Disapointted

[HokiePoq]

We were also on the Oosterdam when you were on it. We actually boarded in Auckland on April 5th.

 

The biggest complaint we had was the number of people who contracted the "URI" and were coughing throughout the cruise.

 

One of our cruisers actually named it the Coughingdam.

 

HAL didn't seem to do anything to get control of the problem (other than wash your hands). There was no 48 hour Code Orange and they didn't invoke a Code Red at all during the cruise.

 

People would cough into their hands and then pick up the tongs in the Lido.

 

I've been home for over a week now and I just got over the nagging cough.

 

Same thing happened to me on our last cruise. Took two weeks after getting home not to cough all night. So many people in a closed environment make it difficult not to catch airborne germs....and yes, people don't follow sanitation rules. I try to avoid the buffets as much as I can but got coughed on directly numerous times.

[Randyk47]

With some exceptions in airline and itinerary, finding the best air fare is a maddening experience even when you follow advice like you listed. What makes it even more difficult is the lack of non-stop flights from many airports.

 

Quite honestly I really didn't mean those as recommendatios, they're just the kind of things you hear. It's almost urban legion status as to what day and time of day is best. Certainly there appear to be days like Friday and Saturday where the airlines appear to, maybe even historically have jacked up prices. I recently read an article on some travel blog where the author had supposedly researched trends and whereas the old rule of thumb was that Tuesday was the best day to book a flight it was now Sunday.

 

I know we start watching flights, particularly to Europe where we've been cruising lately, months out. We're looking for a whole host of things like price, departure and arrival times, number of stops/plane changes, connecting airports, connection times, and so on. We usually get it down to two or three options and start watching the price. Trick is that airlines don't have guaranteed fares, once you buy you're pretty well stuck and that makes pulling the purchase trigger nerve racking. My advice....research and plan then patience, perseverance, and a bit of luck.

[qsuzi]

Quite honestly I really didn't mean those as recommendatios, they're just the kind of things you hear. It's almost urban legion status as to what day and time of day is best. Certainly there appear to be days like Friday and Saturday where the airlines appear to, maybe even historically have jacked up prices. I recently read an article on some travel blog where the author had supposedly researched trends and whereas the old rule of thumb was that Tuesday was the best day to book a flight it was now Sunday.

 

I know we start watching flights, particularly to Europe where we've been cruising lately, months out. We're looking for a whole host of things like price, departure and arrival times, number of stops/plane changes, connecting airports, connection times, and so on. We usually get it down to two or three options and start watching the price. Trick is that airlines don't have guaranteed fares, once you buy you're pretty well stuck and that makes pulling the purchase trigger nerve racking. My advice....research and plan then patience, perseverance, and a bit of luck.

 

I subscribe to the website it sounds like you are referring to so have seen the advice you listed and have used it. Once I'm booked with an airline where I'm stuck with the fare, I try not to look to see if the price has changed. :)

[cruz chic]

The airline was British Airways, and since the poster has a Red Sox logo, I'm assuming Boston. Punching in London to Boston, business class a month from now gets £4866, which at current exchange rates is within spitting distance of $7500.

 

I was looking on A well known travel site for a flight From Boston on the 27th returning one week later. The very highest price is $4900 Canadian which would be less than $4000 usd. I haven't got a clue where your price is coming from. This is business class.

Edited May 28, 2015 by cruz chic

[happybeachbum]

I love ships, cruising, and the sea. We've been loving cruising for about 35 years. Our first HAL experience was on the Eurodam in 2010. We thought that perhaps it was the best cruise experience we had had (entertainment wasn't the best though). Food was wonderful. MDR filets & lobster were as good as what was served in Pinnacle.

 

We got off the Noordam April 10, 2015. After this cruise, I was actually entertaining a river cruise for our next cruise! I eat quality food at home and the Noordam did not deliver on that point. My filet did not resemble in any way a filet and certainly did not taste like a filet. My next beef order was not edible. Some nights, there weren't any entrees that appealed to me. One night I was surprised to see liver offered as an entree. That's a first. I did have some good meals though.

 

Ours was an 11 night Caribbean cruise. The ports were great - except Nassau. Wished it had been Half Moon Cay.

