Wheres the new ships ?

[kazu]

Jacqui, I just wanted to also state that I do not for see HAL getting rid of the Prinsendam any time soon. But then anything is always for sale for a price :rolleyes:

I do see them attempting to get rid of Veendam and Statendam soon the problem is no one wants them Many years ago when Europe was much stronger there would always be a small cruise line out there that might be interested in buying HAL ships because they were well taken care and nicely appointed. Basically a turn key ship. But sadly that is currently not the case either for the ship being Turn Key or smaller cruise lines having the need and money to purchase. I think if economy had not tanked 2 or maybe even all 4 of the S Class ships would have been long gone.

 

What I do see HAL doing in the future will be pushing those who prefer the smaller ships to the Mini Me of HAL which is now Seabourn. I predict that HAL will copy basically what RCI/Celebrity did with Azamara. It will remain separate yet will have many similarities and will eventually include credit with your HAL Mariner Status.

 

Thanks Lisa - I suspect your gaze into your crystal ball is all too accurate!

[CostaSmurfette]

Hey let's take away the phrase Cruise ship and in the future call it Circus

ship. Are you going on a cruise? No, i'm going on a Circus run. Yes, you will have newbies, but you will also have the new 50's folks who will become the Blue rinse crowd and will be fed up with the newbie types and would want relief from that element. I think that there will always be

a defined market for voyagers; not cruisers, they are people who know and want the feel, the style, the panache and the finesse disassociated with the Duh, Circus

mentality. Can you believe that there are actually people who do not

get off ships while in port, don't care who the Captain is, how high the

zip line is and if the waiters dance on the tables. We have been on world

cruises and Grand Voyages and found no need for Ice rinks, Climbing Walls and CD's named Spanky or Buffy!:eek:

 

Yep...and as Laffnvegas already intimated, those of us who actually prefer smaller ships without the trimmings will be steered quietly towards the likes of Seabourn, with fares to match the "exclusivity" of not having the revenue generators found on the big & glitzy ships.

 

It's sound business...even though to most of us "traditionalists" it comes across as highly distasteful and not what we envision cruising to be.

 

Pretty much every smaller ship line charges a premuim fare...even the standalone boutique styled ships within the bigger fleets charge more than the "run of the mill fun palaces"...you have it in HAL with Prinsendam and Costa has it now with neoRomantica...aimed at the more discerning adults wanting to cruise in the old fashioned way, quietly and to ports the bigger ships can only dream of visiting.

 

Those of us who prefer the smaller ships are slowly being forced to pay the premuims for that experience...which IMHO is outrageous and unfair, but there is little we can do about it.

[Typhoon1]

It can't get any uglier than that.

 

4,100 passengers makes it even uglier.

[LAFFNVEGAS]

Yep...and as Laffnvegas already intimated, those of us who actually prefer smaller ships without the trimmings will be steered quietly towards the likes of Seabourn, with fares to match the "exclusivity" of not having the revenue generators found on the big & glitzy ships.

 

It's sound business...even though to most of us "traditionalists" it comes across as highly distasteful and not what we envision cruising to be.

 

Pretty much every smaller ship line charges a premuim fare...even the standalone boutique styled ships within the bigger fleets charge more than the "run of the mill fun palaces"...you have it in HAL with Prinsendam and Costa has it now with neoRomantica...aimed at the more discerning adults wanting to cruise in the old fashioned way, quietly and to ports the bigger ships can only dream of visiting.

 

Those of us who prefer the smaller ships are slowly being forced to pay the premuims for that experience...which IMHO is outrageous and unfair, but there is little we can do about it.

What confuses me is the statement of how you think it is "Unfair"? First ever since HAL came out with Zuiderdam the first Vista Ship and suddenly the prices were much lower, of course this was not that long after 9/11 and travel was still trying to recoup. The Prinsendam and S and R Class ships have always cost more per cabin it has only been in recent times when HAL is having a hard time filling those older ships because they are older that HAL has dropped their pants with the prices but only for the Inside and OV cabins. The balcony cabins which HAL jokingly sells them as "Suites" still pull in a premium. HAL added the Lanai cabins to give them something else to try to raise the price on when they saw that they were having to drop prices on the older ships.

