Rise in Tips ?

[Dryce]

I believe they may be over extending themselves and should consider a cheaper holiday.

 

This sort of off hand statement misses the advantage to somebody on a very very tight budget in that the cost of the cruise can be almost totally contained. And it can be a cheap holiday if managed carefully.

[terrierjohn]

Quote:

I believe they may be over extending themselves and should consider a cheaper holiday.

 

This sort of off hand statement misses the advantage to somebody on a very very tight budget in that the cost of the cruise can be almost totally contained. And it can be a cheap holiday if managed carefully.

You are obviously quite a politician, taking this statement on its own and out of context like that.

[balf]

It probably would be far better if the cruise lines added it to the invoice price, however I believe this would more than double the current level of auto tips levied (

 

I don't see why. The object wouldn't be to increase the total revenue but share it out among all the passengers. The passengers who cough up now would effectively pay less and the tight wads would pay more. The total take would be the same and it would be guaranteed assuming the ship was full.

 

David.

[Dryce]

You are obviously quite a politician, taking this statement on its own and out of context like that.

 

The quote is terse and specific - it's specifically in context given the post of mine that preceded it and which you quoted.

 

I'm not trying to score points - just make one that is important. Not everybody on board is well heeled - and some have to be careful. Circumstances of passengers can vary quite a bit.

[PORT ROYAL]

I don't see why. The object wouldn't be to increase the total revenue but share it out among all the passengers. The passengers who cough up now would effectively pay less and the tight wads would pay more. The total take would be the same and it would be guaranteed assuming the ship was full.

 

David.

 

Hope you realise that asking a tightwad to pay more may induce a severe shock to their delicate natures.

But knowing tightwads they may request for the removal, and refund, of the prepaid gratutities. Best idea is to increase the fares and tell the tightwads the gratutities are free!:D

[terrierjohn]

I don't see why. The object wouldn't be to increase the total revenue but share it out among all the passengers. The passengers who cough up now would effectively pay less and the tight wads would pay more. The total take would be the same and it would be guaranteed assuming the ship was full.David.

 

Originally post by dryce The quote is terse and specific - it's specifically in context given the post of mine that preceded it and which you quoted.

 

I'm not trying to score points - just make one that is important. Not everybody on board is well heeled - and some have to be careful. Circumstances of passengers can vary quite a bit.

David, You clearly did not read or fully understand post 90, once a large company put staff onto their payroll those costs have to absorb their share of the business overheads, which in most cases doubles the cost.

So to all those who want it added into the cruise fare do be prepared for it to cost more.

 

Dryce, everyone who cruises should be aware of the way the hotel staff receive their remuneration, and need to factor this into their cost planning.

[Dryce]

David, You clearly did not read or fully understand post 90, once a large company put staff onto their payroll those costs have to absorb their share of the business overheads, which in most cases doubles the cost.

So to all those who want it added into the cruise fare do be prepared for it to cost more.

 

Actually this doesn't have to be the case.

 

Airlines segment their pricing to pass on specific costs to the customer - and also to elliminate the pricing of these costs from being included in their agents' commission. Meanwhile the customer is supposed to just see the all-in price.

 

Dryce, everyone who cruises should be aware of the way the hotel staff receive their remuneration, and need to factor this into their cost planning.

 

I disagree. Unless prices are advised as such eg.

 

"7 days from £499 + £35 gratuity"

 

or

 

"7 days £534 (* includes optional gratuity)"

 

But they don't advertise that way - they advertise the headline price and stick the details of the gratuity in the small print.

 

If it's required part of the remuneration package for the staff then this is being somewhat dishonest.

 

Now I know it's an industry culture. And I also have to say that the service I've received on P&O has meant that we tip over and above the suggested minumum or autotip - not because of any obligation but appreciation. The crew are what make the experience - and I'm well aware that the underlying reason the cruising is so relatively affordable is the arbitrage of 'local' crew wage levels vs the wage levels of the customers.

 

The issue for me is that I dislike price obsfuscation. If people want to treat the auto-tip as mandatory then make it a separate and up front service charge that is declared in the headline pricing even if it is only collected once on board.

[balf]

David, You clearly did not read or fully understand post 90, /QUOTE]

 

Well I have re read it and it still seems to have nothing to do with the simple procedure of removing the tips and adjusting the fares.

 

Cruise fares are changed constantly for commercial reasons. There would be no reason why this would be different in this case.

 

David.

[newbieafloat]

It all comes down to percentages:

 

If 50% of the passengers are cancelling the tips, and P&O double what they're currently pulling in to include a processing fee for making it inclusive, it netts out at the same cost per passenger, it's just that everybody pays it.

 

If only 15% of passengers are cancelling their tips, but 10% are increasing them and another 10% are topping up with cash/envelopes, then they'll consider the system to be working.

 

We seem to make up a small percentage of the passengers (only 8 people from this forum on the roll call for my cruise with over 3k passengers), so we can't take our views as representative of all on board. P&O will adjust their methods if the market dictates it, but I agree with the earlier poster who said this would be just one of many factors which could/would vary cost to us the fee paying public

[P&O Lynn Knickers]

It all comes down to percentages:

 

You are looking at it from a corporate company view

 

The Waiter/Steward looks at it as follows :

20 pax = X Pounds.

15 pax pay.

5 pax stiff

equals less than minimium.

 

Its correct to say, that sometimes they receive overpayments/ extra tips.

But most are not paid the correct "Minimium" gratutity.

 

P&O do *Not* make up the balance.

They dont have to.

 

 

 

.

Edited March 18, 2015 by P&O Lynn Knickers
Lynn is a Lady of leisure.

[newbieafloat]

You are looking at it from a corporate company view

 

.

