First-time Cruisers Seek Advice from Seasoned Pros

[caviargal]

Everyone is entitled to their opinion and it is ok to build up the river cruise like you like but don't degrade others that you have never traveled on.

 

I stated what lines I personally would not choose and why. How does that degrade them? There are lines that cost more as well but we don't choose those either as they are not a good fit.

 

GCT actively markets to seniors and is not a luxury line. That is factual and not "degrading". We prefer a younger target demographic and a line with features that appeal to their preferences. Would love to try A -Rosa when they get another season or two under their belts.

 

I have seen many boats in port over the course of 6 river cruises. I have looked into their cabins while parked next to them, crossed through them to get to shore, looked into their public spaces. Their websites show cabin size, amenities and passenger count. All objective information, not subjective.

 

The reports from passengers who have cruised in times of water and other issues are very informative IMO as to the quality of a line. Those count, too, IMO. We have had weather influenced issues twice with two different lines and both handled them very well.

 

I make my decisions based on what is right for me, not for someone else. Not degrading at all, just reality.

[Keystonetraveler]

We really enjoy AMA and find their quality and attention to detail to be excellent. We would not choose Grand Circle as they are too basic and cater to AARP demographic;

 

Could you explain what you mean by catering to AARP demographic? Based on the ads I see in the AARP magazine, almost all river and ocean cruise lines seem to have the AARP market as one of their targets. And, when I look at brochures, including AMA's, it looks like most all the passengers in the pictures are likely to fit the criteria for AARP membership!

 

Like you, I do like AMA, but I have always found my fellow passengers to fall into what I view as the AARP demographic for the most part.

[Host Jazzbeau]

Everyone is entitled to their opinion and it is ok to build up the river cruise like you like but don't degrade others that you have never traveled on.

 

I don't need to sail on a boat to know that certain features are deal-breakers, and that certain other features will make a big difference TO ME.

 

Objective issues:

• Twin beds nailed to the outside walls (GCT) -- deal-breaker.

• Really small cabins: DW and I felt that our NCL Dawn inside @ 142 SF was too small, so we want a large and well laid-out cabin. [AMAcello standard cabins are 170 SF, so this is our standard for other river cruise ships.]

 

Subjective issues:

• Food: most river cruise reviews say the food isn't as good as on ocean cruises -- and IMO most ocean cruise food isn't good enough these days -- therefore anything less than the best river cruise food would be a major problem. [CC reviews and my TA are pretty unanimous that AMA has the best food. That's why we're going on AMA in a few weeks.]

• Decor: I don't want to spend a week in a French bordello. I don't need to sail on Uniworld -- I've seen the pictures on their website.

• Service: The recent flooding reports make Viking sound quite scary unless everything goes smoothly.

• Inclusiveness: apparent price differences tend to go away when you start calculating the cost of the non-included items on the "cheaper" cruises -- unless you don't plan to partake of the extra included items. We plan to take all the AMA included tours, and I plan to drink the included wines at meals; the AMA optional tours seem fairly priced; the four-day extension to Lucerne and Zurich is probably overpriced but we don't want the hassle of being our own cruise directors on this trip; the AMA airfare deal was fairly priced and included free (and hopefully hassle-free) transfers.

 

So when we compared all factors, it was easy to eliminate many other river cruise lines [and I will admit this is "degrading" them -- but for clear reasons]. Among the contenders, the AMA price seemed eminently worth it.

[Sylve1]

OP,

I'll share with you what our TA (a river boat specialist) told us; choose a ship that is a recent build. The finishings will not be as "tired" but more importantly, there is less chance for major mechanical things to go wrong.

 

All of the ships will be approximately the same dimensions since they must fit through and sail underneath ancient locks and bridges. How the interior is arranged might be slightly different.

 

All of that said, if itinerary is what is most important to you, you will not be on board ship much but instead will be off ship exploring, eating, and drinking.

 

Remember, too, sometimes the top deck will be closed for a few days to fit under those old bridges!

 

For what it's worth we sail Avalon but have our eye on an AMA itinerary. Have a great time; we love river cruising.