Let's step backwards here, do you think it cost less money to operate the smaller ships? HAL has been gradually loosing more money each year operating the S and R Class ships. I believe that the Prinsendam is barely breaking even because they due charge even more for her but they are not making a profit there only hopes in making money is with Shore Excursions and on board revenue. The S and R Class ships are costing HAL money every day. To make it a bit easier to understand think about purchasing things in bulk, think of the larger ships as buying something in bulk. Or like Wal-Mart with their buying power that has put out many small stores simply due to their size and buying power. Same is true with ships, the bigger the ship the less with selling more cabins and more people on board to spend money makes for more revenue. The Fuel Cost remains very close to the same mostly due to the fact that the new bigger ships conserve fuel better than the older ships plus the older ships have a much higher daily cost of maintinence and cost for repair.

But back to Why would you think it is unfair? It is not unfair you are paying for the smaller ship experience, for a ship that has less passengers. If you want a private concert in a small venue then the price of that ticket is going to be far more than a venue that holds 50,000 people. If you want to fly on a Private Jet then the cost is going to be far more than going on a commercial plane. There is absolutely nothing unfair about paying more. You are simply paying for being able to cruise on a smaller ship with less people. To be able to keep a float so to speak a smaller ship must charge a lot more money to break even not even make a profit. But sadly the numbers of people willing to pay more are decreasing so you make the choice go with the masses or I want to be treated special on a smaller ship. Soon the smaller older ships of HAL and even Princess with Ocean Princess and Pacific Princess will be a thing of the past.

[kazu]

Lisa, no question that the Prinsendam costs more - makes sense to me as it is a smaller ship - and we totally get it;) Some of us are willing to pay it as the ship and the crew and the itineraries are worth it:) It's just my experience, but on our last cruise it was definitely a ship a 'step up' from the other HAL ships. Nearly like a cross roads between premier (or mass) and luxury. Just a lot of little things that did not go un-noticed;)

 

Totally get why the smaller ships cost more and we don't have a problem with that. However, sailing Seabourn has no appeal to us

 

that being said, we enjoyed the Noordam, Rotterdam, old Nieuw Amsterdam, Zuiderdam and the Ooesterdam and hope to sail the Westie soon.

 

Variety is the spice of life:)

 

We'll see what the future holds - and just take it from there;)

 

Who knows?

[sail7seas]

We've sailed all HAL ships except Prinsendam. The right opportunity has not yet presented for us to sail her.

 

We pay more to sail our much loved Maasdam but also love Noordam and had great cruises on Eurodam, Westerdam, Oosterdam and other ships.

 

Each is different even the sisters. It's nice to have the choices.

Some itineraries, the per diem is higher. Some dates the per diem is higher. Some cruises all the ships make more money than on other cruises. One week they have a crowd that spends and another week, they don't.

 

And all the multitude of other variables.........

 

Kazu...... It's been our experience that the same ship can provide a different cruise experience depending again on many variables. Some are as obvious as who is Captain, Hotel Manager, GRM, Exec Chef etc Another is as basic as weather. With all our cruises, we've had very wide variety of experiences on same ship/same class of ship.

 

JMO........

 

 

[CostaSmurfette]

What confuses me is the statement of how you think it is "Unfair"? First ever since HAL came out with Zuiderdam the first Vista Ship and suddenly the prices were much lower, of course this was not that long after 9/11 and travel was still trying to recoup. The Prinsendam and S and R Class ships have always cost more per cabin it has only been in recent times when HAL is having a hard time filling those older ships because they are older that HAL has dropped their pants with the prices but only for the Inside and OV cabins. The balcony cabins which HAL jokingly sells them as "Suites" still pull in a premium. HAL added the Lanai cabins to give them something else to try to raise the price on when they saw that they were having to drop prices on the older ships.

