Trouble in Europe -- Credit Card with no chip?

[newgrange]

I saw someone mention Amex - don't bring Amex cards to Europe - very few places accept them.

[Surreyman]

Britain is known for their stifling regulations. A couple of years ago we were in London for a nephews wedding and wanted to give him a gift check - of the sort any US bank will sell. No bank would sell a gift check to anyone not having a long term account relationship - they cited the necessity of preventing terrorists from anonymously funding operations.

 

We went to a post office and had no problem anonymously buying a postal money order (read: "check") - so much for consistency.

 

There is no concept of a gift cheque in UK banking, some organisations will provide what is effectively a voucher but not a cheque.

 

A postal order is still in use in the UK but not by many people.

 

There are strict money laundering rules over account opening in the UK.

Edited July 13, 2014 by Surreyman

[Surreyman]

In a somewhat related way (money problems while traveling) we learned the hard way in 2012 that banks (all banks) in the UK will not change US currency. In the past we always took some cash as the major banks would change it at a better rate than travel checks. Scary when no one wants to take our currency. When questioned, the banks fell back on that old tired line "it is to prevent drug dealers money laundering". BS, or as the Brits say: bollocks! We were not trying to change millions, just a middle aged US couple on holiday trying to change a few hundred $$. Now you have to go to money changers at the airport, train stations, or Marks & Spencers. Guess how much they charge for the privilege!!

 

Any bank in the UK will change dollars to Stirling I've done it many times, you must have been asking the wrong question. B*****ks is not the same as BS and is not used in polite company. There are rather more outlets than you quote who will change money, and not many of them will be at railway stations.

[Surreyman]

I saw someone mention Amex - don't bring Amex cards to Europe - very few places accept them.

 

They charge far too much commission to the vendor for them to find it worth supporting. The overwhelming majority of credit cards in the UK have no annual fee, whereas American Express does so this doesn't make it attractive to the user.

[Surreyman]

I have just gone through the exercise of trying to get a Chip & PIN card for an upcoming trip to Spain. I called all the banks that issue my cards and researched several websites that rate cards. Here is what I found:

• one apparently complete success: Barclay Arrival Plus -- comes with Chip and preassigned PIN which they say clearly is a full-on credit-card PIN; you can change the PIN (that raises a red flag, because I thought the PIN was burned into the Chip -- but they explain that you have to use it once at a staffed location in Europe, then the card will be updated for use in kiosks with your new PIN) -- no Foreign Transaction Fees, excellent rewards (2% on everything and an extra 10% if you redeem for travel expenses), big points bonus in first three months, annual fee waived the first year.

• Citi now issues cards with Chip and ATM PIN -- some CC posters say they have been able to use the ATM PIN in Europe for credit card transactions -- but the Citi cards I have charge 3% Foreign Transaction Fee.

• Amex Platinum cards can be reissued with Chip -- but no PIN, so they will only work if your salesperson knows how to do "Chip & Sign" procedure [note: this is the full-on Platinum card with $450 annual fee and no waiver, not the Delta card that also says "platinum"]. Other Amex cards don't even have the Chip option yet

• there are a couple of credit unions that have full Chip & PIN, but joining them is somewhat complicated

• Chase will be switching all its cards to Chip & PIN by the end of the year, but that doesn't help for travel this summer

 

[sorry if I'm duplicating information already posted on this thread -- I did a search and "Barclay" had no hits]

 

The chip and the PIN are two separate parts of the security. If the PIN was encoded in the card then so,some acquiring the card could access the PIN.

 

The PIN can be changed to something more memorable or if you think it may have been compromised in some way.

[Jim Avery]

Any bank in the UK will change dollars to Stirling I've done it many times, you must have been asking the wrong question. B*****ks is not the same as BS and is not used in polite company. There are rather more outlets than you quote who will change money, and not many of them will be at railway stations.