 

This may true of some in relation to age but we travelled on Avalon Tranquility last September and I think it was built 2006?. We couldn't tell. I don't think anyone could describe it as tired in fact the opposite. It was immaculate.

[Ship's Wake]

I don't need to sail on a boat to know that certain features are deal-breakers, and that certain other features will make a big difference TO ME.

 

Objective issues:

• Twin beds nailed to the outside walls (GCT) -- deal-breaker.

• Really small cabins: DW and I felt that our NCL Dawn inside @ 142 SF was too small, so we want a large and well laid-out cabin. [AMAcello standard cabins are 170 SF, so this is our standard for other river cruise ships.]

 

Subjective issues:

• Food: most river cruise reviews say the food isn't as good as on ocean cruises -- and IMO most ocean cruise food isn't good enough these days -- therefore anything less than the best river cruise food would be a major problem. [CC reviews and my TA are pretty unanimous that AMA has the best food. That's why we're going on AMA in a few weeks.]

• Decor: I don't want to spend a week in a French bordello. I don't need to sail on Uniworld -- I've seen the pictures on their website.

• Service: The recent flooding reports make Viking sound quite scary unless everything goes smoothly.

• Inclusiveness: apparent price differences tend to go away when you start calculating the cost of the non-included items on the "cheaper" cruises -- unless you don't plan to partake of the extra included items. We plan to take all the AMA included tours, and I plan to drink the included wines at meals; the AMA optional tours seem fairly priced; the four-day extension to Lucerne and Zurich is probably overpriced but we don't want the hassle of being our own cruise directors on this trip; the AMA airfare deal was fairly priced and included free (and hopefully hassle-free) transfers.

 

So when we compared all factors, it was easy to eliminate many other river cruise lines [and I will admit this is "degrading" them -- but for clear reasons]. Among the contenders, the AMA price seemed eminently worth it.

 

I have a question for you. So if AMA is sold out on the itinerary you desire when you want to travel or doesn't cruise the river you want to travel on, would you pass on taking a river cruise being that there are not any decent alternative options that meet your needs?

 

Not trying too sound too harsh, but if that is the case it really reminds me of a few Disney cruisers I have encountered who lament the fact that "I sure wish Disney would offer new itineraries" and who only cruise to regions of the world Disney goes even though they have a desire to travel elsewhere. In short, if Disney (insert favorite cruise line) doesn't go there, I won't go there either.

[caviargal]

Could you explain what you mean by catering to AARP demographic? Based on the ads I see in the AARP magazine, almost all river and ocean cruise lines seem to have the AARP market as one of their targets. And, when I look at brochures, including AMA's, it looks like most all the passengers in the pictures are likely to fit the criteria for AARP membership!

 

Like you, I do like AMA, but I have always found my fellow passengers to fall into what I view as the AARP demographic for the most part.

 

On our two AMA cruises, at least 40% of the passengers were under 50. One was a wine cruise, which attracts a younger crowd, and the other a Christmas market cruise.

 

AMA offers active level excursions and bike tours and the evening entertainment was lively on several evenings and many nights we were out dancing til past midnight to a DJ on a packed dance floor. This is in stark contrast to our cruises on Avalon.

 

There have been several interviews with Kristin Karst, one of the owners, where she discusses that AMA sees a change in the traditional river cruising market and that they are attracting a younger demographic with some of the programs and features. This was the case on both of our cruises with them and one of the reasons we really enjoyed ourselves on our two AMA cruises, much more so than our Avalon cruises. The energy and personalities of the CD and management team on AMA also made a big difference IMO. While our CDs on Avalon were very competent and hard working, our CDs on AMA were much younger and added more life overall to our cruising experience.

 

Now A -Rosa, new to the US market, is actively pursuing a 40 something demographic with their programs.

 

GCT has found their niche as a value line focused on AARP with their marketing. Viking's CEO stated in a recent interview that he has no interest in attracting younger cruisers (this is not a direct quote but something he clearly expressed). I agree with jazzbeau about the decor on Uniworld. Looking at the boats when are docked next to them and walk through them is enough of that decor for me. We dubbed one the "Heidi" cruise one evening when we were docked next to them - lounge to lounge - and watched a few of the passengers taking a nap during the evening entertainment, which was a vocalist dressed like Heidi, singing to about 30 passengers. Not for us.