 

Ok, like I said, CARIBBEAN CRUISE. No music at the pool for a Caribbean Cruise?! There was a lady who played a steel drum for one hour but she didn't interact at all with the audience. We still remember the name of the steel drum band that played on our honeymoon cruise - Pan Vibes :)

 

However, on this Caribbean cruise --not Art Collectors cruise--there was no shortage of annoying announcements. Art auctions, showings, etc., Bingo, etc. -- all the money makers for the cruiseline. In addition to the constant art announcements, our mailbox was inundated with art flyers all day long. On quality paper. What a WASTE!!

 

We like attending the shows. The singers seemed talented but the PA system made everything sound way too loud, shrill and harsh. So the songs were different each night but the way the sound got delivered made it all sound alike. The CD was pleasant enough but basically an announcer for the shows.

 

By the end of the cruise, my stomach and esophagus felt weird. I thought maybe it was the ship's desalinated water?

 

In closing, here are my thoughts on the current standards regarding price and value:

 

The mainstream lines have built too many ships with too many cabins to fill. Some of these cruises are discounted like crazy. I think the lines are slowly slitting their own throats: Getting rid of live music; building tiny pools that cannot accommodate all the pax wishing to use the pools -- some lines like NCL no longer have the space for decent sized main pools because their extensive suite area takes up so much precious space; purchasing substandard beef, etc.;cutting back on employees making for slow and mediocre service in the MDR. HAL installed 20 new cabins on Noordam's Deck 11 in recent years. Instead, why not add Tamarind restaurant or a comedy club, etc. that everyone can benefit from? However, I do commend HAL for keeping their aft pools and the outside aft area for alfresco dining. One cannot find aft open space on Royal Caribbean for just sitting and enjoying watching the wake.

 

Also deplorable was all the smoke on this cruise. For that reason alone, I would go with Celebrity. Think about it HAL: not all gamblers smoke! I perhaps would have spent a few bucks in the casino had I been able to open my eyes in there without getting a film on my contacts. Also much of the aft pool area was filled with wafting smoke.

 

So, in closing, it wasn't an awful cruise, but it could have been so much nicer. I love the sea, but the rivers are look'n a lot better.

[Randyk47]

Once I'm booked with an airline where I'm stuck with the fare, I try not to look to see if the price has changed. :)

 

Me neither. Good way to potentially make your stomach or head or both hurt. :D

[cruz chic]

I love ships, cruising, and the sea. We've been loving cruising for about 35 years. Our first HAL experience was on the Eurodam in 2010. We thought that perhaps it was the best cruise experience we had had (entertainment wasn't the best though). Food was wonderful. MDR filets & lobster were as good as what was served in Pinnacle.

 

We got off the Noordam April 10, 2015. After this cruise, I was actually entertaining a river cruise for our next cruise! I eat quality food at home and the Noordam did not deliver on that point. My filet did not resemble in any way a filet and certainly did not taste like a filet. My next beef order was not edible. Some nights, there weren't any entrees that appealed to me. One night I was surprised to see liver offered as an entree. That's a first. I did have some good meals though.

 

Ours was an 11 night Caribbean cruise. The ports were great - except Nassau. Wished it had been Half Moon Cay.

 

Ok, like I said, CARIBBEAN CRUISE. No music at the pool for a Caribbean Cruise?! There was a lady who played a steel drum for one hour but she didn't interact at all with the audience. We still remember the name of the steel drum band that played on our honeymoon cruise - Pan Vibes :)

 

However, on this Caribbean cruise --not Art Collectors cruise--there was no shortage of annoying announcements. Art auctions, showings, etc., Bingo, etc. -- all the money makers for the cruiseline. In addition to the constant art announcements, our mailbox was inundated with art flyers all day long. On quality paper. What a WASTE!!

 

We like attending the shows. The singers seemed talented but the PA system made everything sound way too loud, shrill and harsh. So the songs were different each night but the way the sound got delivered made it all sound alike. The CD was pleasant enough but basically an announcer for the shows.

 

By the end of the cruise, my stomach and esophagus felt weird. I thought maybe it was the ship's desalinated water?

