JOIN LINDY LIVE FROM THE MS ZAANDAM Sept 24 to Oct 12, 2011

[RuthC]

I think there should be extra compensation for the confusion. Also a box of chocolates!! (right Ruth!)

At the very least. :D

 

Mostly, I think Seattle should get it's act together and give accurate information. People call there for that information, and make plans based on it. Then, to get to the ship and find it's not the case, is beyond disappointing. It's false advertising!

Get the answer right in the first place, even if it's not the one the caller would prefer.

[IRL_Joanie]

I think I know what the information conflict is between Seattle (Karen, who I also speak with) and the Shore Excursion Offices on the ship.

 

There is an elevator that goes down to B deck (Bottom most accessible deck) and from there you are able to roll a wheelchair or scooter right onto the tender platform and into the tender. I've utilized this system on Nieuw Amsterdam and have photos from a couple other ships showing the platform.

 

My guess is that Shore Excursions on board the ship has no idea that this exists.

 

In the last photo you can see a young crew member standing in the doorway that leads from the elevator to the tender platform (Click on the photos to see full sized)

 

Amsterdam:

 

 

These 2 are from the Oosterdam and are the best photos I have showing the Tender docking area on B Deck:

 

 

 

Joanie

[startwin]

I talked to Seattle twice yesterday on the same issue, and within half an hour of each other.... and got conflicting info. Still waiting for someone to determine exactly what is correct. They certainly have problems there.

[RuthC]

There is an elevator that goes down to B deck (Bottom most accessible deck) and from there you are able to roll a wheelchair or scooter right onto the tender platform and into the tender.

That's true on the Vista and Signature ships, Joanie, but not on the other classes.

[IRL_Joanie]

That's true on the Vista and Signature ships, Joanie, but not on the other classes.

 

Ruth, you might just be right. I looked long and hard at the photo and see that there does not appear to be a lift or dorrway down there by the platform itself. Nor can I discern any sort of lift apparatus.........

 

I also just found a similar photo of the Rotterdam and it looks the same as Amsterdam

 

 

Joanie

[lindalans]

The Oahu Grand Circle Island Tour.

This excursion was booked through HAL. They are using Gray Line Hawaii Polynesian Adventure Tours; the coach was air conditioned and very clean. On leaving the terminal we headed east around the south east corner of Oahu, all the way north up the east coast, then headed west, before heading south down the middle of Oahu. If you just want to drive by many well known beautiful places at 60 miles an hour, stopping at only a few, then this is the tour for you.

The coast line certainly offers majestic vistas, very scenic shore lines and of course many surfing beaches. We passed by the International Marketplace, the Punchbowl, Ala Moana Beach Park, Waikiki Beach, Diamond Head, and Koko Head. I think I would have enjoyed browsing around the Marketplace for a couple of hours. Waikiki Beach looked as beautiful as it does on TV and I had visions of walking bare-footed across the warm sand, while gentle ocean waves lapped around my feet. I am of course dreaming! I hate walking bare foot, and I learned at Paradise Cove that my wheelchair only goes in circles on the sand!

Our first 10 minute stop was at Hanauma Bay. Cousin Dwayne “forgot” that I may have liked to get out; so I was thankful that I have an 18x zoom lens on my camera. As he was doing his head count I gave him a gentle reminder that I would like to get out on future stops!

We drove past the Halona Blow Hole & Sandy Beach to Makapuu Point. A 10 minute stop here gave me time to take some photos. Our next stop at a country store in Waimanalo was 20 minutes. Go figure!!!!!

The coastline is very beautiful with many beaches right on the roadside, as we made our way to the Byodo-In Temple. The Temple is in theValley of the Temples Memorial Park, and is a replica of a temple in Uji, Japan, that was constructed over 950 years ago. It is a non-denominational Buddhist temple which welcomes people of all faiths to worship or meditate.

We had 15 minutes here. What an amazingly peaceful place this is, and you’d need at least a couple of hours to do it justice. Once I was over the bridge, the rest of the area is thick gravel. I quickly found out that, like in the sand, my wheelchair would only go around in circles! What a disappointment! How I would have loved to go inside to see the nine-foot Amida or "Lotus" Buddha as it is called, because he sits upon a lotus flower. I read that it is the largest wooden Buddha carved in over 900 years; and it is stained in black lacquer and decorated in gold leaf.