 

I went into every major bank in the UK and was told the same. No exchange of US currency. they directed me to M& S, train stations, or airports. Do you think I am making this up??? To what end??? They all said I needed to have an account with them to exchange currency. Why on earth would I have an account with, say, Lloyds when I live in Arizona???

Edited July 13, 2014 by Jim Avery

[Surreyman]

I went into every major bank in the UK and was told the same. No exchange of US currency. they directed me to M& S, train stations, or airports. Do you think I am making this up??? To what end??? They all said I needed to have an account with them to exchange currency. Why on earth would I have an account with, say, Lloyds when I live in Arizona???

 

I live in the UK and have changed money in banks I don't bank with, so I don't know why they wouldn't for you.

 

Odd they would direct you to Marks and Sparks or a railway station. As I say few railway stations have exchange facilities. If I was directing someone somewhere other than a bank I'd suggest a travel agent or post office

[newgrange]

Most banks will have an issue with large US bills - perhaps that was the problem.

[FATJACK]

They charge far too much commission to the vendor for them to find it worth supporting. The overwhelming majority of credit cards in the UK have no annual fee, whereas American Express does so this doesn't make it attractive to the user.

 

On my last trip to Europe (2011) to include a couple of weeks in France and Italy and a seventeen day TA cruise out of Venice. I found that the Amex card was accepted at all the places that accepted Mastercard and Visa. These places were not all high end places but included small family wineries in Tuscany and more. Besides the Amex Platinum Card, the Amex Delta Card does not charge a foreign exchange fee.

 

Using both the Amex Platinum and Delta Card for my personal and business purchases have allowed my family and me to fly using frequent flyers miles to Europe several times in the last fifteen years with me in Business Class at very little or no costs. I have found the costs associated with Amex to be of no consequence over the long run.

[Hlitner]

I went into every major bank in the UK and was told the same. No exchange of US currency. they directed me to M& S, train stations, or airports. Do you think I am making this up??? To what end??? They all said I needed to have an account with them to exchange currency. Why on earth would I have an account with, say, Lloyds when I live in Arizona???

 

It is not just in the UK. We have seen a trend throughout Europe where banks just do not want to bother changing currency. It is not worth their time and cost. We have even seen some banks with hand lettered signs in their windows saying they do not exchange currency. I would also say that we travel extensively in Europe and have not tried to exchange a US bill on over a decade. We simply get all of our cash from ATM machines, which is what most Europeans do for cash. But we have tried to exchange various European currencies (like Norwegian Krone for Euros) which has even been problematic in some places.

 

On our recent (last month) driving trip through France (and part of Germany) we noticed that the exchange rates at money changing places (I cannot help but look at their rates) was generally designed to give the a 5-10% profit. If you are exchanging a $1000 that is not a big deal, but for those of us who travel extensively it can amount to real money and we also think its a hassle. When we need cash we simply stop at a nearby ATM (which are nearly everywhere) and get our cash in seconds with no hassle....and we use US banks that charge no foreign exchange fees.

 

Hank

Edited July 13, 2014 by Hlitner

[Stratheden]

In a somewhat related way (money problems while traveling) we learned the hard way in 2012 that banks (all banks) in the UK will not change US currency. In the past we always took some cash as the major banks would change it at a better rate than travel checks. Scary when no one wants to take our currency. When questioned, the banks fell back on that old tired line "it is to prevent drug dealers money laundering". BS, or as the Brits say: bollocks! We were not trying to change millions, just a middle aged US couple on holiday trying to change a few hundred $$. Now you have to go to money changers at the airport, train stations, or Marks & Spencers. Guess how much they charge for the privilege!!

 

Why didn't you get the cash from your bank at home before you left? That is what we do. You are going to carry cash - what does it matter what currency it is in. We leave in a few weeks for Europe and I already have £, €, HUF and CZK. Not a lot but enough to get by for a day or two. After a 28hour flight the last thing I need to think about is currency.