 

In closing, here are my thoughts on the current standards regarding price and value:

 

The mainstream lines have built too many ships with too many cabins to fill. Some of these cruises are discounted like crazy. I think the lines are slowly slitting their own throats: Getting rid of live music; building tiny pools that cannot accommodate all the pax wishing to use the pools -- some lines like NCL no longer have the space for decent sized main pools because their extensive suite area takes up so much precious space; purchasing substandard beef, etc.;cutting back on employees making for slow and mediocre service in the MDR. HAL installed 20 new cabins on Noordam's Deck 11 in recent years. Instead, why not add Tamarind restaurant or a comedy club, etc. that everyone can benefit from? However, I do commend HAL for keeping their aft pools and the outside aft area for alfresco dining. One cannot find aft open space on Royal Caribbean for just sitting and enjoying watching the wake.

 

Also deplorable was all the smoke on this cruise. For that reason alone, I would go with Celebrity. Think about it HAL: not all gamblers smoke! I perhaps would have spent a few bucks in the casino had I been able to open my eyes in there without getting a film on my contacts. Also much of the aft pool area was filled with wafting smoke.

 

So, in closing, it wasn't an awful cruise, but it could have been so much nicer. I love the sea, but the rivers are look'n a lot better.

 

I was on the same cruise. It just goes to show how different experiences can be. I thought the food was quite good and didn't remember formal nights being the cheapie special they were on the Veendam this month. I did get a bargain for once on this cruise so maybe my expectations were different. I hate smoke and didn't find it at all bad on this cruise but I did spend a fair amount if time in the cabanas. I'm quite confident the food was much worse on that cruise then in 2010.

[GlennG]

This thread has become quite lengthy and people have made incredible and heartfelt responses to the OP. The OP, a four star Mariner with Holland America Line, was quite clear in articulating his disappointment with HAL. To review, he was disappointed with the unsatisfactory cleaning of his cabin, the unsatisfactory service in the dining room, the unsatisfactory quality of food, poor lectures, and overpriced tours. Other contributors have mentioned concerns about unsatisfactory modifications to ship infrastructure. In other threads, we read about dissatisfaction with HAL's smoking policy on the balconies, and regular problems with air conditioning and plumbing. It's reasonable to conclude that HAL has gone downhill. We are told by many posters that this is the case with all of the major cruise lines. We are also told that we are still getting good value for our money since cruise fares have not increased with inflation. I'm likely an out-of-the-mainstream thinker, but I don't think that I'm getting a bargain when I have to endure sub-standard food, sub-standard service, and ship infrastructure that will not support reliable air conditioning and plumbing. Here are the questions. Is the only alternative for us is to vote with our money? Should we be investing our vacation dollars in more up-scale cruise lines? Are there any practical ways of informing HAL of our current displeasure? As a participant in this forum, I know that I'm a part of a small sailing minority. I, very much doubt, that that senior personnel, within HAL, read the stuff on these boards. Can I get some suggestions on where we should go from here?

[kazu]

This thread has become quite lengthy and people have made incredible and heartfelt responses to the OP. The OP, a four star Mariner with Holland America Line, was quite clear in articulating his disappointment with HAL. To review, he was disappointed with the unsatisfactory cleaning of his cabin, the unsatisfactory service in the dining room, the unsatisfactory quality of food, poor lectures, and overpriced tours. Other contributors have mentioned concerns about unsatisfactory modifications to ship infrastructure. In other threads, we read about dissatisfaction with HAL's smoking policy on the balconies, and regular problems with air conditioning and plumbing. It's reasonable to conclude that HAL has gone downhill. We are told by many posters that this is the case with all of the major cruise lines. We are also told that we are still getting good value for our money since cruise fares have not increased with inflation. I'm likely an out-of-the-mainstream thinker, but I don't think that I'm getting a bargain when I have to endure sub-standard food, sub-standard service, and ship infrastructure that will not support reliable air conditioning and plumbing. Here are the questions. Is the only alternative for us is to vote with our money? Should we be investing our vacation dollars in more up-scale cruise lines? Are there any practical ways of informing HAL of our current displeasure? As a participant in this forum, I know that I'm a part of a small sailing minority. I, very much doubt, that that senior personnel, within HAL, read the stuff on these boards. Can I get some suggestions on where we should go from here?