Let's step backwards here, do you think it cost less money to operate the smaller ships? HAL has been gradually loosing more money each year operating the S and R Class ships. I believe that the Prinsendam is barely breaking even because they due charge even more for her but they are not making a profit there only hopes in making money is with Shore Excursions and on board revenue. The S and R Class ships are costing HAL money every day. To make it a bit easier to understand think about purchasing things in bulk, think of the larger ships as buying something in bulk. Or like Wal-Mart with their buying power that has put out many small stores simply due to their size and buying power. Same is true with ships, the bigger the ship the less with selling more cabins and more people on board to spend money makes for more revenue. The Fuel Cost remains very close to the same mostly due to the fact that the new bigger ships conserve fuel better than the older ships plus the older ships have a much higher daily cost of maintinence and cost for repair.

But back to Why would you think it is unfair? It is not unfair you are paying for the smaller ship experience, for a ship that has less passengers. If you want a private concert in a small venue then the price of that ticket is going to be far more than a venue that holds 50,000 people. If you want to fly on a Private Jet then the cost is going to be far more than going on a commercial plane. There is absolutely nothing unfair about paying more. You are simply paying for being able to cruise on a smaller ship with less people. To be able to keep a float so to speak a smaller ship must charge a lot more money to break even not even make a profit. But sadly the numbers of people willing to pay more are decreasing so you make the choice go with the masses or I want to be treated special on a smaller ship. Soon the smaller older ships of HAL and even Princess with Ocean Princess and Pacific Princess will be a thing of the past.

 

The unfair bit is that why should people be forced to pay higher fares for a smaller ship in the same fleet as a leviathan?

 

For instance...Prinsendam is more expensive than her fleetmates, neoRomantica is more expensive than her fleetmates....

 

It is fine paying the premium for Seabourn, Regent, Silversea et al cos they have a fleet that are pretty much the same size ship, they go on same sort of itineraries and give similar service levels.

 

But...Prinsendam & neoRomantica are within standard mainstream fleets, so surely they should have the same mainstream fares....they have the same crews, same food etc as their fleetmates...

 

If HAL and Costa want to have upper mainstream ships, then maybe they should branch out properly and not do half hearted attempts.

 

Why should people who love a specific cruise line and who want to experience small ship cruising pay over the odds for the priviledge...?

 

You see Prinsendam in port, you are aboard Zuiderdam...you like the look of Prinsendam, you love HAL so you have a look at what Prinsendam does and then you look at the fares, then compare the fares tween Prinsendam and Zuiderdam for a 14 night cruise....you find disparity. Now anyone who might not know that Prinsendam is a one-off ship that does her own sort of cruises will look at the two sets of fares and wonder why there is a gulf tween the individual costings on each ship when they run for the same company...

 

Whereas, you see Seabourn Legend in port, you're on Zuiderdam and you like the look of Legend...but you kinda know that she must be more expensive just by looking at her and the fact that it is another cruise line, and when you check her out, yep, she is more expensive.

 

People assume that ALL ships in one fleet will have close if not identical pricing, especially those who might be first timers. And when they see that one ship is way over the budget compared to the rest of the fleet there is a real danger that it can be misconstrued...not so much that "oh she must be special" but "oh...what the heck is wrong with the other ships cos they are so much cheaper than that one?".

 

neoRomantica has been incredibly well received, she is stunning...her rebuild and refit have made her all very grown up and she commands the top fares...just as Prinsendam does...but it's become almost a case of two Costa's and two HAL's..the cheaper, more mainstream ships and the grown up, exclusive ship all in the same fleet and that is why it is unfair for those of us who would love to sail on Prinsendam or neoRomantica but cannot got the fare structure is out of reach, we either have to put up with the huge gin palaces or go without.

[kazu]

The unfair bit is that why should people be forced to pay higher fares for a smaller ship in the same fleet as a leviathan?

 

For instance...Prinsendam is more expensive than her fleetmates, neoRomantica is more expensive than her fleetmates....

