Horrible experience onboard Marina

[Hlitner]

34 minutes ago, Ride-The-Waves said:

I don't get it.  Why mock seniors?

 

Our one cruise on Marina resulted in "never again" on Oceania.  Too many people who believe they are "entitled" to do what ever they want anywhere on the ship.  This is  not "refined" cruising.  The alcohol policy provides for too much "lubrication" for enjoying dinner in a specialty restaurant.  One group of 2 couples came to dinner carrying three drinks each.  Not enjoyable sitting next to them.  Found many fellow passengers very critical of others.  Not a welcoming cruise line.

 

I get it, that you were on a cruise with a group of unpleasant ship mates.  But lets put this in perspective.  Just about every cruise line either sells drink packages or includes alcohol.  "O" is no different from other lines when it comes to this issue.  Over our 50 years of extensive cruising, we have seen bad drunks on many cruises with many cruise lines.  It is inevitable, and most ships depend on staff and their security folks to deescalate or deal with these kind of folks.  But on most cruise lines, the security folks are few (and far between).

 

So what to do?  We think the best solution (for most passengers) is to put some distance between yourself and unpleasant folks.  If the situation becomes completely untenable, you might want to quietly get to a crew member and call the situation to their attention, or get to a phone can call the ship's emergency number (often 911) and ask for security.  

 

Over the years we have often been critical of various cruise lines (which has gotten us flamed here on CC) but we call it like we see it.  But, other than mentioning the problem, we have never suggested that folks avoid a cruise line because of a bad batch of passengers on a cruise.  It can happen on any ship or any line.

 

Hank

[DrHemlock]

1 hour ago, Ride-The-Waves said:

One group of 2 couples came to dinner carrying three drinks each.

Now that I'd like to see.  (...and be able to do! 🤣)

[Hambagahle]

On 5/28/2023 at 6:15 PM, ldtr said:

Note that they chose to move your party, not quiet the other party. So apparently the other parties behavior was acceptable to the restaurant. They solved the conflict by moving you.

Restaurant management is not a police force.  And they really cannot tell people to quiet down unless they are clearly drunk.  Resolving the problem by moving the person who complains makes sense to me, if a move is possible.    (And it is also possible that these people were slightly deaf.  We have friends who are they speak very loudly.  We like them and have known them for years but it is hard for us!!)

[Sabbycat]

On 5/28/2023 at 6:35 PM, ldtr said:

While am basically a fairly quiet person in public areas and also tend to enjoy listening to music there are a couple of things that I find interesting in this stream.

 

1. is there a reasonable expectation of quiet in a bar/lounge? While certainly one can have those expectations in a theater or a concert. This location was neither. It was a lounge, a location at which socializing is not uncommon.

 

2. Who is the judge of when socializing goes from good fun to rude behavior. Certainly if one is insulting other passengers it is rude. But is it really if people are talking, joking around and laughing? Is there a magical decibel level where the line is crossed? 

 

There are times when I am annoyed by the behavior of others. However, In  lounge, a social environment why is my opinion on behavior any more credible then theirs.

 

You could take 50 passengers and get 50 different opinions on proper behavior.

Generally it is expected that you speak quietly when there is a musical performance in a venue, regardless of the venue. Manners dictates. Alas, manners are in short supply these days. 

 

Rude behavior is being so loud that one disrupts the enjoyment of others. So yes, loud behavior is considered rude.

[jonthomas]

Over 50 cruises with celeb, way too many drunks, belly flop contests, Walmart parade of the poorly dressed, the poor taste newly wed not so newly wed game...horribly behaved kids and their parents...if hating all that makes me a snob, then that is what I am and proud of it...

So glad that this element sticks to lines other than O.

[Sabbycat]

2 hours ago, jonthomas said:

Over 50 cruises with celeb, way too many drunks, belly flop contests, Walmart parade of the poorly dressed, the poor taste newly wed not so newly wed game...horribly behaved kids and their parents...if hating all that makes me a snob, then that is what I am and proud of it...

So glad that this element sticks to lines other than O.

Celebrity does not have belly flop contests or a lot of drunks. You are very confused. There are almost no children on Celebrity. You truly have your lines confused. I came off a Celebrity cruise recently. Average was mid 60s and it was, as usual, very sedate and quiet.

[jonthomas]

Nope not confused. Guess you missed out on the sights and activities. In over 50 cruises you get to see it all  unless you pretty much stay in your cabin.

