Question about bartender gratuities

[TRLD]

One other piece of information  across all of the CCL linesthe average amount of onboard spend per passenger per day for the last reported quarter was $76.17 per day. Considering that there is a lot of potential onboard spend not included in packages (excursions, Spa, retail, etc) the package prices - crew appreciation would makes up over half of that average.

[Shmoo here]

4 hours ago, d9704011 said:

If a passenger pays $60 per day for a seven day cruise, the total is $420.  Over the course of the seven days, let's say 40 drinks are consumed and a couple of pizzas are eaten.  Internet is probably less than $2 per day, drinks cost $2 each and the entire rest of the Plus Package is probably not costing more than $20.  So, the total cost to Princess for the week is 7 x $2 plus 40 x $2 plus $20... a grand total of $114!!!  Plenty left over to make contributions to CA pool, take a profit, etc....

The Plus package also includes gratuities.  So, 7 night cruise, 2 people in room @ $16 each per night =$224.   $224+$114=$338.  Still less than the $420, but closer.

[Crookshanks]

19 hours ago, dreaminofcruisin said:

Regardless of whether or not you feel like tipping above the amount of included gratuities....the MOST important thing you can do if you have exemplary service from a crew member, is mention them in the post cruise survey. I have been told by several of them that this plays into their bonus pay and time off.

 

So much THIS!

 

You can name up to 5 people on the survey.  Take note of the names of those who really made your cruise better. Make sure to name them as they will get first pick on new contracts and be more likely to get promoted.

[MacMadame]

16 hours ago, TRLD said:

The SEC is involved because they are listed on US stock exchanges and must meet US accounting and reporting standards.

Which is why they can't say that crew appreciation is $16/day and goes into a pool and then not put that money into the pool.

 

However, Princess is headquartered in the US (Santa Clarita to be exact), so they pay US taxes and therefore the IRS absolutely is involved.

[rideev]

2 hours ago, MacMadame said:

Which is why they can't say that crew appreciation is $16/day and goes into a pool and then not put that money into the pool.

 

However, Princess is headquartered in the US (Santa Clarita to be exact), so they pay US taxes and therefore the IRS absolutely is involved.

But still doesn't answer the question of how much of the $60 for Plus that process puts into the Crew Appreciation pot.  Not the gratuity pot or the tip pot, but the "Crew Appreciation" pot.  Saying that $16, $17, or $18 of that $60 is allocated to the CA pot is just crazy.  Saying that because the CA amount is $16 for someone not on the Plus program means PCL will put $16 in the pot for those on the program is about as asinine as someone buying the Princess Plus Beverage package for ~$76 per day and then paying an additional $16 per day for CA and passing up Princess Plus.

 

And how much of that crew appreciation goes to each individual?  No one knows because they give it out as they see fit and to whom they are for.

[MacMadame]

4 minutes ago, rideev said:

Saying that $16, $17, or $18 of that $60 is allocated to the CA pot is just crazy. 

It's not remotely crazy. Everything else in the packages costs them a minimal amount. Putting in the amount they say they do leaves them with plenty of profit.

[rideev]

1 minute ago, MacMadame said:

8 minutes ago, rideev said:

 

It's not remotely crazy. Everything else in the packages costs them a minimal amount. Putting in the amount they say they do leaves them with plenty of profit.

Where do they say they put that amount in the pot? 

The CA costs them nothing, less than minimal. 

 

By your logic, if the drinks costs them a few Dollars, and Internet cost them nothing more, then they should put the whole thing into the CA pot, but they don't.  And there is nothing anywhere that says how much of that $60 goes to CA.  All of the crew is on salaried contracts.  Some of them may get a bonus with all of the CA money pooled fleet wide.

[memoak]

3 minutes ago, rideev said:

Where do they say they put that amount in the pot? 

The CA costs them nothing, less than minimal. 

 

By your logic, if the drinks costs them a few Dollars, and Internet cost them nothing more, then they should put the whole thing into the CA pot, but they don't.  And there is nothing anywhere that says how much of that $60 goes to CA.  All of the crew is on salaried contracts.  Some of them may get a bonus with all of the CA money pooled fleet wide.

You really think that Elon Musk gives them the Starlink WiFi for nothing ?  He didn’t get to bring a billionaire that way 

[rideev]

24 minutes ago, memoak said:

You really think that Elon Musk gives them the Starlink WiFi for nothing ?  He didn’t get to bring a billionaire that way 

Of course not.  They pay bunches for that. 

 

Others say those costs are minimal.  I think they may be a fixed cost. 

 

What in really saying is no one knows how much of the $60 or $80 from Plus or premier that Princess puts into the CA pot.  But to say that all other costs are negligible so they can put the full $16,17 or 18 into the pot based on your cabin choice is foolish.