 

It is fine paying the premium for Seabourn, Regent, Silversea et al cos they have a fleet that are pretty much the same size ship, they go on same sort of itineraries and give similar service levels.

 

But...Prinsendam & neoRomantica are within standard mainstream fleets, so surely they should have the same mainstream fares....they have the same crews, same food etc as their fleetmates...

 

If HAL and Costa want to have upper mainstream ships, then maybe they should branch out properly and not do half hearted attempts.

 

Why should people who love a specific cruise line and who want to experience small ship cruising pay over the odds for the priviledge...?

 

You see Prinsendam in port, you are aboard Zuiderdam...you like the look of Prinsendam, you love HAL so you have a look at what Prinsendam does and then you look at the fares, then compare the fares tween Prinsendam and Zuiderdam for a 14 night cruise....you find disparity. Now anyone who might not know that Prinsendam is a one-off ship that does her own sort of cruises will look at the two sets of fares and wonder why there is a gulf tween the individual costings on each ship when they run for the same company...

 

Whereas, you see Seabourn Legend in port, you're on Zuiderdam and you like the look of Legend...but you kinda know that she must be more expensive just by looking at her and the fact that it is another cruise line, and when you check her out, yep, she is more expensive.

 

People assume that ALL ships in one fleet will have close if not identical pricing, especially those who might be first timers. And when they see that one ship is way over the budget compared to the rest of the fleet there is a real danger that it can be misconstrued...not so much that "oh she must be special" but "oh...what the heck is wrong with the other ships cos they are so much cheaper than that one?".

 

neoRomantica has been incredibly well received, she is stunning...her rebuild and refit have made her all very grown up and she commands the top fares...just as Prinsendam does...but it's become almost a case of two Costa's and two HAL's..the cheaper, more mainstream ships and the grown up, exclusive ship all in the same fleet and that is why it is unfair for those of us who would love to sail on Prinsendam or neoRomantica but cannot got the fare structure is out of reach, we either have to put up with the huge gin palaces or go without.

 

Not Lisa but since we are talking about my favourite ship:) Let me add my two cents worth - the smaller ships cost more to run - it's as simple as that:rolleyes: They still need all the crew to do all the normal stuff to run a ship which is pretty big - then they need the regular crew.

 

The nice thing about the Prinsendam is if you look, you will find the crew to passenger ratio higher than on the other HAL ships. There's a reason for that. Most of the crew members know you no matter where you go. In one day they know what you like to drink - they bring you the hors' d'hoeuvres at happy hour - they bring sambal at dinner - whatever.

 

But the bottom line is there is a reason they cost more.

 

Might not seem fair - but that's a fact of life - the smaller a ship the more it costs to go on it. It's up to us - to decide if we want to shell out the dollars or not. I resisted the P'dam for years thinking it was outrageously priced - until we got on it for the first time. There are some outstanding deals on her right now (sad, but true). We can't spare the time off, but if you can, this would be the ideal time to give it a shot.

 

I envy anyone grabbing the TA on her even if she is headed for dry dock:)

[kazu]

We've sailed all HAL ships except Prinsendam. The right opportunity has not yet presented for us to sail her.

 

We pay more to sail our much loved Maasdam but also love Noordam and had great cruises on Eurodam, Westerdam, Oosterdam and other ships.

 

Each is different even the sisters. It's nice to have the choices.

Some itineraries, the per diem is higher. Some dates the per diem is higher. Some cruises all the ships make more money than on other cruises. One week they have a crowd that spends and another week, they don't.

 

And all the multitude of other variables.........

 

Kazu...... It's been our experience that the same ship can provide a different cruise experience depending again on many variables. Some are as obvious as who is Captain, Hotel Manager, GRM, Exec Chef etc Another is as basic as weather. With all our cruises, we've had very wide variety of experiences on same ship/same class of ship.

 

JMO........

 

 

 

I agree Judy, the people running the ship determine the ambience and the care. I'm always amazed how a cruise can vary from one to the other. And how even on the same voyage cruisers can see things differently.