On one cruise, the kids were so bad, we all got compensation towards a future cruise. There was a promo , kids sail free. 

Oh forgot to mention the horse betting, yup by the pool with an all day steel drum band. But that's the Caribbean,  there are other delights for other destinations. Just hope those that enjoy that, continue to sail their lines of choice.

[osandomir]

1 hour ago, jonthomas said:

Nope not confused. Guess you missed out on the sights and activities. In over 50 cruises you get to see it all  unless you pretty much stay in your cabin.

On one cruise, the kids were so bad, we all got compensation towards a future cruise. There was a promo , kids sail free. 

Oh forgot to mention the horse betting, yup by the pool with an all day steel drum band. But that's the Caribbean,  there are other delights for other destinations. Just hope those that enjoy that, continue to sail their lines of choice.

If all was that bad it makes me wonder how you managed your 50+ cruises with Celebrity before you “converted” to Oceania. While we mostly cruise with Oceania we sailed with Celebrity just once for itinerary. The line wasn’t our favorite but we didn’t find everything that bad as you described.

[jonthomas]

It took us too long to realize we could do better. Of course not all of our cruises were that bad. The final straw was the class division and if you wanted better food, you had to pay for a suite. We watched a wall being built across the main dining room to create the space for those in suites.

We don't travel for the itinerary specifically, been to most places we are interested in.

Now O suits us much better.

Just hope it continues to deliver what is important to us.

[ZachIsHere]

On 5/28/2023 at 9:00 AM, jonthomas said:

Perhaps O has attracted some that are used to being on carnival or celebrity. We used to see people behaving badly on celeb, never on O.

 

Absolutely wild to labor under this assumption.

[ZachIsHere]

On 5/28/2023 at 7:04 PM, ldtr said:

Certainly.  How about if they simply ignored the request or if they responded that they had a different view to the situation?

 

 

 

This.

 

The other side of this story probably goes something like "Me and my friends were enjoying ourselves we are on vacation after all and the rude staff came up and tried to hush us like we were children in a library"

There seem to be a lot of people in this thread who think the employees have some magic wands in these situations. If we are all being honest right now about the nature of many cruisers and their level of entitlement there are a lot of people who don't take that kind of pushback well or refuse to be self-aware enough to think they are the problem. All of this puts the staff in a no-win situation where escalation is a lot of trouble and so is "hoping it goes away"

I totally get the thread starter being frustrated and hate to hear stuff like this happening but there does seem to be a degree of naivete by some in this thread.
 

[jonthomas]

5 hours ago, ZachIsHere said:

 

Absolutely wild to labor under this assumption.

Not at all. There are plenty that sail on other lines for the party atmosphere. To think otherwise is just a lack of experience.

[Guest ldtr]

On 6/5/2023 at 5:52 AM, jonthomas said:

Not at all. There are plenty that sail on other lines for the party atmosphere. To think otherwise is just a lack of experience.

Funny thing is that most people would not consider 4 people at one table talking and maybe laughing in a lounge to be a party atmosphere.  The question on volume is open to interpretation that would probably vary considerable when any given group is asked independently.  I certainly have not seen any signs in the lounges on Oceania saying that it is a quiet area when performances are taking place, which I have certainly seen in performance venues such as Lincoln Center on HAL.

 

It is rather unclear if the cruise line has the same expectation as some passengers.  After all there are comments earlier in this stream that would imply that the cruise lines view is different.  Those that referred to members of ships entertainment staff and even ships officers in the same venue also talking and laughing.

 

That is separate from the threat made when they were asked to quiet down.

 

 

Edited June 6, 2023 by ldtr

[VisionaryJax]

This thread has been quite interesting! My partner and I have done several cruises -- not dozens like some of you! When the kids were smaller, we were on Carnival and Royal Caribbean with the little ones and Granny, and we cruised through the Panama Canal on Princess. We had fun, but then the kids became teens and wanted to do other kinds of vacations, and we didn't cruise for a long while and then in 2019 for our 20th anniversary we booked Oceania Marina in the South Pacific, and we loved it so much! It was our trip of a lifetime, and the older and more sedate clientele were just what we wanted as old sedate folks ourselves! We had an amazingly spacious cabin and loved always being able to find a place by the pool and a seat at the bar and not always having to chase after a kid ...