Of course there are. You can email HAL with your concerns after a cruise and your real life experience and disappointments.

 

Not everyone is disappointed. Not everyone has issues.

 

and yes, you can vote with your wallet and try some other line that is more upscale and pay for it. it's not a hard choice IMO.

 

Overall, we have been very happy with HAL and I have sailed on her since 1987 so, yes, I have seen the changes.

 

Some things I miss - some things I don't. My main concern is the cruise I am on and the quality I get. that is true whether I sail HAL, Oceania or any other line. Certain expectations do come with the "publicity" they do and I think that can lead anyone to disappointment on any line.

[qsuzi]

This thread has become quite lengthy and people have made incredible and heartfelt responses to the OP. The OP, a four star Mariner with Holland America Line, was quite clear in articulating his disappointment with HAL. To review, he was disappointed with the unsatisfactory cleaning of his cabin, the unsatisfactory service in the dining room, the unsatisfactory quality of food, poor lectures, and overpriced tours. Other contributors have mentioned concerns about unsatisfactory modifications to ship infrastructure. In other threads, we read about dissatisfaction with HAL's smoking policy on the balconies, and regular problems with air conditioning and plumbing. It's reasonable to conclude that HAL has gone downhill. We are told by many posters that this is the case with all of the major cruise lines. We are also told that we are still getting good value for our money since cruise fares have not increased with inflation. I'm likely an out-of-the-mainstream thinker, but I don't think that I'm getting a bargain when I have to endure sub-standard food, sub-standard service, and ship infrastructure that will not support reliable air conditioning and plumbing. Here are the questions. Is the only alternative for us is to vote with our money? Should we be investing our vacation dollars in more up-scale cruise lines? Are there any practical ways of informing HAL of our current displeasure? As a participant in this forum, I know that I'm a part of a small sailing minority. I, very much doubt, that that senior personnel, within HAL, read the stuff on these boards. Can I get some suggestions on where we should go from here?

All I can go by is the improvements in the last few years that Princess has made and I saw an overall better product when talking about condition of the cabins and common areas. Also better service overall. But I am only judging by one HAL cruise and there are many of you who have many more HAL cruises and for much longer periods of time.

Edited May 28, 2015 by qsuzi

[kazu]

I was looking on A well known travel site for a flight From Boston on the 27th returning one week later. The very highest price is $4900 Canadian which would be less than $4000 usd. I haven't got a clue where your price is coming from. This is business class.

 

the person you quoted was referencing a pounds price so I am guessing they are in the U.K. or Europe. Pricing is much different there.

[cruz chic]

This thread has become quite lengthy and people have made incredible and heartfelt responses to the OP. The OP, a four star Mariner with Holland America Line, was quite clear in articulating his disappointment with HAL. To review, he was disappointed with the unsatisfactory cleaning of his cabin, the unsatisfactory service in the dining room, the unsatisfactory quality of food, poor lectures, and overpriced tours. Other contributors have mentioned concerns about unsatisfactory modifications to ship infrastructure. In other threads, we read about dissatisfaction with HAL's smoking policy on the balconies, and regular problems with air conditioning and plumbing. It's reasonable to conclude that HAL has gone downhill. We are told by many posters that this is the case with all of the major cruise lines. We are also told that we are still getting good value for our money since cruise fares have not increased with inflation. I'm likely an out-of-the-mainstream thinker, but I don't think that I'm getting a bargain when I have to endure sub-standard food, sub-standard service, and ship infrastructure that will not support reliable air conditioning and plumbing. Here are the questions. Is the only alternative for us is to vote with our money? Should we be investing our vacation dollars in more up-scale cruise lines? Are there any practical ways of informing HAL of our current displeasure? As a participant in this forum, I know that I'm a part of a small sailing minority. I, very much doubt, that that senior personnel, within HAL, read the stuff on these boards. Can I get some suggestions on where we should go from here?

I do believe that hal reads these boards. On occasion they have responded on here and made some changes. The two that come to mind are the medal program and the back peddling with the wine policy. I think the only thing a person can do is leave the line. I still think there is enough good to stick around but I'm not going to pretend that everything that hal does is the best. There are enough posters on here already that can see no wrong.