[TRLD]

3 hours ago, MacMadame said:

Which is why they can't say that crew appreciation is $16/day and goes into a pool and then not put that money into the pool.

 

However, Princess is headquartered in the US (Santa Clarita to be exact), so they pay US taxes and therefore the IRS absolutely is involved.

Not really. The workers at HQ pay US taxes. Ship workers do not. All.profits from shipboard activities are not taxed in the US.

 

The only thing taxed in the US are things such as Alaskian tours where the activity is taxed in the US.

 

While the HQ is in the US the company is not a US corporation. Registered in Panama and the UK.

 

So the IRS has very little involvement with the company and no involvement with anything ship based.

[MacMadame]

1 hour ago, rideev said:

By your logic, if the drinks costs them a few Dollars, and Internet cost them nothing more, then they should put the whole thing into the CA pot, but they don't.  And there is nothing anywhere that says how much of that $60 goes to CA.  All of the crew is on salaried contracts.  Some of them may get a bonus with all of the CA money pooled fleet wide.

This is a strawman argument. I said they had to put the full CA into the CA pot due to how accounting works. And that they could without giving up too much profit.

 

I don't know why you are so determined to think Princess is only putting a pittance into the CA pot.

[rideev]

42 minutes ago, MacMadame said:

 

I don't know why you are so determined to think Princess is only putting a pittance into the CA pot.

Why can't they say that they take full Internet fees out of the Plus package, full drink prices, and whatever is left over they put into the CA pot?

 

No one knows how much of the Princess Plus is allocated to anything. 

 

Why are you so adamant about thinking Princess is just giving money to their employees?  If so, why wouldn't they just pay them more? 

 

Don't matter to me, I won't ever do plus or premier ever again.  I spend much more money that way.

[memoak]

22 minutes ago, rideev said:

Why can't they say that they take full Internet fees out of the Plus package, full drink prices, and whatever is left over they put into the CA pot?

 

No one knows how much of the Princess Plus is allocated to anything. 

 

Why are you so adamant about thinking Princess is just giving money to their employees?  If so, why wouldn't they just pay them more? 

 

Don't matter to me, I won't ever do plus or premier ever again.  I spend much more money that way.

If they took full drink prices out then there would be zero left   Many of us drink 8-12 drinks a day do you think they take money out of employees salary to make that up ?  If we paid by the drink we would have a bar bill of way over $200 a day for the 2 of us

[TRLD]

38 minutes ago, rideev said:

Why can't they say that they take full Internet fees out of the Plus package, full drink prices, and whatever is left over they put into the CA pot?

 

No one knows how much of the Princess Plus is allocated to anything. 

 

Why are you so adamant about thinking Princess is just giving money to their employees?  If so, why wouldn't they just pay them more? 

 

Don't matter to me, I won't ever do plus or premier ever again.  I spend much more money that way.

The reason why they do not pay them more is because the current system provides benefits to the cruise line, the passengers, and the workers 

 

As I mentioned above the money from the service charges and the crew appreciation are processed outside of corporate financials. That means that they are neither revenue nor expense. Process it as revenue and expense and the companies net margin would be materially lower. It would also impact some fees the cruise line pays. It also provides the cruise line more flexibility. If there is a material change in business the pool drops. If it was all salary the cruise line would be on the hook for the full amount if the it was salary.

 

For the crew, depending upon country of resident, in some cases they receive beneficial tax treatment for money from the pool vs salary.

 

For the passenger if it is in the fare then it would be used as part of the travel insurance cost calculation. Now since it is charged during the cruise it is not part of the cost used to calculated the cost of travel insurance (at the cost of travel insurance being about 5% of trip cost, the current system would save about a dollar per day).

Edited May 14 by TRLD

[rideev]

6 minutes ago, TRLD said:

The reason why they do not pay them more is because the current system provides benefits to the cruise line, the passengers, and the workers 

 

As I mentioned above the money from the service charges and the crew appreciation are processed outside of corporate financials. That means that they are neither revenue nor expense. Process it as revenue and expense and the companies net margin would be materially lower. It would also impact some fees the cruise line pays. It also provides the cruise line more flexibility. If there is a material change in business the pool drops. If it was all salary the cruise line would be on the hook for the full amount if the it was salary.

 

 

 

So, how much of the princess Plus does princess put into the CA pot and process outside of corporate financials?

[TRLD]

10 minutes ago, rideev said:

So, how much of the princess Plus does princess put into the CA pot and process outside of corporate financials?

As I said about the CA contribution would not be considered revenue. So if it is $16 for your cabin per day. That would not be considered revenue. It would be transfered to the pool. Also would be the 18% service charge on sale. if the price is 60 then the service charge would be 10.80 making the package total cost be 70.80. The total contribution to the pool would be 26.80 (I believe I was off by .40 in one earlier posting). The amount of revenue recorded as onboard sales revenue would be $44.

