Concordia News: Please Post Here

[SomeBeach]

Wouldn't a captain, knowing that there was a delicate navigational maneuver being made, want to be at the bridge overseeing the operation? Where was he right before this happened that was way more important than the safety of his passengers and crew? The evidence shows he took command a few minutes before the incident. Where the heck was he before? Don't understand how anything else could be more important.

 

IMHO this was a captain who was promoted way above his capabilities. He had charisma and knew how to charm but he was way in over his head. Not only did he take the ship into very dangerous waters for the sake of vanity, he failed to ensure he was safely passing through an area known for danger. He then failed to follow all safety protocols and lost control of his crew, his passengers, his ship and his senses. Witnesses have said he sat frozen for hours on a rock staring at the ship as it was going down! :eek:

 

Hopefully this will serve as a lesson for all cruise lines to choose their captains carefully. They need to screen out the risk-takers and those who are not willing to take responsibility.

 

I could believe he sat on that rock and probably in shock at that point. Many people think when something happens, shock sets in right away. While it can, in many cases it can come an hour, day, or even a week after something horrible happens.

I somewhat believe the Captain went into survival mode when the accident first happened. From some reports, he seemed to be functioning on some level. It is more than likely when he got away from the ship and really saw it, that's when it hit him. I remember one interview shortly after the accident where he really made no sense in his comments. Then the one where he was being taken out of the police van while still on the island, he had the deer in the headlights look on his face. I do believe that he was in shock.

Now this is just an opinion based on some prior experience I have had with shock. I was not there to see him either before, during, or after.

Now, seeing the latest interviews, I believe he is back in survival mode. I also think he needs to shut up because he's making thing worse for himself.

[sidari]

"A captain cannot shift blame onto his officers," he said. "And a ship with more than 4,000 people on board cannot be put under the command of such an amateur."

 

That comment is a bit rich coming from the mayor of a tiny island who clearly knows nothing of navigating a ship or the responsibilites of the officers below Captain! and to call them amateurs is a total insult.

 

SB ... I am with you on this one regarding shock, most people having never felt or had to deal with the aftermath of severe shock in a person or persons can never understand how a person looks or acts either at the time or hours or days afterwards.

 

"Captain Schitino seems to have a priority adjustment problem. Given a choice between the saftey of the ship, passengers and crew versus a stolen evening with his inamorta, he quickley chose the latter"

 

Uni .. I am glad that to see that you are also a mind reader and can tell us exactly what was on or in his mind that night!

 

 

Tonka ... Do you have any idea of the depth of water along the route that was mapped out near the island of Giglio ? Concordia would need as i understand it a minimum of 30 feet of water under the keel in order to stay upright, according to the Media reports the water below where the ship now lies is around 300 feet deep and therefore deep enough at half a mile from the island to support the ship.

[GregnChris]

The Captain seems to be saying that he was responsible for the ship coming to rest on the rocks, which saved lives. But I don't know how he could have done that. Wasn't the ships propulsion system rendered inoperative very shortly after the collision? If so, how did he maneuver the ship to come to rest on the rocks?

 

From what I have read, it was a fortunate wind that pushed the ship back towards the island. Not something the Captain did. Yet he seems to be claiming credit for it.

 

Greg

[cruiserfanfromct]

"A captain cannot shift blame onto his officers," he said. "And a ship with more than 4,000 people on board cannot be put under the command of such an amateur."

 

That comment is a bit rich coming from the mayor of a tiny island who clearly knows nothing of navigating a ship or the responsibilites of the officers below Captain! and to call them amateurs is a total insult.

 

What is rich is Schettino sitting clueless on the rocks while the Major and Deputy Major of this tiny island had to improvise and devise its own emergency plan.

 

The Concordia was basically a floating resort, with a captain who acted more like a floating hotel manager, a man that was probably chosen because he looked good in a uniform and could socialize with the men and cavort with the ladies, but useless (or worse than useless) when a real maritime emergency struck. As we now have PROOF.

 

Hopefully the cruise industry will take heed from this disaster and put into place guidelines (if there aren't any already) for hiring and promoting all future captains and officers.

[DocF]

The Captain seems to be saying that he was responsible for the ship coming to rest on the rocks, which saved lives. But I don't know how he could have done that. Wasn't the ships propulsion system rendered inoperative very shortly after the collision? If so, how did he maneuver the ship to come to rest on the rocks?

 

From what I have read, it was a fortunate wind that pushed the ship back towards the island. Not something the Captain did. Yet he seems to be claiming credit for it.