 

I guess it's all in perception and your own experience:D

 

We've done ok. there have been a couple that I wasn't thrilled with - but overall, a day at sea is still better than a day at work:):)

[LAFFNVEGAS]

Lisa, no question that the Prinsendam costs more - makes sense to me as it is a smaller ship - and we totally get it;) Some of us are willing to pay it as the ship and the crew and the itineraries are worth it:) It's just my experience, but on our last cruise it was definitely a ship a 'step up' from the other HAL ships. Nearly like a cross roads between premier (or mass) and luxury. Just a lot of little things that did not go un-noticed;)

 

Totally get why the smaller ships cost more and we don't have a problem with that. However, sailing Seabourn has no appeal to us

 

that being said, we enjoyed the Noordam, Rotterdam, old Nieuw Amsterdam, Zuiderdam and the Ooesterdam and hope to sail the Westie soon.

 

Variety is the spice of life:)

 

We'll see what the future holds - and just take it from there;)

 

Who knows?

Jacqui I project a few things that will happen in the near future and I could be wrong with this since HAL had said in the begining they were going to keep HAL and Seabourn totally separate ;) but many things were not been kept separate. So I suspect that eventually HAL and Seabourn will give each of their passengers credit for sailing the other line. I also predict they will allow or have crew that have worked on either line work on the other. (In the old days this happened with Windstar) It has been my understanding that in the last 12 months the Seabourn Feel has been more HAL then ever but with a luxury feel to it. While pricing is higher with Seabourn it is also more like an all inclusive product. Also prices are coming down some with Seabourn. In many cases the prices of some Seabourn cruises when you figure in the cost of drinks/wines and premium dining and if you book an Deluxe Verandah Suite you are paying pretty darn close to the same. In many cases the Prinsendam is far more than say the Sojourn.

 

I think often people have this block thinking that the luxury line is too much money when many times you can book a Luxury cruise for close to the same dollar amount. Seabourn actually needs to change their pricing structure just like HAL, they are so much a like it is not even funny. They start out way too high then keep dropping the prices to fill the ship. (Which is the opposite of what lines such as Crystal have done) Currently the best time to purchase Seabourn is about 70 to 60 days prior when it is not peak season because they too have Flash prices with extremely low (for them) pricing.

[Pettifogger]

If, as many of you have asserted, HAL is only going to buy bigger and bigger ships in the future, the threat is very distant for those of us of "very late middle age."

 

I feel confident that HAL will maintain her older smaller ships much longer than many of you think for business, not sentimental reasons. If they don't, they would be leaving behind a substantial segment of their prospective passengers and this is by no means a good time to do that.

 

Some years from now, the market will presumably improve enough that prospective passengers are clamoring for cabins, any kind of cabins, as they were a few years ago, and HAL can then dispense with the smaller older ships if they wish, but I think 'some years from now' is going to be longer than some of you, and maybe even they, think.

 

But to "hedge my bet" I'm cruising now.

[ASIWISH]

\

I remember a post here on the HAL board where in a review (may have even been a Live From) stating they heard from crew that there was going to be a new HAL ships and it was being built in Japan. That was written several months ago and we all kind of wrote it off. I for one do believe there could be some truth to this.

 

I reported on that during my "Live From" on the Nieuw Amsterdam last spring… and I took a good bit of ribbing about it….

 

I actually stopped believing it myself!!!:D

 

The ship "was" to be called the Grand Statendam and it "was" to be built in Asia.

[sail7seas]

Jacqui I project a few things that will happen in the near future and I could be wrong with this since HAL had said in the begining they were going to keep HAL and Seabourn totally separate ;) but many things were not been kept separate. So I suspect that eventually HAL and Seabourn will give each of their passengers credit for sailing the other line. I also predict they will allow or have crew that have worked on either line work on the other. (In the old days this happened with Windstar) It has been my understanding that in the last 12 months the Seabourn Feel has been more HAL then ever but with a luxury feel to it. While pricing is higher with Seabourn it is also more like an all inclusive product. Also prices are coming down some with Seabourn. In many cases the prices of some Seabourn cruises when you figure in the cost of drinks/wines and premium dining and if you book an Deluxe Verandah Suite you are paying pretty darn close to the same. In many cases the Prinsendam is far more than say the Sojourn.