[Jim Avery]

Why didn't you get the cash from your bank at home before you left? That is what we do. You are going to carry cash - what does it matter what currency it is in. We leave in a few weeks for Europe and I already have £, €, HUF and CZK. Not a lot but enough to get by for a day or two. After a 28hour flight the last thing I need to think about is currency.

 

That is what I do now. I used to save enough Pounds Sterling from the last trip to start the next (Mother is English so at least every 2 years or so) and took cash as that was the easiest way as I was living in a small town in the South of the US. Getting foreign currency of any type involved ordering it, paying a fee, and waiting for it to arrive. Not at all like living in ATL or NYC.:eek: Now, in the PHX area all the large banks carry the usual major currencies. We just were blind sided on that particular trip and now know that US currency is not the formerly near universally accepted currency.

[Stratheden]

Yes that is what I do. Ordered it last Tuesday and it was ready for pickup on Thursday. No big ordeal.

 

I admit I'm a bit of an over organiser but would rather be relaxed on my trip than trying to work out where and when I can change money. Once the small amount that we take with us is used we just go to the ATM.

 

I have a small amount of US and CAN left over from last year and hopefully we will get to use it next year. We will make sure we keep some € from this year to take to Italy next year also. See, I have next year all worked out already and I haven't even left on this year's trip yet. :rolleyes:

[navybankerteacher]

It's just a different system. The post office is used for that kind of transaction. The Post Office in the UK is like a financial institution, it's not mainly for mail!:)

 

My point: was if the government forbids banks to sell checks to non-customers for security reasons, why would they do precisely that through the post office? It is simply a matter of government saying it can do exactly what they forbid others from doing.

[navybankerteacher]

Yes that is what I do. Ordered it last Tuesday and it was ready for pickup on Thursday. No big ordeal.

 

I admit I'm a bit of an over organiser but would rather be relaxed on my trip than trying to work out where and when I can change money. Once the small amount that we take with us is used we just go to the ATM.

 

I have a small amount of US and CAN left over from last year and hopefully we will get to use it next year. We will make sure we keep some € from this year to take to Italy next year also. See, I have next year all worked out already and I haven't even left on this year's trip yet. :rolleyes:

 

You will always get a better exchange rate by getting you GBP or euros at ATM' over there by accessing your US account - rather than doing a foreign currency buy at home. You also save yourself the risk/inconvenience of carrying a lot of currency.

 

Of course, we usually come back with foreign currency - travelling overseas every year. It makes sense to save it for next trip, rather Stan swap back.

[Surreyman]

My point: was if the government forbids banks to sell checks to non-customers for security reasons, why would they do precisely that through the post office? It is simply a matter of government saying it can do exactly what they forbid others from doing.

 

I don't think it's a government edict. As I said above, gift cheques are an unknown concept in the UK.

[Surreyman]

On my last trip to Europe (2011) to include a couple of weeks in France and Italy and a seventeen day TA cruise out of Venice. I found that the Amex card was accepted at all the places that accepted Mastercard and Visa. These places were not all high end places but included small family wineries in Tuscany and more. Besides the Amex Platinum Card, the Amex Delta Card does not charge a foreign exchange fee.

 

Using both the Amex Platinum and Delta Card for my personal and business purchases have allowed my family and me to fly using frequent flyers miles to Europe several times in the last fifteen years with me in Business Class at very little or no costs. I have found the costs associated with Amex to be of no consequence over the long run.

 

Amex appeals to certain people, but I would not recommend that one relies on it without bringing another card with you.

[Lizzie68]

My point: was if the government forbids banks to sell checks to non-customers for security reasons, why would they do precisely that through the post office? It is simply a matter of government saying it can do exactly what they forbid others from doing.

 

 

I may be wrong but I don't believe you can purchase gift cheques from banks in Canada either. There's a whole different set of rules and laws that apply to the financial institutions. Post Offices in the UK are kind of unique in the financial services they offer and it goes way back to when few people actually had a bank account. All pensions and benefits used to be paid through the Post Office. But really, why worry about what another country's regulations are - when in Rome and all that.