For lunch (which wasn’t anything to write home about) we stopped for 50 minutes at the Polynesian Cultural Center. The grounds are lovely, and I would imagine that you’d need a full day here to take in everything about the culture of the different Polynesian Islands.

As “Cousin Dwayne” was getting me into the bus on the lift, my foot got trapped and I got a nasty gash on the back of my right heel. It bled like crazy and using the first aid kit aboard, a passenger tended to my wound, which I greatly appreciated, especially as I never even heard the word sorry from “Cousin Dwayne.” He did document it, and for the rest of the tour he called me Linda instead of referring to me as “the ADL lady.”

As we continued on with our journey he pulled in briefly at Turtle Bay, and we got to see a large green sea turtle from a distance. I didn’t get a photo as there were too many people around it.

Our next 15 minute stop was at the Dole Plantation where I made a beeline for the famous pineapple whip. There was a long line up but I was determined I wasn’t going to leave without one. It was absolutely delicious and covered with the sweetest, freshest pineapple I’ve ever had. Mmmmmmmmmm!!!!

Our final 10 minute stop was at The Nuuanu Pali Lookout ("Cool Height Cliff") overlooking the 985 foot cliffs of the Koolau Mountain Range. It was cloudy, drizzling and very very windy. As I’m beginning to think these “dam” ships don’t like me, I decided to stay on the bus!!! They say it is one of the best views on O'ahu. as the stone terrace overlooks the areas of Kaneohe and Kailua, Mokolii (a pointy island locals call Chinaman’s Hat) and the University of Hawaii’s marine biology research center, Coconut Island. Despite the clouds, it was an impressive view.

On arriving back at the ship I took my swollen legs and feet, and battered right heel, down to the infirmary. There it was cleaned and dressed with skin glue and antibiotic cream. I can’t shower for 24 hours, and with instructions to keep it elevated, I have to go back in 48 hours.

A very tired Lindy arrived back in her cabin at 7:30pm, ordered room service (French onion soup, pot roast and a chocolate dessert) and climbed into bed.

All questions will be answered tomorrow.

[startwin]

Ruth, you might just be right. I looked long and hard at the photo and see that there does not appear to be a lift or dorrway down there by the platform itself. Nor can I discern any sort of lift apparatus.........

 

I also just found a similar photo of the Rotterdam and it looks the same as Amsterdam

 

 

Joanie

 

Joanie that's just the loading bay, no elevator on any of the R & S ships, I don't know about Vista though.

[RuthC]

He did document it, and for the rest of the tour he called me Linda instead of referring to me as “the ADL lady.”

I cannot believe this guy's attitude! :eek: Not good, especially for someone in a customer service job.

Hope your foot heals quickly.

 

Isn't that Dole whip delicious! :D I could go for some right now.

[lindalans]

In Nawiliwili, Kauai, Tuesday Oct 4, 2011

Another 7:30am wake up call this morning after a not so good night. My heel is very sore, and I had to get up several times to pee, as I had taken a lasix to reduce the fluid build up in my feet and legs.

With our late arrival back last night and having to go to the infirmary, I never got to the Shore Excursion Desk. It is only open from 5pm – 6pm. I will go tonight for sure as my tour today is shorter, so will be back in time. I plan on going early to stand in line, as I’m sure I won’t be the only wheelchair user waiting to talk about the lift issue.

One way or another I’ll get to the bottom of it, as I feel it’s an important issue for all those of us who use wheelchairs and scooters. Seattle should not be selling these shore excursions with incorrect information. I fully intend to write to Karen when I return home because it is false advertising.

I headed up to the Lido for orange juice and a danish, but got waylaid by the man in the jazzy wheelchair. So without breakfast (which isn’t a big deal) I made a dash for A deck and the terminal, which is the meeting point for my excursion.

Kauai Plantation Railway Train Ride & Manor House Visit

The tour company is the same one as yesterday and our driver was Won, another native Hawaiian. Again very friendly, knowledgeable and as an added bonus he called me by name. Like yesterday the coach was air conditioned and very clean.