 

<snip>

 

 

We've done the arithmetic and for some cruises on Seabourn, compared against what we pay for our "S" on Maasdam to do Canada/NE, it would actually be a lower cost for us to sail the same number of days on Seabourn. That is not the rule for all Seabourn or all Maasdam cruises, of course, but there are some.

 

We most certainly can sail Prinsendam for the same and lower per diem though not always in an "S" cabin but all cruises on her, we can sail Prinsendam and 'save money' if we take a different category.

 

You're right, Lisa.

 

 

 

 

I reported on that during my "Live From" on the Nieuw Amsterdam last spring… and I took a good bit of ribbing about it….

 

I actually stopped believing it myself!!!:D

 

The ship "was" to be called the Grand Statendam and it "was" to be built in Asia.

 

 

I remember that, Kevin. And we have heard Grand Statendam again since but who knows if it is just a self-perpetuating rumor. :D Tell the rumor enough times, it gets spread to enough people that we all start to think it's true. :)

 

WELCOME BACK. Great to 'hear' from you.

 

[sail7seas]

The unfair bit is that why should people be forced to pay higher fares for a smaller ship in the same fleet as a leviathan?

 

For instance...Prinsendam is more expensive than her fleetmates, neoRomantica is more expensive than her fleetmates....

 

It is fine paying the premium for Seabourn, Regent, Silversea et al cos they have a fleet that are pretty much the same size ship, they go on same sort of itineraries and give similar service levels.

 

But...Prinsendam & neoRomantica are within standard mainstream fleets, so surely they should have the same mainstream fares....they have the same crews, same food etc as their fleetmates...

 

If HAL and Costa want to have upper mainstream ships, then maybe they should branch out properly and not do half hearted attempts.

 

Why should people who love a specific cruise line and who want to experience small ship cruising pay over the odds for the priviledge...?

 

You see Prinsendam in port, you are aboard Zuiderdam...you like the look of Prinsendam, you love HAL so you have a look at what Prinsendam does and then you look at the fares, then compare the fares tween Prinsendam and Zuiderdam for a 14 night cruise....you find disparity. Now anyone who might not know that Prinsendam is a one-off ship that does her own sort of cruises will look at the two sets of fares and wonder why there is a gulf tween the individual costings on each ship when they run for the same company...

 

Whereas, you see Seabourn Legend in port, you're on Zuiderdam and you like the look of Legend...but you kinda know that she must be more expensive just by looking at her and the fact that it is another cruise line, and when you check her out, yep, she is more expensive.

 

People assume that ALL ships in one fleet will have close if not identical pricing, especially those who might be first timers. And when they see that one ship is way over the budget compared to the rest of the fleet there is a real danger that it can be misconstrued...not so much that "oh she must be special" but "oh...what the heck is wrong with the other ships cos they are so much cheaper than that one?".

 

neoRomantica has been incredibly well received, she is stunning...her rebuild and refit have made her all very grown up and she commands the top fares...just as Prinsendam does...but it's become almost a case of two Costa's and two HAL's..the cheaper, more mainstream ships and the grown up, exclusive ship all in the same fleet and that is why it is unfair for those of us who would love to sail on Prinsendam or neoRomantica but cannot got the fare structure is out of reach, we either have to put up with the huge gin palaces or go without.

 

 

I get all you are saying but just wish to point out that we sail Maasdam a lot. We are almost always in the same cabin.

 

Same ship, same cabin, very often the same bartenders, same cabin stewards etc but far from the same price for all cruises on her. We pay a great deal more to sail Canada/NE every summer than we do to sail the Caribbean.