 

We loved it so much, we decided to book another trip of a lifetime as soon as we could, and we definitely wanted it to be on Marina. Then of course the pandemic ... and all our plans were put on hold ... and so now we're booked on sister ship Riviera for our 25th anniversary next year. What worries me, based on this thread is ... are Oceania cruisers different after the pandemic than they were before? I know people's nerves and behavior got frayed and upset during and after pandemic from so much stress and fear ... we read about folks having breakdowns on airplanes all the time now! So what do you think ...

 

Did we just get lucky on our 2019 cruise to have a lot of jovial and easy-going fellow passengers? There were only 800 aboard a ship that I think can hold 1200, so maybe there just weren't crowds and the need to compete making people act up?

 

Or are travelers essentially different now than they were pre-pandemic with more of a license to be obnoxious and strike back if told to behave?

 

I want to believe we will luck into another polite, friendly, and not chaotic group on our Riviera cruise next year -- but based on the experiences reported here ...  I am wondering!

[MEFIowa]

2 minutes ago, VisionaryJax said:

... Did we just get lucky on our 2019 cruise to have a lot of jovial and easy-going fellow passengers? There were only 800 aboard a ship that I think can hold 1200, so maybe there just weren't crowds and the need to compete making people act up?....

We had such passengers on Riviera (719 passengers, 12/2021) and Sirena (630 passengers, 11/2022). We'll find out about Riviera again come Oct-Nov 2023, 20 nights in the Med. (Sirena waits till 9/2024 in the Baltic.)

[Hambagahle]

Here is what I think is different following the pandemic based on the tourists I see in my own country, Switzerland - because there was a three year period where people could really not travel there was a "cooped up" feeling AND a lot of spare cash floating around.   Now people who were very happy with Princess or HAL are moving up to Oceania and Azamara.  And some who loved Oceania have moved up to Regent.  So you get, if you like, people coming from another culture.  With different expectations and ways of doing things.   Here in Switzerland we are seeing already (and June is only the start of the summer season for tourism) the "mix" of tourists is different and - sadly for the tourists - they seem to be more of the "tick the box and move on" sort...the ones who visit the CLOY sites for example.  Get your selfie, don't bother with the mountains unless they are your backdrop, and go to the next place.  No thought whatsoever of hiking or even just sitting and soaking up the view.

Hopefully for my country this "wave" will pass.  And we will go back to "normal" tourism (whatever that is!).  Very likely the cruising industry is going through a similar "wave".   

Just a thought!

[Guest ldtr]

13 hours ago, Hambagahle said:

Here is what I think is different following the pandemic based on the tourists I see in my own country, Switzerland - because there was a three year period where people could really not travel there was a "cooped up" feeling AND a lot of spare cash floating around.   Now people who were very happy with Princess or HAL are moving up to Oceania and Azamara.  And some who loved Oceania have moved up to Regent.  So you get, if you like, people coming from another culture.  With different expectations and ways of doing things.   Here in Switzerland we are seeing already (and June is only the start of the summer season for tourism) the "mix" of tourists is different and - sadly for the tourists - they seem to be more of the "tick the box and move on" sort...the ones who visit the CLOY sites for example.  Get your selfie, don't bother with the mountains unless they are your backdrop, and go to the next place.  No thought whatsoever of hiking or even just sitting and soaking up the view.

Hopefully for my country this "wave" will pass.  And we will go back to "normal" tourism (whatever that is!).  Very likely the cruising industry is going through a similar "wave".   

Just a thought!

Just returned home from a few weeks in Switzerland in May.  The tourist areas did seem pretty busy for this time of year with many tour groups hopping from one tourist attraction to another, especially in the main locations like Zermatt and Luzern.  Outside of those areas not so much.

 

As usual the Knie circus was excellent.  We usually try to schedule our visit to coincide with its time in Zurich. 

 

We just like taking our time, staying in one place for a few days then traveling by train to the next place to stay for a few more days

[Psoque]

On 6/7/2023 at 2:45 AM, Hambagahle said:

Here is what I think is different following the pandemic based on the tourists I see in my own country, Switzerland - because there was a three year period where people could really not travel there was a "cooped up" feeling AND a lot of spare cash floating around.   Now people who were very happy with Princess or HAL are moving up to Oceania and Azamara.  And some who loved Oceania have moved up to Regent.  So you get, if you like, people coming from another culture.  With different expectations and ways of doing things.   Here in Switzerland we are seeing already (and June is only the start of the summer season for tourism) the "mix" of tourists is different and - sadly for the tourists - they seem to be more of the "tick the box and move on" sort...the ones who visit the CLOY sites for example.  Get your selfie, don't bother with the mountains unless they are your backdrop, and go to the next place.  No thought whatsoever of hiking or even just sitting and soaking up the view.