 

 

[NavyVeteran]

On 5/11/2024 at 10:17 PM, nasa1974 said:

I generally tip my room steward at the end of the cruise.

My go to bar is Crooners. By the end of the first night, they know what I am drinking. The next night I sit at the bar and they bring me my drink. I will almost always get a refill before walk ups during the time I am at the bar. I typically tip $5 a night. To me it's worth the attention.

My go to bar is also Crooners. I usually tip the bartenders there at the end of the cruise for the exceptional service I have been receiving for the entire cruise. I have received the same attention. They would have my drink ready as soon as I sit down. Pre-medallion, they would not ask me my stateroom number after the first night. I never tip until the end of the cruise. I believe my service was every bit as good as that for the people who tip early. I tip as a reward for exceptional service - not as a bribe hoping to receive exceptional service later.

[memoak]

2 minutes ago, NavyVeteran said:

My go to bar is also Crooners. I usually tip the bartenders there at the end of the cruise for the exceptional service I have been receiving for the entire cruise. I have received the same attention. They would have my drink ready as soon as I sit down. Pre-medallion, they would not ask me my stateroom number after the first night. I never tip until the end of the cruise. I believe my service was every bit as good as that for the people who tip early. I tip as a reward for exceptional service - not as a bribe hoping to receive exceptional service later.

We do exactly the same 

[rideev]

27 minutes ago, TRLD said:

As I said about the CA contribution would not be considered revenue. So if it is $16 for your cabin per day. That would not be considered revenue. It would be transfered to the pool. Also would be the 18% service charge on sale. if the price is 60 then the service charge would be 10.80 making the package total cost be 70.80. The total contribution to the pool would be 26.80 (I believe I was off by .40 in one earlier posting). The amount of revenue recorded as onboard sales revenue would be $44.

 

 

There is no service charge on the Plus package. 

 

Where are you getting your data?  It is obviously flawed.

[TRLD]

9 minutes ago, rideev said:

There is no service charge on the Plus package. 

 

Where are you getting your data?  It is obviously flawed.

A friend from of mine from Santa Clarita said that it was the normal CA contribution plus all service charges paid by that passenger.

 

But did not say exactly what service charges since it depended upon what the customer purchased . I had read that Princess packages  did have a service charge. so that mistake was mine.

[MacMadame]

5 hours ago, rideev said:

Where do they say they put that amount in the pot? 

The CA costs them nothing, less than minimal. 

 

By your logic, if the drinks costs them a few Dollars, and Internet cost them nothing more, then they should put the whole thing into the CA pot, but they don't.  And there is nothing anywhere that says how much of that $60 goes to CA.  All of the crew is on salaried contracts.  Some of them may get a bonus with all of the CA money pooled fleet wide.

No, that's not my logic. My logic is that Princess says what the daily CA fee is and therefore, they are bound by it. Drinks, wifi, etc. are in a fungible pot of money called expenses. CA is not the same. There are rules about it and what it can be spent on. It's in its own account (similar to vacation/PTO for a company). Your company can't spend the money PTO money -- it's held in something similar to escrow. And Princess can't spend the CA for similar reasons.

[nasa1974]

1 hour ago, NavyVeteran said:

My go to bar is also Crooners. I usually tip the bartenders there at the end of the cruise for the exceptional service I have been receiving for the entire cruise. I have received the same attention. They would have my drink ready as soon as I sit down. Pre-medallion, they would not ask me my stateroom number after the first night. I never tip until the end of the cruise. I believe my service was every bit as good as that for the people who tip early. I tip as a reward for exceptional service - not as a bribe hoping to receive exceptional service later.

I never thought of it as a bribe. After the first night I tip because I appreciate the fact that I'm treated as a regular. Like Cheers. If I need a refresh, I get one before the walk-up crowd. I tip because I watch how busy they get and I still get priority for my drink. It's nice to get some special attention and I like to say thank you.

[MacMadame]

4 hours ago, rideev said:

Why can't they say that they take full Internet fees out of the Plus package, full drink prices, and whatever is left over they put into the CA pot?

This has been explained several times.

 

4 hours ago, rideev said:

 

No one knows how much of the Princess Plus is allocated to anything. 

I know the law and I know about General Accepted Accounting Practices that govern how this money has to be allocated and spent or the publicly traded company gets in trouble.

 

4 hours ago, rideev said:

Why are you so adamant about thinking Princess is just giving money to their employees? 

Why are you so adamant that Princess is ripping off its employees?
 

 

[d9704011]

4 hours ago, MacMadame said:

Why are you so adamant that Princess is ripping off its employees?

Apparently, it keeps the argument going.

[MacMadame]

5 hours ago, d9704011 said:

Apparently, it keeps the argument going.

Good one! 😄