 

If we see such price difference same ship/same cabin,why is it 'unfair' to see difference in prices to different ships in the fleet doing different itineraries. If one ship happens to sell better or faster than another doing similar itineraries, why shoudln't they charge more for cabins on the better selling ship? Good business IMO

 

August, 2013 Veendam is doing a seven day cruise only once next summer and the per diem for that ship for that week is very, very high as compared to what she got for lots of the sailings this past summer. Same ship let alone same fleet.

 

 

 

[LAFFNVEGAS]

I reported on that during my "Live From" on the Nieuw Amsterdam last spring… and I took a good bit of ribbing about it….

 

I actually stopped believing it myself!!!:D

 

The ship "was" to be called the Grand Statendam and it "was" to be built in Asia.

Kevin, that is right it was you :D Oh I was one that actually believed you and tried to find out from those I knew that might know but they had not heard this at all but if this was to come out we will definitely give you the kudos ;) I actually think it is still a likely possibility. I have had the Gut Feeling for over a year that HAL would be announcing a new ship but after a year of feeling this and nothing it really becomes just a thing that it was about time :cool:

[Copper10-8]

We've done the arithmetic and for some cruises on Seabourn, compared against what we pay for our "S" on Maasdam to do Canada/NE, it would actually be a lower cost for us to sail the same number of days on Seabourn. That is not the rule for all Seabourn or all Maasdam cruises, of course, but there are some.

 

We most certainly can sail Prinsendam for the same and lower per diem though not always in an "S" cabin but all cruises on her, we can sail Prinsendam and 'save money' if we take a different category.

 

You're right, Lisa.

 

I remember that, Kevin. And we have heard Grand Statendam again since but who knows if it is just a self-perpetuating rumor. :D Tell the rumor enough times, it gets spread to enough people that we all start to think it's true. :)

 

WELCOME BACK. Great to 'hear' from you.

 

 

The next two HAL ships will come out of an Asian yard and not one in the land of the rising sun:cool:. And I wouldn't put any $$ in Vegas on one of them being named "Grand Statendam"

[sail7seas]

Does Korea ring a bell? :)

 

Please don't say "Made in China". :)

[Copper10-8]

....................Other than that line, they could go to Olsen, Thomson (who have two ex HAL's already), Saga...the marketplace is small but very active and popular.

 

.....................................

 

 

Actually, three (Thomson Cruises & former HAL ships):

#1 - Thomson Spirit, ex-Nieuw Amsterdam III, ex-Patriot

#2 - Thomson Celebration, ex-Noordam III

#3 - Thomson Dream, ex-Homeric, ex-Westerdam II, ex-Costa Europa

[serendipity1499]

The unfair bit is that why should people be forced to pay higher fares for a smaller ship in the same fleet as a leviathan?

 

For instance...Prinsendam is more expensive than her fleetmates, neoRomantica is more expensive than her fleetmates....

 

It is fine paying the premium for Seabourn, Regent, Silversea et al cos they have a fleet that are pretty much the same size ship, they go on same sort of itineraries and give similar service levels.

 

But...Prinsendam & neoRomantica are within standard mainstream fleets, so surely they should have the same mainstream fares....they have the same crews, same food etc as their fleetmates...

 

If HAL and Costa want to have upper mainstream ships, then maybe they should branch out properly and not do half hearted attempts.

 

Why should people who love a specific cruise line and who want to experience small ship cruising pay over the odds for the priviledge...?

 

You see Prinsendam in port, you are aboard Zuiderdam...you like the look of Prinsendam, you love HAL so you have a look at what Prinsendam does and then you look at the fares, then compare the fares tween Prinsendam and Zuiderdam for a 14 night cruise....you find disparity. Now anyone who might not know that Prinsendam is a one-off ship that does her own sort of cruises will look at the two sets of fares and wonder why there is a gulf tween the individual costings on each ship when they run for the same company...

 

Whereas, you see Seabourn Legend in port, you're on Zuiderdam and you like the look of Legend...but you kinda know that she must be more expensive just by looking at her and the fact that it is another cruise line, and when you check her out, yep, she is more expensive.