It was only a short drive to our destination and Won pointed out places of interest. As soon as we pulled into the 105 acre plantation we were told we had 15 minutes before we boarded the train at 10am. Won also explained that after the 40 minute train ride, we would meet back at the bus at 11:30am which would give us at least ¾ of an hour to view the Manor House and its grounds. Definitely more my style of tour, with time to take photos of the beautiful grounds, and many different coloured hibiscuses.

The train was very clean and the two passenger cars are made from pure mahogany wood and the train track was all hand laid. A 1939 Whitcomb Diesel Engine pulled the cars. The lift to get into the car was easy to get on and off, is ADA approved and has a 600-pound capacity. It was hand cranked by a pleasant young man. From the train we had excellent views of the orchards where they are growing acerola cherries, cashew nuts, mangos, star anise, lychees, pineapple, sugarcane, bananas, papayas, taro, as well as hard woods and bamboo. The train stopped so anyone could get off to feed the animals, which were wild pigs, goats and sheep. The baby wild pigs were so cute, and our guide told us we were welcome to take them home as pets, as they breed like wild fire!!

In 1935, when sugar was in its heyday, Gaylord Parke Wilcox, the head of the Grove Farm Plantation, constructed the Manor House, which was his dream house on the Kilohana estate. When it was completed, this 15,000-square-foot pseudo-Tudor mansion would be the most expensive home ever built on Kauai. Once the centre of a 26,000 acre sugar tract, I found it to be impressive and well worth the visit.

On arrival back at the ship I headed for lunch at the Lido, then spent a couple of hours in my cabin, relaxing and working on my report. It was good to put my feet up for awhile.

After changing for supper, at 4:30pm I headed down to the Shore Excursion Desk to wait until it opened at 5pm. I was the 2nd in line, but ended up 3rd as a big guy pushed in front of me. I chatted to the lady who was first, and she was cancelling her excursion in Lahaina because her husband was in a wheelchair, and she also had been told they couldn’t tender in.

Katrinka (the lady) remembered me (I must be one of those once seen never forgotten people) and my shore excursion was cancelled and 100% refunded. I asked her why there was such lack of communication between Seattle and the ship, and she told me she has talked to Karen (in Seattle) many times, telling her that there used to be one, but there were so many accidents with it that they hadn’t used it for about 4 years. She also told me that when the Zaandam goes in for its next dry dock it will be fitted with one. I thanked her, and told her I would communicate this info. to Karen when I got home. I also mentioned my accident on the bus lift yesterday, and she was already aware of it. I guess small accidents like this don’t even rate a plate of chocolates, which was the only compensation I received on the Amsterdam last year when I broke my back!!!!!!!!!

As I arrived in the dining room the ship started to do some rolling. Not long afterwards the Captain made an announcement, we may not be able to stop in Lahaina! A final decision won’t be made until the morning. He explained the possibilities and that he had plans A, B, C, & D in place. I couldn’t hear the details of all the plans as people were talking. One plan though would be not to use the ship’s tenders, but to use the shore ones which are much bigger. Plan D would be that we would bypass Lahaina altogether, and go directly to Hilo where we would stay overnight. I have no problem with this as he knows best.

It was good to be in the Dining Room with my table mates again. I enjoyed tropical fruit, caesar salad, roast turkey, and a chocolate hazelnut meringue that was so sweet I left it.

Afterwards I headed back to my cabin as I was too tired to take in the show, and just wanted to put my feet up. Seeing as I can’t go ashore tomorrow whether or not we make it to Lahaina, I plan on putting the privacy sign on my door so I can sleep in.

At 9pm I had a call from the Front Office. This was in regards to my question about tendering that I had asked about on Wednesday, Sept. 28, 2011. The young lady was very pleasant and said that she had heard from the 4TH Officer. She said that the Zaandam has a lift but that the 4TH Officer had said that because of rough seas I would be unable to tender in. I explained that I had heard the announcement by the Captain that we may have to go directly to Hilo, because of weather conditions, and that he would update us in the morning. She said that as of tonight we are still scheduled to stop in Lahaina.

We all know that if you are using a wheelchair or scooter (and depending on your weight and its weight) that tendering is out no matter what, if the seas are rough, and that it is at the discretion of the Captain.