[cruz chic]

the person you quoted was referencing a pounds price so I am guessing they are in the U.K. or Europe. Pricing is much different there.

 

Beats me. It just seems that a few on this board just love to try to put me in my place. I'm wrong often. When I'm not I'm not going away without stating what I see. Thx for your input.

[kazu]

Would love to get some feedback on what others think are the most effective ways for informing HAL of what changes we feel are most important and influencing that those changes occur? Have the ways suggested by Kazu resulted in specific improvements? All I can go by is the improvements in the last few years that Princess has made and I saw an overall better product when talking about condition of the cabins and common areas. Also better service overall. But I am only judging by one HAL cruise and there are many of you who have many more HAL cruises and for much longer periods of time.

 

I do know some of it makes a difference. I was one of many that emailed the officeof the president on the wine policy. It was changed.

 

I emailed immediately when I had such bad service in the PG on our Maasdam cruise and subsequent cruisers reported it was great so it was definitely fixed.

 

Does it solve all problems? I don't know. But if the company doesn't know they can't fix it.

 

If enough people voice the same concern, I would like to think it is listened to.

 

Take a look at the NCL announcement above - I just posted they rescinded the decision. They heard from their clients and listened.

[qsuzi]

I do believe that hal reads these boards. On occasion they have responded on here and made some changes. The two that come to mind are the medal program and the back peddling with the wine policy. I think the only thing a person can do is leave the line. I still think there is enough good to stick around but I'm not going to pretend that everything that hal does is the best. There are enough posters on here already that can see no wrong.

 

Well that is a sobering conclusion and ultimately what may become the choice. Whatever cruise line I sail, I will give written and verbal feedback on board when appropriate and upon return. HAL is generally more expensive for balcony and suite cabins (at least in the itineraries / areas I choose), so it seems like there would be more pressure for them to make needed changes.

Edited May 28, 2015 by qsuzi

[qsuzi]

I do know some of it makes a difference. I was one of many that emailed the officeof the president on the wine policy. It was changed.

 

I emailed immediately when I had such bad service in the PG on our Maasdam cruise and subsequent cruisers reported it was great so it was definitely fixed.

 

Does it solve all problems? I don't know. But if the company doesn't know they can't fix it.

 

If enough people voice the same concern, I would like to think it is listened to.

 

Take a look at the NCL announcement above - I just posted they rescinded the decision. They heard from their clients and listened.

Excellent Kazu. That is how change does happen. Not all the time and sometimes slower than we like. But really there are things we value about HAL and why we choose them. We are invested in it staying that way and continuing to select HAL.

Edited May 28, 2015 by qsuzi

[cruz chic]

I always give feedback on my after cruise survey. Maybe 2 times I've been mad enough to write. Sometimes things get fixed by complaints, sometimes by circumstance. I think they do have to hear it enough and realize that it will hurt their bottom line before they made a change.

[zerbot]

I was looking on A well known travel site for a flight From Boston on the 27th returning one week later. The very highest price is $4900 Canadian which would be less than $4000 usd. I haven't got a clue where your price is coming from. This is business class.

 

The British Airways site. I picked June 28th (exactly one month out), but the pricing was the same for all the surrounding days. I priced a one way flight, not a round trip. It looks like one way is a lot more expensive. Wow. They really do that. Sheesh.

[cruz chic]

The British Airways site. I picked June 28th (exactly one month out), but the pricing was the same for all the surrounding days. I priced a one way flight, not a round trip. It looks like one way is a lot more expensive. Wow. They really do that. Sheesh.

one way is often more expensive then round trip.

[zerbot]

one way is often more expensive then round trip.

 

How long have they been doing that? I haven't flown in over a decade, but I do remember when I got a call that my mother had collapsed and been taken to the hospital, I had to book a last minute flight, and round trip was definitely not cheaper than one way. I didn't know when I'd be returning so I just booked one way, and got extra special TSA treatment thrown in (a big reason why I haven't flown in over a decade).

 

I can't imagine a potential hijacker spending more on a one way ticket that will also get a helluva lot more scrutiny at security.

 

What do they do if you buy a round trip and just don't show up for the second half?