[Surreyman]

I may be wrong but I don't believe you can purchase gift cheques from banks in Canada either. There's a whole different set of rules and laws that apply to the financial institutions. Post Offices in the UK are kind of unique in the financial services they offer and it goes way back to when few people actually had a bank account. All pensions and benefits used to be paid through the Post Office. But really, why worry about what another country's regulations are - when in Rome and all that.

 

Yes the Post Office is different in the UK from some other countries. It is also not the same as the Royal Mail which actually collects the mail and delivers it.

[Lizzie68]

Yes the Post Office is different in the UK from some other countries. It is also not the same as the Royal Mail which actually collects the mail and delivers it.

 

Further confusion for those on this side of the pond. However, important to note that yes, indeed, you buy stamps and process your mail at the Post Office.;)

[Jim Avery]

Most banks will have an issue with large US bills - perhaps that was the problem.

 

They did not indicate the size of bills as the issue. After all, the largest readily available bill in US currency is $100. It pales in comparison to the 500 Euro note!:D

[Surreyman]

Further confusion for those on this side of the pond. However, important to note that yes, indeed, you buy stamps and process your mail at the Post Office.;)

 

You can buy stamps there along with many other things. However, as with much of Europe, you can buy stamps at many other outlets as well.

[Lizzie68]

You can buy stamps there along with many other things. However, as with much of Europe, you can buy stamps at many other outlets as well.

 

OK. Now back to regular programming......

[navybankerteacher]

I don't think it's a government edict. As I said above, gift cheques are an unknown concept in the UK.

 

The banks said that the reason they would not sell a cashiers check was government regulation - supposedly to prevent funding of terrorism. They fully understood the concept - it was solely government regulation which prevented them from engaging in such transactions. I used to work at a London branch of a US bank - so I am not completely uninformed. Gift (or other official) checks drawn on banks may now be unknown - but they used to be common.

 

In any event, HMPost surely does know the concept.

[Surreyman]

The banks said that the reason they would not sell a cashiers check was government regulation - supposedly to prevent funding of terrorism. They fully understood the concept - it was solely government regulation which prevented them from engaging in such transactions. I used to work at a London branch of a US bank - so I am not completely uninformed. Gift (or other official) checks drawn on banks may now be unknown - but they used to be common.

 

In any event, HMPost surely does know the concept.

 

We are way off track and it is a pity that there is no option for private posts on here.

 

An answer in two parts. You can still get official cheques drawn on banks they are called bankers drafts and are usually used for large transactions like house or car purchases, although more and more banking is done electronically and most British banks are taking more and more steps to put people off using no electronic transfers. In the UK all clearing bank cheques were accepted by all other clearing banks so if you wanted to give someone a gift then you could just write them a cheque and they could bank it in a different or the same bank.

 

The anti terrorist laws are EU wide and require banks to have positive proof of who their customers are esp for transactions over 1000 euros. As the fines for noncompliance are high, they would rather put obstacles in the way of non-customers. None of which is, I admit of much interest to most on here :)

 

Money changing facilities are widely available in UK towns there are 6 in the town I live in so rates are competitive, although none are at the railway station or the marks and spencer.

 

On the main subject of the thread, to summarise you may struggle if you come to Europe with a non PIN and chip card, although mag card and PIN are still accepted in some places. You can if you have the right card get money from most ATMs and these can often be found in locations away from banks.

Most ATMs are free but your bank will most likely charge you if you are abroad.

 

Credit cards are more widely accepted in the UK than they are in some other EU countries so it is best to carry some currency.

 

Fortunately most of the main EU countries (not the UK) use the euro so you can take the same money from one country to the next.

 

 

Cash is still widely accepted but cashless transactions are being pushed hard - bank cards in the UK come with touch less pay facilities and London buses no longer accept cash. It is often much cheaper to buy prepaid cards on metros than it is to try and pay cash.