Hopefully for my country this "wave" will pass.  And we will go back to "normal" tourism (whatever that is!).  Very likely the cruising industry is going through a similar "wave".   

Just a thought!

I agree that there are more and more inconsiderate people in the world, and this trend, at least in my experience, is accelerated, even during the 2020-2023 time period.

 

I have no idea what the “cruise culture” is in Switzerland, and for that matter, I assume every person has his/her own perception of this subculture.

 

However, I refuse to agree that there is some sort of a well-defined cultural segregation of people based on which cruise lines they patronize.  Obviously, the cruise lines want that for multiple reasons.  For example, Oceania and other lines in the “middle” of the price range like to convince their customers that they are somehow “superior” to those who cruise with less expensive lines, in order to reinforce customer satisfaction.  They even encourage their customers to call those less expensive lines as “mass market lines.”. This is rather ironic since almost all cruise lines that, say, I can afford, I consider them to be mass market (I have been with a variety of cruise lines, including Norwegian, Royal Caribbean, Princess, HAL, Celebrity, Windstar, and Crystal).  I think they are all “mass market” lines as far as I am concerned.  And the funny thing is that I have paid less for some of the Crystal cruises than some of the Celebrity cruises we have taken (and we never book expensive cabins on any of them).

 

Also, I don’t think there’s any effot/financial strength required for someone who has routinely patronized Carnival/Norwegian, etc. to book a cruise with any of the more “upscale” lines.  If you look at any aggregate cruise booking engines, you will see that the price tags (either in total or per diem) of most of these cruise lines heavily overlap.  I guess some people have been brain-washed to think they strictly “belong” to some particular brand, and I respect that.  But I personally do not feel like I’m a captive to any particular cruise line, either financially or “culturally.”

 

Furthermore, especially in the US, and probably elsewhere, it has been documented that the finances of that elusive “middle class” have been shrinking, especially among the retirees.  May of the people in this socioeconomic slice have been tightening their budgets, and the pandemic has accelerated this trend.  So, I can’t blame the blame the pandemic for the appearances of “Pretty Woman” people on cruise ships either.

 

I firmly believe that there will be inconsiderate, rude, ignorant people everywhere we go, and only thing I can do is to either ignore them or deal with them in a manner that is most conducive and least disruptive to our enjoyment.  I’m actually getting very good at ignoring people like that.

 

 

[jonthomas]

To have credibility about the atmosphere and behavior on lines other than O, you need to have sailed on them and have had the experience for yourself. Not only sailed on them but done various itineraries as the carribbean or transatlantic, for example, as well as different times of the year. All these variants will attract a different clientelle. Not only that, but a variety of promotions also come into play which can affect the composition of the passengers.

Without this personal experience calling me a snob and an elitist has no substance, just a "red herring".

To say all lines have passengers behaving similarly is to be either very inexperienced or naive.

[mancunian]

I think there is yet another problem and it is to do with taped music, particularly vocal taped music.

 

We are currently on the new Vista - beautiful ship, super food and best staff we have come across but ………. much noisier than we have experienced on previous O  cruises.   Last night we dined in Ember the new speciality restaurant.   Good experience except for the taped vocal music which meant people had to raise their voices to be heard at their table making it a generally unpleasant experience.  Yes OK we are towards the end of our cruising career and it is the oldies complaining again but I still think some balance possible.

 

We enjoy live music but  also like peace and quiet andcannot understand why there is so much taped music.  People want a background nowadays.  As the cruise goes on we are finding the level of noise quite a problem and will in future keep with our other favourite, Silversea.  Of course we may find they are going the same way.

[Hlitner]

17 minutes ago, jonthomas said:

To have credibility about the atmosphere and behavior on lines other than O, you need to have sailed on them and have had the experience for yourself. Not only sailed on them but done various itineraries as the carribbean or transatlantic, for example, as well as different times of the year. All these variants will attract a different clientelle. Not only that, but a variety of promotions also come into play which can affect the composition of the passengers.

Without this personal experience calling me a snob and an elitist has no substance, just a "red herring".

To say all lines have passengers behaving similarly is to be either very inexperienced or naive.