 

jazzbeau, the points you made cover some of the objective reasons we choose AMA. The subjective are important to us as well. The wonderful cheese board at lunch and dinner, the layout of the dining room, the extra service in the dining room (less self serve at breakfast and lunch), the little touches at special events, the quality of food and service, having a masseuse on board, the entertainment we have enjoyed on our two cruises and the overall attention to detail was excellent on both trips.

 

We are very excited to be on the AmaPrima for Christmas and New Years and I cannot wait to see what AMA has in store for us to celebrate the holidays.

[sippican]

We really enjoy AMA and find their quality and attention to detail to be excellent. We would not choose Grand Circle as they are too basic and cater to AARP demographic.

 

Could you explain what you mean by catering to AARP demographic? Based on the ads I see in the AARP magazine, almost all river and ocean cruise lines seem to have the AARP market as one of their targets. And, when I look at brochures, including AMA's, it looks like most all the passengers in the pictures are likely to fit the criteria for AARP membership!

 

Like you, I do like AMA, but I have always found my fellow passengers to fall into what I view as the AARP demographic for the most part.

 

I am amused by all of this "AARP demographic" discussion. We are proud members of AARP. We ski, hike, kayak, snowshoe, zip line, snorkel, ride bikes, camp, etc. Funny how some like to lump people into stereotyped groups (spring-breakers, Puerto Ricans, Disney cruisers, and the dreaded Carnival mob). Who cares? Your trip is what you make it! We have yet to find that the demographics of our traveling companions have a major impact on our experience. You name it, boring, rude, challenged, fascinating, helpful people can be found anywhere. Personally, I find it has little to do with age and that is one of the least important factors I consider when planning a trip. We enjoy being with young families as well as seasoned travelers. I understand that others feel differently. Would we want to be on a walking tour with those not capable of moving at a moderate pace? Of course not, even though we are AARP members :D

 

As far as a marketing target, of course they look towards a more mature audience. Guess where the money is, and which group has the mist time to travel?

[caviargal]

I am not anti AARP at all. I simply prefer to choose a line that aims for a more inclusive target demographic. I also would not choose a sailing on a line that was family friendly as I prefer to avoid kids.

 

Not sure why it is offensive to narrow down our preferences based on what we personally enjoy.

 

We often take my mom with us when we river cruise and she is 82. On AMA, she takes the tours designed for slow walkers and we do the active tours or go out on our own. Works really well for both of us.

 

We are following A-Rosa as they are gearing to the 40-50 somethings and that is very appealing to us. Entertainment and amenities are in line with their target market and that is us.

[Cary Cruiser]

I don't need to sail on a boat to know that certain features are deal-breakers, and that certain other features will make a big difference TO ME.

 

Objective issues:

• Twin beds nailed to the outside walls (GCT) -- deal-breaker.

• Really small cabins: DW and I felt that our NCL Dawn inside @ 142 SF was too small, so we want a large and well laid-out cabin. [AMAcello standard cabins are 170 SF, so this is our standard for other river cruise ships.]

 

Subjective issues:

• Food: most river cruise reviews say the food isn't as good as on ocean cruises -- and IMO most ocean cruise food isn't good enough these days -- therefore anything less than the best river cruise food would be a major problem. [CC reviews and my TA are pretty unanimous that AMA has the best food. That's why we're going on AMA in a few weeks.]

• Decor: I don't want to spend a week in a French bordello. I don't need to sail on Uniworld -- I've seen the pictures on their website.

• Service: The recent flooding reports make Viking sound quite scary unless everything goes smoothly.

• Inclusiveness: apparent price differences tend to go away when you start calculating the cost of the non-included items on the "cheaper" cruises -- unless you don't plan to partake of the extra included items. We plan to take all the AMA included tours, and I plan to drink the included wines at meals; the AMA optional tours seem fairly priced; the four-day extension to Lucerne and Zurich is probably overpriced but we don't want the hassle of being our own cruise directors on this trip; the AMA airfare deal was fairly priced and included free (and hopefully hassle-free) transfers.

