inclusion into modern society as equals, yet we feel the need to have special places to go (gay bars, gay cruises, pride fest etc). Equality will only happen when we allow it to happen....but that is just my opinion.

 

3) The GLBT crowd knows how to party....sometimes too much. That just isn't my scene.

[TX_Atlantis_Cruiser]

Hmmm, seems like the sentiments here are running very much against all gay charters based mainly on price (okay the OP was about price, piont taken). I am very much biased in favor of Atlantis (hence my screen name), but most posters on this thread do not seem to be comparing the two sides on a fair basis.

 

As stated above, a full ship charter is, by nature, more costly to the chartering company and will therefore start from a higher price base. In the case of Atlantis and RSVP, the 'amenities' they outfit the ship with (e.g. dancefloor on top deck with lasers, killer soundsystem & lightboard, 'gay oriented' music throughout the ship, and the above average entertainment) add to the cost of sailing which has to be passed on to the consumer. In the end, the question is "do you want to sail on a mainstream cruise with no extras or niceties (no kids, no dress code, no stares for walking around in boots and your underwear) or do you like to have all of the all gay cruise advantages?" For my partner and me it's a 'no brainer' as we love places like Key West, but have turned to the all gay charters as a way to get away from everyday existence and spend seven days in a gay oasis.

[TX_Atlantis_Cruiser]

Also forgot to add that, while the Atlantis cruises can be a bit more wild than others, I haven't noticed a "gay bar" atmosphere. Quite the contrary, we have found that a good portion of Atlantis cruisers are upscale professionals (lawyers, doctors, engineers, etc.) and while they let loose during the dances, much of the rest of the cruise is just more sedate socialization. Also on the excursions we've done, having all guys is much more fun than mixed in with parents/kids and the atmosphere on the land excursions is not at all "party" though it is very lively. An afternoon at sea lounging on the pool deck with thousands of guys in speedos or watching the bears try to squeeze another cub into the hot tub is a whole other experience from the everyday life. Yes Atlantis has definitely overextended themselves this year and, hopefully, has corrected that in 2011, but the price for an all gay charter remains a good value given the experience of being on a ship free of homophobia (and CHILDREN) vs. being on a ship that mirrors our everyday existence in suburbia. BTW my partner is in recovery and still thoroughly enjoys the Atlantis atmosphere and has met some wonderful guys in the Friends of Bill meetings on the ships.

[Boytjie]

1) Price....I can do two mainstream cruises verses one chartered cruise. I'm all about the quantity of vacations.

 

I like a balance between quality and quantity. :)

 

2) I don't believe we as a community are "special" and therefore we don't need all chartered cruises. The GLBT community wants inclusion into modern society as equals, yet we feel the need to have special places to go (gay bars, gay cruises, pride fest etc). Equality will only happen when we allow it to happen....but that is just my opinion.

 

Ships are chartered by various groups: jazz musicians, religious groups, politicians, nudists, businesses etc. It's not about being excusionary, it's about a bunch of people with similar interestes wishing to sail together. Since gays are quite visable on just about all cruise lines on regular sailings I don't think it has anything to do with 'equality'.

 

3) The GLBT crowd knows how to party....sometimes too much. That just isn't my scene.

 

Not sure about what "too much partying" means... does it apply to Carnival cruises and other short booze cruises too? :D

 

Luckily there are opptions for people to cruise as they wish. :)

[Schplinky]

We haven't taken an Atlantis cruise but I'm glad the option exists for those who want or need an exclusively gay environment in order to be themselves. My fear for Atlantis is that they have started to train people to wait until the last minute because their free air or 2-for-1 sales are becoming much more common, the same as they did with RSVP before they nearly went under and had to be purchased.

 

We'd rather sale more often and so that's a key reason we have not chosen Atlantis or the pricier mainstream lines, for that matter. For others who are not as happy in a mainstream environment, Atlantis is a good choice and I hope they keep chugging along. I know the Allure sold out right away but the other sailings this year don't look overly sold out so i wonder if the Allure simply attracted most of the Atlantis customers for the season and it's hurting their other sailings.

 

I think it will be interesting to see the reaction to the Allure. The Oasis has had fantastic reviews but for Atlantis' purposes, not being able to have everyone in one place will be a challenge. Having 5,000 guys and no headliner (if what I read is correct) might be tough, too, since the premium entertainment is one of the things a gay cruiser is paying extra for.

[Boytjie]

Also forgot to add that, while the Atlantis cruises can be a bit more wild than others, I haven't noticed a "gay bar" atmosphere. Quite the contrary, we have found that a good portion of Atlantis cruisers are upscale professionals (lawyers, doctors, engineers, etc.) and while they let loose during the dances, much of the rest of the cruise is just more sedate socialization. Also on the excursions we've done, having all guys is much more fun than mixed in with parents/kids and the atmosphere on the land excursions is not at all "party" though it is very lively. An afternoon at sea lounging on the pool deck with thousands of guys in speedos or watching the bears try to squeeze another cub into the hot tub is a whole other experience from the everyday life.

