Future HAL builds?

[Hlitner]

48 minutes ago, NavArch64 said:

Since RCG, CCL and NCLH have taken on so much debt to ensure liquidity, and therefore have limited capital investment capability for now, I would be surprised if they bid for Crystal or its assets. However, MSC is an interesting possibility. Since their very large global container ship business is generating cash right now, they may have an ability to bid for Crystal or its assets that the other three do not. Also, since they want to start a high-end brand, they may find the Crystal brand to be appealing. Who knows ... we shall see.

We have often posted about MSCs underlying ownership (primarily a single Italian family) and very strong case/financial position.  In fact, in the past few weeks MSC's container ship company has become the #1 largest container shipping company in the world.  The container industry has become a true cash cow in the past few years and gives MSC the ability to both internally (and externally) finance other ventures.  But MSC is now in the process of starting a luxury (or near luxury) cruise line that will initially have 4 new ships (currently being constructed or under contract) in the 63,000 ton class.

 

So, while MSC is certainly in a position to purchase Crystal it may not fit their business plan,  On the other hand they could certainly integrate the 3 Crystal ships into their new luxury line which would leave them with 7 ships (once the 4 new builds are delivered).   One other MSC tidbit is that on our MSC cruises we have met quite a few staff who used to work at HAL...including one old friend.  Our own experience with MSC (we only book their Yacht Club) has caused us to recommend to some friends that they might want to try the MSC Yacht Club.  But MSC does desperately need to make some improvements in their shore-based management/customer service and improve training of their onboard hotel staff.  Like any company that goes through rapid expansion, MSC has obviously had problems finding enough qualified service staff.   And that is another reason we favor their luxury oriented Yacht Club where they have generally assigned some of their best staff.

 

Hank

[chengkp75]

11 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

On the other hand they could certainly integrate the 3 Crystal ships into their new luxury line which would leave them with 7 ships (once the 4 new builds are delivered).

From a cost/revenue standpoint, I don't see them interested, in 18 & 26 year old ships, even charging luxury rates.  The new Endeavour, could be attractive, if they want to go the expedition route, charging expedition rates to cover the construction costs.  And the river cruising boats would be another new market for them, and I'm not sure they are looking that way.

 

And, while freight rates are high now, this is a traditionally cyclic market, with booms and busts, so they could be looking at falling rates if inflation slows demand, and crew start getting vaccinated and capacity outruns demand.

[rkacruiser]

7 hours ago, Hlitner said:

 One other MSC tidbit is that on our MSC cruises we have met quite a few staff who used to work at HAL

 

The CD on MSC Meraviglia in January, 2020 was Gene Young, a respected and retired HAL CD.  MSC was able to lure him out of retirement and he did an excellent job.  He even had a special program in the main theater during an afternoon at sea when he demonstrated that his singing voice remains as great as it was.  

[rkacruiser]

22 hours ago, Hlitner said:

That did get a laugh from both DW and myself :).  Not only would you often not find Senior Officers at the Mariner's Luncheons, but you would seldom find DW and myself 🙂

 

Pleased to provide some humor for your wife and you.  But, maybe you missed the points I was trying to make?

 

Some Senior Officers do attend the Mariner Luncheons.  Is it as frequent as it once was?  Maybe not.  But, if one has had conversations with these individuals, the micro-management that they are enduring from Corporate along with the accompanying paperwork may require their attention more than hosting a table at the Mariner Luncheon.  My second point (and the most important from my perspective as a guest) is a Master who is better suited to be the Master of a ship carrying cattle from port A to port B.  With a Hotel Director who seemed to share that mind set.  

 

23 hours ago, Hlitner said:

When we first reached the 4 Star level we went to a few of those luncheons are were underwhelmed with the menu

 

During my most recent HAL cruises, the menu has improved.  But, my wine glass doesn't seem to be refilled as often as it once was.  

 

22 hours ago, RuthC said:

My husband was so proud receiving his that I buried it with him.

 

That is a helpful suggestion for me.  It would be a better use of those medallions than what my family would do with them.  

[kangforpres]

Crystal has Suspended Operations for 90 days to do Financial reasons...that info came out today and can be easily confirmed with a simple search. So I'm wondering what brands in the CCL group would be sacrificed for the survival of the company? There are some on CC who seem to have a pretty good knowledge of their financial situation.

 

With the big 3 all swimming in debt and more short term cancellations being announced every day it would seem MSC with their Cargo business would be in position to acquire others assets if the saw it beneficial.

 

OK, I'm trying to look on the bright side and booked a RCI Casino offer today for Alaska in May an Ocean View for 2 for just taxes and fees, list price is $3300.

 

-Paul

[rkacruiser]

16 minutes ago, kangforpres said:

So I'm wondering what brands in the CCL group would be sacrificed for the survival of the company?

 

Foolish to do so in order to acquire either the Crystal ships or the brand in my opinion.  Some posters see the "Crystal brand" more significantly important as a luxury brand than I do.  Silverseas, Seabourn:  these are the stand alone luxury cruise lines that I think of when I consider such a cruise category. 

 

17 minutes ago, kangforpres said:

it would seem MSC with their Cargo business would be in position to acquire others assets if the saw it beneficial.

 

They have the $$, but Crystal Symphony and Crystal Serenity does not seem to me to fit into the MSC portfolio.  

 

Hapag-Lloyd has not been mentioned during this discussion of the Crystal ships.  They might fit into the Hapag-Lloyd fleet better than any of the others that have been mentioned.    

[notladjr]

Unlike apparently the vast majority of HAL cruisers I would love to see him add some larger ships. I don't understand the fascination with small or mid size ships but to each his own. I think HAL could do larger ships with more room for additional amenties like additional eating options, etc while still maintaining the "classic cruising" vibe.

Unlike many who cruise HAL because they have smaller ships I cruise HAL some despite the fact they have smaller ships. I love Half Moon Cay and BB Kings Blues Club. For those reasons alone I will always cruise HAL some. In two days I board the smallest ship  I have ever cruised on for 14 nights, HAL's Zuiderdam. Looking forward to the great HAL crews and good cuisine but wish it was bigger!

[Mary229]

11 hours ago, notladjr said:

I don't understand the fascination with small or mid size ships but to each his own.

Part of the fascination is the smaller ships allow for more interesting, long itineraries.  The smaller ship can go to ports larger ships cannot navigate and long detailed itineraries will never draw a crowd of 6000😆.   I agree a larger ship which maintained the population density and crew to passenger ratio would not necessarily be bad - but that is not my experience.