 

So when we compared all factors, it was easy to eliminate many other river cruise lines [and I will admit this is "degrading" them -- but for clear reasons]. Among the contenders, the AMA price seemed eminently worth it.

 

I admire your logic, but the fact is that each of the companies has their own niche in the marketplace and I sure they all work hard to keep that niche.

 

When I knew absolutely nothing about river cruising, someone gave me the names of several companies and I went to their websites to check them out. I was completely turned off by the Uniworld décor on their boats and I immediately rejected them out of hand. Only later, having spent much time on this forum did I find that they are considered "top tier" by most people. They have their niche and I'm still glad I chose Viking.

 

And speaking of Viking, they are by far the largest of the cruise lines with the most boats and the most passengers. They must be doing something right. Their product has the broadest appeal, they carry the most passengers - therefore they must be the "best" - right? It's only logical.

 

And as I recall their were some complaints about how AMA handled recent flooding. The most complaints by far were about Viking, but again by far they have the most boats, most passengers. etc.

 

Anyway, as I said each cruise line fills a needed niche in the marketplace otherwise they would not stay in business long term.

 

I find this discussion about who is best to be silly, and HIGLY SUBJECTIVE.

[H2Otstr]

I am amused by all of this "AARP demographic" discussion. We are proud members of AARP. We ski, hike, kayak, snowshoe, zip line, snorkel, ride bikes, camp, etc. Funny how some like to lump people into stereotyped groups (spring-breakers, Puerto Ricans, Disney cruisers, and the dreaded Carnival mob). Who cares? Your trip is what you make it! We have yet to find that the demographics of our traveling companions have a major impact on our experience. You name it, boring, rude, challenged, fascinating, helpful people can be found anywhere. Personally, I find it has little to do with age and that is one of the least important factors I consider when planning a trip. We enjoy being with young families as well as seasoned travelers. I understand that others feel differently. Would we want to be on a walking tour with those not capable of moving at a moderate pace? Of course not, even though we are AARP members :D

 

As far as a marketing target, of course they look towards a more mature audience. Guess where the money is, and which group has the mist time to travel?

 

LOL. One only has to be 50 years old to be a member of AARP. My husband was mortified when he received an AARP Membership card in the mail on his 50th birthday, all compliments of his father :D.

[cbb]

Sylve1,

We love Avalon and have not found her interiors to be worn regardless of age of ship, but others on other lines have remarked on interiors being "tired" and that is largely due to the age of the ship and/or no drydocking for a while. Age of ship IS important for mechanical issues.

 

Also keep in mind many of these cruise lines are taking "groups." You may think you're traveling on a cruise line that you've researched and matches what you want--but that "group" can change the dynamic of that cruise.

 

We once traveled with a large group of credit union people and most of their ages were 50-60; they were all still working. They ate together and toured together. What a nice way to receive "continuing education" credits!!

[Ship's Wake]

Sylve1,

We love Avalon and have not found her interiors to be worn regardless of age of ship, but others on other lines have remarked on interiors being "tired" and that is largely due to the age of the ship and/or no drydocking for a while. Age of ship IS important for mechanical issues.

 

 

The river cruise lines in Europe have ample time for doing maintenance and refurbishing at season's end. Most European river cruise boats operate from March until November, with a few boats running in December.

 

They are out of service from January through March, giving the owners many weeks to fix what needs fixing.

 

Perhaps steamboats or ingo e have more knowledge about this and can shed some more light on how often off season maintenance is carried out.

[cbb]

oysterdam, I totally agree with you and I'm not the one who has remarked on interiors being tired. I think that since more cruise lines are putting more ships into the rivers, those tired ones are either being retired, or being beautified in order to stay competitive.

[sippican]

Caviargirl - Never said anything about anyone being anti-AARP, it's the stereotyped image of who belongs to that group that I find amusing.

Of course one should choose a line based on personal preferences, I respect those choices and whatever logic used to arrive at them.

You point out one of the things we like about AMA - the varied activity levels of the tours. We also like that bikes will be available.