 

That holds true for RSVP too. Going on a enxcursion with all family is quite fun. I have seen the buses with excursions from other ships and they usually seem so subdued and dull whereas the gays are all having fun. And we woudl hear commenst form peopel on regular cruises saying they want to go with us!

 

Like the time in Roatan where we had the guide and driver sing their national anthem for us, or coming back from carnival in Curacao and the whole bus broke out singing to the theme from the Love Boat when it played on the sound system - don't know if it was sheer luck or the driver planned it.

[KauaiBruce]

I think the posts about drinking too much on gay cruises are funny. I guess people do not read the regular post boards. People get pretty drunk on the straight cruises also. You would have to get drunk to stand the kids.

 

Not having children on a ship is worth the price! I love the surreal atmosphere of living in a 100% gay world surround by smiling straight servants. It is fun being part of the Norm instead of the minority.

 

I live in a small town type atmosphere on an island. We are totally openly gay and people here are very accepting. I wonder if those who do not want to be in such a gay saturated environment already live in largely gay areas.

 

I saw threads like this back when the economy was great and the Atlantis cruises were all selling out. I think it is insane for Atlantis to keep increasing its schedule while the economy is bad. Yes, the gays are a little less effected by it if they have no kids but everyone is watching the budget right now.

 

I think the Allure killed the regular Atlantis March cruise. I was surprised to see it still listed. That one is usually heavily booked for the next year before people leave it.

[chelseaguy]

Partner and I choose not to fly to FL or PR to catch a ship so NY based crusies are our thing. Unfortunately Pied Piper's schedule rarely matches ours, but we have had wonderful times and met great people on Cunard, NCL and HAL. We still hope PP might work and would try Atlantis?/RSVP if they left from NY and were favorably priced.

 

Next cruise: QM2 from NY January 3.

[Boytjie]

and would try Atlantis?/RSVP if they left from NY and were favorably priced.

 

I have spoken to someone at RSVP about NY departures and there are basically two options: Canadian or Caribbean cruises. Canadian cruises are popular in general and demand high so the charters are more expensive and would make it less profitable for RSVP. Gay charters are usually 7 day cruises and thatremains the popular length. For Caribbean cruises it would take 2 days to get to warm weather (and 2 days back) during the cold month and that is not good when outdoor parties are a mainstay of gay cruisess.

[chelseaguy]

Peter,

Thanks for the explanation. Our preference is for winter, so I guess that makes it unlikely we'll find a match. I expected as much.

[RMS Olympic]

1. the economy is going to hit the younger crowd that may need low prices

2. The older crowd having been there done that look for more unique experiences

3. The wealthy crowd that may not be impacted by the economy may want upscale. Or smaller ships, or more boutique experience.

So one product flavour may not fit the customer base.

.............................

Then there is the size of these ships.

One cruise on Oasis....would eat up the potential regular customers that would fill 2 to 2.5 cruises on smaller ships of 2000 pax.

Add in the charter lead time for a ship........does not allow for swings in the economy.

I have been on both Atlantis and RSVP....and love being in the majority. I dont make use of the late night parties, but still love meeting guys from all over. I am always amazed at the diversity within our own community.

However this coming Jan, I chose to sail on the NieuwAmsterdam a month ahead of the RSVP cruise on the same ship. By doing so I saved more than half the price as a solo. So price for me as a single becomes a challenge...as on mainstream cruises I dont have to pay the double charge as on a charter. Now if there was a special ship or special itinerary....I'd bite the price and book.

In the future , will probably try Pied Piper as I am more a piano bar type than on deck party animal.

Charters....still a remarkable option....I waited to do a gay charter to Hawaii, and will sail on the RSVP cruise this fall......even if its on NCL.....

Touring with LGBT folks makes everything just more fun!

My 3.5 cents.

[shepp]

1 I don't believe we as a community are "special" and therefore we don't need all chartered cruises. The GLBT community wants inclusion into modern society as equals, yet we feel the need to have special places to go (gay bars, gay cruises, pride fest etc). Equality will only happen when we allow it to happen....but that is just my opinion .

 

Sorry, my opinion differs. I'm not attracted to all-gay cruises - too old, too thrifty, and hey, I live a 15-minute stroll from Castro Street. Which is not to say they don't have their place. Having been exposed to homophobia on a mixed HAL cruise, I have to say that, thick-skinned as I usually am, I was uncomfortable being trapped on a ship with those people for the rest of the week.

 

Equality and assimilation are two different things. And I'm thinking there's something odd about your thesis. Would anyone suggest to Irish-Americans that St. Patrick's Day parades are an impediment to their civil rights? Does a guy learning about the "special" all-female Red Hat Society think that women don't deserve the right to marry? Would you suggest that a guy who wants to get laid go to a mostly straight bar and hope his gaydar's working?

 

Equality will only happen when we make it happen...but that's just my opinion.