 

People assume that ALL ships in one fleet will have close if not identical pricing, especially those who might be first timers. And when they see that one ship is way over the budget compared to the rest of the fleet there is a real danger that it can be misconstrued...not so much that "oh she must be special" but "oh...what the heck is wrong with the other ships cos they are so much cheaper than that one?".

 

neoRomantica has been incredibly well received, she is stunning...her rebuild and refit have made her all very grown up and she commands the top fares...just as Prinsendam does...but it's become almost a case of two Costa's and two HAL's..the cheaper, more mainstream ships and the grown up, exclusive ship all in the same fleet and that is why it is unfair for those of us who would love to sail on Prinsendam or neoRomantica but cannot got the fare structure is out of reach, we either have to put up with the huge gin palaces or go without.

 

Not Lisa but since we are talking about my favourite ship:) Let me add my two cents worth - the smaller ships cost more to run - it's as simple as that:rolleyes: They still need all the crew to do all the normal stuff to run a ship which is pretty big - then they need the regular crew.

 

The nice thing about the Prinsendam is if you look, you will find the crew to passenger ratio higher than on the other HAL ships. There's a reason for that. Most of the crew members know you no matter where you go. In one day they know what you like to drink - they bring you the hors' d'hoeuvres at happy hour - they bring sambal at dinner - whatever.

 

But the bottom line is there is a reason they cost more.

 

Might not seem fair - but that's a fact of life - the smaller a ship the more it costs to go on it. It's up to us - to decide if we want to shell out the dollars or not. I resisted the P'dam for years thinking it was outrageously priced - until we got on it for the first time. There are some outstanding deals on her right now (sad, but true). We can't spare the time off, but if you can, this would be the ideal time to give it a shot.

 

I envy anyone grabbing the TA on her even if she is headed for dry dock:)

 

CostaSmurfette, Sorry but I too disagree with you & agree with Laffinvegas & Kazu..

First of all the Prinsendam is not a mainstream Hal ship..She does not have the same Crew's & Food as the other HAL ships..Her crew is the elite & hand picked for the Prinsendam..Her cabins are much larger than any other HAL ship we've been on, & even have walk-in closets!..As Kazu pointed out the crew to Psgr ratio is much more on the Prinsendam..

We are booked in an OV in Jan, & we will even have a concierge from our Agency on board to help us if necessary! HAL is paying FEDX to pick up our luggage at home & ship it to & from the port when we embark & disembark..

And as Lisa pointed out, the Prinsendam costs much more to operate than any other HAL ship in te fleet.. She goes into exclusive ports where other ships can't get in & some of the Port charges can be much higher than most of the mainstream port charges..The food is not the same mainstream food you would get on the Westerdam or the other HAL ships..They serve premium food (the best food we've ever had) & the Service is exceptional...This is our favorite ship & we can't wait to reboard her again in Jan..The fares are right in line with the service we expect to receive on board as they should be....

We too are willing to pay more for this small ship experience..Most experienced cruisers would never put the Prinsendam in the same category of the other HAL ships..That's why were happy & willing to pay the premium price for our cruise in Jan...

Cheers..Betty

[Copper10-8]

Does Korea ring a bell? :)

 

Please don't say "Made in China". :)

 

Yeah, we have one of those here in San Pedro, at Angel's Gate Park, pretty darn close to the L.A. Cruise Center from where the cruise ships depart. It's called the Korean Bell of Friendship

[ASIWISH]

 

WELCOME BACK. Great to 'hear' from you.

 

 

Thanks, Sail!!!!

 

I have been traveling Sunday thru Friday with my new job since April… now, things get back to normal. So I am happily back on CC!!!!

 

Things have been a little crazy!

[ASIWISH]

I was one that actually believed you and tried to find out from those I knew that might know but they had not heard this at all

 

That's right!!!

 

I was feeling pretty good about my "scoop", especially when you believed me for a short time… but once you backed off a bit, I started to doubt myself..!!!

 

I'd love it if it came true, but I also agree with the others that HAL is a good size fleet right now, and the S-Class is big enough for me…

 

Nice to hear from you, Lisa!