Not boasting, but we have been blessed to have cruised on 16 different lines (17 and 18 are booked) ranging from true budget lines (such as the long gone Regency) to luxury lines such as Seabourn and Crystal.  We have seen badly behaved passengers on every ship/line with the exception of our one Crystal cruise, Azamara,  and our numerous Seabourn cruises.  As to Seabourn, I think one factor is that their ships are very spacious (no lines and very little crowding) and relatively small 450 or 600 passenger.  

 

We find the "snob" effect fascinating.  For many years we resisted going on Seabourn because we expected an issue with a ship full of snobs.   The reality was completely different and we found our shipmates to be gracious, fun, interesting, laid back, and generally very polite.  Where we have encountered the most "snob effect" has been on a couple of our longer HAL cruises (we have over 500 days on that line) where we have sometimes encountered the attitude of, "I have been on X number of cruises which makes me better than others,"  or "how many worlds have you done?"   i should also mention that on our most recent HAL cruise (last month) we met a gentleman who is worth over $200 million (why on earth was he on HAL?) who was completely charming and an excellent dinner companion (we dined with him twice).

 

So, here is my theory!  There is no accounting for "jerks" and they do exist everywhere.  There are also folks who cannot "hold their booze" and all the drinking on ships contribute to their bad behavior.  But we cannot help but think that folks on the luxury lines simply have the attitude that everyone on the ship is there....which makes them OK (just because they are there).  Not sure if that makes sense, but it explains what we have encountered.  

 

Where does that leave "O?"  I have no clue since we have yet to cruise on O (but a 35 day cruise is booked).  If we accept the premise of "premium lines" we have cruised (several times) on Azamara and never witnessed bad behavior on those cruises.  We would think that "O" attracts a similar crowd to what we have had on Azamara.  But any cruise can have some "jerks" and that is just the roll of the dice.  I also think that for those that are always complaining about "jerks" on every cruise....that perhaps they should look inward.  Perhaps there is something in their own behavior that brings out the worst in folks 🙂

 

Hank

[Hlitner]

2 minutes ago, mancunian said:

I think there is yet another problem and it is to do with taped music, particularly vocal taped music.

 

We are currently on the new Vista - beautiful ship, super food and best staff we have come across but ………. much noisier than we have experienced on previous O  cruises.   Last night we dined in Ember the new speciality restaurant.   Good experience except for the taped vocal music which meant people had to raise their voices to be heard at their table making it a generally unpleasant experience.  Yes OK we are towards the end of our cruising career and it is the oldies complaining again but I still think some balance possible.

 

We enjoy live music but  also like peace and quiet andcannot understand why there is so much taped music.  People want a background nowadays.  As the cruise goes on we are finding the level of noise quite a problem and will in future keep with our other favourite, Silversea.  Of course we may find they are going the same way.

Your post made me smile.  When we were on a Seabourn cruise (in Greece) we met a lovely lady who was bouncing back and forth between our Seabourn ship and a Silverseas vessel that was also doing the Greek Islands on a similar schedule.  Every month, she switched ships (and did this for about 4 months).  When we asked her for a comparison of the lines, she said that SS was just too quiet and not as much fun as Seabourn (where they have deck parties, caviar in the surf, etc).

 

If the piped-in music is too loud, we wonder if a quiet comment to management might have the desired effect.  It never hurts to politely make your concerns known, and at least give management a chance.

 

Hank

[rbtan]

Had this sort of thing happen in Murano(a restaurant on Celebrity) Absolute horrid table. Rude & obnoxious.(not drunk, just low lifes) My spouse spoke up & said knock it off. Once he spoke up others then chimed in.The thing to do is you get the table number & report the time & place to guest services. They then look it up & warn the pax to knock it off. It seemed to work, as we saw them again & they were much more subdued.I mean this was bad. These people were referring to all Catholic Priests as molesters(and worse) Referring to people from Maine as dirt poor as church mice etc.We're from NH & these pax were from Massachusetts. My spouse asked them if they were from Lowell/Lawrence/ or perhaps Chicopee. That seemed to shut them down pretty fast.

[ORV]

What was this thread about? 

[jonthomas]

It hasn't veered too far from the original ops post of the  badly behaved on the Marina.

 

Have to add that after 5, O cruises have not yet seen anything that would make take notice but have seen plenty over the years on other lines.

 

Have never forgotten, a baby in diapers in the hot tub on a Celeb ship and the screaming swearing parents that were reported and had to take the baby out of the tub.

The tub subsequently closed for everyone else. 

When you have cruised a great deal, all kinds of situations of the badly behaved will come to mind. On O  as well, I'm sure, but not yet.