 

Greg

 

The Captain lies. The reason the hulk is where it presently lies is that the currents carried it to this point. It has nothing to do with the navigation of the ship after it collided with the rock and subsequently lost power. The grounding and capsize were caused by weather and natural forces, not by the Captain or any of his crew.

 

Doc

[mickey_d_mouse]

I'd like to know how much Today Tonight and the other channels paid this man he already got 50,000 euros for the Canale 5 interview and now these two, I have never asked or recieved a cent. Maybe I shoudl ask costa to pay me 50,000 euros to shut up.

 

I am sorry I dont think he was in shock or anything else he is a coward plain and simple.

 

I do not believe he steered the ship I think it was fate that made us end up on that rock.

 

All of you maritime experts, if he had abondoned ship whilst the ship had a slight tilt after the accident would all have the lifeboats got off? If he had commanded his staff to evacuate with orders over the radio, and told them which way to go into Giglio over the radio with commands, Would more have died or is he just totaly full of crap.

 

Sorry if this sounds terse the last few days have made the nightmares come back, I havent been sleeping very well.

[SomeBeach]

What is rich is Schettino sitting clueless on the rocks while the Major and Deputy Major of this tiny island had to improvise and devise its own emergency plan.

 

The Concordia was basically a floating resort, with a captain who acted more like a floating hotel manager, a man that was probably chosen because he looked good in a uniform and could socialize with the men and cavort with the ladies, but useless (or worse than useless) when a real maritime emergency struck. As we now have PROOF.

 

Hopefully the cruise industry will take heed from this disaster and put into place guidelines (if there aren't any already) for hiring and promoting all future captains and officers.

 

How would they do this? Sure, it may be possible in a psychological exam to pick up some clues to the personality of an individual to cast some doubt on their ability but is that enough to stop their promotion. You would have to place a person in extraordinary circumstances to see how they react and that is just not possible.

Even if you threw all of what happened to Concordia into a simulator at a Maritime Training Center and have various obstacles thrown at them, you would not get a clear picture. The mind would think different during simulation vs real life and death.

 

Again, just my opinion. I am in no way looking to defend the Captain. He lost me when he "fell off the ship." That was enough to make me cast doubt on most everything he says.

[SomeBeach]

I'd like to know how much Today Tonight and the other channels paid this man he already got 50,000 euros for the Canale 5 interview and now these two, I have never asked or recieved a cent. Maybe I shoudl ask costa to pay me 50,000 euros to shut up.

 

I am sorry I dont think he was in shock or anything else he is a coward plain and simple.

 

I do not believe he steered the ship I think it was fate that made us end up on that rock.

 

All of you maritime experts, if he had abondoned ship whilst the ship had a slight tilt after the accident would all have the lifeboats got off? If he had commanded his staff to evacuate with orders over the radio, and told them which way to go into Giglio over the radio with commands, Would more have died or is he just totaly full of crap.

 

Sorry if this sounds terse the last few days have made the nightmares come back, I havent been sleeping very well.

 

Mickey, no need to apologize. You lived this and have every right to your opinion. Tho I explained about shock, it wasn't to defend him. As I just stated in my last post he lost me with his fall off the ship comment. I, like you, find him to be a coward and a disgrace to the many hard working, skillful Captains I am acquainted with.

The rest of your post I'll leave to those with more knowledge of evacuating a ship.

[cruiserfanfromct]

I could believe he sat on that rock and probably in shock at that point. Many people think when something happens, shock sets in right away. While it can, in many cases it can come an hour, day, or even a week after something horrible happens.

I somewhat believe the Captain went into survival mode when the accident first happened. From some reports, he seemed to be functioning on some level. It is more than likely when he got away from the ship and really saw it, that's when it hit him. I remember one interview shortly after the accident where he really made no sense in his comments. Then the one where he was being taken out of the police van while still on the island, he had the deer in the headlights look on his face. I do believe that he was in shock.

Now this is just an opinion based on some prior experience I have had with shock. I was not there to see him either before, during, or after.

Now, seeing the latest interviews, I believe he is back in survival mode. I also think he needs to shut up because he's making thing worse for himself.

I don't doubt that he was in shock, however, I think he was more in shock for having lost HIS career and what an A** he was going to look like to the world than the safety of his passengers and crew.