As of 9pm tonight the confusing issue is, does the Zaandam have a lift to get us on and off the tender???? Karen (in Seattle) says yes, Katrinka at the Shore Excursions Office (on the ship) says no, yet the 4TH Officer (on the ship) says yes also! Who is right????

For my own satisfaction, and because I think it’s important for future cruisers to know this information before they book shore excursions on the Zaandam I’m going to investigate this further.

[erewhon]

Am enjoying reading your reports.

Hope the injury to your heel heals quickly.

 

Good luck in your quest to discover the truth about the lift for tendering.

[keep on cruising]

Lindy, thanks for your great, informative reports. It sounds like you had a wonderful time in Kauai. I hope your heel heals very quickly.

 

I am very interested in what you find out about the lift. It is really confusing on if the Zaandam has a lift or not. I sent an email to Karen but have not received a response yet.

 

Enjoy the rest of your cruise.

[yakky]

What a small world we have when your own wine attendent is a young man that Jerry and I care for very deeply!! Thank you for making the inquiry.

 

So sorry about your foot-hopefully it will heal quickly. Your reports on the Islands are terrific. I look forward to all your comments.

 

We have had 10 cruises on HAL and enjoyed each one. (I also travel with the wheelchair) Sometimes "stuff" happens, but the staff are always great and accommodating. All this to say, we enjoy your easy style and do hope you savor every day on board!

[lindalans]

Answers to questions!

Lisa…..Yes there is a 3 hour time difference in Hawaii. We put the clocks back 1 hour each night on Sept 25, 27 & 29. I was happy that they did it at night and not during the day, as some ships do.

Sharon & Jerry….I apologize for spelling your name with a G instead of a J. Micheal told me yesterday he had emailed you.

Benchmarklearning……….No I didn’t think the luau at Paradise Cove was worth the money. It was $154 through HAL. The drive out there was ¾ of an hour each way, we received an orchid lei, and apart from the pork I’ve enjoyed better meals on the ship. If you were in a wheelchair or had a walker you didn’t go up to the buffet, but had the meal served to you on plates with cutlery and cloth napkins. If you helped yourself it was paper plates (small) plastic cutlery, and paper napkins. You get a free mai tai, 2 free standard drinks (pop) and 1 exotic one (I had a pina colada.) One guy on our roll call went back for seconds, but it had all been cleared away! They take a photo of you, but if you want to buy it, its $15.

Boards…………..No I’m not from PA. I grew up in Northern England and emigrated to Alberta, Canada in 1977. Gallivanting is a common expression in England and supper is Canadian. In England we always called supper tea!

The cabin with the sewer smell is on the Main Deck near the first bank of elevators at the bow of the ship. Stella said they cleaned the carpets again and it’s better. She also told me that someone else is having the same problem on Deck 7 in an aft cabin.

Lahaina, Hilo, Hawaii, Wednesday Oct 5, 2011

Last night I put the Privacy sign in the key card slot so I could sleep a little longer. I did get an extra hour! The Captain made an announcement that a tender had been sent ashore but was unable to get back. We are now sailing to Hilo and will arrive around 5pm – 5:30pm and will be docked there overnight, instead of arriving at 8am in the morning.

At 10:30am I went to the spa to have my hair done.

Afterwards I basically just tootled around the ship talking to different people. I am truly amazed how many of them are very angry that we have now missed two ports. Some have even said that that they think the Captain must not be very experienced. They just do not seem to understand that he cannot predict the weather. I am happy that he is thinking of the safety of his passengers and crew, as I don’t need anymore accidents.

I had to go back to the infirmary to have my heel cleaned and dressed. Tomorrow after my shore excursion I have to go again. She will clean it and leave the dressing off, but I’ll have to go back to my cabin, then later on go back to have it re-dressed.

When I was in the infirmary the evening of our second day in Honolulu, I noticed something disturbing. While I was lying on the bed, that had one of its bed rail sides up, there was what looked to be about a 5” streak of dried blood on it. It was still there today, so whoever is responsible for cleaning the infirmary, isn’t doing a good job.

At 5pm there was a bbq on the Lido deck so I had supper there tonight. It was very good. I enjoyed chatting to many new people, as well as some I’d already met. I had intended to go ashore when we docked but stayed for the bbq instead.

