FCC *CANADIANS* - illegal to expire?

[kluv2cruz]

Does anyone have wisdom about Consumer Protection and whether FCC are like a gift certificate or canceled airfare that’s gone into a travel bank which is illegal to have an expiry date in Canada?
 

Seems to me this is my money I paid for a cruise and it can’t just disappear with an expiry date, but I don’t know where to look for information to support this. I’m in BC and I know BC consumer protection act prohibits gift cards from having an expiry date.

 

Thanks for any wisdom. Mine are Celebrity. Cross posted in Celebrity area too.

[Fouremco]

4 minutes ago, kluv2cruz said:

Does anyone have wisdom about Consumer Protection and whether FCC are like a gift certificate or canceled airfare that’s gone into a travel bank which is illegal to have an expiry date in Canada?
 

Seems to me this is my money I paid for a cruise and it can’t just disappear with an expiry date, but I don’t know where to look for information to support this. I’m in BC and I know BC consumer protection act prohibits gift cards from having an expiry date.

 

Thanks for any wisdom. Mine are Celebrity. Cross posted in Celebrity area too.

There are a good number of issues at play here, in particular the circumstances under which the FCC was issued. For example, for much of 2020 when Celebrity was cancelling cruises, you had the option of a full refund or an FCC in a higher amount. If you chose to go with the higher value FCC and accepted the terms and conditions applying to the FCC, I'm not sure that you would be protected. 

 

Of course, the other main issue is that you are dealing with a US-based company, and I don't know whether related Canadian legislation can be applied extraterritorially.  

[bennybear]

32 minutes ago, kluv2cruz said:

Does anyone have wisdom about Consumer Protection and whether FCC are like a gift certificate or canceled airfare that’s gone into a travel bank which is illegal to have an expiry date in Canada?
 

Seems to me this is my money I paid for a cruise and it can’t just disappear with an expiry date, but I don’t know where to look for information to support this. I’m in BC and I know BC consumer protection act prohibits gift cards from having an expiry date.

 

Thanks for any wisdom. Mine are Celebrity. Cross posted in Celebrity area too.

This is a very interesting question. I have read that some cruise lines, ie Princess have refunded after the fact.  We are in the very same boat, lol!  We have been told that bonus credits will expire the end of the year, but looks like the original amount will be rolled over to 2023.  Seems HAL is being quite stringent in this regard about not extending credits further.  
I asked this very question of Gabor Lukacs of Canadian air passenger rights and he thought your provincial legislation should apply.  
It is also  difficult with the level four warning for cruises, not sure when that will change. Also with the world situation, in our case we need to make a decision on an Israel cruise in early May and final payment is due now.  It seems some cruise lines are playing a game of chicken.  Currently my understanding is that cruise ships cannot visit Israel, will that change by May?  Who knows, but it’s a big gamble to increase the already large credits I have. 

[kluv2cruz]

Thanks fouremco and bennybear. Fouremco, I had so many cruises cancelled and transferred to other cruises then canceled etc that I’ve lost track of the source of the original FCC. Before I reached out to Celebrity, I wanted some facts because I know they’re going to say I need to use it by Dec 31/22, or lose it, and that’s not the answer I want - it’s only $600 thank goodness, but I’m pretty sure it’s a deposit I made on a cruise for DH and I, and that’s the hitch- I don’t see him sailing Celebrity by Dec 31/22 (too darn $$$). Fouremco, I was going to reach out to Gabor too! Thought I’d ask here first.

[em-sk]

20 hours ago, kluv2cruz said:

Does anyone have wisdom about Consumer Protection and whether FCC are like a gift certificate or canceled airfare that’s gone into a travel bank which is illegal to have an expiry date in Canada?
 

Seems to me this is my money I paid for a cruise and it can’t just disappear with an expiry date, but I don’t know where to look for information to support this. I’m in BC and I know BC consumer protection act prohibits gift cards from having an expiry date.

 

Thanks for any wisdom. Mine are Celebrity. Cross posted in Celebrity area too.

 

I think you need to look at where the certificate was issued and the transaction occurred.  If it occurred on the ship then your likely protected by consumer law in the country of the ships flag.  Panama, Bermuda etc.  In the case of Celebrity most of their ships are registered in Malta.  I don't know what protections exist in that country.

 

Best bet is seeing if they have extended them or else doing a booking and changing it when you get closer to knowing what to do next.

 

[broberts]

Would it make a difference if a Canadian TA was involved?

[Fouremco]

1 hour ago, broberts said:

Would it make a difference if a Canadian TA was involved?

That's a interesting question, but I suspect not as Celebrity issues the FCC's, not the TA. When we had a cancelled cruise, Celebrity emailed us directly with the FCC's, completely bypassing our Canadian TA. 

[kluv2cruz]

Thanks all… i do have a Canadian TA. And I think even if I book a sailing then cancel, it falls off the table. I don’t think husband will get on a celebrity ship before expiry and they won’t let me use it on my upcoming celebrity sailing with a friend as it’s in DH name. I have some work to do - need to pin down exactly how it arose. I know it’s flowed in and out of about 3-4 cruises which is muddying things. Thanks. 

[em-sk]

12 hours ago, broberts said:

Would it make a difference if a Canadian TA was involved?

 

If you purchased it through a TA in Canada then Canadian laws would apply as the transaction occurred in Canada.  If you used it to buy a cruise and then subsequently canceled my guess is Canadian laws would apply but not certain.  

 

Most provinces also have insurance programs that the TA are forced to pay into that also provides some level of protection not certain if this case would apply.