 

If he had cared one ounce about them he would have stayed on the ship until they were all safely off or if he did actually "fall into a lifeboat" he should have gotten right back on the ship or at least gotten a boat and tried to go back to rescue those that were in the water instead of sitting on a rock doing nothing but feeling sorry for HIMSELF.

 

You are right - he needs to stop talking because every time he opens it he contradicts himself. He definitely shouldn't be giving interviews in English as he clearly can't speak the language and could say something he doesn't mean and later regret.

[SomeBeach]

The Captain lies. The reason the hulk is where it presently lies is that the currents carried it to this point. It has nothing to do with the navigation of the ship after it collided with the rock and subsequently lost power. The grounding and capsize were caused by weather and natural forces, not by the Captain or any of his crew.

 

Doc

 

I fall into the wind, currents, natural forces camp too.

Maybe this sounds simplistic but if he had control of the ship, which he has claimed, why did it go so far out to sea before turning back to shore. If you could steer it wouldn't you pick the direction of land. :confused:

[cruiserfanfromct]

How would they do this? Sure, it may be possible in a psychological exam to pick up some clues to the personality of an individual to cast some doubt on their ability but is that enough to stop their promotion. You would have to place a person in extraordinary circumstances to see how they react and that is just not possible.

Even if you threw all of what happened to Concordia into a simulator at a Maritime Training Center and have various obstacles thrown at them, you would not get a clear picture. The mind would think different during simulation vs real life and death.

 

Again, just my opinion. I am in no way looking to defend the Captain. He lost me when he "fell off the ship." That was enough to make me cast doubt on most everything he says.

It might be impossible to screen and evaluate all situations and personalities but something other than whatever is in place must be done.

 

It was already known by Costa that Schettino had personality issues and crew members and former captains have come forward and said that he had a daredevil personality and was arrogant and dogmatic. These are clues that should not have been overlooked IMHO.

[sidari]

sitting on a rock doing nothing but feeling sorry for HIMSELF.

 

Can someone tell me where this info came from?

 

As for the ship taking itself to where it is now maybe someone would like to explain how the ship turned itself around from its direction of travel to where it ended up and if Schettino and his officers did nothing as is being claimed then who released the anchors to initiate an emergency turn?

maybe it was the mayor of the island who did it!

 

SB .... The ship could not have turned around close to the island due to lack of depth of water under its keel, one thing is for sure that had the ship continued in its original direction many many more deaths would have occured and Concordia instead of lieing on its side would be on the seabed.

[cruiserfanfromct]

I'd like to know how much Today Tonight and the other channels paid this man he already got 50,000 euros for the Canale 5 interview and now these two, I have never asked or recieved a cent. Maybe I shoudl ask costa to pay me 50,000 euros to shut up.

 

I am sorry I dont think he was in shock or anything else he is a coward plain and simple.

 

I do not believe he steered the ship I think it was fate that made us end up on that rock.

 

All of you maritime experts, if he had abondoned ship whilst the ship had a slight tilt after the accident would all have the lifeboats got off? If he had commanded his staff to evacuate with orders over the radio, and told them which way to go into Giglio over the radio with commands, Would more have died or is he just totaly full of crap.

 

Sorry if this sounds terse the last few days have made the nightmares come back, I havent been sleeping very well.

This quote is from a maritime expert - can't vouch for its validity:

 

"Some even praise Captain Schettino for running the Costa Concordia aground, but this decision was flawed.

 

When a ship is grounded to prevent her from sinking, the typical maneuver is to point her bow toward a sandy point on the charge and drive her ahead. This was not possible here because the ship had lost propulsion. Instead the ship was driven by thrusters (or current, the facts remain unclear) sideways toward the beach. When the keel hit bottom her 114,147 tons of steel continued to have momentum but, because she was moving sideways (all sway with very little surge or yaw), the momentum didn’t propel her further onto the beach, rather it seems to have caused her top-heavy build to “trip over itself”.

 

The ship’s stability was already reduced by the free communication of water into the ship at the area of damage. Grounding reduced the stability further. When the keel touched bottom the center of gravity moved from inside the ship down to the keel. Just watch a toy ship in the bath as you let out the water… once the toy ship’s keel touches the bottom of the tub the ship tilts over.

 

Why does a ship list to starboard when all her damage is on the port side? This could have been caused by emergency ballasting procedures (pumping water into the starboard side to compensate for the water entering to port) but the more likely answer is that by grounding her starboard-side-to the beach the ship’s momentum pulled her over to starboard.

 

Heavy lists aboard ships are dangerous and, in this case, could likely have been avoided if, rather than beaching the ship, Captain Schettino had anchored her in close proximity to the shore."