At 10pm I headed back to my cabin and set a wake up call for 7:30am as I have a 9:15am shore excursion planned.

When I get back in the early afternoon, I’ve decided to see if I can arrange a meeting with the Captain or an officer, to talk about the tender lift issue.

[startwin]

Thanks for the great job you are doing. One of the most informative and interesting "live from...." threads ever:) Too bad about missing ports.... lots of the same kinds of comments about the same captain when we missed ports in Alaska. Maybe they are some of the same passengers.

Hope your ankle heals up OK.

[lindalans]

In Hilo, Hawaii Thursday Oct. 6, 2011

I was awake long before my wake up call at 7:30am. I love racing up to the Lido on excursion mornings for those fresh Danish and orange juice. After 17 days aboard the Zaandam I’m going to get a rude awakening when I get home.

I headed down to Deck A for debarkation onto the pier. Those steep gangplanks don’t even bother me anymore, as the crew take it slowly, and I know I am in capable hands.

I’m a little early so I park and people watch.

Nyron (the male from the Shore Excursion Desk) finds me and says “We are going to be breaking up today” I say “Oh do you live in Hilo?” and he says “No I live on the ship.” I must have looked confused as he said “ You can’t go on the excursion as they won’t take your chair on the lift.” Am I hearing right? They have a lift but they won’t take my wheelchair!! He said he was only given this information this morning, and there’s nothing he can do! I’m absolutely flabbergasted. L I asked if there was a wheelchair accessible taxi available but there are none in Hilo. He then told me to wait, and he’d see if he could figure something else out.

It wasn’t long before he came back and said there was nothing. He also told me that even if I could have taken the excursion ‘Historical Hilo and the Nani Mau Gardens’ which includes a 40 minute tram ride, the tram doesn’t have a lift! I asked if there was a Hilo Hatties close by that I could just go to in my wheelchair, but he said there wasn’t.

I came back to the ship with a heavy heart.

My first stop was to the Front Desk to request an appointment to see the Captain, or Chief Officer, about the tender lift. They asked if they could help, but I said no as I needed some questions answered. He got on the phone and I told him I wanted to see either of them personally. When he got off the phone he said I would be contacted.

Back in my room it wasn’t long before the phone rang and it was Cheryl from the front desk. She asked if she could help, and I said no I wanted to speak to the Captain or first officer. She asked what my questions were, so I told her about Cruise Critic, my daily reports, and the lack of communication between Seattle and the ship in regards to the tender lift.

She suggested I talk to Guest Relations so I said I wanted to speak to someone with authority. When she phoned me back later she said I could meet with the manager at 4pm. I am not an unreasonable person and I have to start somewhere, so I agreed to the meeting at 4pm.

When I get a bee in my bonnet about something I don’t stop buzzing until I have answers. At home I’m an advocate for the disabled, and I’m a volunteer board member, and treasurer, for our local senior center. Issues are right up my alley!!!

Right now I have to go down to the infirmary, then I’m heading to dine with the chef. The clocks go forward an hour tonight so I’ll finish this tomorrow.

[erewhon]

I hope you have a successful outcome from your meeting with the manager.

[catl331]

Unbelievable!! I am angry with HAL! You seem to be such an upbeat person and still managing to have some fun. Rats!:mad:

[jayteeaitch]

Unbelievable!! I am angry with HAL! You seem to be such an upbeat person and still managing to have some fun. Rats!:mad:

 

and why shouldn't she be - she's a reet gudd lass from upp North - and

 

born to it:rolleyes::D

 

( I hope it's West of the Penninnines;))

[RuthC]

I can't help it, Lindy. I'm starting to wonder if cruising is for you!

Looking forward to hearing about the results of your meeting.

In the meantime, have a danish for me, will ya?

[keep on cruising]

:( I really feel bad that you are having so many issues with your tours. Did they ever say why they would sell you a tour that was not really accessible?

 

We were told by Karen that the Hilo tour you booked was accessible also without a mention that the tram was not. The garden's website also says it is completely wheelchair accessible.

 

While we did not book a ship's in Hilo we did in a couple of other ports. Now I'm thinking, I need to cancel these and try to do them on our own.