[Marigold252]

Well that is a sobering conclusion and ultimately what may become the choice. Whatever cruise line I sail, I will give written and verbal feedback on board when appropriate and upon return. HAL is generally more expensive for balcony and suite cabins (at least in the itineraries / areas I choose), so it seems like there would be more pressure for them to make needed changes.

 

We did 2 14 day cruises with HAL in 2014. Loved them both, even with code red on most of the first one. But we cruise for the ports, and don't get too bent out of shape with little things that aren't perfect. But when a HAL shorex had the worst tour guide ever I put in a complaint to the tour director. Hope the info was acted on. The only thing I can honestly say has "gone downhill" recently is the long time it takes for dinner in the MDR.

[cruz chic]

How long have they been doing that? I haven't flown in over a decade, but I do remember when I got a call that my mother had collapsed and been taken to the hospital, I had to book a last minute flight, and round trip was definitely not cheaper than one way. I didn't know when I'd be returning so I just booked one way, and got extra special TSA treatment thrown in (a big reason why I haven't flown in over a decade).

 

I can't imagine a potential hijacker spending more on a one way ticket that will also get a helluva lot more scrutiny at security.

 

What do they do if you buy a round trip and just don't show up for the second half?

 

As far as I know it's been a few years. I've tried pricing one way and so have friends and it seems to be this way when it relates to overseas. It doesn't seem to happen within Canada or the USA although one way seems to be more expensive than half of the round trip. I seem to recall a thread on cc when someone was considering booking the round then using half. Iirc the common thread was that would not be a good idea and your flight could be cancelled. I have no idea what would happen in reality because I haven't done it.

[ellieanne]

How long have they been doing that? I haven't flown in over a decade, but I do remember when I got a call that my mother had collapsed and been taken to the hospital, I had to book a last minute flight, and round trip was definitely not cheaper than one way. I didn't know when I'd be returning so I just booked one way, and got extra special TSA treatment thrown in (a big reason why I haven't flown in over a decade).

 

I can't imagine a potential hijacker spending more on a one way ticket that will also get a helluva lot more scrutiny at security.

 

What do they do if you buy a round trip and just don't show up for the second half?

 

The couple of times I have done this, I just lost the money for the return portion of the fare. As long as you show up for the outbound flight it's okay. If you don't take the outbound flight, your reservation is cancelled. But if you miss the inbound/return portion, there's not much to be lost but the cost of the fare.

 

I never set out to miss the return portion of the flights, the airlines screwed me over. My flight was late into LAX, so I missed the connection. And there were NO agents anywhere to help rebook or get passengers on other flights. Thankfully my parents had booked me on another airline on one of the last available flights out so I just collected my luggage and forfeited the remaining return leg.

 

The other time it was a similar situation, though the initial return flight was cancelled (mechanical issues so the airline says) and there was no way I would get home in time to make an appointment, so I just forfeited the return ticket and booked a one-way ticket on another airline.

 

As long as you take the outbound flights, it's okay to forfeit the return portion of the ticket.

[SoCal Cruiser78]

...As long as you take the outbound flights, it's okay to forfeit the return portion of the ticket.

 

I have read that some airlines have threatened to ban passengers who do this from making future ticket purchases, but I haven't heard of any actually doing it yet. The same with "hidden city" ticketing, where passengers disembark at a connecting city rather than changing planes. I mention this as it is always a possibility that such a ban could be invoked at some point.

[ellieanne]

I have read that some airlines have threatened to ban passengers who do this from making future ticket purchases, but I haven't heard of any actually doing it yet. The same with "hidden city" ticketing, where passengers disembark at a connecting city rather than changing planes. I mention this as it is always a possibility that such a ban could be invoked at some point.

 

I've read that too, but I'm not really sure how enforceable it is, especially since both times I've done it, it was really the airline's handling of the situation that forced me to make other arrangements. I seriously doubt the airlines will be changing the way they do business so I'm not sure that banning future ticket sales is legal or enforceable.

 

And aside from the fact that the airlines themselves mess it up, sometimes missing the return flight is through no fault of the passenger's -- there were delays getting to the airport due to situations on the ground. or it could be the passenger became too ill to travel. There are all kinds of valid reasons for forfeiting return flights. I would never book a round-trip ticket with the intention of not completing both flights, but things can and do happen to prevent you from doing so.