 

Cary Cruiser, I agree. There is a niche for all, and obviously Viking currently fills the greatest need, as does Carnival in the large ship market. What is best for some may not be best for others, but the profits sure speak for themselves.

 

We have remained open in our choices, both for land and cruise vacations. Few have disappointed, and some are favorites. We look forward to every new experience with a positive approach. i enjoy hearing about the impressions of others on these boards, including the never-ending "who's best". In my opinion, the best is whatever ship I am fortunate to be on at the time! :D

[Host Jazzbeau]

I have a question for you. So if AMA is sold out on the itinerary you desire when you want to travel or doesn't cruise the river you want to travel on, would you pass on taking a river cruise being that there are not any decent alternative options that meet your needs?

 

Not trying too sound too harsh, but if that is the case it really reminds me of a few Disney cruisers I have encountered who lament the fact that "I sure wish Disney would offer new itineraries" and who only cruise to regions of the world Disney goes even though they have a desire to travel elsewhere. In short, if Disney (insert favorite cruise line) doesn't go there, I won't go there either.

 

I'm a long way from running out of AMA itineraries, and I book as soon as the new seasons are announced (I'm booked through 2015 now) so I have never been unable to get the cruise (or cabin) that I wanted.

 

But if I were determined to take a particular river cruise and AMA couldn't accommodate, I would use the same factors to choose a back-up cruise line. From what I've read, it would probably be Avalon or Tauck.

[Got2Cruise]

I'm a long way from running out of AMA itineraries, and I book as soon as the new seasons are announced (I'm booked through 2015 now) so I have never been unable to get the cruise (or cabin) that I wanted.

 

But if I were determined to take a particular river cruise and AMA couldn't accommodate, I would use the same factors to choose a back-up cruise line. From what I've read, it would probably be Avalon or Tauck.

 

I am so jelly. :D:p

 

I think the month of travel also reflects the demographic. If you travel in the summer, you will see more teenagers and working teachers on board. I happen to be a teacher, and who did I hook up with by chance, you got it, another couple, the wife is a teacher. Our Avalon ship was docked with a Uniworld boat, and I happened to see plenty of young folks with their families on the ship. (I didn't care for the decorating taste, but I bet their Mom and Dad liked it so that is why it was booked) The folks I spoke to over the "rails" stated they loved the cruise.

 

This was the Paris/Normandy itinerary, which I think probably attracts a younger demographic also, because, almost everybody wants to see Paris at least once in their life, and if they can afford it, take their children also. So, yes, certain itineraries attract a different demographic.

[Ship's Wake]

I'm a long way from running out of AMA itineraries, and I book as soon as the new seasons are announced (I'm booked through 2015 now) so I have never been unable to get the cruise (or cabin) that I wanted.

 

But if I were determined to take a particular river cruise and AMA couldn't accommodate, I would use the same factors to choose a back-up cruise line. From what I've read, it would probably be Avalon or Tauck.

 

Makes sense.

[Ship's Wake]

I am so jelly. :D:p

 

I think the month of travel also reflects the demographic. If you travel in the summer, you will see more teenagers and working teachers on board. I happen to be a teacher, and who did I hook up with by chance, you got it, another couple, the wife is a teacher. Our Avalon ship was docked with a Uniworld boat, and I happened to see plenty of young folks with their families on the ship. (I didn't care for the decorating taste, but I bet their Mom and Dad liked it so that is why it was booked) The folks I spoke to over the "rails" stated they loved the cruise.

 

This was the Paris/Normandy itinerary, which I think probably attracts a younger demographic also, because, almost everybody wants to see Paris at least once in their life, and if they can afford it, take their children also. So, yes, certain itineraries attract a different demographic.

 

Agree with you about demographics during certain times of the year, and on certain itineraries.

 

We have seen on our three December cruises for the Christmas markets many couples in their 30s and 40s onboard (like us :)).