[cruiserfanfromct]

sitting on a rock doing nothing but feeling sorry for HIMSELF.

 

Can someone tell me where this info came from?

 

It came from eyewitnesses at the scene. Could you tell us what Schettino was doing after a "divine hand" made him "fall into a lifeboat"? What did he coordinate and from where?

[sidari]

"It came from eyewitnesses at the scene"

 

CT .... Could this be the very same Eye Witness who claimed to have seen him walking along the jetty on Giglio in clothing non of which was a Captains uniform? the above quote appears to be at odds with the reply from your previous post that it came from an unknown Maitime expert ?

 

In your reply re beaching of a ship i have read quite a few times that a Captain would prefer to do it in that way but there is no beach in the area where Concordia lies so sitting the ship on the bottom as they claim they were trying to do would seem a sensible thing to do had it worked.

[cruiserfanfromct]

Management shakeup at Costa:

 

http://www.seatrade-insider.com/News/News-Headlines/Costa-evp-Ursprunger-reassigned-to-undefined-role.html

[cruiserfanfromct]

"It came from eyewitnesses at the scene"

 

CT .... Could this be the very same Eye Witness who claimed to have seen him walking along the jetty on Giglio in clothing non of which was a Captains uniform? the above quote appears to be at odds with the reply from your previous post that it came from an unknown Maitime expert ?

I'm as clueless as the Captain on the rocks as to what your question is here. :confused:

In your reply re beaching of a ship i have read quite a few times that a Captain would prefer to do it in that way but there is no beach in the area where Concordia lies so sitting the ship on the bottom as they claim they were trying to do would seem a sensible thing to do had it worked.

I believe his conclusion was: "Heavy lists aboard ships are dangerous and, in this case, could likely have been avoided if, rather than beaching the ship, Captain Schettino had anchored her in close proximity to the shore."

 

I interpret this as instead of running aground (it's obvious there is no beach there), he should have anchored in deeper water so the ship would not have listed and the lifeboats would have been able to deploy.

[Tonka's Skipper]

sitting on a rock doing nothing but feeling sorry for HIMSELF.

 

Can someone tell me where this info came from?

 

As for the ship taking itself to where it is now maybe someone would like to explain how the ship turned itself around from its direction of travel to where it ended up and if Schettino and his officers did nothing as is being claimed then who released the anchors to initiate an emergency turn?

maybe it was the mayor of the island who did it!

 

SB .... The ship could not have turned around close to the island due to lack of depth of water under its keel, one thing is for sure that had the ship continued in its original direction many many more deaths would have occured and Concordia instead of lieing on its side would be on the seabed.

 

 

Sidari..the wind and current changes, especially around a land mass.It is possible that after the vessel loss all way on her, a change in current and wind did spin the vessel around and pushed her back to the island/coast.

 

You are correct the vessel crew did let the starboard anchor go when near the coast......who ordered it I do not know at this time.

 

As I said before.the more the Captain talks, the deeper that hole he is digging gets!

 

 

I don't understand this 30' of water depth under the keel to float upright thing?//.......there is not bases for it in vessel stability........not to mention...how does she stay upright in a harbor/ at a berth with only a few feet, of water under the keel? Now that said.........a vessel stability( EI she could more easily or less easily roll) will change with the sea/current conditions and the depth of water under the keel.

 

AKK

Edited July 16, 2012 by Tonka's Skipper

[Tonka's Skipper]

Management shakeup at Costa:

 

http://www.seatrade-insider.com/News/News-Headlines/Costa-evp-Ursprunger-reassigned-to-undefined-role.html

 

 

This has long been expected...and its a joke and insult to the public to say the job elimination has nothing to do with the legal issues the office executives are facing.

 

There will be more changes as well.IMHO

 

AKK

[Uniall]

oops

Edited July 16, 2012 by Uniall

[Uniall]

"A captain cannot shift blame onto his officers," he said. "And a ship with more than 4,000 people on board cannot be put under the command of such an amateur."

 

That comment is a bit rich coming from the mayor of a tiny island who clearly knows nothing of navigating a ship or the responsibilites of the officers below Captain! and to call them amateurs is a total insult.

 

SB ... I am with you on this one regarding shock, most people having never felt or had to deal with the aftermath of severe shock in a person or persons can never understand how a person looks or acts either at the time or hours or days afterwards.