 

... because that's where any future change would come from :)

 

I fully intend paying the recommended grats barring any major service issues, and even then, I will make a judgement call based on the service from others who will benefit from them. I have no intention to hold back purely on principle, and have budgetted grats into my on board spending. That said, the amount I actually give may be subject to change based on the service I actually receive. I think that's perfectly fair all round (to the waiters and stewards, but also to me)

[P&O Lynn Knickers]

... ...That said, the amount I actually give may be subject to change based on the service I actually receive. I think that's perfectly fair all round (to the waiters and stewards, but also to me)

 

That is very fair, and if you receive service not on a par with your expectations, then you are totally correct in not paying / underpaying your Waiter/Steward.

 

 

 

 

 

.

Edited March 18, 2015 by P&O Lynn Knickers
Lynn has a very big heart.... bless her

[BigJH]

We are talking about a "gratuity" aren't we? If it get's added to the overall cost, then doesn't it cease to be a gratuity, which by default is discretionary, and given if a passenger feels that they have received good service? If added to the coat and automatically distributed, doesn't it simply become part of a "salary"... I always leave the automatic tip in place for myself and my wife but remove for my children, as they like to give a small donation to the cabin steward at the end of the cruise - however - I would have no qualms about removing it if I thought the service was poor, that should be my right - try removing it if it were added to the cost of the holiday - no chance... One element that seems to be more popular now is restricting certain options unless you prepay (eg select dining with Celebrity) - this I believe is wrong, and forces prepayment...

[P&O Lynn Knickers]

................One element that seems to be more popular now is restricting certain options unless you prepay (eg select dining with Celebrity) - this I believe is wrong, and forces prepayment...

 

I agree with your view, but on the other hand, ask why are the cruise lines implementing this.

My answer is that its the passengers who are / were stiffing the waiters/stewards.

That's why the gratutity is added.

On RCCL / Carnival / Princess, its the European cruisers, who are feared the most to "Stiff" the waiters and stewards. And with very good reason

 

And by European of course I include the British.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

.

Edited March 18, 2015 by P&O Lynn Knickers
Lynn is the best person in the world.... probally

[BigJH]

I agree with your view, but on the other hand, ask why are the cruise lines implementing this.

My answer is that its the passengers who are / were stiffing the waiters/stewards.

That's why the gratutity is added.

On RCCL / Carnival / Princess, its the European cruisers, who are feared the most to "Stiff" the waiters and stewards. And with very good reason

 

And by European of course I include the British.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

.

That's an interesting viewpoint, and one i can neither agree or disagree with as I have no evidence either way. Us British in general, tend to be more reserved when it comes to rewarding good service, but at the same time we are generally less likely to complain about bad service - something I must admit, I am not afraid to do. However, this does seem to be changing, sometimes for the better, but in a lot of situations, unfortunately for the worse, something we seem to have picked up from across the pond (...where there's blame there's a claim etc...). I am still quite new at cruising, and have yet to come across service that poor that I felt the need to accelerate the auto tip - and long may it stay that way!!!

[Boycey]

Y

P&O do *Not* make up the balance.

They dont have to.

 

 

.

 

You must be quite high up in the Carnival corporate structure to make such an unequivocal statement, yet you self-describe as a lady of leisure.

 

It couldn't be that you're just guessing too, could it?

[P&O Lynn Knickers]

You must be quite high up in the Carnival corporate structure to make such an unequivocal statement, yet you self-describe as a lady of leisure.

 

It couldn't be that you're just guessing too, could it?

 

I am a Lady of leisure : Yes.

Working for Carnival or any of its many companies :, No

Guessing : Not a hope.

 

If you are familiar with any of my post's here on this forum, you will be aware how much I know of what goes on "Within" the cruise industry.

 

 

(One doesnt rise to the bait Boycey )

 

 

 

.

Edited March 18, 2015 by P&O Lynn Knickers
Lynn is a lovely person, kind, attractive, and known for her charity work

[PORT ROYAL]

I am a Lady of leisure : Yes.

Working for Carnival or any of its many companies :, No

Guessing : Not a hope.

 

If you are familiar with any of my post's here on this forum, you will be aware how much I know of what goes on "Within" the cruise industry.

 

 

(One doesnt rise to the bait Boycey )

 

 

 

.

 

Another saucer of milk for Lynn? ;)

[PurpleMoonlight]

I am a Lady of leisure : Yes.

Working for Carnival or any of its many companies :, No

Guessing : Not a hope.

 

If you are familiar with any of my post's here on this forum, you will be aware how much I know of what goes on "Within" the cruise industry.

 

 

(One doesnt rise to the bait Boycey )

 

 

 

.

 

 

If they don't make up the gratuity pool why would an Officer state they do?

[P&O Lynn Knickers]

If they don't make up the gratuity pool why would an Officer state they do?

 

Really ?

Where is that written down ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

.

[PurpleMoonlight]

Really ?

Where is that written down ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

.

 

 

A poster in this thread has claimed they were advised it.

[daiB]

A poster in this thread has claimed they were advised it.

 

 

Perhaps that poster was wrong.

[PurpleMoonlight]

Perhaps that poster was wrong.

 

If P&O don't have to make up the gratuity pool, why do think the staff that benefit from it have to pay any cash gratuity received into it if the passenger removes the auto-gratuity?

[daiB]

If P&O don't have to make up the gratuity pool, why do think the staff that benefit from it have to pay any cash gratuity received into it if the passenger removes the auto-gratuity?

 

So no one member of staff suffers because he/she has cruisers who will not pay.

 

I have never heard from anyone that P&O make up the tips to any level. They pay a bonus over and above. Perhaps this is what was meant.

[PurpleMoonlight]

So no one member of staff suffers because he/she has cruisers who will not pay.

 

 

That's not what P&O claim.

Edited March 18, 2015 by PurpleMoonlight