[kiwik8]

I am new to cc and have just started my own forum and the came across this and have really enjoyed the comments. I am of the mid 40 age and on my first cruise and first trip to Europe. I chose viking as the dates suited me because I come from NZ and are a teacher our main holidays are in winter. However they have cancelled our New Years cruise which is giving me the opportunity to look around. After listening to this I have requested an AMA quote for their Christmas cruise. Has anyone been on Vikings new year cruise before as they have offered us the same cruise going the other way. Budapest to Nuremberg. Many thanks

[Beeje]

It's me again, the OP. Last time I checked my post had about 7 responses. Tonight I was doing more research and said to the spouse "I am rethinking this whole river cruise thing. There is just more information than I have time to process blah blah blah" and then decided to come back here and check my post. 43 replies! Some of them have been very helpful and gave me a few more lines to look into. Normally I adore the planning of a trip and have built many international vacation itineraries from scratch in the past, but this cruise business is underscoring just what a novice I am, and I don't have a lot of time to put into the research. Starting to wonder if I should enlist the aid of a travel agent but that is totally against my grain. Hopefully I'll be able to grin and bear it, good thing I planned ahead! Thanks everyone who provided useful, friendly advice.

[cbb]

Beeje,

Many people on this thread feel strongly about "their" cruise line. Really, I don't think there is much difference in most of them. The cruise companies offer pretty much the same itineraries; they have to...it's the same rivers and towns! It's all about geography!!

 

Most market the cruises to people from the US, Canada, Australia, New Zealand and UK so the food will be about the same, the beds and cabins about the same, the guides in the towns are from the same tour companies. The ships are going to be the same size because they have to fit through the same lock systems.

 

Let's face it, you are going to see the same castles, cathedrals, vineyards, etc that everyone else is going to see. Some of the optionals may be a little different and some may offer "theme cruises."

 

Look for an itinerary you like, decide how much you're willing to spend, look for "deals," compare the companies so that you know what is included and what are additional charges and then choose. I don't think any of the companies will leave you unhappy (unless there is flooding, but that's another thread!)

 

Beeje, don't worry about all of this--it's vacation after all. Happy sailing!

[Hydrokitty]

Beeje,

Many people on this thread feel strongly about "their" cruise line. Really, I don't think there is much difference in most of them. The cruise companies offer pretty much the same itineraries; they have to...it's the same rivers and towns! It's all about geography!!

 

Most market the cruises to people from the US, Canada, Australia, New Zealand and UK so the food will be about the same, the beds and cabins about the same, the guides in the towns are from the same tour companies. The ships are going to be the same size because they have to fit through the same lock systems.

 

Let's face it, you are going to see the same castles, cathedrals, vineyards, etc that everyone else is going to see. Some of the optionals may be a little different and some may offer "theme cruises."

 

Look for an itinerary you like, decide how much you're willing to spend, look for "deals," compare the companies so that you know what is included and what are additional charges and then choose. I don't think any of the companies will leave you unhappy (unless there is flooding, but that's another thread!)

 

Beeje, don't worry about all of this--it's vacation after all. Happy sailing!

 

I couldn't agree with you more! I've done 5 river cruises with Vantage and I like them very much, but I still get info from Viking, AMA and GCT. As I posted before (and apparently badly) the companies and the ships are all basically the same for the reasons you describe and they all charge about the same otherwise they couldn't compete. Each of them will have their own touch and some of those touches are very important to some and unimportant to others. YOU have to decide who goes where you want to go and THEN start looking at things like shore excursions, cabin size, targeted demographic, etc. I still say you can't go wrong if you go with one of the major companies. And as to the demographic, river cruising appeals to the older generation, lets face it, we're the ones with the money and the time and without us they'd go out of business. One thing I will tell you: once you go on a river cruise you will join the rest of us in going on more of them. It's a fantastic way to travel.:D

[caviargal]

I am new to cc and have just started my own forum and the came across this and have really enjoyed the comments. I am of the mid 40 age and on my first cruise and first trip to Europe. I chose viking as the dates suited me because I come from NZ and are a teacher our main holidays are in winter. However they have cancelled our New Years cruise which is giving me the opportunity to look around. After listening to this I have requested an AMA quote for their Christmas cruise. Has anyone been on Vikings new year cruise before as they have offered us the same cruise going the other way. Budapest to Nuremberg. Many thanks

 

We are on the AmaPrima, departing Nuremberg on 25 December. I am certain that AMA will make it special.