[em-sk]

7 hours ago, kluv2cruz said:

Thanks all… i do have a Canadian TA. And I think even if I book a sailing then cancel, it falls off the table. I don’t think husband will get on a celebrity ship before expiry and they won’t let me use it on my upcoming celebrity sailing with a friend as it’s in DH name. I have some work to do - need to pin down exactly how it arose. I know it’s flowed in and out of about 3-4 cruises which is muddying things. Thanks. 

 

Some times the third person in the cabin gets a very deep discount.  If you booked three people and one backed out at the last minute that does not stop the other two from enjoying their cruise.

 

 

[cdn_tbird]

20 hours ago, kluv2cruz said:

Thanks all… i do have a Canadian TA. And I think even if I book a sailing then cancel, it falls off the table. I don’t think husband will get on a celebrity ship before expiry and they won’t let me use it on my upcoming celebrity sailing with a friend as it’s in DH name. I have some work to do - need to pin down exactly how it arose. I know it’s flowed in and out of about 3-4 cruises which is muddying things. Thanks. 

I know that everyone is well intentioned and their advise makes sense. That said, this is a legal matter and quite honestly, you should be reaching out to the appropriate BC gov't dept and travel agency council for their guidance because that's what matters most. Once you have that information, then speak with X or your TA.

 

I believe the rules with the FCC are they have to be used for a cruise that occurs either by Dec. 31/22 or 1 year from date of canceled cruise whichever is later. So maybe there is time for DH to change their mind. The other thing I'm not sure of is, would the 1 year from cancelled cruise timer reset to be 1 year from the last cruise you used the FCC for. If it is, you could theoretically book a cruise for Dec then cancel it and have until Dec 2023 to use the FCC.

 

Just my 2 cents and I could be totally off base. Hope you get the answer you're looking for.

[kluv2cruz]

Thanks all. 

[bennybear]

27 minutes ago, kluv2cruz said:

Thanks all. 

Let us know how it works out, please. 

[Princess Fi]

We have successfully had FCCs transferred to another person. There is a specific process but that may be your best option. 

[iancal]

We had a completely different experience with UK based TUI.   Probably the largest travel provider in the world....cruise ships, airline, etc

 

We purchased a late booking Mexico AI stay from them.  We have dealt with them numerous times.  On line and remotely through a UK TA.  We were issued a credit in April 2020.  And advised that if we did not request a refund in the interim our money would be automatically refunded in Oct 2021.

 

In between that time we had regular emails. at least every two months reminding us of the credit, the amount, and the terms.  Sure enough last Oct we got notice that a refund cheque had been cut and mailed to us.  Eight days later it arrived in the post.  Never once did we have to contact them.

 

Not certain if this was because of UK legislation, their tourist industry protection or some obscure EU regulation.  Whatever it was it certainly worked for us.

[bennybear]

British and European legislation is quite different and more consumer friendly.  We easily got our money back from BA in 2020. 
 

But it would be good to know about FCC as they are issued as credits for cruises so not sure how Canadian legislation would apply.  Wondering if the Facebook group Canadian cruisers may be of any assistance?  

[kluv2cruz]

Sheepishly, I now realize we received this as a credit on our charge card 2 mos ago. This arose originally from a couple of years ago when I paid a deposit of $960 for a Celebrity cruise that was subsequently canceled re COVID. At the time, they gave us 1.25, or $600 each FCC. I moved it 3 times to different canceled cruises. The last move was to a cruise in 2022. In the end, DH isn’t able to go on this cruise so my friend is going with me, and DH’s $600 ($480x1.25) was moved 2 times more to future cruises. Reality is DH won’t be sailing Celebrity (we’re west coast Canada so very few affordable Celebrity sailings to chose from, and well, work gets in the way) by Dec 31/22 when this falls off the table. So, I now remember somehow my TA was able to get his $480 refunded. My $480 is on this cruise with my friend. Thanks all… a good exercise in thinking through what could happen with expiring credits.

[Fouremco]

Thanks for getting back to us with the update. Yours is an excellent example of why I use a spreadsheet to track all financial interactions with Celebrity. 

[kluv2cruz]

We’re a little computer challenged at the moment. I track in notes on my iPhone but gosh there were so many cancellations and rebookings and life was also happening all around this… so yes, a spreadsheet would be better than iPhone notes!

[broberts]

1 hour ago, kluv2cruz said:

We’re a little computer challenged at the moment. I track in notes on my iPhone but gosh there were so many cancellations and rebookings and life was also happening all around this… so yes, a spreadsheet would be better than iPhone notes!

 

Don't know about iPhones, but I just discovered that Microsoft has a spreadsheet app for my android phone.

[Fouremco]

22 minutes ago, broberts said:

 

Don't know about iPhones, but I just discovered that Microsoft has a spreadsheet app for my android phone.

Yup, iPhones too. They have an app version of Numbers, Apple's spreadsheet that syncs across all your Apple devices.

[cdn_tbird]

21 hours ago, Fouremco said:

Yup, iPhones too. They have an app version of Numbers, Apple's spreadsheet that syncs across all your Apple devices.

Microsoft Excel is also available for iOS devices, but I'm not sure I'd want to try and navigate a spreadsheet on such a small screen. Personally, I use Google Keep as my note app. It's available on iOS as well. It will sync your notes across platforms which for me is a bonus for me as I use both an iPhone & Android device.

[broberts]

1 hour ago, cdn_tbird said:

Microsoft Excel is also available for iOS devices, but I'm not sure I'd want to try and navigate a spreadsheet on such a small screen. Personally, I use Google Keep as my note app. It's available on iOS as well. It will sync your notes across platforms which for me is a bonus for me as I use both an iPhone & Android device.

 

I was leery about about the small screen, but on my A52 5G it is reasonably easy. Wouldn't want to use it for anything complex, but a basic table that isn't too long is no problem.