 

"Captain Schitino seems to have a priority adjustment problem. Given a choice between the saftey of the ship, passengers and crew versus a stolen evening with his inamorta, he quickley chose the latter"

 

Uni .. I am glad that to see that you are also a mind reader and can tell us exactly what was on or in his mind that night!

 

 

Tonka ... Do you have any idea of the depth of water along the route that was mapped out near the island of Giglio ? Concordia would need as i understand it a minimum of 30 feet of water under the keel in order to stay upright, according to the Media reports the water below where the ship now lies is around 300 feet deep and therefore deep enough at half a mile from the island to support the ship.

 

You don't have to be a mind reader to spot an arrogant egomaniac who puts a ship and passengers in danger to satisfy his own disires for adulation and agrandizement with no humanity toward any other person or thing.

 

You don't have to be maritime expert to spot an incompetent, irresponsible and inept ship's Captain who orders a ship close to shore at 3/4 speed close to shore and it capsizes and who sneaks to personal safety to watch 32 people die.

 

You don't have to be a legal eagle to conclude that such a ship's Captain is a homocidal and sociopathic coward and criminal.

 

If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, It must be a duck.

 

In my opinion, anyone who denies these conclusions is either:

Not thinking clearly OR

Has been retained to provide legal or public realtions assitance OR

Is trying to white wash an evil and protect its perpetrator for some hidden purpose or agenda.

[SomeBeach]

Warning: the second paragraph is disturbing to read as it relates to the little girl.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2012/07/15/concordia-aftermath-what-to-know-before-boarding-a-cruise-ship.html

Edited July 17, 2012 by SomeBeach

[sidari]

Tonka .... with regard to water under the keel, i have read and also seen a tv programme that showed in order for a cruise ship to be able to float without doing what Concordia did it requires a Minimum of 30 feet of water under it, with less water it then becomes unstable and can turn onto its side due to a shift in its centre of balance.

 

With regard to changes at Costa some were made a while ago but are only now taking place and as you say were expected.

 

 

Uni ....In my opinion, anyone who denies these conclusions is either:

Not thinking clearly OR

Has been retained to provide legal or public realtions assitance OR

Is trying to white wash an evil and protect its perpetrator for some hidden purpose or agenda.

So in other words anyone who disagrees with you has to be wrong!

regardless of having their own opinion despite the fact that you are making statements and still do not have the full facts to hand of what really did happen prior to and after Concordia hit the rock.

 

nor are you qualified to make judgements on a person/persons in regard to his or her profession having never been there yourself!

[Uniall]

Tonka .... with regard to water under the keel, i have read and also seen a tv programme that showed in order for a cruise ship to be able to float without doing what Concordia did it requires a Minimum of 30 feet of water under it, with less water it then becomes unstable and can turn onto its side due to a shift in its centre of balance.

 

With regard to changes at Costa some were made a while ago but are only now taking place and as you say were expected.

 

 

Uni ....In my opinion, anyone who denies these conclusions is either:

Not thinking clearly OR

Has been retained to provide legal or public realtions assitance OR

Is trying to white wash an evil and protect its perpetrator for some hidden purpose or agenda.

So in other words anyone who disagrees with you has to be wrong!

regardless of having their own opinion despite the fact that you are making statements and still do not have the full facts to hand of what really did happen prior to and after Concordia hit the rock.

 

nor are you qualified to make judgements on a person/persons in regard to his or her profession having never been there yourself!

 

Yes, in this special situation anyone who defends Captain Schitino is wrong. The only question is why is the Schitino's defender wrong? Assuming they have a clear mind and are thinking straight, what is their secret agenda or motive?

 

You don't have to have "been there yourself" to make a rational judgement about the efficacy of a "professional's" conduct. If a plumber installs a new pipe and the basement is flooded the next morning, the plumber is incompetent. The "facts speak for themseves". It goes by different doctrinal names in different countries. In Anglo-American law it's the doctrine of "Res Ipsa Loquitor". You should look it up and educate yourself.

Edited July 17, 2012 by Uniall

[Tonka's Skipper]

Tonka .... with regard to water under the keel, i have read and also seen a tv programme that showed in order for a cruise ship to be able to float without doing what Concordia did it requires a Minimum of 30 feet of water under it, with less water it then becomes unstable and can turn onto its side due to a shift in its centre of balance.

 

 

Sorry Sidari.......the program was wrong or at best a misrepresentation of a large tall cruise ship stability in swallow water............where it may have somewhat less stability with little water under the keel..........she will not (under normal weather etc).........become unsafe.