 

Does anyone know of a name in the Special Needs Department that I can contact other than Karen. It is definitely not right that people rely on the information they receive from the web site and from emails (so not word of mouth that could be open to misinterpretation) and then have no way to tour a port they have traveled so far to see.

[Himself]

You have had some frustrating moments on what should be a wonderful cruise. I admire your fiestiness.

[keep on cruising]

I decided to research this tour a little more. Interestingly, Princess has a similiar tour but does not sell it as wheelchair accessible (it shows the transportation for the tour is not accessible).

 

I also called the garden and asked about the tram. They informed me there is no way a wheelchair can board the tram. I have no idea of how this tour can be sold as accessible without a caveat that you cannot board the tram.

 

Lindy, I hope the rest of your cruise goes more smoothly. Like you I want to get to the bottom of this. Thanks to you, I can investigate before we board in 3 weeks. I'm certainly not going to allow it to ruin my cruise but I do want to know what to expect.

[lindalans]

Meeting with Bernadette, the Guest Relations Manager.

At 4pm yesterday I met with Bernadette, the Guest Relations Manager, who was a very pleasant young woman. I told her I was the group leader (which I am) for the 26 Cruise Critic members aboard the Zaandam. Can you tell I am still hoping to at least get a plate (a box would be better) of chocolates, or an invite to a Captain’s Cocktail party???? And not for a drink either!!

I explained about the email from Seattle prior to boarding and booking my shore excursions with Karen, and it clearly states the Zaandam is already equipped with a tender lift so we can stay in our wheelchairs. I told of my conversation with Katrinka who says they used to have one, they don’t now, and that she has told Karen this many times; and that when the Zaandam goes in to dry dock, it will be fitted with one. I told of the message via the front office from the first officer who said the Zaandam DOES have one! I also mentioned my accident on the bus lift with NO apology from “Cousin Dwayne” plus the disappointment in Hilo, with the bus that had a lift, but wouldn’t take my wheelchair, so I had to return to the ship.

For good measure I threw in that I had paid nearly $3000 for this trip (it was actually $2831.36 without air fare and hotel cost.) That HAL in Seattle is false advertising their shore excursions to the disabled; and that despite their website saying they do not discriminate against the disabled, they actually do.

I also told her I was doing “a live from the Zaandam” and that I was seeking answers for future Cruise Critic passengers who are getting conflicting information from Seattle. Plus I stated there was a lack of communication between Seattle and the ship. At all times I was pleasant, as being angry doesn’t get you anywhere, and I just needed answers!

She listened and noted my concerns, and she told me the Zaandam does indeed have a lift, but it is not on the tender. She drew a drawing of the ship to explain where the lift is! It is one deck below the A deck and it is at water level. It looks to be like a small platform that comes out from the ship. On the right hand side it has 6 steps down to it, which she said of course would be no use for a wheelchair user, but on the left side there is a lift to get onto the platform. I have asked her to get me a photo of this elusive lift, and she is 90% sure she will be able too. She is also going to talk to Nyron (who is the manager of shore excursions) so his staff are made aware, and will alert Seattle. She promised to get back to me on it, and if I haven’t heard from her by tomorrow afternoon, I will be knocking on her door, now I know where she hides out!

OK so now we know the ship has a lift, however, don’t get too excited, as this is not the lift that Seattle is saying is aboard the tender (which I personally think would be safer) unless of course you fancy the possibility of a cold dip in the ocean!!

Soooooooo at this point I concur that Seattle is guilty of false advertising any excursions they are selling to those of us who use wheelchairs, and can’t do steps. I would not have booked this cruise if I had known what I know now; I would have cancelled before final payment. Holland America will definitely be receiving a letter from me about this, with Karen getting a copy!!!!

The rest of yesterday is to be continued.

[erewhon]

Linda,

 

Thank you for this update.

Am really pleased that you were able to speak with Bernadette, hope she gets the photo for you.

 

It is disappointing that HAL sells excursions as wheelchair accessable, when they are not. Maybe Head Office needs to send a person who requires a wheelchair to actually test what they advertise.

[fann1sh]

Lindy, I'm heartsick about all the roadblocks you've endured.

 

((hug))